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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
 Posted - 05/28/2007 : 14:55:35
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well....MRI tommorow...not sure where to go w/ this post. I'll say that 4yrs ago I was completely cured w/ sarno after a year of crippling bk pain, and 2 herniated discs.
But, now I'm 4 mos into this terrible relapse, the pain is different. Feels "real" this time. Of course I thought it was real b4 too. Which 1/2 of me thinks is attributed to a post traumatic experience (the experience is still lingering actually), and 1/2 of me thinks its because of an "impressive physical incident".
I'm kinda embarrased because I used to tout Sarno to the point I got tired of it, and now am Hiding my condition out of embarrasment. If you've noticed I'm enjoying Baseball's posts because that was me the last 4 yrs. I guess I just have to follow thru w/ Sarno's golden rule of getting checked out conventionally 1st. Thanx for listening. |
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Littlebird
USA
391 Posts |
Posted - 05/28/2007 : 15:29:49
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Hope the MRI results will provide what you need to feel sure one way or the other. Let us know how things turn out for you.
Best wishes, Corey |
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electraglideman
USA
162 Posts |
Posted - 05/28/2007 : 15:37:12
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I can understand wanting to talk to a group of people about something they have experienced. If you have been pain free for the last 4 years I don't think an MRI will hurt anything but maybe your pocket book. Hey, no shame in that. Better safe than sorry.
When you find out the MRI shows the same thing as the last except for maybe some age marks it will help speed up your heeling process when you do your TMS home work. |
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sensei adam rostocki
USA
167 Posts |
Posted - 05/28/2007 : 16:49:33
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Best of luck for a positive result. One way or the other, you will get some peace of mind and stop wondering...
CURE-BACK-PAIN(dot)ORG |
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salamander
85 Posts |
Posted - 05/28/2007 : 17:27:46
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The problem that I have found with getting an MRI is that it will undoubtedly show up something. Herniated disks, degenerated that, slipped this, cracked that, enlarged dipsoid, elongated parsiple, the list goes on.....
Now you run the risk of buying into whatever the medical establishment wants you to believe. I'm a firm believer that you should rule out any "real" medical problem. However, the tendency for us TMS sufferers is to want to assign blame to a physical problem, no matter how much we believe in Sarno's teachings.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that you will most likely have to go through a new period of "repudiating the physical". Fortunately, Sarno cover practically all the so called back problems that are really TMS. At least all you have to do is review Sarno books to set your mind at ease.
Regards,
Doug |
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LadyBug
USA
54 Posts |
Posted - 05/28/2007 : 18:16:31
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Of course it's smart to check out new symptoms. We will be waiting to hear from you! If and when the half of you that believes it is the remainder of the PTSD wins this battle, we will be here with you. Hang in there and best of luck.
No Good Deed Goes Unpunished |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 05/28/2007 : 20:03:17
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Hi Skizzik,
What was the "incident" that triggered your pain?
There's nothing to be embarrassed about. Whether your pain is due to a legitimate structural injury or TMS psychosomatic causes, your pain is real. Once again there is nothing to be embarrassed about.
From my understanding of TMS, about 80% of pain is TMS and 20% is legitimate. Legitemate injuries can morph into chronic TMS pain due to emotional overlays. TMS pain can be a complex dynamic depending on what is going on in your life at the time.
My hip pain has been dx'ed by two TMS docs as NOT TMS and some of each, but I have some doubts so I pursue a non-surgical approach, (much to the distress, displeasuure and dismay of most of my acqauintances, who would love it, if I would get a replacement). There is always time for that. I have learned more from my old hip about my sport, other people and myself than I ever would have from a shiney new hip joint.
Hang in there, Skizzik, and just regard the MRI results as one part of your dx. There is usually a conservative approach to every injury. Your knowledge of TMS gives you the upper-hand in deciding whatever course is best for you.
Good Luck!, and I enjoy your sense of humor at the board and positive attitude.
Cheers,
tt 
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 04:51:23
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littlebird,electraglideman,sensei,salamander,ladybug,tennistom, thanx for the kind words.
I am looking for "peace of mind" and hopefully few "age marks"
TT, well, I was hummin along for 4 yrs like I said. W/in that 4 yrs, I've built a new home, added 15mi to my commute, shoulder surgery, had my 3rd child, (not to mention unhappy upbringing) and thought I lost it all when last fall I was investigated at work for a "worktime violation". Basically not working when I should've. That led to confiscating my laptop which they were determined to find inappropriate material on.
For 8 weeks I became a mental wreck. Had to hide the investigation from friends and family for wife. She was a mess. When you have the perfect union utility job that you worked so hard to get and you may have "clicked" it all away, you go mental...
Fortunately, I never went to any bad sites, (but I was so nervous about things I clicked on on youtube etc... who knows how far they would take the innapropriate tag). Then I got a call from the union telling me everything would be alright a week b4 x-mas. That I would be suspended 30 days, and on a 2yr probation.
Now the phys incident was that I was so happy to be pain free, that I joined a gym year and a half b4 that, and started powerlifting 6mos prior to my mental trauma. Deadlifting, squatting etc. I gained 40 lbs or so. During my investigation, I lost 20# not trying, but continued to workout due to the stress.
When I got back to work in Feb, I noticed my lower spine was feeling worn more and more, but of course, I would chalk it up to TMS. Then, with not even using the wgts I used to, I came home from a workout on the 2nd day back to work w/ my spine very sore. I looked in the mirror thinking I may see bruising, but couldn't tell for sure. Then my wife asked if I had bruising, but then she said, no it's just the lighting. Well that flipped me out. What have I done???
The next day I had stabbing pain in my L5 or so. I worked out less and less because it would aggravate me. Finally none at all. I fell into a Malaise, CFS, shock that persisted for 6 weeks or so, and still go into horrific slumps. And the back pain is lingering.
And, here I am today.
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Edited by - skizzik on 05/29/2007 04:52:07 |
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 07:51:21
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| It sounds like you already know what is going on with you. Be prepared for an abnormal MRI, since they almost always are in some way or another. How will you deal with what they find? |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 08:44:14
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WOW, Skiizik, sounds like your recent life-cycle history is a formula for a TMS cocktail or H-bomb. The threat of everything you've worked for being taken away overnight is quite a TMS creating scenario.
I had a similar situation, just different events, causing my 'significant' depression which is an affective TMS equivalent. I lost a lot of weight like you did and wasn't hungry for the first time in my life. Dollars-to-donuts, you've got TMS. Don't get too work-ed up about the MRI. The Good Doctor calls the anomalies that show-up on everyone's x-rays "gray hair of the spine.
Keep doing 30 minutes of daily exercise to keep your mental strength up. The mind gives up before the body.
Some of my favorite excerpts from " _THE DIVIDED MIND_ " :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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spiritcloud
USA
12 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 09:51:04
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Good luck with the MRI.
I have this odd theory...I won't go into detail, but isn't any pain or condition created by the mind real? I mean...TMS causes things that can end up requiring surgery to fix if they aren't fixed the other way.
Rather than a distinction between "real" and "TMS" I think the truth is that all physical problems are caused by the mind somehow, whether it be pain or the flu or even cancer. Maybe the important thing that Sarno realized is that the mind has the power to not only cause, but repair anything that goes wrong with the physical body. (To a certain degree. Perhaps there is a point of "no turning back" with some problems. Especially with our finite minds.)
If I sound like a crazy psycho, you can feel free to say so. lol I guess the main thing I am trying to say is that even TMS symptoms are as real as any others. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 10:14:55
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quote:
Originally posted by spiritcloud
Good luck with the MRI.
I have this odd theory...I won't go into detail, but isn't any pain or condition created by the mind real? I mean...TMS causes things that can end up requiring surgery to fix if they aren't fixed the other way.
Rather than a distinction between "real" and "TMS" I think the truth is that all physical problems are caused by the mind somehow, whether it be pain or the flu or even cancer. Maybe the important thing that Sarno realized is that the mind has the power to not only cause, but repair anything that goes wrong with the physical body. (To a certain degree. Perhaps there is a point of "no turning back" with some problems. Especially with our finite minds.)
If I sound like a crazy psycho, you can feel free to say so. lol I guess the main thing I am trying to say is that even TMS symptoms are as real as any others.
You are spot-on SC, Dr. Sarno says the exact same things in his books--great minds think alike.
Some of my favorite excerpts from " _THE DIVIDED MIND_ " :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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Edited by - tennis tom on 05/29/2007 10:16:49 |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 12:14:51
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thanx doc z, tt and spirit.
I thought for sure you guys would come back and say, yikes you may have a real injury there, but it was nice hearing that you pretty much think I'm going TMS bonkers over here. Cool.
Just so hard not to keep thinking of me overdoing it in the gym w/ poor form while having trouble eating, sleeping, thinking...etc...
And that workout I remember I was stepping it up again since I was assured I still had my job.
TT, yeah, I went from 4000 cals a day (total bulk up) to forgetting to eat anything. Nice to know I'm not the only one.
Doc z, I don't know how I'll handle the results. If its the same diagnoses as 4yrs ago, I plan to be pain free soon. If there's more.......well...I'll be posting for sure..
Spirit, we're all crazy psychos here to the rest of the world..lol
Well, perhaps I'll post again, or have to run for my appt. I'll be E-waving to you guys as I'm rolled in to the unit
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Edited by - skizzik on 05/29/2007 12:16:49 |
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ralphyde
USA
307 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 18:34:35
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quote:
I mean...TMS causes things that can end up requiring surgery to fix if they aren't fixed the other way.
I disagree with this part. Dr. Sarno says many times that "TMS is a harmless condition." The above quoted statement could only add to one's fears, and make it more difficult to follow his treatment plan. Nothing about TMS requires surgery. In fact, "Losing one's fear and resuming normal physical activity is possibly the most important part of the therapeutic process." HBP p.81.
Ralph |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 19:38:50
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well I'm done. Had to be rolled out half way thru and given a shot because the doc ordered w/ and w/out contrast. So my blood w/b xtra bright in certain areas I suppose.
I asked the guy if he saw anything (since I can't see it or get the results till I see the doc) and he said nothing jumped out at him except for a couple bulges. He said he could'nt really determine anything else since he just takes the pics..etc..
What did he mean by a couple bulges? Already had a couple I knew of. I looked at my old MRI the other day, and I never realized how extruded one of the discs was. Hard to believe I Sarno'd it away. Or, even Sarno remarks a herniated disc may cause pain when it first happens, but not responsible for continued pain.
Whats continued pain? A week, month? What if I popped em again, and instead of taking it easy, I bulled thru it "returning to vigorous activity" to quick. I mean I have 3 kids that go on my shoulders regularly, and work carrying ladders etc..Will my healing time be delayed for this? Am I freakin out a bit here? Perhaps my biological hardware really needs 6 mos to a yr to heal up. I don't know anymore.
Gonna calm down now. Kids washed and put to bed. Go watch "House" and hit the sack. Hopefully, spine not stiff tommorow morning, I journaled stresses past and present and read MBP between jobs today. Thanx for all the support. |
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weatherman
USA
184 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 20:53:06
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Are you geographically near a TMS doc? One real catch-22 to the conventional medicine route - which I've noted before on this board -is that orthopods etc. can only confirm that something IS wrong, but very seldom that something ISN"T. As others have noted, an MRI etc. will doubtless turn up an abnormality of some kind, which leaves you right back at square one wondering whether your finding merits worrying or not. As an example, I had some back x-rays about 20 years ago by a chiropractor and was told I was developing scoliosis, etc. - and at age 50 have ZERO back troubles (knock on wood)despite a very active lifestyle for the last 30 years. Apparently it wasn't a great worry to me and my mind never grabbed onto it too much. I should note that I've had other problems that I would have gladly traded for a sore back.
If I were at the point of getting MRI's etc. I would probably look at shelling out a few 100 extra $$ for a plane ticket to see a TMS doc and settle it in my mind once and for all. But for now, read and reread the books, hopefully you can reconcile it yourself.
Weatherman |
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Penny
USA
364 Posts |
Posted - 05/29/2007 : 22:03:21
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quote:
Originally posted by skizzik
I mean I have 3 kids that go on my shoulders regularly, and work carrying ladders etc..Will my healing time be delayed for this? Am I freakin out a bit here? Perhaps my biological hardware really needs 6 mos to a yr to heal up. I don't know anymore.
Yeah, I'd say you ARE freakin out a little. Tough love here (((((((skizzik))))))
It's great that you got these tests done, but they may tell you you have herniated something or others and chime in with what you think (almost hope to save face) to be true ... e.g. that by their standards there is something physically wrong with you, and NOT TMS.
The fact that you shared your physical demands with us (e.g. your kids and work each day, and not being able to afford time to heal), well these things coupled with the fact that you feel embarrassed ... well, if I were a betting lass I'd say this is TMS.
Hang in there and keep reading the books, and don't wait for the doctor's office to call . Good to get it checked out, but be prepared ...
>|< Penny
"Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain."
The Great and Powerful Oz |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 05/30/2007 : 04:36:00
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thank you weather and penny.
Sarno is the closest I think, but per the secretary via phone he will only correspond thru mail w/ me since I'm not on Long Island..sigh..but I'll continue to search. Perhaps Sarno would look at the MRI cd?
thanx for the tough love penny!
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 05/30/2007 : 08:37:51
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quote:
What if I popped em again, and instead of taking it easy, I bulled thru it "returning to vigorous activity" to quick.
Hi Skizzik,
This quote jumped out at me from your post. Sarno doesn't say that bulging discs can cause continuing pain AT ALL, regardless of if you do the "right thing" or not. You are doing typical worst-casing symptom analysis here, thinking physical. Same with your worrying about what the x-ray tech says. He/She just takes the pictures! It takes a radiologist to analyze them.
If you had an incident so powerful that it is a post-traumatic experience, and you had TMS before, I would bet dollars to doughnuts you have it now. It is normal for TMS to come back and keep trying to distract us by preying on our fears about our bodies. Seems like this is where you are. Don't let the gremlin's tricks work...
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Wherever you go, there you are. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 05/30/2007 : 09:06:33
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Skiz,
I've heard that images may also be read in India now because it is cheaper. Hope they do better analyzing them there than the customer dis-info I get out of Bangalore from Dell and Magellan Navagation.
I think Dr. Sarno has an associate Doctor at NYU who may take his over-flow patients, don't know for sure--anyone know? Or look at the list for NYC here and at TarPit.com.
Also, Dr. Sopher appears to be quite generous in communicating. Can you travel to see him or talk to him about reviewing your images?
Some of my favorite excerpts from " _THE DIVIDED MIND_ " :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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Edited by - tennis tom on 05/30/2007 09:08:24 |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 05/30/2007 : 16:34:45
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thanx TT, armchair...
Got the report....I'ts ugly.....I think I'm scared....bummed for sure... |
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MRI tommorow......sigh
