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seven
USA
35 Posts |
 Posted - 01/19/2007 : 04:24:45
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In Dr. Sarno's latest book THE DIVIDED MIND, the chapters on psychology explain:
[You don't have to necessarily get to the root of your psychological issues, you just have to understand that the TMS process exists and that psychological/emotional pain can cause psychosomatic physical pain. In fact if the issues are too traumatic it may be counter-productive to dig too deeply-let lying dogs rest.]
My question, do you find that this statement is true for you?
Is just knowing, really believing your psychological/emotional pain can cause physical pain really enough to be cured for you without addressing past of present emotional repressed events?
I know, that I know, that I know, TMS is my problem, the pain is 50% better, moving around my body now, but I am NOT cured. I have been reading daily about TMS for 6-7 weeks, journaling for 2 weeks. |
Edited by - seven on 01/19/2007 04:26:43 |
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Wavy Soul
USA
779 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2007 : 06:26:14
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I would say that JUST KNOWING is about 50 % of it, in my experience.
I do certain practices that involve breathing and feeling into deep emotional spaces, so that the feelings can move through. It's not the same as catharsis, and definitely not the same as suppression.
I had been doing those practices for the 30 years I had chronic illness. Since realizing that I have been using my body via symptoms to process my deep childhood stuff (which I realized before Sarno, about a year ago) I got quite a bit better (from terrible firbro pain). Then in reading Sarno and getting clear about the DISTRACTION factor, I got better still.
Now the remaining healing seems to be the same thing I was doing before - regularly going in and allow my "reservoir" of rage or whatever other deep feelings to flow on through and out to clear up the remaining illness.
I think the inner stuff carries important information and cannot just be ignored. At least in my case, I would say that I actually needed to have the remaining symptoms to force me to become aware of this unconscious pain which wanted me to acknowledge it directly. In practicing direct methods of allowing myself to feel the unconscious feelings, my consciousness has expanded and my ability to be present with others has gotten greater.
It seems to me that much as we think we want an instant total cure, what we really want is to know ourselves as completely as possible so we can live as fully and deeply as is our potential.
So I would say it's both/and -- BOTH just knowing that it's TMS AND digging. I completely disagree with the idea that it's counterproductive to dig - that's like making yourself a dangerous entity which is ridiculous. But one does need skillful means - a really good therapist, for example.
hope this helps.
Love is the answer, whatever the question |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2007 : 07:17:09
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Hi Seven,
I was reading that and said to myself, "That sounds kind of familiar , I think I wrote that!--", and to my bemusement, after searching a bit, it was me. So, in all fairness to the Good Doctor, I would hate for the drivel that I spew out here day after day to be mistakenly hung on him. And who knows, in our society, I may be leaving myself open to a mal-practice suit.
In answer to your question, it works for me! I stave off or ignore various and sundry aches, pains, twinges, minor encounters with fear, rage, anger, shame, depression, feelings of abandonment, being unloved, etc, etc, etc, on a daily basis.
A couple of good examples are:
I have had the seed of a cold hanging out in my throat for about a month now. I'm on a cross-country road trip and it would be inconvenient for me to be weak at the moment and have to stay in bed for a few days, plus I'm enjoying the 80' temps here in Florida playing tennis everyday. When I settle in somewhere, maybe at the Lauderdale Tennis Club, I'll give in to it and stay in bed for a few days, practicing the Western form of meditation: staying home with a cold, watching Oprah, and reading mags.
The other example of TMS thinking working--even if it's structural and NOT TMS--is that I can play decent club doubles, day after day, basicly on one leg. I attribute this to the powerful placebo effect of the Good Doctor's philosophy, even when it's not psychogenic.
[DISCLAIMER]:
So before taking any advice you think you heard from me, please consult with your doc, psychiatrist or parole officer.---------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
Originally posted by seven
In Dr. Sarno's latest book THE DIVIDED MIND, the chapters on psychology explain:
[You don't have to necessarily get to the root of your psychological issues, you just have to understand that the TMS process exists and that psychological/emotional pain can cause psychosomatic physical pain. In fact if the issues are too traumatic it may be counter-productive to dig too deeply-let lying dogs rest.]
My question, do you find that this statement is true for you?
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You don't have to necessarily get to the root of your psychological issues, you just have to understand that the TMS process exists and that psycholgical/emotional pain can cause psychosomatic physical pain. In fact if the issues are too traumatic it may be counter-productive to dig too deeply-let lying dogs rest.
Read Dr. Sarno's latest book, THE DIVIDED MIND, the chapters on psychology explain this stuff very thoroughly.
Good luck,
tt
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Is just knowing, really believing your psychological/emotional pain can cause physical pain really enough to be cured for you without addressing past of present emotional repressed events?
I know, that I know, that I know, TMS is my problem, the pain is 50% better, moving around my body now, but I am NOT cured. I have been reading daily about TMS for 6-7 weeks, journaling for 2 weeks.
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2007 : 08:01:31
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"I completely disagree with the idea that it's counterproductive to dig - that's like making yourself a dangerous entity which is ridiculous. But one does need skillful means - a really good therapist, for example."
Hi Wavy,
Not to agree or disagree with what works for you, but in TDM, several of the contributing TMS doctors assert that it may be better for some people who have suffered deep psychological trauma, such as that due to emotional, physical or sexual abuse, NOT to dig into it.
Good TMS therapists are an endangered species and near impossible to find even in the psychic-peacock feather waving--vortex of NorCal, where you and I reside. A good example is there has been a thread here languishing asking that exact question, "Is there a TMS therapist in NorCal?" I think there were a couple mentioned in SF but I've never seen them mentioned before and they have never posted or made their presence known in the TMS world as far as I've seen. If anyone has seen them please let us know how it goes. When I get back to frisco I'll maybe check them out.
Psychotherapy can be expensive and time consuming. If you're not in a crises and it's not necessary to know what lurks deep down in order to be "cured" of TMS, why go through it?
Wavy if you know of any good TMS therpists could you please see if Dave can add them to the TMS links and resources page?
If one accepts Dr. Sarno's theory that psychosomatic pain is a protector and not a punisher, as Freud asserted, then this makes perfect sense. The theory is that the psychosomatic physical pain is preferable to our psyches than the untenable repressed emotional baggage.
I, for one, agree with this. I could spend the rest of my life digging into how I got to be me and the tragic events that shaped my parents lives that in turn shaped mine. I accept that it happened, and choose to move on and be productive or at least hit a good volley.
I think constant psychic digging in an attempt to discover the Holy Grail of our psychic discontent, to be a life ruiner. I prefer to persue a more fun road. I see all this psychic digging resulting in "Over-Use of the Gray Matter Syndrome". This goes hand in hand with having to read every psycic self-help book around. perhaps a lobotomy would be more expedient.
Regards and Cheers,
tt |
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Redsandro
Netherlands
217 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2007 : 11:57:46
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I didn't read any of the reactions here because I'm lazy or busy or whatever, but to answer your question, I really really wish that was true, but in fact it differs from person to person.
I for one see the 'knowing' as a start position. It makes the proces of recovery possible. The gremlin gave me a one-time-only 80% discount on my pain. I had to fix the rest and fight the many symptom imperatives I got since then by doing TMS work and digging my repressed stuff. I'm affraid it's a life time problem for me.
On the other hand, I know people who got better by reading the book just once, and never had to read it again nor had any reappearing complaints. There's even the fortunate and rare cases of people who get better by hearing about the book and it's view, not having to actually read it.
It's probably very much dependant on your personality, the size of your rage reservoir, the amount of rage that's just too much, the way your internal gremlin works, the way you're unconsciously conditioned to handle internal rage, your ability to believe things that are different from what you've learned before, whether 'knowing' is factlike for your ucs. or still doubtable, and probably many other aspects we don't know about.
Right now your gremlin is talking to you. It is saying something like: "You need to know how it works. Not just know, but feel that you know. Oh and you'll notice when you know. And we'll see where we go from there."
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TMS is the hidden language of the soul. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2007 : 12:11:32
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The answer to this appears to be "sometimes". :-)
I got completely better without doing much in the way of digging, just some journaling. I did the Schechter 30-day workbook, and some stuff I did personally, mostly just reviewing past experiences in the light of TMS, rather than re-experiencing. I have, however, decided that a little digging will help me live my life in a happier way in the long run. But since I don't have any of the Big Traumas (just the usual perfectionism stuff), I can't speak to whether it might be better not to dig those up.
I don't think that continuous deep digging is very productive once you are feeling better -- I'd rather be out doing (the other part of the prescription)!
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Wherever you go, there you are. |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 01/19/2007 : 12:40:35
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As can be seen from the various responses the answer is that there is no general answer because everyone's psychological history is different.
I would say that the most important thing is to monitor your symptoms and see how they change with TMS knowledge. See what it takes to bring symptoms down. Do they go down completely or just a bit and then improvement stops.
As for my case I got 0% better by reading the good doctors books although I immediately believed that I had finally arrived at the correct diagnosis.
For me therapy was in order and deep digging and feeling was and still is my proper path. |
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Is just KNOWING it is TMS really enough?
