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missangel
USA
26 Posts |
 Posted - 04/16/2009 : 08:50:24
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For those who don't know what a trigger point is, in simple terms, it's a small area of muscle that's tightly knotted and very sensitive to pressure. It can refer pain to other parts of the body. Example: some headache pain or dizziness can be attributed to trigger points in the neck.
Before I learned about TMS, I had been using "The Trigger Point Therapy Workbook" to 'deactivate' some of my trigger points. It took about a month, but the knots gradually broke down and disappeared. The book states they can be formed from ongoing stress and negative emotions, leading to continuous muscle tension. So are trigger points secondary to TMS? Sounds like it to me. But since we're not supposed to use any physical remedies during TMS treatment, should I no longer massage my trigger points? I still have some at the base of my skull on the back of my neck. |
Edited by - missangel on 04/16/2009 20:22:28 |
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PRCalDude
49 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2009 : 14:38:32
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The trigger points are definitely secondary to TMS. I have that same book.
I had trigger points in my piriformis and a bunch of other places that wouldn't go away no matter how much I tried to massage them out - they'd always come back. The thing that worked was realizing that they come from the restricted blood flow caused by brain. Once I started viewing them (the trigger points) through the lens of TMS, gave up the massage, and tried to ignore them, they started disappearing. |
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missangel
USA
26 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2009 : 20:27:41
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| It's really good to know your trigger points eventually disappeared without massage. Before I knew about TMS, I had assumed they were RSI related. TMS makes much more sense. |
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scd1833
USA
124 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2009 : 22:49:08
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| trigger points ARE TMS! sarno mentions them in one of his books. it's all the same stuff TMS... the more you pay attention to it, the more it distracts you... |
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Effie
USA
46 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 20:04:36
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I had that book, too -- I also had all the other ones in that series. From my own personal experience, trigger point massage just aggravated and prolonged the pain. Once I discovered TMS, I stopped the trigger point massage sessions, and they went away on their own, so I sold all those books on Amazon for a nice little profit!! 
Oh - and that "backnobber" thingy is now a nice chew toy for my bullmastiffs! |
Edited by - Effie on 04/17/2009 20:06:06 |
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polo
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2009 : 10:19:37
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i also have the same book and needless 2 say have a nasty trigger point in my upper right trapezius. hard as a tennisball and literally push down until i penetrate (major pai/followed by relief)
i def hope this is another deadly web of TMS- been bothered by it for over 2 1/2 years |
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SRW
2 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2009 : 16:51:34
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| I have trigger points in my glutes - medius and maximus, piriformis, and quadratus lumborum - all right side. I also have the same book that you reference. What I find is that when I work the trigger points - they and their referred pain get worse and not better and it hurts for days afterward. |
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missangel
USA
26 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 14:21:27
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| The trigger points I was able to work out were along my scalene muscles. It aggravated them for the first week, but then it got better and they were gone after 3 more weeks. I'm not sure if I should work on the other ones I have left or wait for them to go away on their own. |
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 14:39:36
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| for some reason, these damn trigger points are the one thing I haven't been able to make go away long term--my right shoulder is usually knotted up. i can ignore it most of the time, and it goes away for periods, but it gets annoying. definitely TMS, though... |
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Northerner
62 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 21:32:23
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My trigger points - generally in the left scapular area - disappeared when I stopped going to physical therapy after I was comfortable that I had TMS (and the physical therapist said that we seemed to getting nowhere on them, as they moved a little here and there, and he'd been pushing on them for a year, but they hadn't gotten better).
I am an old man and have known a great many troubles, but most of them never happened.
- Mark Twain |
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polo
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2009 : 08:46:21
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so tension type headaches with major tight band over eyes and major pain in neck/base of skull- IMO caused by trigger points in traps are all tms related??
had great week last week/weekend after reading sarno book and felt great monday/worked out hard and then WHAMO! woke up yesterday with all pains ramped up to highest level. neck pain/base of skull ached/tight band over eye headache/traps trigger point size of racquetball.
what the heck happenned - was pain legit or tms related. very frusrating |
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Northerner
62 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2009 : 12:06:35
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Someone help me with the exact reference on this one for the poster polo above.
There was a study cited somewhere in the TMS literature/books in which they found oxygen deprivation in the shoulder muscles of people with headaches. This is in line with the oxygen deprivation tehory that Dr. Sarno has proposed as an explanation for TMS.
I am an old man and have known a great many troubles, but most of them never happened.
- Mark Twain |
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Jorgen_C
8 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2009 : 13:07:09
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I've read an article where they identify trigger points in muscles after only relatively short times (30s to minutes) with blood/oxygen deprivation. I couldn't find it again I'm afraid. I have a bunch of trigger points in my back but I've stopped worrying about them now that I know about TMS. By logic, when whatever is behind my TMS dissolves so should the trigger points.
I also read about a guy who's participated in many autopsies and said he'd never seen a single trigger point in dead muscle tissue. ut that's just from his mouth, so don't take it too seriously. |
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Hillbilly
USA
385 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2009 : 08:57:25
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"Trigger points are the hallmark findings of TMS," from HBP. Evidently, when Dr. Sarno does his examination, he feels for these things. Some people call them tender points, others trigger points, he uses neither. This physiological change in the muscle tissue is what keeps people tuned in.
If you read the author's story of "The Trigger Point Therapy Workbook," you will see that he was riddled with anxiety from early on in life, and had a terrible sensitivity to sound. Much of the back of the book is devoted to teaching people how to relax. Wonder Why?
I hate quotations. Tell me what you know.
Ralph Waldo Emerson |
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missangel
USA
26 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2009 : 15:17:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Hillbilly
If you read the author's story of "The Trigger Point Therapy Workbook," you will see that he was riddled with anxiety from early on in life, and had a terrible sensitivity to sound. Much of the back of the book is devoted to teaching people how to relax. Wonder Why?
Good point. I had forgotten about the relaxation techniques in that section. |
Edited by - missangel on 04/23/2009 17:11:56 |
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rubymineroad
3 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2009 : 18:07:32
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| There is a new article on WebMD on alternate treatments for fibromyalgia, regarding massage. It mentions that its important to apply moderate pressure, its the pressure that makes the difference. Its important to move the skin and see the finger indentations in the skin. Seems like their researcher of many years, found that light massage or stroking doesn't help. And patients from the study have fewer tender points and less pain. Interesting article might be worth looking at. |
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harihot
1 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2009 : 11:34:33
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Like many others , I too have suffered trigger points for many years. The worst are in guteals & piriformis , right hand side.I too have tried massaging them with tennis ball etc but all I do is make them much worse . The trouble is that I find it very hard to resist pressing on them as they sort of scream at me to do so & in the first instance they do ease the pain but very quickly they rebound & hurt more than ever. I am a firm believer these are caused by tms.
Do any others have the same difficulty as me in being unable to resist pressing on their trigger points even though it makes them worse & if so please tell me if you have any hints as to how to resist. |
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can TMS cause trigger points?
