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art
1903 Posts |
 Posted - 03/27/2007 : 04:09:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity18
Art,
You got to give it up. She's never going to get it. You've done a heroic effort, however!
Curiosity
You're right curiosity...I had the exact same thought. So discouraging though. Had Karen just seen this one thing,it would have made me much happier...
Sonora,
I still disagree in that I see the two acts as essentially different, or at least essentially different enough not to qualify as hypocrital...Still, I appreciate a nicely turned fine distinction and I'm glad of your slightly softened stance... , or more accurately, since it seems this was your stance all along, the fact that you went to the trouble of explaining it more...I appreciate your fairness..
And I have said I wish I could take that post back. I concede that it does fly in the face of what I said about a higher, "best" use of the forum...What makes the post different in my view is that it was a single, personal, one time, concrete request for assistance, said assistance to be rendered in a private, off list manner..There was simply no way for me to reach out for this assistance without resorting to a one time post...Karen could well have contacted her many friends on the list privately to solicit opinions...I think that's an important distinction...
Again though, I wish I could take it back..The very fact that yo've got me explaining and backing and filling all over the place should tell me something... |
Edited by - art on 03/27/2007 04:40:04 |
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alexis
USA
596 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 06:44:04
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| Karen, He can't stop. I know it's hard for you because you were put on the defensive, but really he can't stop and I think you're going to have to. If you can, just don't even open this topic again. No one is going to change a compulsive behavior right here in the middle of a thread. I'm pretty sure he wants to stop and he can't. I'm sorry this happened; it is very painful to watch. I won't be opening the topic again either. |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 06:52:31
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It's posts like these that depress me the most. Aren't you the one who suggested some form of autism? You haven't the slightest clue who I am, or where I'm coming from, and have in my opinion misread each and evry important social clue in this exchange...Autism indeed.
For those who understand where I'm coming from, you have my gratitude and appreciation, even if you don't quite agree with me...
The truth is I find it terribly uncomfortable to be involved in angry exchanges. But with discomfort comes growth. I'd rather hash things out, own my own mistakes and unpleasant emotions, and learn something in the process..
Edit: Having said all of that, I do agree that this has probably run its course...So unless anyone has something constructive to say, I'll retire from the field as well...
I hope Karen and I can go on being friends even though we've had our disagreement. As ever, I wish her the best and am sincerely sorry I caused her pain..Maybe we've both learned something...
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Edited by - art on 03/27/2007 08:23:44 |
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Curiosity18
USA
141 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 10:31:44
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Singer Artist,
You're absolutely right. I should not have referred to you in the third person. I am sorry for that. It's difficult for me to often watch your threads end up down the same path. I do wish you well on both your TMS journey as well as you artistic endeavors. My part in this thread is finished.
All the best,
Curiosity
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 11:25:23
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I woke up this morning with some trepidation as to what TMS blood letting would pour forth from my trusty (and grungy) old Dell Insperion 600. With the help of my trusty styptic pencil, i can once again see the sceen, (by-the-way, does anyone know why styptic pencils don't come with erasers?). It appears that an armistace has been declared and peace talks are being conducted by third parties. Some are being admistered to in field hospitals with lowered doses of pain-killers buoyed by the knowledge that they are off the battle-field while others are on the beach also lessening their pain.
Being a grizzled survivor of The Boarde Wars, it makes for an interesting perspective to view the skirmeshes and battles from behind the lines at Club HQ.
Having survived the ancient GW War of 20 Pages, now lost to TMS history, you have all fought bravely and valliantly for what your sub-conscious believe in--a jolly good go! Every board member should
test their id, ego and super ego in such fire. I see the Sensei has had the good sense to maintain his neutrality in this war, although he would have probably kicked some butt if he had entered the combat.
For some Tuesday morning quarter-backing, (I'm on the left coast, we only have 4 day work weeks, if that). It all started innocently enough with Karen's show and tell. Art added what I thought was a sincere heartfelt tangent regarding psychological motivations and the war errupted. You'd think someone had assassinated an Arch Duke or something. (Although with our congressmen packing, perhaps this might be a premonition of events to come...and I thought it was illegal to have concealed-carry in DC).
Being lame, I refrained from interjecting my iditotic, imbeclic views, except to say that "I voted for ArT". In the fog of war, Karen interpreted this as making me a foe...a prime example of the much misunderstood strategies used by the gremlin. i have retained my neutrality throughout the entire event and am exploring immigration to Switzerland, I'm crazy for fondue.
Some lessons to be learned would be if you lay yourself out in cyberspace, you might well expect every reaction under the sun, behind the moon and from black holes. Don't be surprised if some come out of left field and catch you off-guard. That's to be expected from the internet, who knows what people are thinking behind your back of you in the real-world--or is this the real world? Scan the respnoses, consider them all for possible validity, take it for what free opinions are worth, some people pay big bucks like $250 an hour for overviews that may not be as valid. Remember, your enemy who tells you the truth, is a better friend than a friend who lies to you.
Don't expend too much energy, give it your best shot and then go to brunch. Or if you have the energy, stay in the fray, until you're the last one lying on the couch. It can serve as a cleansing for the gray matter much like an upper-colonic.
For those who had the courage to tussle, thanks for the entertainment. I had it in pic-in-pic, along-side "Mad Cramer". I'm looking at Psychiatric Solutions, (ticker symbol PSYS:Nasdaq). Looks like it may be a good pick in the long-term.
Just my $22.22 worth, adjusted for inflation.
Cheers,
tt  |
Edited by - tennis tom on 03/27/2007 11:34:32 |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 11:37:00
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Alexis,
Thank you for your empathy and kindness..:))
Curiousity,
Thank you for the apology and well wishes..:))
Art,
Apology accepted and of course we are still friends..:))
Sending love and hugs to each and every one of you, especially the people who, in the beginning, treated this thread the way it was sincerely intended...I am very grateful!
Thank God this is over...
~Karen |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 11:50:04
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PS...I want to directly acknowledge the lovely people who were so supportive of me and my sharing of the good news...They are:
Shawn
ndb
sonora sky
wrldtrv
AnneG
Alexis
Wish I could meet you all and personally thank you from the heart!
lots of love,
Karen |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 12:41:49
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And I'd like to thank all those who supported me as well....
Curiosity18
TT
Flybynight (sort of, but I'll take it..
TT, as a veteran of many of those skirmishes myself, including the Big One, which got so bloody and all consuming that I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that civilization itself might have briefly hung in the balance...
Too bad it was relegated to the dust heap of threads deleted, because the generations to come after us might well have been able to learn something...As the man said (I'm not sure who, but it was someone, I know that) Those who forget history are condemned to repeat it...
TT, you and I have had our differences in the past, which is a little like saying Hitler and Roosevelt had a minor disagreement once (guess who gets the role of Hitler and who Roosevelt in my little passion play?), but I do appreciate your support on this one...More than that, as a writer, I know an appealing writing style when I see one..You're not without talent my friend, do you know that?
So TT, until the next bloody engagement, which knowing us might well be by the afternoon, I salute you...
A.. |
Edited by - art on 03/27/2007 13:25:26 |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 13:49:48
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Kudos to you too mate...stop
Politics makes strange bedfellows...stop
More later...stop
Have important meeting to attend at Yalta with Stalin...stop
Cheers,
see ya' on the putting green.
tt
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
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HelenB
17 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 14:56:16
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So I guess we're all done here, until Karen plays the "innocent victim" and comes back in a couple of months with some lame false TMS topic veiled in "Oh, please, go look at my art work. GEE, I don't for a single moment relate my art's popularity to making money !!!!!"
Then she'll get resistance, and play the innocent victim for the remainer of the thread.
Am I the only one feeling the deja vu?
Art, you were right all along, and you were piled on, the way it has happened to TT so many times in the past.
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 14:58:21
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| So, Helen...Who are you REALLY angry at?? There's a whole lot of anger and hostility in your words... |
Edited by - Singer_Artist on 03/28/2007 15:40:00 |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 15:01:56
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| And Helen...where in your life do you typically stir up controversy and bad feelings once they have FINALLY subsided...Interesting timing, indeed...Art and I made amends...But it seems you have some warped desire to stir things up again and hurt me in the process...Had you chimed in somewhere in the middle it would have been less obvious that all you are trying to do is cause more hurt feelings and more arguments between people...And truly, you don't deserve even this reply from me, not in the least. |
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truenorth
USA
83 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 15:25:18
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HelenB-
I couldn't agree with you more. |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 15:48:20
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Helen and TrueNorth,
I do not need to use my degree in Psychology to figure out why you both chose to speak now, when the dust finally settled and peace remained...You figured that I would be the ONLY one reading this any longer, since several people said it was their last comment in the thread...and so...you could accomplish two things..
1) hurt and/or anger me directly
2) release some hostility toward me (displaced, of course) and not have to deal with any of my friends on here calling you on it or challenging your stance...
Having a disagreement with Art was particularly painful because I care about him as a human being and respect him highly...But you, Helen, inappropriately attacked me b4, in the recent past, and several people DID call you on it! I am sure you have a vivid memory of that... How history does repeat itself, indeed! |
Edited by - Singer_Artist on 03/28/2007 15:43:26 |
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HelenB
17 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2007 : 20:23:21
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Karen,
I wasn't seeking to make you angry. While its like shooting fish in a barrel, it's not my intention. I don't get my jollies from it.
My intention was to support Art, who was sort of gunned down to a submissive position.
I didn't respond earlier because I haven't read the board recently.
History does repeat itself, as stated in my post, about you drumming up interest in your art through this forum, for whatever reason and as a by product of whatever. That has happened before.
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2007 : 07:02:43
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quote:
Originally posted by HelenB
Karen,
I wasn't seeking to make you angry. While its like shooting fish in a barrel, it's not my intention. I don't get my jollies from it.
My intention was to support Art, who was sort of gunned down to a submissive position.
I didn't respond earlier because I haven't read the board recently.
History does repeat itself, as stated in my post, about you drumming up interest in your art through this forum, for whatever reason and as a by product of whatever. That has happened before.
Helen,
For what it's worth, I know you weren't baiting Karen. YOu came to the party late, but so what? I don't see that as any sort of a crime, let alone a transparent one...I was going to lay low on this, but since you've mentioned my name twice as an object of support, and perhaps pity , I feel the need to thank you...I've not really backed off my initial position...I've merely taken Karen at her word that this time she was not trying to promote herself, in any one of the myriad ways people do that, ways both large and small, both personal and commercial, both forgivable and otherwise..
Since she's in the past tried to sell her work on this forum, she can't argue that she's never promoted herself in this way, and it seems to me that's something that's out there, for anyone to see, hence not worth hammering away on...She knows that's wrong...If not then, then certainly now...
I'm not even sure I've apologized to Karen per se...She says that I have and since I'm a peacable sort I see no need to quibble...What I am sorry for is hurting her, but I knew she'd be hurt going in, and I decided the issue was important enough, and she was strong enough, for me to simply regard her pain, and mine (and I have had some pain as a result of this thread) as necessary collateral damage...But that doesn't preclude feelings of empathy for Karen who clearly is a sensitive person..
My sense of Karen is she's a bit of a diva...a performer...Like most performers/actresses/artists, there's a bit of necessary let's call it self-involvement...I don't see that as bad, or evil in any way...It's part of who she is as an artist...But I do think it sometimes inevitably clouds her vision...I don't doubt for a second that karen is truly hurt and surprised when people react to her this way...so to the extent she better understands things now, I'd say that's a good thing...
As to me, I've got my own issues in this area...Possibly we all do. I like being liked, and it's been hard for me to hear the anger and bewildering "diagnoses" I've been given as someone who must have at least half a screw loose to be petty enough to even broach this subject..I must be autistic, or I must be compulsive, or I must be angry, or I must be simply bad...Oh the poor man, one poster implies, he simply can't help himself...
I invite those who have made their feelings known in this regard to do what I try to do, and what I suspect you and Curiosity do, which is to look within...
That's where the answers are...That's where the important truths are to be found.. |
Edited by - art on 03/28/2007 07:06:36 |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2007 : 12:52:41
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Art,
I DID NOT TRY TO SELL MY WORK ON THIS FORUM, EVER, darn it! Make up your mind, you say you believe me, then you take it back! Read my previous post again without a cloud of judgement in your eyes! In my previous post I was talking about tightness in my skull and all I did was MULTI TASK and mention my new website at the same time!...I never had my very own website b4 and I was excited to share it with everyone I know in cyberland and the real world..It was an innocent post, just like this one was, and many enjoyed it, that is part of why I did "IT" again!
It is beyond ridiculous that a post that should have been no more then two pages has turned into all of this! And, you are still insulting me and INDIRECTLY calling me a narcissist AGAIN by saying I am a self involved Diva! You are just saying it in a nicer, sugar coated way...I am not completely over the other insulting remarks and so the wound has been re-opened after reading this...(I admit I have a touch of the flu and a fever, so perhaps I am being over-reactive myself, but I cannot help what I feel!)
You even made sure to take back your apology, or clarify it and taint it's positive affect...All i have been doing since things supposedly were resolved is kissing your butt, trying to preserve our cyber friendship...When I never did anything hurtful to you in the first place...I hate this extreme goodist in me and how I cannot stand things being tense, especially with someone I like...Maybe I should finally just GIVE UP and realize that there is no way we are EVER going to truly resolve this issue between us. |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2007 : 13:09:40
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| That's not my memory Karen..I thought I recalled you asking if anyone was interested in buying, to let you know...If that's not the case, then of course I apologize for that.. |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2007 : 13:19:32
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| 1/27/07 a post by me entitled "tightness in skull"...Re-read it and see that I Never did what you are accusing me of... |
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"Good" Stress
