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altherunner
Canada
511 Posts |
 Posted - 08/15/2012 : 22:35:01
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| hi Mala - i had spoke to you about my daughter who is working overseas, she had some sexual (mostly verbal) abuse from a school counsellor. She has been away for a few months now, and her gut problems, and acne have gone away completely.i asked her if she thinks it is diet, or the climate, and she is not sure. i think it may be emotional. |
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mala
Hong Kong
774 Posts |
Posted - 08/17/2012 : 22:36:32
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Hi Al I 'm so pleased to hear that your daughter is doing well & I hope that it continues to be all good.
Well I have now seen the dentist & the TMJ specialist. Dentist says there are 2 cavities that need sorting out & a wisdom tooth that is non functional that could be removed but can't say for sure whether they are causing the jaw pain or not. TMJ specialist took xrays. Nothing came out in those. She did a very thorough check up and found a very tight muscle spasm on the left jaw where the pain is. Then she checked my neck & head and was really taken aback by how much muscle spasm there was and also trigger points. She told me to learn to relax and gently massage the tight muscle in the jaw gently. But apart from that nothing conclusive.
Just an update to let you all know.
Thx v much .
Mala
Honestly, I sometimes really get fed up with my subconscious. It's like it's got a mind of its own.
Alexei Sayle
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 00:49:19
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quote:
Originally posted by mala
...She did a very thorough check up and found a very tight muscle spasm on the left jaw where the pain is. Then she checked my neck & head and was really taken aback by how much muscle spasm there was and also trigger points. She told me to learn to relax and gently massage the tight muscle in the jaw gently. But apart from that nothing conclusive.
Mala, congratulations!!! You've been checked out thoroughly by a specialist, a physician, the holy-grail expert for eliminating the structural could NOT find anything WRONG, aside from tight muscles and "trigger points". This sounds suspiciously like TMS!!!
I'm reading between the lines here, but if it were me, I would be jumping for joy here with this great news--getting an all clear on the structural leaving TMS as the source. Yet, you say this was "nothing conclusive". Reading between the lines, once again, it sounds like you are still not satisfied with this all clear DX and still searching for a structural cause. To me this sounds "CONCLUSIVE" that it could well be TMS! What do you think??? |
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Cath
116 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 05:14:03
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Hi Mala
You sound fairly desperate now, and your symptoms seem very similar to mine. Three years ago I was convinced there was something seriously wrong with my jaw, or my neck, or both. I saw a TMJ specialist who told me that there was nothing wrong with my jaw, and gave me exercises to do. The pain worsened, mainly because of my extreme anxiety and focus on it. I then saw a maxillofascial surgeon who also said my jaw was fine, but the muscles around the jaw were so tight that my jaw was beginning to lock up. He said he could do a manipulation of the jaw under general anaesthetic, and also advised a steroid injection into the jaw joint. I was desperate at this time, so I consented. It was the worst decision I could have made. After the minor op I worsened, and then contracted some kind of infection and a very high fever. The docs didn't know where the infection was, but I was in the worst pain of my life. My whole head and jaw were on fire, day and night for weeks.
I recovered from the fever within a couple of weeks, obviously, but have never succeeded in being pain free. The pain spread into my shoulders and back and finally my hips, and then the docs said I had chronic myofascial pain and fibromyalgia. And yet, all their tests and MRI scans have come back as being normal for someone of my age (53).
I learned about TMS and Dr Sarno a year ago, and knew instantly that what I have been doing for the last 3 - 4 years is focussing all my attention on the pain and many other symptoms, and yes, catastrophising it all. I am still on medication (neurontin) for the pain, which I put off taking for quite a while until I was absolutely desperate. I had been taking various other painkillers beforehand - NSAIDs, Tramadol, etc, but decided to just take the neurontin, which works in a different way to the painkillers. In fact they don't know how it works, but it takes the edge off neurological pain.
I am now totally committed to Dr Sarno as, although I haven't kicked this habit yet, (still have a lot of work to do - coming off my meds being my next goal) I intend to keep on with the TMS work until I am totally pain-free. I have had a little improvement, which is encouraging me to keep going. I have also just this week made an appointment to have some talk therapy with a psychotherapist. Some of what is eating away inside of me needs to be heard.
I hope you also improve soon, and start to realise, like me that this pain definitely has a psychological route. I think the problem for me was that even though my tests were coming back as normal, I kept thinking that they must have missed something. It was inconceivable that I could have so much pain, and not have something medically wrong.
Cath |
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mala
Hong Kong
774 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 07:26:53
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Hey TT it's not that I am unhappy about the results. On the contrary I think it's great that there is nothing seriously wrong. Just thinking about what to do teeth wise. Hard to open the mouth too wide right now. Mind you I did have them cleaned yesterday. The TMJ doctor told me to take a muscle relaxant before so that the jaw wouldn't be too tight & I asked the dentist If he could do it quickly & he did. Just some tightness today. But otherwise really pleased that there is nothing wrong. and the muscle relaxant was gooooood. I could seriously get used to all this medication quite easily.
Here's an interesting observation. Has got me thinking. I told my mom about the jaw & neck pain today & she told me that she had it too. Actually my mom started having back pain at around the same age I started, then her neck bothered her & then jaw, shoulder etc. Only after many years did she get relief I think in her mid sixties.Then her knees went & she had double knee surgery & the age of 72but has recovered from it beautifully & is pretty active at 80. I wonder if seeing her go they all that has somehow influenced my subconscious. She thinks it's connected to menopause.
Cath, thx for yr post. I'm so sorry to hear about all your pain. I do hope you find relief soon . Did you hear SteveO s interview . It was very interesting. He mentioned that when he tells people about tms and his back, they all seem to understand but still kind of insist that they however have a structural problem so I guess a very imp step towards recovery is to believe that when the docs say there is nothing wrong then there is nothing wrong.
I am also going to see a therapist when I get back to HK .
Do keep posting here . There are many people on this forum who care & most importantl make you feel that you are not alone.
Good luck
Mala
Honestly, I sometimes really get fed up with my subconscious. It's like it's got a mind of its own.
Alexei Sayle
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Edited by - mala on 08/18/2012 07:29:40 |
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plum
United Kingdom
641 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 08:28:07
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Mala, I could have been reading about myself in your words. Like you, I've been through the mill but the one thing that pushes me to the edge is jaw/facial/dental pain. I've heard similar things about trigger points, tight muscles, referred pain...it goes on. All due to clenching which we all know is tms. I'm having the devil's own battle with it and I have to smile in recognition at the fighting talk. For me this is definitely an anger issue, with other emotional seasonings to be sure, but I believe Steve O is right on this.
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plum
United Kingdom
641 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 09:26:13
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| Joys of technology. My phone ran out of juice so that last post may seem abrupt and I've lost my thread now but basically this is a manifestation of tms that is not only hard to ignore, it scares me silly sometimes. All the other ruses ranging from back pain to tendonitis through to suspected fibromyalgia haven't freaked me out like this which is why my darling brain is using it. |
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Cath
116 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 09:51:48
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Hi Mala
Thanks for your kind words. I have already read SteveO's book once and am currently gping through it again, very slowly. His book definitely made a big impact on me the first time of reading. In his words, stubbornness got me into this, and stubbornness will get me out again.
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2012 : 14:21:12
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Hi Mala, it is too bad you couldn't enjoy your time in Thailand, it is one of my favorite place to be in the world.
It is also great the your dentist and doctor are pretty much gave you a clean bill of health, they all want you to "relax" more. Just relax more Mala. Go to the floating market and enjoy some boat ride, eat some of those wonderful BBQ chicken with sticky rice and somtom salad. Watch the people, really pay attention at the people around you, really really look and them and think about them, about all the activities around you. Look at those beautiful temples (Wats) and try to find out more about it's history, learn more about the architect, the abbotts... you are on vacation, and your mind really really need a vacation from your body.
We all climb a mountain one step at a time. Now let try to take a vacation from your body one day at a time. Just today, just for today you will not think about your body, your pain, your problems,,, just for today you will not think about your symptoms. Let dedicate this day to a loveone, how about to your lovely husband. Let make this day about him only. Give him all your attention. Make the day a memorable day for him and you. Let enjoy the great city of Bankok, Let have fun just the two of you and do everything in your power to not talk about yourself, your pain. If he ask how you are, tell him you feel fine and all you want is just to make him the center of attention today.
I hope you will give this a try. My cure start in one day, the day that I refuse to fear and think about myseld or my pain anymore. then the next day, then the next, then the.... I almost want to guaranty that you will be cure in a week time if you would just do what I just suggest. Reading thru your post I am confidence to say that you are a very intelligent person, you just have a very bad habit, you are addicted to negative thinking. Your life will be wonderful if you can cure your addiction.
Goodluck Mala.
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No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
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bryan3000
USA
513 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2012 : 01:46:18
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| Balto for president! |
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mala
Hong Kong
774 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2012 : 08:00:55
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Balto what a great post. Thailand happens to be one of our favourite places too. How did you know I love som tam & sticky rice . And another favourite of mine is yum woon sen. I have to admit I have been avoiding all spicy food since I got here which is a bummer since I love street food but I did try some today.
And I took your advice & tried not to think a out myself too much we watched a movie and the in the evening hubby & I went to the roof bar on the 32nd floor of the Sofitel & drank ourselves silly.
Just got back & thought I'd post this.
I hear what you are saying about not fearing. I am desperately trying although sometimes its not easy when the pain overrides everything but I hear you loud & clear.
Tell me what you you did when the pain got too much for you to ignore. How did you get over that.
Love yr posts balto. & many many thx.
Mala
Honestly, I sometimes really get fed up with my subconscious. It's like it's got a mind of its own.
Alexei Sayle
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Edited by - mala on 08/19/2012 08:01:53 |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2012 : 19:45:11
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quote:
Originally posted by bryan3000
Balto for president!
haha, Thanks Bryan, you almost induce a tms respond in my body. That is the funniest joke I have heard in a long long time. I can't even run my own household here Bryan. In my family, my wife is the president, my 7 years old daughter is her adviser. Even my dog, Lexus, have more right than I do here.
Oh, by the way, marrital trouble is one of the biggest cause of tms/anxiety. To the men in this forum, the secret of a happy marriage is to master just a few words: Yes dear, You are right dear, Any thing else dear, ... It work wonder for me. Very peaceful here. As long as I get that $20 weekly allowance I'll be OK.
Thanks for the joke Bryan.
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No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2012 : 20:20:03
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quote:
Originally posted by mala
Balto what a great post. Thailand happens to be one of our favourite places too. How did you know I love som tam & sticky rice . And another favourite of mine is yum woon sen. I have to admit I have been avoiding all spicy food since I got here which is a bummer since I love street food but I did try some today.
And I took your advice & tried not to think a out myself too much we watched a movie and the in the evening hubby & I went to the roof bar on the 32nd floor of the Sofitel & drank ourselves silly.
Just got back & thought I'd post this.
I hear what you are saying about not fearing. I am desperately trying although sometimes its not easy when the pain overrides everything but I hear you loud & clear.
Tell me what you you did when the pain got too much for you to ignore. How did you get over that.
Love yr posts balto. & many many thx.
Mala
Honestly, I sometimes really get fed up with my subconscious. It's like it's got a mind of its own.
Alexei Sayle
Oh Gosh! yum woon sen, this is torturing Mala.
I was never able to ignore my pain or any of my tms/anxiety symptoms. I concluded that that is impossible to do and trying to do so just create more stress and discouragement.
My mind were full of negative thoughts and emotions. I focus on them all day long. I am addicted to negative thinking. I was so addicted to them that they just appear without any effort from me. Do you notice that most of our negative thought are automatic and most of our positive thoughts need to be create by us.
What I did is I just "float" (like Dr Weekes said in her book), whenever a fear thoughts appear in my mind I just tell myself: OK, I'm in pain and I have lots of fear, Which is just a normal body respond to pain symptoms. It is all tms/anxiety and I will be OK in time, in the mean time I'm just going to do ..... (fill in the blank with activities, with affirmation)
Have a logical talk to your mind. Each time you feel fear just talk to yourself. Tell yourself there is nothing to worry about, nothing to be affraid of, it is all tms, it is just my body's normal respond to unpleasant emotions. The first couple days is difficult, you get discourage very easy because you don't see any result. But it take time. It took you a long time to "think" yourself into this, It will take sometime to convince your mind that you are OK.
After a few days you will start to believe in yourself and will start to see some calmness, some relaxation in your body.
There are many tools to speed thing along. Meditation will help calm you down. Mind power using affirmation will help you regain confidence in yourself, your health. Keeping busy, keeping active will prevent your mind from wandering aimlessly and creating unwanted thoughts.
Also, I learned the following from one of my teachers, try not to be on the receiving end of sympathy too often. Sympathy is wonderful, it is a nice gesture, but to tmser's like us it is sometime would just reinforce our negative situation. It just tell us that it is ok to be in pain, which is not what we want. You don't want to be a victim. You want to regain your self esteem, take back your self confidence, take back control of your thinking.
Hope this help Mala. With limitted time and space, forum is not an ideal place to fully tell you everything I really want to tell. That would need a book. I thought about writting a book for a long time about my experience, about what I have learn from countless mindbody teachers, about how my tms/anxiety came to it's end., but too bad I'm such a terrible writer.
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No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
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mala
Hong Kong
774 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2012 : 22:08:36
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Yet another great post & lots of good techniques that I am going to use.
You are spot on about the negative thinking being spontaneous. You actually have to work hard on creating positive thoughts but what is even harder is believing those thoughts. It's one thing to affirm but another to actually truly believe. But the only is to suceed is to keep generating those good thoughts till it becomes an automatiic process.
You know balto there has never been any problem understanding your posts at all. In fact your posts are some of the best. It's not about the language , it's about how you communicate plus you have a wealth of knowledge & experience that you can share which will be so beneficial to people who are suffering.
I think it's a great idea to write a book. I can see your book being very different from all the other tms books out there. It will have a different perspective which is what is needed.
As for language & editing, you can always find people who can help.
All the best & many thx
Mala
Honestly, I sometimes really get fed up with my subconscious. It's like it's got a mind of its own.
Alexei Sayle
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Edited by - mala on 08/19/2012 22:09:46 |
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bryan3000
USA
513 Posts |
Posted - 08/20/2012 : 13:23:49
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quote:
Originally posted by balto
quote:
Originally posted by bryan3000
Balto for president!
haha, Thanks Bryan, you almost induce a tms respond in my body. That is the funniest joke I have heard in a long long time. I can't even run my own household here Bryan. In my family, my wife is the president, my 7 years old daughter is her adviser. Even my dog, Lexus, have more right than I do here.
Oh, by the way, marrital trouble is one of the biggest cause of tms/anxiety. To the men in this forum, the secret of a happy marriage is to master just a few words: Yes dear, You are right dear, Any thing else dear, ... It work wonder for me. Very peaceful here. As long as I get that $20 weekly allowance I'll be OK.
Thanks for the joke Bryan.
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No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience.
Haha! I have a 6 year old so I know exactly what you're talking about.
I do think your advice is invaluable, though. You are so on point, I dig around to find your posts.
A book is a big undertaking, but I'd sure read it if you wrote one. Or, even a written, detailed history of your recovery in a thread here would be great. Your efforts here are greatly appreciated.
Mala,
You suffer from anxiety. I suffer from anxiety. I've finally started to make inroads to healing.
What possible condition could cause so many other random symptoms that swap out for a new one every few days or weeks? Jaw issues are commonplace for anxiety, as is ringing in the ears, headaches, neck problems, etc.
You can go after your anxiety/panic the direct route like Hillbilly, Balto and others have suggested... or opt for a more complicated approach if you feel it suits you better. But, you just have to get your mind 100% dedicated to the notion that this is stress, not a physical issue. I know first hand how debilitating symptoms can be. I'm still working through many o them. But, I KNOW WHAT THEY ARE now. I refuse to let my body/mind bluff me. Yes, when a new symptom arrives... it's normal to have a period of frustration, wondering about the symptom... even complaining. But, then we need to file it under "BS" like all of the rest of our symptoms, and move on. I'm not preaching anything to you here that I'm not right in the middle of trying to implement, myself. But, we've GOT to do the work. Rest, relaxation, self-love, acceptance and cognitive restructuring. (i.e. not fearing the fear.)
I can't wait to read your success story here. I predict it won't be long, and you'll be here helping others. You'll just get fed up, and you'll rise above this thing.
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Another TMS equivalent? Unbelievable.
