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Susie
USA
319 Posts |
 Posted - 06/11/2004 : 12:54:13
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| Monte- I would love to believe you are correct. I was discussing tms with a friend today who is a believer in it. I realized during this discussion that I had some very strong equivalent symptoms in fifth grade and I am now 55 years old. Granted, I didn't know what was wrong with me then and I now have the tools to deal with it, but I really am a believer in the fact that people and personality patterns don't usually change. I hope you prove me wrong!!! In regard to this forum--I feel better after I read it everyday. Dealing with the causes of tms have given me a feeling of well being that I haven't had in a long time. I think advice from this forum is invaluable. I think our past experiences are more help to each other than any doctor we might find. Thanks to Dave for this opportunity. |
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Allan
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2004 : 18:51:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave
quote:
Originally posted by Carol
I would love to hear from any of you who have totally eliminated mindbody symptoms.
If anyone claims this, I would not believe them.
As I recall, there was a recent survey to determine if any people had completely recovered. I believe that there were several such reports.
Allan Masison |
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2scoops
USA
386 Posts |
Posted - 06/12/2004 : 22:38:26
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"As I recall, there was a recent survey to determine if any people had completely recovered. I believe that there were several such reports."
I believe that we can be healed of this pain. Like Kenny V always says there is hope. If we are willing to give up what we were taught and can say TMS is the cause of the pain, if we can ignore the structural and think emotional, than we can be cured. |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 06/13/2004 : 09:57:33
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Personally I do not think of TMS as a "thing" that needs to be "cured."
I believe as human beings we will always have some mindbody symptoms. We can rid ourselves of the chronic pain that we now know is psychogenic, that we may have previously attributed to structural problems. But I think it is unrealistic to expect that we will go through life never again to get a tension headache, or upset stomach, or a backache. We can strive to recognize the symptoms for what they are, and accept them as a benign signal to turn our thoughts towards our emotions. |
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Monte
USA
125 Posts |
Posted - 06/13/2004 : 12:02:58
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exactly, yes.
if you believe candace pert when she says our body is our
subconscious mind and if you believe that all thoughts and emotions
have physical locations in the body as scientist have proven and that all this occurs simultaneously in the body and the brain then all of this stuff is with us all the time. the good and the bad, since we label it such.
if you believe this and if you know your physical pain symtpoms,
the ones that are really bothering you, are tension related,
then why do we wallow in them. why do we continually discect them.
why do we ask for everyone's opinion of them. and why do we then believe when they don't go away after awhile, that then they must
have a physical "injury" component attached to them?
i'm just asking not lecturing.
imo, it is because we allow ourselves to take some responsiblity but
that we are afraid to commit and take full responsibility---because
that would mean we could fail, we could look foolish, people might make fun of us....it is fear pure and simple. if we put some of the
responsibility on our poor old unbalanced broken body then we can
rely on a doc to fix it. and this of course is socially acceptable.
even if the doc fails, that is socially acceptable as well.
susie, i'm not implying that discussion boards are the problem, of cousre they are an excellent way to relay info and participate and all of that... but they can be abused and relied on to fix the problem,- when in this disorder only You can fix or heal the cause,
because they are your emotions, your thoughgts, your beliefs...
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Allan
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 06/13/2004 : 18:10:35
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Once again I agree with Dave.
We can be completely recovered but there is always the TMS symtom appearing once again and we must just repeat the process. And the proces (cure), as stated by Dave again and again is to focus on the cause and not the pain.
Allan
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2004 : 07:45:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Monte
imo, it is because we allow ourselves to take some responsiblity but
that we are afraid to commit and take full responsibility---because
that would mean we could fail...
This is an excellent point. I think TMS sufferers might find that this statement applies to other aspects of their lives as well. |
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Texasrunner
USA
60 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2004 : 12:54:39
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| Obviously, it's not good to get overly caught up in thinking about TMS all of the time, as that in itself is counter-productive. And rather than think of "I have TMS" or "this is with me for life," isn't it better to simply be aware that your personality tends to react to stress in a certain way? For whatever combination of life experiences and personality traits, your own reservoir of rage is full and overflowing, that's all. And because the reservoir is unconscious, you don't deal with it and focus on a physical pain (TMS)which serves to distract you from the rage. But the awareness of that lets you go through each day without adding additional volume to the reservoir, and the waters subside. Your brain will still try to create pain as a distraction for you to focus on, but you are on to its game...so the reservoir does not overflow again unless you let it. |
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n/a
21 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2004 : 15:06:53
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Great summation points, Dave, Monte and Texrun.
And what POWER we have when you really think about the implications of this discovery about ourselves. No BATTLE needed:) |
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Fox
USA
496 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2004 : 13:48:13
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| Some of you guys seem to be saying that procrastination fits in with the perfectionism associated with TMS. I am definitely a compulsive perfectionist, but I am too much of a perfectionist to tolerate any (or much) procrastination behavior in myself. I don't see how the two personality characteristics can be related. It seems to me that most perfectionists would not allow themselves to be procrastinators. |
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Fox
USA
496 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2004 : 14:00:18
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| Being the perfectionist that I am, I must correct the error in my last post. I do remember reading a book by Albert Ellis, the founder of Rational-Emotive Therapy, which was the precursor to Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, many years ago which dealt with procrastination. Ellis did say that one of the causes of procrastination was perfectionism -- fear that the decision made or the action taken would be a mistake or would be regretted down the road. |
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2scoops
USA
386 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2004 : 14:11:54
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| Thanks for the post Fox. I am exaclty that way. That statement hit home. I am that way. I have procrastinated things because I thought too much about it. That statement makes a lot of sense to me. My life had to be perfect, so let's say if I know some girl would like me, I would think about ti so much that it would take me a long time to make a decision. I would a lot of the time come up with a reason not to ask her out. Then that girl would find someone else and I would get jealous, which in turn causes anger. Good connection Fox. |
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Carol
91 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2004 : 19:52:21
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Fox, your post regarding putting things off because we (perfectionists) are afraid of making a mistake really struck me. I had not thought of this as the reason for my procrastination, but now that I think of it, this really is a big factor. And often I get so frustrated with trying to over-research something before making the decision that I end up making the wrong decision anyway. What I am trying to do now is get as much information as I can and then try to use it wisely, instead of doing nothing at all because I might make the wrong choice. Realizing this has made a distinct difference in how I feel. I had dealt with so many issues for the past four years, and made a lot of progress, but a significant level of pain stayed with me anyway. Since I became aware of this procrastination thing I have improved steadily and may even get rid of ALL the pain eventually!!
Carol |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2004 : 09:42:50
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Perfectionism and procrastination really do go hand in hand when it comes to TMS. The root of the problem is low self-esteem and harsh self-judgement.
If we fail at something, we believe it somehow indicates we are a bad or deficient person. We can't live with the possibility of projecting this inferior image to others. If we take action, and it turns out to be the wrong action, it injures our sense of self-worth. So we procrastinate, don't take action, to avoid the negative feelings that we attach to failure. But avoidance feeds the low self-esteem anyway.
I try not to attach so much importance to everything I do. I tell myself, it's OK to try and to get it wrong, that is part of being human. If you make a mistake, you learn from it and move on. Everything does not have to be perfect. Sometimes "good enough" is OK.
This is the mindset I strive for, but like any bad habit, perfectionism and procrastination are difficult to shake. I just keep working at it. |
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n/a
21 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2004 : 10:14:21
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Thanks for your thoughts Dave, and ALL:
I like what Thomas Edison said about his struggles with creating the filament light bulb -- "Now I know 2,750 ways it won't work."
OK, for you perfectionists out there -- I may not have the # correct but you get the drift.
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n/a
21 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2004 : 10:20:09
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And, not to blab on, but as I read my post and had another thought -- Thomas probably didn't view his process as a "struggle" but as a challenge creating a whole different dynamic for himself.
This TMS thing is just an opportunity for me to learn who is really in my T-shirt. |
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Carol
91 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2004 : 14:57:56
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When I think back to my childhood and early adult life, it seems that there was never any positive feedback except for good grades in school, which were totally ignored by my parents. Only negative things were ever communicated, so the standard of perfection was set early on in my life.
My oldest daughter is very intelegent. Her first semester in college she got a GPA of 4.0. When I congratulated her she was rather thoughtful, and then said "do you realize Mom, that now anything less is failure?" That really made me think about the whole perfectionism thing. I work really hard now at giving positive feedback (when earned) to my grandchildren and friends. I did the same thing when I was a manager. I sure wish I had understood when I was young how easily a perfectionist is created, and how hard it is to be one!!
Carol |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2004 : 15:30:59
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| Good post Carol in regards to perfectionism. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2004 : 15:50:32
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| Good post Dave. The year Babe Ruth hit his record 60 home runs he also held the record for strikeots. |
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JayP
USA
54 Posts |
Posted - 06/21/2004 : 08:52:18
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Carol,
Your post certainly hit home with me. My parents, too, gave me very little positive feedback growing up. In fact, it wasn't until I was 40-something that I found out that the only reason I had to go to a math tutor as a kid was because my school began teaching "new math". When we moved, my new school still taught "old math" and I was way behind the 8-ball. All these years I felt ashamed and stupid that I needed a tutor. This is just one instance. I know my parents laid the ground work for my perfectionism, and it's something I've been dealing with all my life.
Your statement about how easy it is to create a perfectionist and how hard it is to be one is so true! Thanks for your post. |
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Give up tms!?
