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alix
USA
434 Posts |
 Posted - 12/11/2012 : 23:02:08
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I would like to thank balto for his great posts on fear. That was the missing link at the end for me between being much better and completely better.
I would feel good most of the day but then I was worried that my symptoms may come back and bingo, they always did (albeit mildly).
But balto really identified this fear of symptoms as a key element to confront. Well done.
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Jilly
USA
40 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2012 : 20:38:00
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quote:
Originally posted by alix
I would like to thank balto for his great posts on fear. That was the missing link at the end for me between being much better and completely better.
I would feel good most of the day but then I was worried that my symptoms may come back and bingo, they always did (albeit mildly).
But balto really identified this fear of symptoms as a key element to confront. Well done.
I struggle with fear too...I didn't see Balto's post on this...can you direct me to it ? Thanks |
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2012 : 20:49:36
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| Jilly, balto has many insightful posts on fear including in the thread that you started recently titled "new to tms" on the 2nd page. |
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Jilly
USA
40 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2012 : 04:54:04
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quote:
Originally posted by alix
Jilly, balto has many insightful posts on fear including in the thread that you started recently titled "new to tms" on the 2nd page.
Thanks..I will look for it  |
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pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2012 : 20:52:34
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I have not been on this forum all that long, but I have read a lot of the archives and there are quite a few threads like this dating back over the years, with the Sarno purists on one side and people who seem to have been helped by more eclectic approaches (and some who are downright critical of Dr. Sarno) on the other. And some who from a quick read seem to have switched camps along the way.
Why does chronic pain have to have a single cause and a single treatment, one size fits all, though? What if for some it is caused more by unresolved emotional conflict at the unconscious level, and for others it's more a somatic expression of an anxiety disorder or even just plain stress where the issues are more accessible and on the surface, and where cognitive and behavioral approaches are better suited than digging into the unconscious or however SteveO elegantly phrased it? Or perhaps for some people a combination of approaches might be helpful?
It seems to me that the battle lines need not be drawn so sharply and that these discussions need not be so "either-or." Just one person's observation, along with the observation that people for whom something has worked seem to me to generalize that what ailed them must be what ails others and what worked for them should work for everyone else. Maybe it's not that simple? |
Edited by - pspa123 on 12/15/2012 20:54:18 |
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eric watson
USA
601 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 10:46:29
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quote by pspa123-
Why does chronic pain have to have a single cause and a single treatment, one size fits all, though? What if for some it is caused more by unresolved emotional conflict at the unconscious level, and for others it's more a somatic expression of an anxiety disorder or even just plain stress where the issues are more accessible and on the surface, and where cognitive and behavioral approaches are better suited than digging into the unconscious or however SteveO elegantly phrased it? Or perhaps for some people a combination of approaches might be helpful?
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pspa what site or post have you been reading?-we do apporach tms from all kinds of angles-thats why this post is here-your words r questionable to me-have you read sarnos books?-have you healed from tms? why r you so angry-anger is a reaction that creates tms,-were here to help pspa-what r u here for?steveo has helped many posters here and so has ace,how many have you helped? |
Edited by - eric watson on 12/16/2012 10:48:13 |
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 11:38:53
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I am going a bit OT here but what I found terribly discouraging the first time I tried to apply the Sarno technique back in 2005 were the video and audio testimonials from cured patients.
To hear somebody say that half way through the book they were already 80% better or that they completely recovered after 5 years of pain in 10 days is terribly discouraging when you struggle yourself.
But the second time I revisited Sarno successfully, I tried to put those testimonials into perspective.
The fact is that these people are very carefully selected and there is a huge pressure on them when a professional crew is behind them and the testimony will be made public, to give a positive feedback.
They cannot say something like "well, I was great a week ago when Dr.X asked me to give a testimonial but not so much today".
It would have been more helpful for me to hear people say that it was hard but that they recovered at the end (which is what most of the success stories are on this forum).
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eric watson
USA
601 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 12:08:41
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quote:
Originally posted by alix
I am going a bit OT here but what I found terribly discouraging the first time I tried to apply the Sarno technique back in 2005 were the video and audio testimonials from cured patients.
To hear somebody say that half way through the book they were already 80% better or that they completely recovered after 5 years of pain in 10 days is terribly discouraging when you struggle yourself.
But the second time I revisited Sarno successfully, I tried to put those testimonials into perspective.
The fact is that these people are very carefully selected and there is a huge pressure on them when a professional crew is behind them and the testimony will be made public, to give a positive feedback.
They cannot say something like "well, I was great a week ago when Dr.X asked me to give a testimonial but not so much today".
It would have been more helpful for me to hear people say that it was hard but that they recovered at the end (which is what most of the success stories are on this forum).
ok alix so you have to hear people r in pain for you to get better? -but because of pressure they lied?
but the people at tms help tell more truthfull storys than sarno did -so in reality hes a lier but your really on to it?
why does this sound like a never ending thread of doubt and despair?
are you saying sarno selected speacial people under pressure to lie for him?
if so ,then you dont believe sarno huh?
then why r u really here?
one post you say sarno helped after you understood net,
the next your dogging him again
which is it and lets get to the final point
you sound like you like the drama this has brought to an other wise peaceful forum-its good you got healed
but you got to get your story straight man
r u really healed?
and r u attributing it to sarno or net
if net ,then just say it alix and kill this drama once and for all
now the reason i am replying in this manner is your post has brought a lot of doubt and dispute amongst the tms forum
you see it i know
but sarno is not a lier and the people r not coached-
i know because im one of those people that totally 100% got healed
should we fuss and argue and doubt because others havent completely gotten there healing yet and make them feel like they have been led in the wrong direction
the teachings here originate from sarnos teachings-we dont lie -we tell the truth-so am i lying and pressured because i told you im healed-i think not
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 12:15:18
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Eric,
You are being very aggressive. I am not saying people are lying at all. I am just saying that those people were carefully selected and I have been in that exact position of giving a testimonial (for some product I was endorsing) and it is nerve wrecking.
Eric, if you feel this thread is disturbing (which I do not comprehend why) feel free to ask for its deletion. It makes no difference to me.
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andy64tms
USA
589 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 12:42:35
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Hi all,
I’m not even posting right now supposedly taking a break, but I have to respond.
Please, please do not delete this thread. It has helped me immensely recognize that I am not alone in “my slightly different or controversial cure” and there are others like me.
Eric I thought you were cured, I see you as being hypersensitive, angry and carrying the Sarno banner to extremes. Your are very loyal to Sarno, we all are, and owe him a great debt, but in being so you seem to be blinded as to how things are done in the real world today: i.e. through conversation, debate, exchanges of opposing views, and finally the negotiating process.
I will not be commenting further on this thread. Eric I know I need a break from the forum, maybe you should take one and begin to enjoy your recovery.
See you next year,
Sincerely
Andy
Past TMS Experience in 2000, with success.
Stopped Wiki Edu Program in lieu of own journalling
Charlie Horse on neck for 20 years, is almost gone.
Books:
Healing Back Pain
Unlearn your Pain
The Great Pain Deception |
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pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 12:44:30
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quote:
Originally posted by eric watson
quote by pspa123-
Why does chronic pain have to have a single cause and a single treatment, one size fits all, though? What if for some it is caused more by unresolved emotional conflict at the unconscious level, and for others it's more a somatic expression of an anxiety disorder or even just plain stress where the issues are more accessible and on the surface, and where cognitive and behavioral approaches are better suited than digging into the unconscious or however SteveO elegantly phrased it? Or perhaps for some people a combination of approaches might be helpful?
_________________________________________________________________
pspa what site or post have you been reading?-we do apporach tms from all kinds of angles-thats why this post is here-your words r questionable to me-have you read sarnos books?-have you healed from tms? why r you so angry-anger is a reaction that creates tms,-were here to help pspa-what r u here for?steveo has helped many posters here and so has ace,how many have you helped?
There is no anger in anything I said and there is no need to be aggressive in your response or to demean me. I never said Dr. Sarno's methods have not helped many people nor did I suggest that his most ardent supporters such as yourself have not helped people. I was simply saying I ALSO saw some merit to the views of other people who have posted on this forum that all chronic pain was not necessarily caused by unresolved emotional issues at the unconscious level, and that more garden variety anxiety and stress might be to blame to some extent or for some people. As I am sure you know I am referring, in part, to some of Hillbilly's posts. How is that angry? I think it is you who is being defensive and perceiving an attack that never was made. Anyhow, since apparently the message to me today is that I am not fit to post here, I won't any more. Have a peaceful day. |
Edited by - pspa123 on 12/16/2012 12:50:04 |
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pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 12:51:03
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| inadvertent double post sorry |
Edited by - pspa123 on 12/16/2012 12:52:05 |
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Ace1
USA
1040 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 13:38:31
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| Hi guys. Lets love each other. We want to help not hurt. Maybe I started this and it was not my intension. I promise my only intension to mention anger was to help maybe clue someone to something. If it is said in any other way besides a gentle manner, it will not help them see anything and spark defenses. Lets all forget about what was said to each other here. Lets start fresh. Eric's intensions are good and I think pspa intensions are good too. Eric is just trying to support Steve's and my position bc he thinks we are helping a lot of people. He is so greatful to being cured that anything that may in anyway take away from someones healing, affects him. Please look at it that way. Just bc someone is cured doesn't mean they can't make mistakes or be angry sometimes, we after all are still human. I also understand Alix, he is just saying that he could not heal based on dr sarnos book alone for which I had a similar experience. I do have to say that dr sarno was the only reason I eventually persued the right path to my healing. Remember we need to be more forgoving over all in order to truly heal |
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eric watson
USA
601 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 17:10:18
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ok-im backing out of this thread
had to post and i did....
if it benefits someone great....
i think ace said it best-were all here to help
so lets do that...
pspa you have a right to your thoughts the same as i or ace or steveo does
alix again you and pspa can bring out a great debate....
and really andy dont ya know already....
were all friends here....debating about theorys
and yes im healed-i just know how to be argumentive in a constuctive state without hurting anymore...
although i see this post as very perplex
its as much as i as us all that kept the debate stimulated, i hope you all have a blessed christmas....
god bless
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Edited by - eric watson on 12/16/2012 17:20:58 |
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 18:12:27
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| Cheers Eric and Happy holidays! |
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eric watson
USA
601 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 18:19:30
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quote:
Originally posted by alix
Cheers Eric and Happy holidays!
cheers to you alix and happy holidays to you too my friend |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 18:28:10
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quote:
Originally posted by alix
But the second time I revisited Sarno successfully, I tried to put those testimonials into perspective.
The fact is that these people are very carefully selected and there is a huge pressure on them when a professional crew is behind them and the testimony will be made public, to give a positive feedback.
They cannot say something like "well, I was great a week ago when Dr.X asked me to give a testimonial but not so much today".
I recall the testimonials in the books and on Dr. Sarno's video. I would respectfully disagree with your assessment of the scenario. These people were not paid for their testimonials as paid actors would be. They were bonafide patients of Dr. Sarno who attended his seminars after being examined by him. There is no guarantee that once you get over one TMS symptom, life's vicissitudes as listed on the Rahe-Holmes list will not crop up again and deliver you another TMS symptom in an attempt to protect you from emotional dis-ease.
It's too bad we could not all have been residents of the Tri-States area so we could have been his personal patients. The TMS dx coming from the Good Doctor is probably one of the most valuable tools of modern medicine. Numerous of his patients have posted here, that when they had new symptoms, they revisited or called Dr. Sarno for TMS "boosters" and if it was TMS regained their faith--it gets easier with practice. Once you were a patient of Dr. Sarno's, you were a patient for life--too bad he retired so young at ninety. |
Edited by - tennis tom on 12/16/2012 18:29:39 |
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 20:40:22
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Tennis_tom,
I was referring to the Schechter video. No matter what, there is a huge pressure to give good news when you are on a video like that surrounded by a professional camera crew. It is just human nature. I am sure that the people featured are much better and I am not criticizing them. I just think there is more to the story in each case. I would have liked to hear about their struggle and not that it was so easy.
Again, I am not criticizing. It just explains why I did not connect with those testimonials back in 2005.
Imagine yourself tennis_tom being invited by Dr.Schechter to speak on his next DVD. Maybe you would refuse to do it but if you accept, you will emphasize the positives and maybe minimize the negatives when the camera is rolling and a dozen faces are staring at you.
I was not a "paid endorser" either myself BTW. But still, I really thought the product I was endorsing was "great, accurate, but difficult to use". When I was filmed I just said that the product was "great and accurate", I skipped the "but difficult to use". Again, it is just human nature.
But talking about videos, the one from Dr.Schubiner where he explains the ideas of Dr.Sarno in connection with real sections of the brain like the amygdala really clicked for me and made me understand the connection with the science underneath. |
Edited by - alix on 12/16/2012 21:43:07 |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 23:09:46
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Hi Alix,
I didn't know you were referring to the Schechter video--well that's Hollywood. I drove 500 miles to see him once a long time ago, hoping to get the good word that I had TMS. He looked at my x-rays and said nope, get a hip-replacement, sending me off with nocebo grande'. |
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2012 : 23:48:26
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Tennis_tom,
That's a real bummer. Did he look like he was confident in his diagnostic? To me he said TMS but his demeanor and body language was more like "I have no clue".
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Topic |
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Cured from pelvic pain
