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Suz
559 Posts |
 Posted - 08/22/2006 : 13:19:06
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Anne,
I have been trying to make headway with my TMS equivalent - food allergies and have hit a terrible wall. Unfortunately, after a breakthrough last week where I realized that all the allergies are nonsense (I really believe this now) - I started by reintroducing wheat. I ate it every day and the gas/acne was coming less and less. At the same time, though, I had a terrible flare up of sciatica - I mean I forgot how excruciating it is. I have had it for 2 days now and it is slowly subsiding. My skin has also broken out quite badly. I have eased off eating the foods and my back is getting much much better. Did this happen with you? Did you experience an increase in pain when you started to tackle the foods?
I would rather restrict my diet than have this pain again or do I just have to be really brave. The diet is not that awful really. (I am chickening out dealing with them) |
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miche
Canada
283 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 14:27:17
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| Very anxious to hear what Anne has to say, as this is my worst problem also, I keep jumping from restrictions to no restriction, convinced that dairy and grains keep me in pain, yet telling myself it is tms and eating all I want, back and forth, on this threadmill......sigh.. |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 14:34:46
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Miche,
I can tell you categorically that if you are attributing pain in the back/neck/hips to consuming "allergic" foods - then you are barking up the wrong tree. I was on this track for 10 years so I understand so so well what you are going through. It is such an uphill battle. I am now 100% convinced that eating these foods has no link whatsoever to the pain. My symptoms from eating the foods are acne/rosacea/a hangover type feeling/bloating and gas. In other words - skin adn GI issues - how TMS equivalent are those??!! They are classic. I think the only answer is to bully through it. HOwever, I did not expect my back pain to flare up in response. I think my brain was freaked out as the food distraction wasn't working any more and so needed to revert to it's old place of pain. Wow - I forgot how painful that sciatica is.
Miche - it is nice to know I am not alone in this although I can't wait for us not to deal with this anymore! Let's see if Anne has some pearls of wisdom as she managed to kick the pain and the food intolerances |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 15:17:03
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I think I might weigh in here as well...I had terrible food allergies..Just the worst (miche, you will see shortly when you receive that)..Horrible, tears inducing sinus headaches, weakness, fatigue, depression, the works..
I agree Suz, totally psychosomatic...But this doesn't mean our responses are not real...I don't think one can simply say (at least those of us who have had these for years and years), "ok brain, cut it out" and be forever free...It takes time and patience, and I think a gradual approach is better..
Here's what worked for me
1: A two week water fast to try to give my body a bit of a rest every day so that it might have a chance to heal.
2: Finding ways to reduce stress.
3: A commitment to Dr. Sarno and the principles of TMS.
4: A gradual (over a period of a year or so) reintroduction of the offending foods.
5: A change in diet in the sense that for 6 months or so I didn't eat anything until at least noon, and usually not until 3 or 4 in the p.m., again in an attempt to give my body a rest so that it might have a chance to heal..
I don't want to give the impression that I had some master plan. I stumbled on these things as I went along, but I do believe all of them played a part in my recovery...And I know some will think a few of these are quite drastic...But I was quite sick and willing to do anything to get better...
TMS purists will tell you you only need #3 and I can't prove they're wrong..Perhaps all the rest of it was some sort of placebo, but I honestly don't think so...
These illnesses..whether food allergies, or chronic fatigue, or fibro, are quite complex..Nobody really knows what the heck what's going on with them in my opinion...There are a lot of theories out there, but I think it's all so much speculation...
My main point is I believe that a multi-faceted approach is often needed...
Just my experience for what it's worth... |
Edited by - art on 08/22/2006 17:49:28 |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 15:34:45
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Art,
Thank you so much for such a helpful post.
Do you not suffer from any of these symptoms now? I am not sure what you mean when you write that your body needed to heal. Heal from what if there was nothing actually wrong and your brain was doing the whole thing? Forgive me if this is a dumb question. I wonder if the water fast etc. were placebos - but hey - who cares, your method worked which is quite an achievment if you ask me. I really applaud you for that success.
These GI/sinus/skin issues are not fun. I think conditioning is really hard to break. I am a TMS purist I guess. I think the secret might lie in taking it all slowly and patiently - just like the approach to my back pain. It is helpful to hear that it took you a year to accomplish this - makes me relax a bit. Did you take it one food at a time? Would you mind telling me your offending foods? I am not enjoying the process - primarily because my sciatica returned and it is horrendous. Ridiculous but horrendous! It is already just a mild dull ache now after applying Sarno's principles over the last 24 hours. But my brain did not like me tackling the food at all.
I don't feel very brave right now and I hate that my skin has totally broken out. i am very vain about my acne. When I don't eat carbs or sugars, my skin is beautifully clear - what ridiculous conditioning |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 16:02:22
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Hi Suz,
I eat whatever I want now pretty much...As to your healing question, I don't believe food allergies are straightforwward TMS in the sense that back spasms are...I believe these allergic responses are real and caused by genuine physiologic syndromes...The initial cause is psychosomatic, or perhaps psychogenic is a better word in this instance, but keep in mind that many devastating illnesses can be as well, including cancer probably, and heart disease.
A person can't simply will cancer, or heart disease, or chronic fatigue, or food allergies away...At least, I couldn't.
I don't want to talk you out of being a purist. You might very well be right. I'm only telling you what worked for me, and at the same time trying to make some sense of the whole experience..
It changed the course of my life, in some sense really ruining it for a decade or more. |
Edited by - art on 08/22/2006 16:29:14 |
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miche
Canada
283 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 16:19:07
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Suz, Art, thank you both for your feedback, I do not have acne, but the pain in my upper back and stomach is quite bad, sometimes I think that I have ulcers again, certainly a lot of reflux, what confuses me is that the pain in my upper back is equally bad, very sore to the touch from the spine all the way around the ribs and on top of shoulders and neck. Having said this I used to get back pain when I had ulcers also , yet I don't remember that my back was sore to touch then, I realise that the muscle pain sounds like tms and prabably the stomach pain is also, yet should I have an ulcer again I doubt that the tms work would be sufficient . If it is an ulcer then would it not make sense that certain food would agravate it? I am trying to ignore my allergist telling me that I have an allergy to corn and wheat as I read that skin testing is not very accurrate to detect those. The last specialist I saw for my stomach three years ago did not send me for any tests as he was convince that the soreness in my stomach originated from the osteoarthritis in my spine and the muscle pain from fibro. I suppose this is why I am having such a hard time sticking to the tms theory as I have been diagnosed with so many ailments, yet I want to BELEIVE.....and I chose not to medicate....mostly I will be the first to admit that I vacillate and get so confused about it all.
Art, I admire the way you went about this whole thing, a lot of willpower and determination on your part. I guess I just have to convince myself that it is not physical once and for all and embark on the tms journey.
Sorry for the long response, I am at my worst today, and reaching out to the veterans again......Thank you both...I am grateful ..Miche |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/22/2006 : 18:28:58
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quote:
Did you take it one food at a time? Would you mind telling me your offending foods?
Sorry Suz, I didn't notive this at first...
I did take it very slowly, though not in an organized, checklist kind of fashion...Basically I'd just "try" a little bit of something...a couple bites of pizza, a single egg, a piece of whole wheat toast, whatever..
It's probably easier to tell you what I wans't allergic to...
Vegetables, fruit in small quantities was ok, most fish (yuk)...a few exotic meats, a few exotic grains..
I was in food hell for quite a long while... |
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Mary Ann
Canada
42 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 09:53:18
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Suz,
You have TMS on the run: your sciatic pain is the transfer to another location, but the strategy your brain is using isn't actually the pain itself, but the fear of that pain.
I have posted before that I have overcome my food sensitivities with a TMS approach. It was also a gradual process for me. I have realized that overcoming TMS symptoms is not like a light switch--now it's on, now it's off--it's more like a dimmer swtich, first the symptoms are terrible and intense and then they gradually fade away.
Have faith that this is working. Laugh at your brain's strategy because it is SO OBVIOUS. Take some pain medication in the mean time and try to forget about it. It WILL go away.
As for food: I suggest you don't eat your offending foods everyday, but gradually reintroduce them a few times a week. Give yourself time to readjust. Try not to worry about the acne, it's that fear factor aspect to TMS that is so effective. It will clear up too.
As for myself, my TMS has moved again. I'm pain-free and have been symptom free from food for a number of months now. Instead, my hayfever/asthma has now ratched up a million notches. I have been mostly ignoring it and using drugs to manage them. The asthma has never been severe and is thankfully under control without steriods now(it was really bad in the Spring). But right now my hayfever is so out of control that if I skip my allergy pill I'm a mess of sneezing, runny nose and watery eyes--you'd think I had a cold! I assume at some point I will attempt the drug-free way to manage this, but it's working just fine for now.
Have faith Suz. This too will pass.
Mary Ann
PS. Art: got your email but haven't had a chance to respond since I've just returned from a 3 week vacation.
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Scottydog
United Kingdom
330 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 13:50:34
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Hi Suz,
When I'd suspected that my gluten intolerance might be a TMS symptom I slowly introduced bread, pasta etc into my diet, usually along with other things. For example a small bread roll only when I was half way through my meal. I'd got so used to a gluten free diet that it was easy to just eat a small amount of things with wheat in. That would be a year ago roughly. Now I eat anything but am wary of bought bread and cakes as some have so much preservative and trans fatty acids in them that I expect them to have a negative effect even if they don't!
I had no relapse of back pain or anything instead I did have severe spells of depression last summer, very scary. Now that seems to be gone but I get furiously angry over things (unreasonably so) - usually when I feel forced into something or obliged to do something I dont want to - but I think it's really a response to things from my past. As described in Facing the Fire by John Lee.
Unfortunately, when I was depressed or am angry, reason goes out of the window - if anyone can suggest a way to bring back a calmer frame of mind I'd be glad to hear it.
This TMS stuff is a long haul but worth it.
Anne
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 15:05:10
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Thank you Anne and Maryann,
You are so so helpful and supportive. I will beat this pain and allergies - I know I will. My unconscoius is ridiculous.It sounds like it needs to happen really slowly.
Did you guys find that your symptoms moved around when you started introducing foods? |
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Mary Ann
Canada
42 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 15:28:36
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[quote
Did you guys find that your symptoms moved around when you started introducing foods?
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It's kind of funny how it went with me. I actually didn't notice that I had stopped reacting to food until I realized my asthma had started getting bad again. My approach to food was eat it and live with the reaction anyway. Had been doing that and didn't really notice that I had stopped reacting until a different symptom started showing up!
I'm a long veteran of the tms wars and understand about the symptom imperative. The first time I realized it was TMS was when I had shoulder problems. But I now figure that even before the shoulder problems, I had hip flexor pain, stupid accidents (sprained knee, sprained ankle) and then acid reflux that went away before I even realized they were TMS (the shoulder pain replaced all of these).
Once I cured my shoulders, I got plantar faciitis, then asthma then the food sensitivities. Now I'm back to asthma/allergies again. The thing is though, now that I'm aware of what's going on and I am not fearful of it all, the symptoms don't tend to be as severe or last as long. I am no longer obsessive and accept that it's all basically harmless.
I figure that I will probably always have some kind of tms manifestation since my brain is very persistent. But I am no longer anxious about it and just put up with the symptoms until they go away, which they usually do. Hopefully you will get to that point too where new symptoms don't scare you. Because the real problem with TMS is not the physical discomfort but the emotional engagement (fear, obsession) that serves as the distraction. Once you can disengage, the distraction strategy no longer works, the symptoms go away since they are not serving a purpose.
Keep up the battle, Suz. You are on the right track.
Mary Ann |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 15:28:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Suz
Thank you Anne and Maryann,
You are so so helpful and supportive. I will beat this pain and allergies - I know I will. My unconscoius is ridiculous.It sounds like it needs to happen really slowly.
Did you guys find that your symptoms moved around when you started introducing foods?
I know you asked Anne and Maryann, but I'm hoping you wouldn't mind if I chimed in? I've had no moving around, just a gradual, but very perceptible improvement...The other issue for me, which hasn't gone away yet, is hypoglycemia...But it's better, so there's hope...And I've had the hypo for years longer than the allergies, so that could be a factor as well...
I admit that I still have some fear...I'll read the ingredients on something (a habit that's hard to break) and think to myself, better not take a chance...But I usually make myself, because I know it's important..I was so sick for so long...it's hard to get used to being well again, or almost well...
Believe me Suz, if I could get better, you absolutely can too...I was so sick that I began to doubt I'd be alive in a few years... |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 15:44:42
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Art,
Are you kidding me - mind if you chime in - you're awesome! Thank you so much for sharing all your experience with this equivalent. I always feel it is a bit unusual to talk about food intolerances in this site but it really is an equivalent and a very hard one to break.
It seems that I have to go really slowly and that I will be able to beat this
Suz |
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miche
Canada
283 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 21:44:13
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| Scottydog, I could not help but notice when reading your post that you went from depression to anger, maybe your improvement on all front is the result of your finding your anger and expressing it.Is it not said that depression is anger turned inwards.....just a thought |
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Scottydog
United Kingdom
330 Posts |
Posted - 08/23/2006 : 22:58:47
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Miche,
Yes, I am pleased in a weird way that this is happening - it shows I'm getting through to the underlying problems - just isn't too good for those around me!
Probably also means I might be "cured" in, say, another few months.
Anne |
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Michele
249 Posts |
Posted - 08/24/2006 : 12:11:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Scottydog
Now that seems to be gone but I get furiously angry over things (unreasonably so) - usually when I feel forced into something or obliged to do something I dont want to - but I think it's really a response to things from my past.
My therapist (whom I have seen for about 18 months) always tells me that anger is a secondary emotion. The anger is covering up what is REALLY the emotion. When I get angry, I stop myself and try to dig further to find what is really going on. Knowing this has helped me alot. Hope it helps you too! |
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Fox
USA
496 Posts |
Posted - 08/24/2006 : 15:01:58
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| Mary Ann - can you give us any practical details of how you got rid of PF? I got rid of it by Sarno's ideas after about 6 weeks, but my brother, who now accepts Sarno (to a limited degree), is still having PF problems despite my advice. |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/24/2006 : 15:13:06
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quote:
My therapist (whom I have seen for about 18 months) always tells me that anger is a secondary emotion. The anger is covering up what is REALLY the emotion. When I get angry, I stop myself and try to dig further to find what is really going on. Knowing this has helped me alot. Hope it helps you too!
I think this is a very helpful insight. Now that I think about it, when I get really angry it's often because I'm feeling threatened in some way...I guess viewed this way, our anger has much to teach us..
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 08/24/2006 : 15:48:19
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| I have discovered that at the root of all anger is fear - I am pretty convinced of that. If you think back to the times when people or situations make you angry, one can always find a fearful insecurity at the root of it. Something to think about |
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Mary Ann
Canada
42 Posts |
Posted - 08/24/2006 : 16:03:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Fox
Mary Ann - can you give us any practical details of how you got rid of PF? I got rid of it by Sarno's ideas after about 6 weeks, but my brother, who now accepts Sarno (to a limited degree), is still having PF problems despite my advice.
Actually the PF never really "took". I got it almost immediately after my shoulders were cured and I recognized it as a symptom transfer and it too, went away. I only had it, at most, a week.
There's nothing special about any particular symptom. I think what varies is the degree of conditioning you experience about something. I had been conditioned to think that swimming (especially my poor technique) was causing my shoulder troubles. Then it was posture and "bad setup" of my computer workstation and "over use". Those took a while to unprogram (and may be the equivalent of what Art calls "healing"). I never experienced PF before, nor had I "done anything" to cause it so there wasn't a lot of conditioning to undo. I just recognized it as a transfer and it immediately went away.
So maybe this particular insight can help Suz too: you need time to reprogram your ingrained conditioning that the foods you eat are harmful. It's not that your body can't tolerate the food, it's that you're conditioned to react to it (subtle, eh?). Maybe your internal messages to yourself can be tailored to that aspect of it along the lines of "this is just conditioning, it can't really hurt me, I demand a new condition that I can eat it with no problems."
I'm going to try this with my hayfever (that is if I can ever put up with the symptoms long enough to stop the allergy meds).
Mary Ann |
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question for scottydog - food allergies
