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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
 Posted - 04/08/2005 : 09:09:32
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When I want TMS relief I have to do the work (dialoging, sharing on this forum, talking to people, sharing in my men's group). Very occasionally I find some TMS relief when I wasn't looking for it. This welcomed ocurrence is like the inner child communicating with me. I try to listen, feel the body emotion, and try and interpret what the child is trying to tell me.
This happened yesterday when I was having a serious discussion with my wife about the planning for trying to having a second child. One of my issues, understandably, is this whole issue of childhood vaccinations particularly this DPT vaccine, which was the one that caused my problems in infancy and beyond. In the event down the line that we have another child I argued for not doing this vaccine. (With our first son I did some investigating on this subject and concluded that the risks associated with it were greater than the protection benefits). My wife, on the other hand, is pushing for full vaccinations.
As I presented my opinion on the subject I started to feel that familiar fear emotion, with the accompanied TMS release. I'm always taken aback when this happens. My interpretation of the emotional response is that somehow the speaking up with my wife and expressing my own opinion is violating the belief system established at the beginning of my life. It was too dangerous to speak up and express my opinion for fear of abandonment. Perhaps i'm unconsiously fearfulll that she would react negatively to a contentious issue, or that she will abandon me. I think its an issue of trust. I did not have a firm grounding in my own survival and did not trust that I would be safe if I expressed my opinion.
This experience was very similar to a prior experience where again we were talking about a second child except this time the subject was getting through the birthing experience and me providing adequate emotional support. (My wife and I react in opposite extremes to sleep deprivation where she gets more emotional and I get less emotional). In this case I was speaking truthfully that I didn't think I could meet her emotional needs and that we would need to get help the second time around. My wife, who is especially gifted in emotional matters, interpreted my fearful body reaction (shakiness) as a sign that perhaps I was risking her rejecting me for putting my feelings out there since I know that I didn't give her the appropriate emotional support the first time around.
When I look back at my own progress wrt TMS I realize that i've come a long way towards noticing and really paying attention to the signals the inner child is sending me. When I first started this work I had some of the fear emotion, especially when talking to parents, but didn't have the sensitivity to realize that this was the wounded inner child communicating with me- I just basically ignored him out of ignorance.
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n/a
374 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2005 : 03:55:18
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I have found John Bradshaw's book, 'Home Coming' fascinating, Miehnesor. I'm not surprised that it, and his other works, are so popular, even fifteen years after it was first published. Most of his books are available from Amazon.co.uk for dispatch within 24 hours - a sure sign that they sell in large numbers.
There are many ideas in the book that have had me thinking and I recognise myself in much of what he says.
Something that occurs to me - all the writers that I have found particularly helpful in overcoming the anxiety that allowed my TMS free rein for such a long time, have a common thread - Bradshaw's inner-child, Rick Carson's gremlin and Claire Weekes more direct approach - recognising the false perceptions that can make life pretty unbearable. They are all different approaches but the underlying message is the same.
In a way, we all have to tailor our own recovery from TMS - for many Dr Sarno's advice is enough, but for others (and I am one); as the dreadful back pain subsided, it seemed to allow the anxiety and unreasonable feelings of guilt for every single thing that happened in my family, to surface and an attack from two fronts was what worked for me.
Big decision - having another baby - enough to bring on TMS just thinking about it!
Best wishes
Anne |
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kenny V
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2005 : 08:52:16
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quote:
This happened yesterday when I was having a serious discussion with my wife about the planning for trying to having a second child. One of my issues, understandably, is this whole issue of childhood vaccinations particularly this DPT vaccine, which was the one that caused my problems in infancy and beyond. In the event down the line that we have another child I argued for not doing this vaccine. (With our first son I did some investigating on this subject and concluded that the risks associated with it were greater than the protection benefits). My wife, on the other hand, is pushing for full vaccinations.
quote:
This welcomed ocurrence is like the inner child communicating with me. I try to listen, feel the body emotion, and try and interpret what the child is trying to tell me.
quote:
When I first started this work I had some of the fear emotion, especially when talking to parents, but didn't have the sensitivity to realize that this was the wounded inner child communicating with me- I just basically ignored him out of ignorance.
As far as listen to your inner child, YES it is your conscience given to you for a good reason just like all your emotions that are responding telling you something is wrong.
IMO they are given by a benevolent creator for responding to the outside world as well as understanding our purpose in life, asking all the Q’s to why?
When you question this and Look deep inside your self, it will always point you to the answers you seek.
It is amazing the body in the way it functions; the ability to communicate and tell you something is wrong, its properties in healing, and most amazing its ability within to combat pain. (Natural pain blockers)
Very interesting when they discovered morphine and a few of the other pain blocking drugs, they found out that the brain already had receptors for this, well before the drug had even been discovered.
What does that tell you about the bodies ability to heal within?
Now as far as info and books
David Curby Just came out with a book this moth this April called “evidence of harm” It is on the way to the best seller list/ (a must read)
Also there is “what your doctors may not tell you” (book)
I have thousands of other resources on the subject, but don’t want to get off topic as it was already discussed on this forum see archives below.
thanks
Kenny V
http://tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=743
http://tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=294
Always Hope For Recovery
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2005 : 23:36:08
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Kenny- Thanks for the information.
I am sorry that the vaccination issue has hit you so strong personally, wrt your son. If you read the bood "A shot in the
Dark" and you read the anacdotal stories of the nightmare parents have to face dealing with vaccine damaged children it absolutely brings you to tears. It has certainly reeked havoc with my life and with my family who had to raise a child with serious cognitive problems and learning disabilities. They, along with everyone else, where clueless what happened to me until my mom read the above book and finally put it together what happened. |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2005 : 23:47:59
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quote:
Originally posted by AnneG
In a way, we all have to tailor our own recovery from TMS - for many Dr Sarno's advice is enough, but for others (and I am one); as the dreadful back pain subsided, it seemed to allow the anxiety and unreasonable feelings of guilt for every single thing that happened in my family, to surface and an attack from two fronts was what worked for me.
Big decision - having another baby - enough to bring on TMS just thinking about it!
Best wishes
Anne
Anne- I'm not totally sure I understand what you mean by "an attack from two fronts". Maybe you can expand on that because while I believe i'm doing the right thing for myself now I need to be open to other approaches as well. For instance I can imagine that i've got a lot of de-conditioning to do after I get over the chronic TMS that I am still facing (although I believe I am making slow progress).
Much regards for your comments and help |
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kenny V
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2005 : 07:36:35
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O yea forgot to mention “shot in the dark” that’s a good read also.
When you say read the stories of what parents went through I have read thousands, but mostly I have lived these stories. I have also looked into the eyes of these parents who knew to the day that the JAB took away their child.
Yep they are clueless, Bc #1 the major drug co are covering it up along with its scare tactics also to make people feel guilty that they don’t comply. Also For one thing for all the schooling they go through you would think they would start with the study of simple nutrition. And you have the rest of the world against you when you trey to seek treatment or when you care for your child. Seen way to much Just last week read of 2 families that had their children taken away one raise a 12 year old, shortly after the introduction of drugs, he became out of control, and self injurious. The second family had a neighbor report the child run in the street, without proper understanding the state took him away as well.
……………..Our society just doesn’t understand.
Micah you wrote:
>They, along with everyone else, where clueless what happened to me until my mom read the above book and finally put it together what happened.
What did you say happened to you?
Listen to your inner child
Would like to share something hopefully some will make a connection as well as see this as an illustration to what I am saying here.
This is way to close to home with me.
Now I wont tell you about what happen to some of my family members or the 1000’s of other cases, but I will tell you what happened to me.
When I was about 12-14 months old, I lost all body functions, and ability to communicate, didn’t even cry. My body became limp, non-responsive, and my eyes rolled back. My mom took me to the best pediatric hospital of New York City at that time. They did not know what was wrong, but told her I had a very rare unknown virus of the brain. Don’t know how many tests they did perform, but they did wanted to do some sort of test, I think and take fluid from the brain.
Gee!!!! I wonder what this was caused by? 12- 14 months old. Hmm…. I think I need not to say.Thank God my mom used her conscience and her inner gut feeling and refused to let them touch me. She took me home and loved me a few days latter I recovered and am here today to tell you about it.
Thanks Mom
I love you
Kenny V
Always Hope For Recovery
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Edited by - kenny V on 04/10/2005 07:48:57 |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2005 : 18:37:57
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| Anne -- Oops sorry about that brain dead question. I know exactly what you mean from your previous posts. I think you have convinced me to take a look at your approach and take a look at the taming the Gremlins book. Thx |
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n/a
374 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 02:59:50
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Dr Sarno's books gave me what I had ben looking for - I had worked out for myself that my pain in the back was linked to how I was feeling emotionally. I had actively been looking for 'vindication' - I needed to have an expert tell me that I was on the right lines. I couldn't find what I was looking for from the doctors etc, I had consulted. They tried to keep me focussed on physical solutions for something that could not be treated in that way.
MBP gave me the vindication I needed - here was a doctor of vast experience who was describing my problem exactly. The relief was instant - physically, the back pain was never so bad again.
I knew then that I didn't have two health problems - a 'bad back' and an anxiety disorder - they were one and the same thing. But Dr Sarno is not a psychologist - nor does he claim to be. I needed to explore the causes of my out-of-control anxiety, in order to put defences in place so that I would not be vulnerable to the same thing if life events became difficult again (my problems coincided with a series of family illnesses and bereavements that took place in quick succession).
Reading widely on anxiety conditions helped me greatly - I don't follow any one of them particularly - there are things in every aproach that I have difficulty accepting, but all the writers who have stood the test of time helped give me insight and ideas for dealing with anxiety. The more I read, the more I got the confidence I had lacked in the past.
Miehnesor and Kenny - I had my children before the controversy over possible health problems with vaccinations surfaced, so I didn't have to make these difficult decisions - for some years now there has been debate in the UK over the safety of the MMR (measles, mumps, rubella) combined vaccination. This is over its possible links to autism. It's a difficult decision for parents to make - especially if there has been problems with them in one's family previously.
Something else that occurs to me - those of us who have been unable to get any help with TMS from conventional treatments probably have difficulty trusting doctors in the way we used to. Making decisons on behalf of our children becomes doubly difficult because we have lost some trust in the experts.
Best wishes
Anne |
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kenny V
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 08:15:44
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Good stuff Anne, you seem to have a good grasp on things and I like the way you have applied this to your own treatment approach.
Very well rounded, you seem seasoned in this ay? Very insightful
I haven’t been around in a while. I think we chatted way back when on the old forum.
Can you refresh my mem? You are retired and taking it easy now if im not mistaken?
How are things going for you, and your recovery process?
Btw Andrew Wakefield blew the doors off the MMR connection in the UK.
Peace
Kenny V
Always Hope For Recovery
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n/a
374 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 11:32:08
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You have a good memory, Kenny - I took early retirement from teaching and have the luxury of time - so many of us don't these days; a recipe for TMS. Yes, we did indeed chat on the old board - it's good to hear from you again.
I had actually arranged to go back to teaching two days a week, but due to one set of office workers not communicating with another; if I had taken up the post, I'd have lost all of my (rather good) teacher's pension. Anyone who has taken early retirement due to ill-health can't teach - it used to be allowed, but the rules changed.
It's a pity because two and a half years down the line - I'd have loved to do it again. I was four days away from taking up my post when I found out. I wish I'd known about TMS earlier!
Thanks for the info about Dr Andrew Wakefield - the trouble is there have been so many health scandals and cover-ups in the UK in recent years (mad cow disease in humans - the government denied that one for years; Sudan I - a carcogineric dye that found its way into food products to name but two), that many of us suspect cover-up even where there isn't one.
Best wishes
Anne |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 13:43:46
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quote:
Originally posted by kenny V
What did you say happened to you?
Kenny- Here is my history.
Everything was fine up until about 3 months of age right after the DPT whole cell vaccination. Immediately after the shot I had unconsolable crying which lasted for many hours. When that settled down my personality changed from a very happy expressive infant to emotionally shut down personality. I was emotionless. My parents thought I was deaf. Unfortunately, unlike your mom, mine didn't make the connection that it was the shot that did it. Then the same thing was repeated again at 9 months and at 12 months with basically the same reaction. After the 3'rd shot I was really disconnected from the world. My brother is 13 months younger than me and was a very colliky damanding baby. When he got over that my mom finally decided to work with me and help me return to the world. When my brother had the same DPT shot my folks expected the same aweful reaction and were surprised when he showed no reaction at all. They still didn't put it together that the shot caused my problems. When I was around 2 to 2 and a half my mom started working with me extensively to communicate.
After that the learning disabilities showed up. I was unable to understand verbal speach very well. My mom worked with me extensively for years to comprehend english. She had to repeat things to me multiple times and then she would say to me "now what did I say". I would turn away out of frustration but she would persist and demand that I respond. Over time we did develop a strong bond.
I vividly remember not learning how to read in first grade and my parents trying to teach me during the summer. I have shame memories associated with that, especailly from my father, since he couldn't understand why I couldn't grasp the reading concepts.
Eventually over time I did learn how to understand and read and do things that others did easily. But it took time and even in high school I struggled with reading comprehension issues. I was not a bad student and went to college and got an electrical engineering degree and worked in the field for a long time. Of course I couldn't compare to my brother who was valadictorian of high school and college and is now a tenued professor at the University of California. I was probably unconsciously envious of his ease at doing things that were a real struggle for me but consciously we have always had a great relationship.
I was depressed as a young child and had asthma and other more minor psychosomatic symptoms. TMS really started for me as a teenager with various tendonitis problems. Then the $%^& hit the fan in 1991 with full blown RSI in both hands. I discovered that stretching provided some relief in 1995 but as all TMS'ers know that was no cure for the problem. In 2000 I self diagnosed myself with TMS after reading Sarno but all efforts to deal with the problem psychologically didn't bare any fruit for a full 1 1/2 years when I finally felt the sadness and the subsequent TMS release. I remember thinking - wow this is it - i've got confirmation of the diagnosis and will be getting better.
It's been a considerably more difficult road to recovery since I appear to be one of the rare cases of TMS where I have to feel the emotion to get relief. But about a year ago I feel I really put it together when I realized that I had a glasier of repressed rage stored up from early childhood and I was able to finally feel it. Now i'm just trying to practice feeling the feelings and hoping that one day my psyche will settle down.
For TMS purposes i've got repressed rage at my parents that needs to be expressed. From the childs perspective he felt abandoned and very angry.
From the adult perspective I don't blame them. It's not really their fault. They did the best they could (considering their own unresolved wounds from their childhoods) under a very difficult situation manufactured by the medical community. It was expected back then that you just listen to the doctor and do what they say. Now we know better. |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 13:49:31
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quote:
Originally posted by AnneG
It's a pity because two and a half years down the line - I'd have loved to do it again. I was four days away from taking up my post when I found out. I wish I'd known about TMS earlier!
Anne
Anne - maybe you should hang a shingle and help people with mindbody illnesses. You probably know more than most of the medical and psychology community out there and you have a complete understanding of the various facets of TMS. Just a thought. |
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n/a
374 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 15:49:55
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Thanks for that, Miehnesor. When I found out I would not be able to teach in regular schools again, I almost signed up straight away with an agency who supplies private tutors for children that need extra tuition (I can work in the private sector), but my husband persuaded me to hang fire and take time to think about what I'd really like to do.
He suggested something similar to what you said - maybe take a course that would qualify me to practise therapy. I've been researching university courses in psychotherapy. The nearest one is 90 miles away- too far for daily travel. However, we have the Open University in the UK - set up by the government way back in the 1960s - it allows you to do distance study and just meet up with your tutors around once a month I think.
Even if I never actually become a therapist, I know that I'd like to study psychotherapy - especially in relation to mind/body conditions.
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seanf
21 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 18:48:15
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quote:
Originally posted by miehnesor
quote:
Originally posted by kenny V
What did you say happened to you?
Now i'm just trying to practice feeling the feelings and hoping that one day my psyche will settle down.
miehnesor,
Are you familiar with the work of Arthur Janov? He's the "Primal Scream" therapist that was very much en vogue in the 70s. I've been reading his books recently, and there's a lot of resonance between his ideas and Sarno's. The major difference is that Sarno doesn't think you usually have to feel repressed rage to alleviate symptoms. Janov believes you do, unequivocally.
Janov has only been mentioned a couple times on this board, but I'm curious to hear what other people think of him or his ideas. This seems like as a good a thread as any to do it. |
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seanf
21 Posts |
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kenny V
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2005 : 22:54:55
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Anne
I have an observation I would like to share, but I am not sure if it may apply.
Possibly you can kindly answer and id like to comment.
If my memory is correct weren’t you teaching in the area of special Ed?
And Bc you were forced into retiring it brought much grief to you personally which effected your condition?
So currently you are not working is this correct?
Btw you didn’t mention how you are doing now these days.
And as far as the Wakefield studies there are about 15 new studies well beyond the scope of his work, many brilliant scientists who have opened this whole "so called epidemic” to the public, it will be a matter of time before it will be exposed. But the major drug companies will do all they can to discredit them to save their tails and loose the trust of the public. Why do you think they fessed up to recalling Viox, Over 160, 000 have died so far. Look what is happening in Angolia. These kids are dropping like flies. Its just a shame we have a blind eye and we are sacrificing the health of our own people and children, and it is all for the sake of profit.
kenny V
Always Hope For Recovery
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kenny V
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2005 : 00:01:57
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Micah,
The story like you had as child, I am continually exposed to on a regular basis, many by far are much worse…. Trust me. Consider that you have been blessed that you have overcome your original disabilities. And you are capable of functioning by your self in society. Sure you might have some unresolved issues to work out. But you where able to go to college get an engineering degree. Doesn’t seem that anything would be considered out of norm and impossible for you. I can point you to 100 parents that don’t know if their child will ever speak let alone if they will some day be able to care for themselves. I say this lovingly, stop living in the past, make peace with it and move on.
Btw I don’t know what the future holds for my son, but I have learned to live each day with the hope he will have one. And because of this hope he is recovering.
quote:
It's been a considerably more difficult road to recovery since I appear to be one of the rare cases of TMS where I have to feel the emotion to get relief. But about a year ago I feel I really put it together when I realized that I had a glasier of repressed rage stored up from early childhood and I was able to finally feel it. Now i'm just trying to practice feeling the feelings and hoping that one day my psyche will settle down.
Again I will say you might have a unique makeup that requires your own personal mind body prescription.
But that is not to say that you are of a rare case of TMS. Continue to work on the things that you have already realized as you continue to learn more about yourself and your condition. Every one of us has the answer within, it is just learning how to express and handle our emotions more appropriately.
Always Hope For Recovery
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2005 : 13:30:35
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| I'm not familiar with him but this does sound like it would be something useful for me to checkout. Thanks for the info. |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2005 : 13:57:50
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quote:
Originally posted by kenny V
Micah,
The story like you had as child, I am continually exposed to on a regular basis, many by far are much worse…. Trust me. Consider that you have been blessed that you have overcome your original disabilities. And you are capable of functioning by your self in society. Sure you might have some unresolved issues to work out. But you where able to go to college get an engineering degree. Doesn’t seem that anything would be considered out of norm and impossible for you. I can point you to 100 parents that don’t know if their child will ever speak let alone if they will some day be able to care for themselves. I say this lovingly, stop living in the past, make peace with it and move on.
Btw I don’t know what the future holds for my son, but I have learned to live each day with the hope he will have one. And because of this hope he is recovering.
I absolutely agree with you that it could have been a lot worse and i'm lucky that I was able to mostly recover from my trauma. I realized this big time when I read "the shot in the dark" book.
WRT making peace with it and moving on, I think I am doing that right now although my inner child still needs to vent the rage. As my TMS symptoms start to receed, and I think that process is underway, then I will really be able to say enough is enough and move on. As you say the inner child holds the answer. My job is to follow his lead. |
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374 Posts |
Posted - 04/13/2005 : 02:27:35
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I was a primary teacher, Kenny - I taught Primary 7 (11 - 12 years olds); sometimes Primary 6 (one year younger).
I'm not working at the moment - and, yes, having to give up my job certainly did cause great emotional turmoil. I couldn't see any other option at the time though.
Conditions in teaching in Scotland are pretty generous as far as ill-health is concerned - we get the first six months of absence through illness on full salary, then another six on half-salary; so we don't have to make any long term decisions for a year.
I went back twice during the year I was off sick - but the back pain was unbearable. I was only able to do a couple of days each time. So after nine months of absence I decided to apply for early retirement on ill-health grounds, which was granted. If we get retirement on those grounds we are awarded the pension we would be getting if we remained in teaching to retirement age - so it's a really good deal. I can totally understand why the government don't allow people to return when they get an enhanced pension.
I'm really well now - I've worked hard on changing the way I look at things - not being able to take that part time job would have been a devastating blow to the 'old me'; it's a disappointment - no more than that, to the 'new me'.
I hardly ever get back pain, or any of my other 'ailments', now. If I do, I just ignore it and it goes away.
I still read and post here because I'm aware that I still have a TMS personality - it keeps me on track. I like to hear how people who have helped me (like yourself, Kenny) in the past are getting on as well and if I can help anyone else - that's good as well.
Something you said in your last post, to Micah - 'Stop living in the past' - that's so important when recovering from TMS for many of us - it takes lots of work to make the psychological/emotional changes necessary to start living in the present, but the rewards make all that work worthwhile.
It's good to hear that your son is recovering, I hope he continues to do so. The fact that he has such a caring father must be a huge help to him.
Take care
Anne |
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kenny V
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 04/13/2005 : 22:18:47
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Anne,
it is nice to hear you are doing well. And by your mentioning how you view things now, I can really get a sense that you have learned well. Although you needed to retire early you were very fortunate to be able to do so without any more emotional stress. I did remember that you were a teacher and how it was an important part of your life. Teaching can be very rewarding, especially when you are in it for all the right reasons. I can see that now that you are not able to do so, you might feel a sense of emptiness left over.
Anne I can tell that you are a very caring person, (probably have all the do gooder qualities) and it is important that you do find an area that you can continue to make a difference in peoples lives.
The reason I had asked if you were in t special Ed, because I have seen the pattern of to many e teachers becoming very emotionally connected to their children, which in return effected their heath. So in the same way I would have mentioned that you might have been effected in the same way. And again I would say that you should do some sort of outreach involved in helping others to allow you to use your gift.
You still hangin around here show again that you’re in it for all the right reasons. Don’t remember names nor conditions too well, but do remember that you were there. Kindof forgot allot after the board went sour.
Although we did have some fun time to time. Remember Delilah that came to visit for the weekend?
Ol’e tennis tom had me in a belly buster laugh and my cheeks and side began to get sore. At lest it wasn’t TMS sore. Id have to peal those onions as Gary would say, Any way I guess I should remember the good days and leave it that way, because there was some friction back then and the recovery process is pretty painful.
I really don’t recall l replying to you personally so I hope I wasn’t offensive at any time and actually helped in some way.
And Thank you for your kind comments.
God bless
Kenny V
Always Hope For Recovery
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Listening to the Inner Child
