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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
 Posted - 10/06/2011 : 08:54:08
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Doing an informal survey here, on the MINDBODY continuum, do you consider your symptom to be more physical or psychosomatic? For example, my most debilitating symptom, my "arthritic" right hip, I consider to be physical rather than TMS-psychosomatic. But, I've "cured" myself of numerous other "injuries" through TMS "psycho" thinking.
So, for purposes of this survey would you categorize yourself as a PSYCHO or a PHYSIO? I put myself into the PSYCHO category for sure.
Where do you stand (or lie)?--PSYCHO or PHYSIO? |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2011 : 12:26:00
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This is an interesting query since I'm assuming most people who are dealing with TMS would somewhat by definition think of their symptoms as psychosomatic..
Of course the day to day rub for many is just this question. |
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jaya
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2011 : 10:29:00
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| psycho... all the way baby-proved it time and time again since childhood.. when you leave umpteen doctors offices with more questions than answers, you know somethings up--i wish i had figured this out 42000 dollars ago, my credit card bill reminds me every month. |
Edited by - jaya on 10/12/2011 10:53:54 |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 10/12/2011 : 11:09:36
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| Don't beat yourself up jaya. Most people never figure this out. Give yourself all due credit. |
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jaya
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2011 : 10:21:06
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sometimes im a little to "smart" for myself..if i was a little "dumber" i wouldnt have these physical symptoms at all..im pretty sure of itquote]Originally posted by art
Don't beat yourself up jaya. Most people never figure this out. Give yourself all due credit.
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2011 : 10:54:35
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Tennis Tom,
I am sorry to hear that your hip keeps dogging you after all these years.
In response to your query, I truly want to believe that these pains (feet, back, groin etc) I have experienced these past 7 years are psychosomatic in origin. Yet despite all of my efforts I cannot shake the idea that something is physically wrong with me but they have not found it yet. This keeps me in a constant state of anxiety and there is a feeling resident within me that for these past several years my life has been put on hold --despite the fact I went back to school and completed another degree -- and I may remain in this condition forever. I get severely depressed at times as no one -- not even my dear wife who is so close to me -- understands what I am going through. If you were to look at me you would say I am the picture of good health and all of my medical exams point in that direction. Yet doubts remain and I am afraid. |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2011 : 16:41:46
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Shawnsmith, I was where you are for many years. I died so many times from heart attacks, I died so many times from brain tumor, I was paralyzed with back pain, testicular cancer, stroke... you name it and I had it. It was all in my head.
Conquering an army is easier than conquering your own thought. I live with fear and constant worry about my health for years. I wasted a big part of my life living in fear. Yes, Fear. All we have to do is quit fearing it. Quit fearing the symptoms, quit fearing what the symptoms would do to us then we will be cure. Easier said than done right?, but one day I just did it. I told myself that I had all kind of tests and exams, I have been to doctors after doctors and they found nothing wrong with me. I thought I have all these diseases and yet after years I am still alive. Why don't I just quit fearing it, quit affraid what these pains, these symptoms can do to me for just one week. JUST 1 WEEKS I would refuse to be affraid, just one weeks I would live life to the fullest. Just one week I would go any where, do anything I want to do, eat anything I want to eat even if I think it is bad for my health. Just one week I will refuse to think about my health for even one moment. So what if I die, so what if I have tumor, cancer, nerve damage.... Just one week I will enjoy life. I can go back and continue to worry again after that one week, but for that one week I will not be affraid of anything. Nothing, no sir, not this week. Chest pain, so what. Foggy head, palpitation, so what! back pain, groin pain, feet pain, so what! Constipation, urgency, insomnia, so what! headache, shoulder ache, leg pain, so what!... you name it, so what! If that fear thought, if that worry thought get in your mind, kick it out. Tell it: hey you, I'm not scare of you this week. So what if I die, I don't give a sh.. what you can do to me. I'm going out with my wife and enjoy the night. Get the f... out of my mind.
Do you want to take the jump and free yourself from pain or do you want to continue to live that horrible, depressed life? Take your choice. You have to do it with all your heart. Quit being affraid. That kind of life you have right now is not worth living and it is because of your fear.
In that one week I did more for my health than 10, 20 doctors did for me in 10 years. My confidence rise. My positive thoughts crowded my negative thought, my pains lessen, and within a month I was healthy and happy and back to my real self again.
Quit your fear and the pain, the anxiety will cease.
Stay positive, stay involve, and surround yourself with people and the pain, the anxiety will not come back.
Goodluck. |
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patils
72 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2011 : 07:41:04
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quote:
Originally posted by balto
Shawnsmith, I was where you are for many years. I died so many times from heart attacks, I died so many times from brain tumor, I was paralyzed with back pain, testicular cancer, stroke... you name it and I had it. It was all in my head.
Conquering an army is easier than conquering your own thought. I live with fear and constant worry about my health for years. I wasted a big part of my life living in fear. Yes, Fear. All we have to do is quit fearing it. Quit fearing the symptoms, quit fearing what the symptoms would do to us then we will be cure. Easier said than done right?, but one day I just did it. I told myself that I had all kind of tests and exams, I have been to doctors after doctors and they found nothing wrong with me. I thought I have all these diseases and yet after years I am still alive. Why don't I just quit fearing it, quit affraid what these pains, these symptoms can do to me for just one week. JUST 1 WEEKS I would refuse to be affraid, just one weeks I would live life to the fullest. Just one week I would go any where, do anything I want to do, eat anything I want to eat even if I think it is bad for my health. Just one week I will refuse to think about my health for even one moment. So what if I die, so what if I have tumor, cancer, nerve damage.... Just one week I will enjoy life. I can go back and continue to worry again after that one week, but for that one week I will not be affraid of anything. Nothing, no sir, not this week. Chest pain, so what. Foggy head, palpitation, so what! back pain, groin pain, feet pain, so what! Constipation, urgency, insomnia, so what! headache, shoulder ache, leg pain, so what!... you name it, so what! If that fear thought, if that worry thought get in your mind, kick it out. Tell it: hey you, I'm not scare of you this week. So what if I die, I don't give a sh.. what you can do to me. I'm going out with my wife and enjoy the night. Get the f... out of my mind.
Do you want to take the jump and free yourself from pain or do you want to continue to live that horrible, depressed life? Take your choice. You have to do it with all your heart. Quit being affraid. That kind of life you have right now is not worth living and it is because of your fear.
In that one week I did more for my health than 10, 20 doctors did for me in 10 years. My confidence rise. My positive thoughts crowded my negative thought, my pains lessen, and within a month I was healthy and happy and back to my real self again.
Quit your fear and the pain, the anxiety will cease.
Stay positive, stay involve, and surround yourself with people and the pain, the anxiety will not come back.
Goodluck.
Thanks Balto, You quote is really true and definately will inspire many who has been stuck.
Great Great Post.
Only way we can remove fear is face it. There is not other way. People get stuck because their mind is creating doubt and keep cycle going.
Untill they understand their symptoms are harmless, they are not going to face it. Even if they face it, symptoms will defeat them.
So read liturature that increases understanding of these benign symptoms. One of best book is
" Mental Health Through Will Training" by Abraham Low. Read chapter,
" The Myth of nervous fatigue" That will give you re-confidence.
Thanks all,
Sachin Patil
Doubt is poision for healing.
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2011 : 08:13:44
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quote:
Originally posted by shawnsmith
Tennis Tom,
I am sorry to hear that your hip keeps dogging you after all these years.
In response to your query, I truly want to believe that these pains (feet, back, groin etc) I have experienced these past 7 years are psychosomatic in origin. Yet despite all of my efforts I cannot shake the idea that something is physically wrong with me but they have not found it yet. This keeps me in a constant state of anxiety and there is a feeling resident within me that for these past several years my life has been put on hold --despite the fact I went back to school and completed another degree -- and I may remain in this condition forever. I get severely depressed at times as no one -- not even my dear wife who is so close to me -- understands what I am going through. If you were to look at me you would say I am the picture of good health and all of my medical exams point in that direction. Yet doubts remain and I am afraid.
Welcome back Shawn and thanks for the kind words on my hip. I would recommend getting a DX by a TMS physician, have you ever gotten one?
==================================================
DR. SARNO'S 12 DAILY REMINDERS:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0dKBFwGR0g
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2011 : 14:14:32
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Thanks Sachin Patil for your reply and your mention of Dr. Abraham Low's "Mental Health Through Will Training" which I have read from cover to cover no less than 5 times. I attended recovery meetings for 6 months and they were tremendously helpful as we read through and discussed his work. After reading his book I went out and bought a car and am driving it with great ease, something I could not do for years due to fear of traffic. Everyone can find benefit from reading Dr. Low's work.
Thanks also to Balto for your words of encouragement and inspiring story. I am glad you feel better than you did in the past.
To Tennis Tom, no I have not had an official TMS Dx. Here in Canada such doctors do not exist, period. |
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kesh2
United Kingdom
32 Posts |
Posted - 10/15/2011 : 16:03:54
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tennis tom i have a question for you.
do you find tms hip pain coexists with arthritic hip pain?
not the same as your hip, but i think there'a an anecdote in HBP about mild hip arthritis with a great deal of nearby tms pain.
and does anyone find that tms seems to spring up in places where real injury has occurred? the injury, and maybe a diagnosis of injury, acts as a nocebo to extend the life of the pain and make it worse. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2011 : 06:18:29
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quote:
Originally posted by kesh2
tennis tom i have a question for you.
do you find tms hip pain coexists with arthritic hip pain?
not the same as your hip, but i think there'a an anecdote in HBP about mild hip arthritis with a great deal of nearby tms pain.
Yes, TMS is the volume control for the pain. All my HBP's are loaned and lost at the moment.
Cheers
==================================================
DR. SARNO'S 12 DAILY REMINDERS:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0dKBFwGR0g
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
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Wodg
Australia
89 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2011 : 06:30:00
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| Great post Balto. Many times I've been at that point and backdown |
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Ace1
USA
1040 Posts |
Posted - 10/24/2011 : 20:25:50
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| Dear balto, are you completely pain free now? May I ask, did you continue to challenge the pain till it went away, or did you just live your life without fear? Did you also have to change your reactions to your life situations or just really ignore the pain and not worry about it? These are the questions I'm not really sure about, your answers would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance. |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2011 : 15:59:03
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Hi Ace1, I have not have any tms symptoms or anxiety symptoms for more than 5 years now. The pain, the anxiety started in 1991 and completely left me in 2006. I am very content and at peace most of the time. I do get nervous like any normal person, but it never turn into anything like tms anymore.
The pain, At first I fought it, cursed it, ignored it. Then I chose to accept the pain, the symptoms. I reason with myself, I have many talks with myself that the pain is there, it is there for a long long time and I haven't die or paralyse yet. It has emotional causes. My fear of it doesn't do any good for me. Fear doesn't lessen my pain at all, it even make it worse, so why fear it. Whatever happen I'm not going to be affraid anymore. You have to realize that most of us can handle the pain. Most of us are not affraid of the pain, what we fear is what will happen to us, to our body. We thought the pain is signaling to us that there is something very wrong will happen if we don't do something to fix this.
If you can get rid of the thought that something could happen then we will be cure. For example:
- Back pain -> you fear permanent nerve damage, paralyse.
- tendonitis -> you fear permanent nerve damage, lost of arm use.
- chest pain -> you fear heart attack.
- headache -> you fear you have brain tumor.
- anxiety -> you fear you're going crazy, have a stroke,....
you get the idea. just refuse the fear what could happen when you have a certain symptom then your pain will reduce and leave you eventually. Whatever the symptoms, just think what exactly is that you fear of. The pain is telling you your brain doesn't like some of your thoughts, your emotions. It is not what is wrong with your body. Don't be fool by it.
What good is fear do for you? think about it. What good is fear do for you?
I don't change my reaction to every day life situation. I just try to set a limit on how long I would be upset, piss off, angry, scare... at something or someone. I told myself my peace is more important than _____________ (fill in the blank). Also, If you read some of my old posts, I have made many changes in my life to improve my peace. My goal is to be in control of my thought most of the time. I don't want it to wandering around aimlessly. I try to surround myself with positive people, build meaningful relationships. I traveled and volunteered. I simplified my life, trying to elliminate as much material need as I can.
I wish my English is better. I Hope this help Ace1. |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2011 : 19:41:43
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Good post, Balto. I agree, the fear is much, much worse than any pain. It is the MEANING we attach to the pain that matters. That is really the only thing that matters for me. For example, I have a very high pain tolerance...as long as I know the pain is harmless. When I am running a marathon, sometimes there is a lot of pain the last few miles. That's perfectly fine because I know it is harmless and will end shortly.
On the other hand, this mostly mild pain I have had in my arm for nearly a year is sometimes unbearable, simply because of the meaning I attach to it. I say, why has this lasted so long no matter what I do? Maybe there is something very wrong. Maybe it will last the rest of my life.
And this plantar fascitis I have had on & off for almost two years, that disappears completely for several weeks or longer and then mysteriously reappears; what's that all about? No rhyme nor reason. I get frustrated because I can't figure out the logic of its coming and going.
Other examples: high PSA score. I must have prostate cancer even though biopsy found nothing. Low back pain: I must have herniated a disc. I have many, many other examples, but some of them are so laughable I'm too embarrassed to mention them. |
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Ace1
USA
1040 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2011 : 07:59:21
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| Thank you Balto, dont worry you english is very good. So really the changing of the life and how long you will be angry etc, did not really make the pain go away, just the removal of fear, right? If so, why are you trying to obtain more peace? How about if you were about to bend or do something to use the painful part (when you were in pain), didn't that just naturally create fear in you, not because of what might happen, but because of the pain itself? You say you fought it at first, did that perpetuate the pain for you? In other words is it just living your life normally, without challenging it and with out restricting it, just going about your buisness and knowing it'll go away on its own? Thank you so much your answers and your post is EXTREMELY helpful! |
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Ace1
USA
1040 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2011 : 08:12:55
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| By the way Balto, I am going to print your previous post and read it frequently, thats how good I think it is. I look forward to you next post. Thanks |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2011 : 19:54:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Ace1
Thank you Balto, dont worry you english is very good. So really the changing of the life and how long you will be angry etc, did not really make the pain go away, just the removal of fear, right? If so, why are you trying to obtain more peace? How about if you were about to bend or do something to use the painful part (when you were in pain), didn't that just naturally create fear in you, not because of what might happen, but because of the pain itself? You say you fought it at first, did that perpetuate the pain for you? In other words is it just living your life normally, without challenging it and with out restricting it, just going about your buisness and knowing it'll go away on its own? Thank you so much your answers and your post is EXTREMELY helpful!
I tried to obtain more peace because at first I was able to get rid my symptoms, but the symptoms keep coming back even when I don't have any big negative issues in my life. It took me a long time to realize that the symptoms can come back due to 'conditioning' and overly sensitive nerve. By seeking a peaceful life style I would regain my confidence, desensitize my nerve and elliminate all the chances that tms can come back.
Conditioning is pretty hard to get rid of too. Tennis Tom is very good at describing what exactly is conditioning. When I have a chance I will write about my own experience on how I overcame my conditioning problem. Conditioning is anything you were able to experience with no problem before you have this tms disease now would bring on the symptoms. Example: I can drink coffee with no problem before I have tms, but now drinking coffee would give me a panic attack. I can go through the tunel, ride the airplane, go to a crowded place... but now those things will bring on symptoms. That is conditioning symptoms. The symptoms happen even there is nothing wrong with your body, there is nothing stressful in your life at the moment. Desensitize and a peaceful life style will help me regain my confidence in my health and over come those conditioning fears.
In that one week of refused to fear in my post above, my mind was so set with refuse to fear that I forced myself to do all the things that normally would caused pain and fear. I play tag football with my nephews while having sciatica and back pain. I took my wife to a movie and you know the last movie I saw before that night was Dances with Wolves back in 1991, I think, because I was affraid of crowded places. I went to see a good friend and asked him to jog with me and take me to the emergency room if anything happened to me, I was fined. I keep forcing myself trying to make my symptoms worse but it didn't get worse, the opposite happened, it got better. My focus on the pain start to became less frequent. In a shortime I start to be able to accept my pain, my symptoms. I thought of them just like I have a cold. I will be miserable for a few days and it will get better.
- stop being affraid of what the pain, the symptoms could do to you and the pain will be gone in some time.
- Do the thing you fear to desensitize your nerve.
- talk and explain to yourself about the conditioning process to de-conditioning yourself.
- Make positive change to your life to reduce stress and minimize the chances that tms can come back.
Goodluck Ace1. |
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Ace1
USA
1040 Posts |
Posted - 10/27/2011 : 16:17:33
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Thanks again balto,I will try it. I have already improved dramatically, but it is that last annoying 10% that I have had trouble getting rid of fast. Although I never restricted, I never went out of my way to do activities that would aggravate the area on a regular basis. I also always had a feeling of fear, without any perticular reason. I have tried to change my feeling to one of strength no matter what and this has made a big difference. I am also kickboxing a punching bag, which hurts, but I'm getting better at it. If you could just give a very brief description of how you overcame your conditioning, that would be great unless, you have already mentioned it in your points on the last post. It looks like just 1 month got rid of your symptoms so, I will try and see what I get.
Thanks again for all your help |
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Hillbilly
USA
385 Posts |
Posted - 10/27/2011 : 17:32:49
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For anyone interested in doing exactly as balto and I have to recover, please read Paul David's book, "At Last A Life." In that book he chronicles his struggle with panic and fear and nervous symptoms (which I strongly hold are exactly what TMS is) and how he used the knowledge he gained from reading Claire Weekes' book Hope and Help For Your Nerves in order to get past his 8-yr-long struggle to live beyond the bounds of his house. He talks about the many doctor visits that showed nothing out of the ordinary, ruminating about ever being cured, and many other experiences inside his head that caused him to cower inside his house and hope for the pains and nervous attacks to go away.
The only thing that worked for him was to go back and live fearlessly as before, and although it took a while for his system to calm after years of mental and physical conditioning, he persevered and won his freedom. I did the same. Balto did as well. You can too. Get to it!
I hate quotations. Tell me what you know.
Ralph Waldo Emerson |
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Are You a Physio or a Psycho?
