| Author |
 Topic  |
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
 Posted - 04/07/2013 : 12:06:57
|
| If its so simple why does it take a long time and intense effort to be certified? |
 |
|
|
alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 12:21:19
|
pspa, the tapping is the easy part. Like in EMDR, waving your finger is easy. The difficult part for a practitioner be it EMDR or EFT is to go pass the patient's defense mechanism and interpret subtle reactions or twitches.
The big difference between EFT and faster EFT is that for EFT you construct a setup sentence. In faster EFT you feel it. The reconsolidation is at the end.
Robert Scaer writes about Brainspotting which is a derivative of EMDR. It is a slower EMDR but where every change in facial expression is analyzed.
chickenbone, you read the same things about Gary Craig and EFT. He started from Callahan's TFT which was pretty arcane and simplified it. |
Edited by - alix on 04/07/2013 13:00:35 |
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 12:35:40
|
| So grabbing your wrist, exhaling and saying "peace" achieves a reconsolidation of emotional traumas? You will have to forgive my skepticism. |
|
|
|
alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 12:39:35
|
pspa, you use a peaceful scene or a happy memory. Frankly EMDR is no different on this point. The reconsolidation is at the end and you use a sentence and a memory.
Peter Levine's Somatic Experiencing is also similar where you "renegotiate" a traumatic scene or you imagine a non traumatic ending.
Robert Scaer finds some interesting similarities between primitive tribal ceremonies (that he studied) and some of the practices like EMDR or EFT. Yes it is all pretty goofy and a year ago, I would have been rolling my eyes reading such nonsense... But the fact is that I emerged from 10 years of chronic pain. Of course I cannot pinpoint what helped the most.
I had CBT psychotherapy and that was as goofy as saying "peace" to be honest. |
Edited by - alix on 04/07/2013 13:19:06 |
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 13:07:11
|
| Going to a session with a Matrix Energetics practitioner pretty much turned me off to all of these so-called energy modalities. I suppose I could be doing the baby and bathwater thing. I do notice that one or more of the Faster EFT practitioners also do Matrix Energetics though. |
|
|
|
alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 13:17:55
|
pspa, I completely understand. Maybe EMDR would be a better fit as there is more logic to it. It allegedly inhibits temporarily the amygdala but the reconsolidation is the same.
You should listen to the Dr.Robert Scaer podcast. He strikes me as a no-nonsense guy that suffered from trauma and chronic pain himself.
http://shrinkrapradio.com/321-the-brain-in-trauma-and-ptsd-with-robert-scaer-md/ |
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 13:21:29
|
| Thanks Alix. As I do like to read -- even though I fully endorse the notion that one hits diminishing returns pretty quickly after Sarno in this area -- I ordered his most recent book. I was particularly interested in his views on trauma. |
|
|
|
plum
United Kingdom
641 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 13:49:08
|
quote:
Originally posted by chickenbone
I guess I just still don't get it. I read quite a bit on Robert's website. He has basically no qualifications, is a self-proclaimed guru. Just because a lot of people are stupid enough to follow him and pay him money to do what they could do themselves does not impress me much. He also uses the tactics that Bernie Madoff used to suck in thousands of investors to their financial doom, he pretends to make it difficult to buy into his schemes so that people think this is a select, discerning crowd. He, as well as others like him, is just another carnival barker to me. There will always be those people. I do not follow them.
One thing I have learned during my healing is that you must OWN your own healing or it will not last. I think I have healed and I have the ability to fix myself during flare ups of the TMS. My sleep is much better and I have no pain. My anxiety is greatly reduced. I still plan to do EMDR with a qualified therapist. I recently had a 3 day flare up of pain, but I knew why, what forces were at work. I have now a completely different relationship with pain than I had before. It does not frighten me, I consider it a warning signal. I am able to figure out what I need to do to make the pain go away. I (my mind) is both the creator and the fixer of pain. The only bout of pain I had in 4 months has healed in 3 days. Ace's keys were the cornerstone of my recovery. Then EFT made my recovery faster. I have also confronted very traumatic childhood memories and am able to recall them with almost no bad emotion. Right now, I am in the process of discovering all the false beliefs I have developed over the years and modifying them. These false beliefs and defense mechanisms have mostly been the cause of my emotional problems.
I have no need of someone like Robert Smith. However I do hope to find a caring, legitimate, qualified therapist like Dr. Alexander to help me with EMDR to put the finishing touches on my recovery.
chickenbone, it's wonderful that you've come so far in your healing. Your words are invariably an inspiration and an insight, and maybe this is why I'm puzzled by your antipathy towards Robert Smith. He's not my dream therapist either but for the last two weeks I've been working on myself, my own healing, for free. Maybe I am stupid but I've been feeling better. Maybe I need a break from the crushing negativity here. I really have enough to contend with. |
|
|
|
eric watson
USA
601 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 14:59:44
|
I think your all heroes- different strokes for different folks that's all- we all don't think the same I know from working with a lot of good hearted people and were all in the right, what works for you is good- cherish it and never let it go -master it if you want and in time youll see more powerful experiences from other systems, we grow with time, learn to think about each stone you pass, in time you will build upon that cornerstone and make a beautiful home- I think the best is already hear and I thank you all for being my friends-
if we grow together we stay together- were all front runners don't you guys ever forget that. |
Edited by - eric watson on 04/07/2013 15:02:41 |
|
|
|
plum
United Kingdom
641 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 15:27:00
|
quote:
Originally posted by eric watson
I think your all heroes- different strokes for different folks that's all- we all don't think the same I know from working with a lot of good hearted people and were all in the right, what works for you is good- cherish it and never let it go -master it if you want and in time youll see more powerful experiences from other systems, we grow with time, learn to think about each stone you pass, in time you will build upon that cornerstone and make a beautiful home- I think the best is already hear and I thank you all for being my friends-
if we grow together we stay together- were all front runners don't you guys ever forget that.
Your generosity and kindness are soothing balms.
The way you are, who you are and your expansive view is my touchstone for healing. |
|
|
|
chickenbone
Panama
398 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 15:29:24
|
I am not trying to be unsupportive or negative here. I just hope that some of you are not going down more blind alleys. EFT does not need a practitioner. And if you want to have one, that is ok, but it is certainly not the practitioner who must get past all of your upsets and defense mechanisms. It is YOU who does that. No one can do that for you. They can help guide you, that is all. Robert would certainly not be my choice, but I respect all of your decisions and sincerely wish you the best of luck. I am often wrong.
Shawn, can I ask you what you did with EFT and why you thought it did not work for you? It has always been my impression that the "type" of EFT does not matter. |
|
|
|
plum
United Kingdom
641 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 15:43:33
|
I'm simply confused by your answers. Robert Smith teaches you how to do it yourself so no practitioner needed.
I'm not sure how learning how to do this from a video is so different from book-learning. I also don't understand how learning a self-administered, life-long skill is a blind alley. |
|
|
|
alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 15:47:50
|
Chickenbone, there is no difference between what Gary Craig and Robert Smith offer. They both give for free the videos or manuals and they offer classes or seminars separately for a fee.
There is no need to see Smith to practice fasterEFT. You can just follow the tutorial.
|
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 16:09:22
|
Assessment of the Emotional Freedom Technique, An Alternative Treatment for Fear By Wendy L. Waite - Department of Psychology and Neuroscience, University of Lethbridge, Mark D. Holder - Department of Psychology, Okanagan University College. The Abstract states: The effectiveness of the Emotional Freedom Technique (EFT), a treatment for anxiety and fear, was assessed. One hundred nineteen university students were assigned and tested in an independent four-group design. The groups differed in the treatment each received: applied treatment of EFT (Group EFT); a placebo treatment (Group P); a modeling treatment (Group M); and a control (Group C). Participants' self-reported baseline and post-treatment ratings of fear were measured. Group EFT showed a significant decrease in self-report measures at post-treatment. However, Group P and Group M showed a similar significant decrease. Group C did not show a significant decrease in post-treatment fear ratings. These results do not support the idea that the purported benefits of EFT are uniquely dependent on the "tapping of meridians." Rather, these results suggest that the reported effectiveness of EFT is attributable to characteristics it shares with more traditional therapies. Read the full article at: http://www.srmhp.org/0201/emotional-freedom-technique.html
This article is cited frequently as evidence that EFT is effective. That's weird, because the actual results show no difference between EFT and a placebo treatment. |
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 17:57:41
|
| Shawn millions of people testify to the efficacy of homeopathy too. As you know controlled studies sometimes are useful to weed out placebo effects. I am not debunking EFT or faster EFT, just pointing out that testimonials alone aren't necesarily convincing. |
|
|
|
chickenbone
Panama
398 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:35:12
|
| Ok, Alix, thanks. I understand. |
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:37:22
|
quote:
Originally posted by shawnsmith
Not a solid argument pspa123
*************************
“Living up to an image that you have of yourself or that
other people have of you is inauthentic living – another unconscious role the ego plays.” -- Ekhart Tolle
So you accept homeopathy, acupuncture, chiropractic, Matrix Energetics, detox foot pads, and so forth based on testimonials? If not, what's the difference? |
|
|
|
eric watson
USA
601 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:53:11
|
[quote]Originally posted by pspa123
Shawn millions of people testify to the efficacy of homeopathy too. As you know controlled studies sometimes are useful to weed out placebo effects. I am not debunking EFT or faster EFT, just pointing out that testimonials alone aren't necesarily convincing.
[/quote
Eric)- There convincing to me - its been around 5000 thousand years-
how much more evidence do we need =
the Chinese use it in
different forms- it comes in tai chi I think and reflexology, qi gong, and so many more- This is the system they use to heal from everthing.could that many people a billion be wrong after all this time? do you think all these people are lying or its just a good placebo?
And ten yrs. ago when I took my two year course I doubted the whole time and didn't get nothing but the lessons after I started to tap the way I felt it in shifts I knew I had a tool and I added it to my nlp and psychology with visualizations and have a style or form thats used with sarnos book leading the way
Pulling it all together- it gave me a chance to believe again cause eft and faster eft and tms healing therapy mixed with TTT or tensive thinking therapyGuys its a lot of love ya know- love
let me clear the air on my learnings
I've stated many times I healed from the pain reading sarnos book
this was after id given up and lay bedridden for a year
initially ten years prior I was healed by a faith healer - it sent shock waves through me and boom - healed, all except the sciatica-
and the fear of the pain returning along with a lot of distress did bring it back on ten fold- hence sarnos book
we have to know I studied therapeutic psychology for 15 years as a hobby because that's what I've always loved -by the time I was 30
This was all home study except the 2 years of psychology I got from college- by the time I went to college I knew it would take me at least six to eight years of their studies before id get close to getting to where I already was-So I opted for the two year degree and moved on.
As I've stated before I was in helps - hands on for 13 years-
These helps consisted of preaching , Faith healing, Higher learning teaching and becoming an nlp practitioner.
I've seen so many miracles at the hands of faith healing alone that if I was to tell you - it would be hard to believe but it still holds true- I just didn't think it was possible for me and in my heart I knew id find a way and I did. As you all will
I just couldn't get my own subconscious to know self healing was put here for me and every other person looking to self heal
So to sum it up- after all these studies and more than I can add to one thread I ran across sarnos book and it was almost like I was reading the parables of Jesus coming from an MD. I read Steve Ozanichs book and
I jumped right to it.
After the body pain left I still had extreme anxiety which I fixed with Robert smiths fastereft and Claire weekes books along with the nlp training which has the reconsolidation process also Robert smiths faster eft has the reconsolidation process.
Then those memories that I couldn't get outta my head that were screaming at me by day and night. with the revived hope that self healing is true. I resumed my nlp studies which quickly vanished the phobias or nightmare scenes id lived with for so long. this type of fear I know can be healed with fastereft, eft, nlp, emdr,
See I had to have my own eyes open from sarno then all my combined studies could come to fruition.
that's a lot of studies - and id rather keep it simple
I learned a long time ago different people heal in different ways and that's why I don't argue if 1 method is better than the other
I know sarno is the eye opener as if the lady that sent shock waves through my body wouldn't have been an eye open -
it took me 15 yrs to understand nlp so unless you want to start at 101 I wouldn't go there less you know where to start- its real and it works
claire weekes works just look at baltos post and hill billys
fastereft is awesome and the reconsolidation process is an experience to get. you have to stumble upon it unless your eyes are open to it.
this is truth- all great teachers lead to the rd of healing if it works for you and if it don't I wouldn't knock it cause one day that practice might be the one that heals you
, nlp works and a lot of tolle and aces keys- Claire weekes amd with notes from steveo and his book with to many studies to mention I got that uh-huh moment and they all clicked and now I haven't met a person yet that doesn't like some combination of those forms,
its like were scared to say we use other styles with sarnos teaching- we all have our own built in self help system then what weve learned then we watch ,and having someone to help with these styles isn't bad but if you got about a year and dedicate yourself you can learn enough to heal anything from terror to anxiety to pain,
We truly do have the answer- its about knowing sarnos works if that's the silver bullet- it was for me when I learned all this really is true and it isn't just about positive thinking cause most time im feeling not that great before I work whatever style that day that helps me in my own mind- or other forms works in different ways releasing negative energy and the more of the you loose the more you begin to heal
we should all read sarno first then if something helps you when you apply another style and it helps you no matter never forget that style but in time you'll want to venture and see the grass on the other side
Get all the books of hope and wisdom that you can get your hands on, before this is over everyone going to be grabbing all the great teachers books. there's tons of tapping styles, there's tons of nlp styles. Theirs the tms healing style, and there's soothing styles are meridian lines are proven scientifically to exist and it has no merit with bats wings - I didn't know about if they were there till I learned the system- eft has tons of attributes the same as faster eft 2 members of the same team.
all these styles that psychotherapeutic are from sarno and he back them up and Dr. Alexander backs up these styles. |
Edited by - eric watson on 04/07/2013 19:19:33 |
|
|
|
pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:58:55
|
| Eric yes it could be placebo in the case of some of these things. The placebo effect is extremely powerful. Several studies have shown that false acupuncture (needles in random locations not on so called meridians) works just as well as real acupuncture. If people believe it can work, then it can work. Fake knee surgery was shown to work just as well as real knee surgery. Countless thousands swear by homeopathy, chiropractic, detox foot pads, anything and everything. In some drug trials as many as 50 percent of people who took a sugar pill for depression made substantial improvement. It goes on and on. |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
Topic removed -- too many haters
