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IcyScythe
USA
11 Posts |
 Posted - 08/28/2006 : 15:27:58
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Hey all!
I've been suffering from what's been diagnosed as tendonitis/RSI in both of my hands and wrists (and somewhat in the forearms) for about a year and a half. I've also had upper and lower backpain for about 2 and half years and knee pain for 4 years. I also recently developed ear pain. Are these all TMS related? I think I do fit in with the "TMS personality" described by Dr. Sarno. I work very hard at things I love (such as physical conditioning, guitar practice, etc...) and am pretty hard on myself when it comes to failing at anything. I feel low self esteem when I have trouble achieving things, and I worry alot.
I've been reading Dr. Sarno's book "Mindbody perscription" for about 2 days now (I read about an hour of it a day) and I REALLY hope this works. I'm skeptical I admit, but I'm trying to accept the theory as fact (as I understand this is crucial to recovery).
I'm starting college in about a week and I really need to recover from the hand problem fast or I'm in serious trouble as typing for long periods of time is excruciatingly painful for me. I've been through all kinds of treatment both conventional and alternative including drugs, massage, the Egoscue method, trigger point therapy, and magnets all to no avail. I'm desperate to recover quickly from this as I want to resume working out and playing guitar again (the guitar is what led to me getting this). I've had to lay off of almost every single hobby I enjoy for the past year and a half and I'm really hoping this mindbody thing works.
So... I'd really appreciate any advice those of you who've recovered from TMS have to share (particularly those who had RSI in their hands, as this is the thing I most want to recover from, over the back, knees, and ear pain). Apart from reading the book over and over till I get better (I'm on page 53 so far on the first reading) what can I do? Please give me clear instructions if you can, step-by-step mental excercises if you will. PLEASE be SPECIFIC. For example, I've read that I'm supposed to "meditate" on what's causing my problems... how do I do this?
I just really need help in recovering from this quickly, because like I said, once I'm in college typing out papers constantly I'm going to have trouble.
Also, what's the probable timeframe for recovery? Is there any way to force a reaction like that described in "Helen's" letter in the book to get better instantly? Also, will the recovery be gradual, with a progessive lessening of pain or will I just wake one morning completely better?
Thanks alot for any help! |
Edited by - IcyScythe on 08/28/2006 15:32:35 |
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ndb
209 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 15:57:16
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Hi,
Welcome to the forum. You're at the right place. Your RSI is most certainly TMS.
I recovered comepletely from RSI in my shoulders and hands. I listened to Sarno's audiobook Healing Back pain one night, and the next morning the pain had reduced by 40-50%. Over the next month, I read Mind Body Prescription, and followed the guidelines in it like writing a journal about my rage and painful emotions, and in a month, the pain reduced to 0.
Many others on this forum recovered completely from RSI after suffering for five years and more, mine only lasted a year, and luckily, I found the cure. To read about their successes, use the search feature, and search for 'RSI' and/or 'Successstory'.
The first thing to get yourself to believe is that your condition is HARMLESS, though it may be VERY painful at the moment. So don't worry yourself about your load in college. Read the book, and follow its guidelines. For example, to meditate on your problems, spend fifteen minutes a day introspecting, or talking to yourself about things that have made you angry, your feelings of low esteem/ worthlessness, etc. This will open the door to painful emotions you're repressed.
best,
ndb
ps, go to
http://podolsky.everybody.org/rsi/
the web page of a person about how they recovered from RSI using Sarno's technique, and many other links to people who recovered from RSI. |
Edited by - ndb on 08/28/2006 16:00:17 |
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IcyScythe
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 16:03:54
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Ok so I should talk to myself outloud about any painful feelings in general (past and present)? Thanks for the advice.
What other mental "excercises" should I do?
Should I wait till I recover before resuming guitar playing and weight lifting or would this be acknowleding the problem is physical and hamper my recovery? So should I start playing now or wait?
Thanks again! |
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carbar
USA
227 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 16:20:37
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Hmmm, I'm just gonna go ahead and give you some unsolicited advice because...
RSI plagued me all through college, and I was much the worse for it. RSI for me "came from" my clarinet playing and web designing. I gave up both hobbies and typed all my papers for college using dragon naturually speaking. This sucked. So did not having IM. I really regret not being able to fully enjoy college and my own potential at that time...
So you wrote:
quote:
Apart from reading the book over and over till I get better (I'm on page 53 so far on the first reading) what can I do? Please give me clear instructions if you can, step-by-step mental excercises if you will. PLEASE be SPECIFIC. For example, I've read that I'm supposed to "meditate" on what's causing my problems... how do I do this?
I just really need help in recovering from this quickly, because like I said, once I'm in college typing out papers constantly I'm going to have trouble.
I think that approaching this as something "quick" will not get you the best results. I suggest seeing this recovery period as a way of getting to know yourself and your emotions better. It's GREAT that you recognise yourself in Sarno, it sounds like you are right on. However, exploring your self/reactions/awareness will be something that takes some time.
So, don't get discouraged! In fact, I might even suggest trying to take it easy, if that's possible. Could you take some time off or take 1 less class or work a little less so you have time to focus on the mental/emotional side of this? Make time to sign up for a yoga or meditation class? I would go so far to say, maybe you might even want to take a semester off and evaluate...
If you expect it all to happen at once, this is setting up a potential failure (TMS kinda thing to do!). So, if you just take it little by little and appreciate new insights, awarenesses....this might be better.
I find it really helpful to take a mind over matter approach here. HELLO, we are YOUNG VITAL people. Our bodies do not have any reason to feel chronic pain! You can do it! But, be ready for it to be a process. And look for support here and in real life!
I hope this way helpful in anyway! |
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IcyScythe
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 18:13:21
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Thanks for the advice, and anyone else PLEASE feel free to post your own! I'd really appreciate it.
Also, does anyone know of a TMS practitioner in South Carolina, or fail that, North Carolina or Georgia? I didn't see any anywhere close to me listed on Dr. Schecter's website. |
Edited by - IcyScythe on 08/28/2006 18:13:55 |
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sonora sky
USA
181 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 18:15:48
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Hi, IcyScythe. I agree with carbar: giving yourself a specific "deadline" for recovery will likely produce more anxiety and panic, as you constantly try to evaluate if it is getting better each day or each moment and worrying whether it will be better by "D-day." This thinking may hamper your recovery. But I do identify with you--once I find the answer to something, I want to make it happen *immediately,* and I get frustrated if it seems to be taking "too long." The more I obsessed about my TMS pain--the way it felt, the intensity of it, and when and if it would ever let up--the more negative attention I gave it, the worse it got.
Recovery for TMS is different for each person, and it is a process of indefinite length. Some see doing TMS work as a lifelong process of growth and discovery. You are YOUNG  , so try to relish in the fact that you have discovered the path to recovery now and try not to focus too much on what the status of your pain might be in the future. I know this is isn't exactly the advice you were looking for, but though you will hear about specific techniques that worked well for some of us (and they may work for you, too), keep in mind that healing psychological/emotional-based pain is not always as straightforward as slapping some neosporin and a band-aid on a cut. Seeking a quick fix or a specific formula to aleviate your pain might become discouraging if you don't see results as fast as you would like. If you go into this expecting an experience as rapid and dramatic as Helen's, you may be setting yourself up for frustration and disappointment.
As Sarno says, focus on the emotional root of the pain instead of on the physical pain itself. Have you tried journaling? If you haven't journaled before, Dr. Schechter's Mindbody workbook might help get you going.
Good Luck,
SS |
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IcyScythe
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 19:10:16
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Thanks for the advice... I'll try not to worry about college coming up.
So with this journaling thing... what sorts of things would I write down? Can you give me some examples from your journals (if it's not too personal)?
Thanks! |
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sonora sky
USA
181 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 19:44:14
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I know there are some on this board who journal regularly--hopefully they will post, too. Journaling can be quite beneficial, though I might not be the best person to ask. I'm always gung-ho about it at first, but I tend not to stick with it for long periods of time, especially if I start to feel better. I can give you a few common questions from Schechter's 30-day workbook (which can be purchased at www.mindbodymedicine.com). He expects those doing his workbook to read Sarno every day (even if only a short amount) and reflect on what you read: how it resonated with you, if any of his case studies remind you of yourself, etc. He asks you to explore possible connections between your symptoms and your emotional state. He asks you to describe what's going on in your life (emotionally) each day and try to explore why you might have felt or (re)acted a certain way. He slowly encourages you to become more active and asks you to report on your improvement, even if only baby steps. Listing stresses and fears, as well as how you deal with anger are all common topics. These are just some of the questions that are delt with in the first week or so of the program. The questions get more in-depth as the weeks progress. There are only a few questions listed per day, so it's more about reflection, focus, and quality rather than quantity.
Some people use their non-dominant hand (which would be the left hand for right-handed people and vice virsa) to tap into their id or 'inner child.' This has been discussed in previous threads, so you may want to do a search for "journal" or "journaling" on this forum.
Best,
SS |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2006 : 20:56:48
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Congradulations! You have arrived at the correct diagnosis. You have TMS. I'm envious because I was a lot older before making this discovery.
Great advice from the group. Just wanted to suggest in your journaling that the emotion that is causing your symptoms is in the unconsious so you can't readily feel it. Speculate on each of the important people in your life and sit with the question of how you might have anger towards that person even though you can't readily feel it.
Ooops got to run. Good luck. |
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HilaryN
United Kingdom
879 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 04:23:57
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Great advice from carbar and the others.
I'm also a RSI-recoverer and I agree it's important not to put pressure on yourself to recover quickly. That could be counterproductive.
You asked about resuming activities which appear to aggravate the pain. Sarno advises not to resume these activities too soon as it takes time to recondition your mind.
Once you feel you have absorbed the concepts, I would advise a gradual return to activity. As a temporary measure you could get Dragon NaturallySpeaking to help you with your college assignments.
Hilary N |
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neilo
United Kingdom
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 05:30:09
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Hi there
Ive taken a keen interest in your post because you symptoms are very similar to mine. Im a keen guitar player and PC user. Have had pain in the forearms wrists and hands for 6 years. have tried stretching methods as described by Sharon butler. Had some improvement with the "armaid" device but the pain continues. I have also had pain in my left knee for just over a year. This has put a stop to my karate practice. I read the sarno book last month and am now slowly re reading it.
When i am reading the book, i beleive in it totally. When im away from the book such as at work i start to lose beleif in it.
I guess i just haven't had any kind of eveidence yet to suggest TMS.
I'll stick with it though.
I am now picking up the habit of talking to myself often about whats bugging me, not the obvious things like the weather but whats underneath. Ive always tried to avoid confrontations and emotional issues with myself and others and always tried to hide my temper/emotions.
These are habits i am now trying to change. I am finding it hard going but change is never easy.
I haven't really noticed any reduction in pain but am not as scared or feeling as helpless as before.
These pains are strange thats for sure. I can't play guitar for long but can do DIY projects no problem. I can't train in karate any more but can go hill walking for hours. Im not totally convinced i have purely TMS with no physical damage but i do know that this is wierd.
I hope to keep in touch with you to see if either of us improves.
good luck.
nm |
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ndb
209 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 06:12:04
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I saw a TMS therapist in Atlanta, GA: Dr. David Lipsig. (do a search on him on this site).
I agree with the others...give yourself time to immerse yourself in what the books say and absorb it before going to the therapist. Also, do not put pressure on yourself to do it (the journalling etc) 'perfectly'. If you believe in the ideas of why you are having pain, it will start your recovery.
An example of something I wrote in my journal: 'I hate my parents! I hate the way they made me feel when I dressed in nice clothes or tried to make myself look nice. I felt like they were always secretly laughing at me or dissapproving. Its because of them that to this day I am so self conscious. F*ck*ng assh*l*s! I hate living this way.'
That may have sounded trivial to you (I did choose something that wouldn't give away too much), but it was a big deal to me, and when i relived the emotions my parent's behaviour caused, I felt a lot of sadness and anger. I found it was very cathartic. So just get started writing your thoughts down...anything you've felt angry about/ caused you to feel worthless, and try to feel how you felt at that point. This usually gets the feeling to come out for me.
ndb |
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h2oskier25
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 07:22:02
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ndb wrote
quote:
An example of something I wrote in my journal: 'I hate my parents! I hate the way they made me feel when I dressed in nice clothes or tried to make myself look nice. I felt like they were always secretly laughing at me or dissapproving. Its because of them that to this day I am so self conscious. F*ck*ng assh*l*s! I hate living this way.'
Excellent Example.
I completely recovered from RSI that was so debilitating I gave up everything but my job, and even that I did "half-assed" so as not to flare up. For years I was effected.
I'm completely recovered now. I appreciate the new appreciation it gave me for life.
You are obviously a sensitive person going through a tough life stage right now. You are so lucky to have correctly recognized it as TMS.
Journaling -- the example above is GREAT. I've read a good way to start your nightly journal is "I feel . . ." and usually the rest flows. Some of your feelings ARE going to stem from your anxiety relating to your supposed RSI, and that's normal, but the journaling that's really going to help is the other feelings.
REMEMBER, RSI is NOT REAL. Your pain is generated by emotional feelings repressed in your unconscious, and NOT a sign of anything actually wrong. Remind yourself of that as often as you can, and pretty soon, your brain will start to work on processing the True feelings that have brought you hear.
I have a success story on this site. Do a search on SuccessStory: and RSI and you'll find it.
I have a nice script I used a lot at work to get me back thinking along the write lines. Send me an e-mail with your address and I'll forward it along.
I think the Yoga is a great idea, as well as a hypnotherapist. Help to relax you and let those repressed feeling find their way out.
Your recovery IS a journey. Can't be rushed, but I'd throw myself into the journaling and reading and re-reading Sarno a couple hours a day.
Regards,
Beth |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 11:02:22
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Hi Icy,
People have already given you great advice, and the referral to Rachel's page is really helpful. Also Nate McNamara's page at http://conquerrsi.com/. He has wonderful suggestions for concrete things to do, and I did pretty much all the stuff he suggested (there's lots of reading, especially of successful recoveries and TMS info, but also other things). His story is for me the single most inspiring RSI/TMS recovery story I've read.
I also recovered from RSI, after three years of very severe pain. My SuccessStory is on the site and I have more info about my recovery methods at http://lyspeth.com/rsi/treatingtms.html. It took me only 6 weeks, with the biggest change in the first 2 weeks, but I agree with what others have said about timing. Pressuring yourself or giving yourself a deadline will probably not help. On the other hand, I would not necessarily advocate taking time off before college, or taking a light load. I recovered while starting my first full-time salaried job, and the joy I got as I was more able to take up my duties there was a big motivator for me, and it was an excellent testing ground for my improvement. However, I looked at it as "I have nothing to lose trying this", more than "I must get well because otherwise I can't do this new wonderful job" (although the latter was true, and my awareness of the fact that I had run out of other resources was probably a factor in making me "desperate enough" to really try Sarno -- a lot of people need to be desperate in order to give it a proper try, and apparently I was one).
I did a lot of my improvement by "experiment" -- I would try something, keeping in mind that it could not hurt me. I got this idea from Nate's page, and it worked well for me. But it might not be the right approach for you. The journey is very personal, and the key is your belief in the TMS keystones. It doesn't need to be 100% perfect belief to work, but a general level of belief that they are plausible and applicable to you is essential, and most people say that the best way to acquire that belief is reading the books and journaling to uncover some emotions that may be behind your pain. (BTW I agree with the assessment that others have made: your symptoms sound like classic TMS. I also had accompanying symptoms like knee, back, and foot pain.) I found it also really helpful to make "the list" of all the pressures I felt I had. I was astounded by how long it was and after that I had a great appreciation for the amount of pressure I experienced and it was a big relief, like "Oh, no wonder I feel crappy! Look at all these things!" Just acknowledging that was really great for me.
Best of luck with your recovery. I believe you'll be back to everything you love in no time. Let us know how things go. I know it may not feel like it now, but you are lucky to have found Sarno so early and your college and post-college years will be much happier because of it.
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Wherever you go, there you are. |
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IcyScythe
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 15:02:27
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Wow thank you all so much for giving all that advice AND your success stories. You have no idea (or maybe you do ;)) how much of a confidence booster that is. I'd pretty much given up being able to ever seriously play guitar again (or violin, which I really want to learn) or work out or even just play computer games. I'm pretty pessimistic (I should probably work on that too...)
I'm really excited about this!
So, pretty much I'm just going to try to immerse myself in Sarno literature and keep telling myself it's all mental. I'll try journaling too. Should I write down conscious feelings too or are the only ones that are significant the unconscious ones? |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 08/29/2006 : 15:34:06
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As far as journaling, any emotional issue goes. Most people find it works better if they don't focus on the symptoms, although usually we are also worried about those, and it's okay to write about that worry. But that's part of the distraction that the TMS has been making, so focusing on other issues is preferable.
Remember, Sarno's three causes of rage are:
1. Problems in childhood
2. Personality traits such as perfectionism and goodism that pressure the inner child (sometimes the personality is related to childhood issues)
3. Pressures of daily life
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Wherever you go, there you are. |
Edited by - armchairlinguist on 08/29/2006 15:38:02 |
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carbar
USA
227 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 16:44:13
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quote:
Pressuring yourself or giving yourself a deadline will probably not help. On the other hand, I would not necessarily advocate taking time off before college, or taking a light load. I recovered while starting my first full-time salaried job, and the joy I got as I was more able to take up my duties there was a big motivator for me, and it was an excellent testing ground for my improvement.
Just one clarification here on taking time off: I say this because I feel like us TMS personality types do things because we are supposed to, it's the external or internalized pressure to do the right thing, do the best job, etc. So, I don't know your college situation in this light, but I think maybe you want to consider while you are expoloring your emotional stuff what you want to get out of college and why you wound up where you did. Your own choice versus pressure from others.
In the same light, I think keeping busy and challenged is really important to healing, so if time off were to occur, I'd say doing in a structure way, like an abroad program, or working a full-time job would be the way to go. Sitting around probly never made anyone feel better from anything!
Okay. Good luck with the school year!
Carolyn |
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Andrew2000
40 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2006 : 20:22:30
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So, I don't know your college situation in this light, but I think maybe you want to consider while you are expoloring your emotional stuff what you want to get out of college and why you wound up where you did. Your own choice versus pressure from others
Well said ... these words ring true for me as well -- when I think back on my college experience years ago -- at the time, I suffered from terrible RSI symptoms and had no idea what was happening ... in fact it got so bad I had to leave school ... (I was a piano player) ...
My advice is: keep a clear head; read the right stuff; journal and/or talk to those you feel comfortable with about all of your emotions -- the good, the bad, the ugly; try to let all of your emotions flow to the surface without judgement; learn what matters most to you and why you have chosen the path that you are on ... (vs. why others have pushed you onto a particular path) ... and most importantly, trust and believe in yourself - you have the power to feel and stay well. Always.
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marytabby
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2006 : 15:52:45
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Icy,
I am going through a similar issue with my left wrist. It's not typical carpal diagnosis but tendinitis. TMS doc said keep working at it, it's NOT structural. I have to hope to God I make progress cuz 4 months with this is killing me. Let me know if you have any suggestions of what works for you. You can email me privately if you want via my profile. Mary |
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IcyScythe
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2006 : 16:53:10
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Ok well I'm seeing some *slight* improvement. I don't want to get too excited though, I'd hate to get better partially but never truly recover. It's been 8 days or so since I started tms treatment. If I continue to improve at this rate, I could see myself playing guitar and typing again in 3 or 4 more weeks. I've read the entire Mindbody Prescription book and I've just started "Healing Back Pain" after which I'll re-read the first one. I've also been journaling 10-15 minutes a day (I read the book about 40 minutes a day).
We'll see how this goes. Anyone on here who prays, please pray for me! Thanks!
@Mary: Wow you're really lucky (or blessed) you find out about TMS in only 4 months! It took me a year and half and some people on here far longer. In terms of what I do, I'm just doing everything the people here reccommend (just read through the thread).
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marytabby
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2006 : 17:14:33
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Icy, I am not new to TMS, I had this a year ago along with back issues. The problem is the wrist crap is back.
Keep me posted on how you do. |
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Tendonitis/RSI in both hands/wrists
