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Back2-It
USA
438 Posts |
 Posted - 03/28/2011 : 06:00:12
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JB...
I saw where it said you were done with the chiro. I was just restating the fact and how going to one -- even one who had my best interest in mind-- poisoned my mind.
I still believe both long term anxiety and pain have to be controlled if anybody is going to be successful in dealing with the emotional. If you find the shot helps you (here's hoping it does), then keep up the mind work.
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Edited by - Back2-It on 03/28/2011 06:04:41 |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 12/26/2011 : 19:14:07
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"I believe the same way a structural abnormality or wound alerts our brains that something is wrong, our body produces the same pain to alert ourselves of emotional issues." (quote from Teachme)
Yes, this is an old post from last Spring, but it rings so very true to me now. I have been wondering why I have been plagued by one crazy symptom after another for the past year and this provides a good explanation for it. Of course, Teachme's main point was that FEAR, not rage or other repressed emotions, is really what keeps TMS alive. Several of us have come to that same conclusion and I have never been more sure of it than now.
Just an example: Out of the blue, a slight twinge from something I had a few months ago. So slight, I probably would not even have noticed had I not already been sensitized to it. In a fraction of a second it was gone, but I felt a stab of fear that went through my whole body at that instant, which stayed with me long after the sensation was gone. Often, all I have to do is think about a body part to bring on symptoms.
Like Teachme and others here, I think it is so important to stress how important fear is in the perpetuation of symptoms. It's everything!
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bryan3000
USA
513 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2011 : 11:53:37
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This has been a fascinating thread and I've enjoyed reading through it. I wish the debate wouldn't get so heated but it's subject material that's easy to feel passionate about.
A few thoughts on the matter...
Alexis,
I tend to agree with most of what you write. If I understand you properly, it seems that you and I believe these pain and anxiety syndromes are more a result of multiple factors than purely hinged on fear alone. (Though, I agree that fear is a primary component and possibly the most important.)
I will disagree with you slightly regarding the significance of Claire Weekes. While it's true she's an MD, in my opinion she's got more psychological insight and background than 90% of those calling themselves psychologists these days. If you're read her work... (and I've read everything she's written multiple times) you realize that she's purely treating using psychology. She's a pioneer and the notion that her work isn't "peer reviewed in journals" is a non-issue. We live in a day and age where modern medicine is totally dumbfounded by anxiety and pain syndromes. How many successful treatment stories have you heard from patients of modern, mainstream medicine? For me, I know they succeeded in making my condition much worse, and extended it using toxic medications. So, the fact that these people peer-review anything means nothing to me. Frankly, modern medicine can't find its arse with both hands when it comes to treating mindbody disorders. Our modern doctors and therapists would do well to learn from a pioneer like Weekes.
I went to my GP a while back and we were discussing my anxiety and she told me (literal quote) "you know, it's been almost a year you've had this... it's never going to go away." She then wrote me a script for Prozac which I promptly pitched.
I'd love for Dr. Weekes to get a hold of these modern-day quacks. (Rest her soul.)
All that said, I appreciate your insights and your efforts are doing us all a service.
Hillbilly,
Dr. Weekes regularly speaks about "memory" causing setback, or the notion of feeling totally fine... and out of the blue having panic.
"Memory is such an old fox"..... "memory has stirred the embers of our minds"... etc.
Ever think that what she's really talking about there is subconscious activity? She essentially says that setback is part of recovery, and that it is usually fueled by things beyond our line of sight. That sure sounds like subconscious activity, to me.
Now, her recommendation is still the same. Accept it, deal with it and move on. But, even Dr. Weekes doesn't discount the notion that non-conscious activity plays a role. So, I wonder why it is that you feel so opposed to the notion?
I've brought up the topic in a past thread, but there are scores of examples of subconscious activity we can point to. Dreams, smells, songs, etc. My favorite is the little errands your mind can run for you below the surface. (i.e. stopping thinking about something you're trying to remember, and then your mind forces that thing to the surface later on without your help.)
This isn't to say that fear isn't the primary piece holding this puzzle in place, but to me... there does seem to be enough evidence to support a multi-faceted approach to curing ourselves of these ills.
By the way, I'm primarily an anxiety sufferer. I have pains, headaches etc... but mostly high anxiety. I've been working almost solely in the behavioral realm for coming up on a couple years now. I shunned any sort of emotional or psychological notions for a long time. I ONLY used the work of people like Weekes for my treatment. I went to a CBT therapist and read all I could. I certainly made progress. I'm much better today. But, I'm still not over the anxiety/panic. I don't believe I fear it nearly as much, but the fear does still remain. I'm now looking into opening my mind to the idea of dealing with some past and current emotional stressors, as well as the notion that much of this could be related to compiled stress and emotions I've chosen not to deal with head-on. Time will tell if this is the final key to recovery for me. But, I do believe for me at least... purely focusing on the fear alone is sort of like mopping the floor over and over instead of trying to ALSO find the source of the leak.
In any case, I love reading your posts. I think you're dead-on for the most part and I look forward to reading more. I wish I was somewhere I could work with you and your group.
On that note, I'd love to hear more from you, Balto and the others of like mind on what the removal of fear LOOKS like. I know it's different for all people, but it would be great to hear examples of how you and others lost the fear. I'm back to engaging in regular activities and fear doesn't stop me anymore, or not much. But, it's still there. Have you posted your "story" anywhere where we could see how you did it?
Anyway, great reading all of this stuff. There are some highly intelligent people on this board. What a blessing for the average Joe like me. :)
Thanks!
_____________________________
-1/2010 - Developed chronic sinus problems. ENTs/Docs can't find anything
-5/29/2010 - Doc gives cocktail of allergy meds which induces first ever panic attack/anxiety.
-7/16/2010 - Anxiety stays/worsens - put on Xanax
2/1/2011 - Began Xanax taper - Withdrawal starts - full body chaos
-6/11/2011 - Last dose of Xanax. Physical/emotional chaos continues for several months.
-Now: Taking it day by day, looking for real answers and ways to heal myself without medical poison. |
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BecB
30 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2011 : 15:36:15
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| I could not agree more about fear causing symptoms and preventing them from going away. I experience panic with my pain symptoms. In addition, I am afraid of the pain staying, I admit it. I know this is hindering my healing. Times when I learn to just ride out the pain and act normally without talking about it or focusing on it I feel better. I feel like I am in a war with this fear. I have so much responisbility as well, with small children, and this adds to the fear at times. It is just so much work! I think I am just having a bad day. Also taking anxiety medicine, like klonopin, helps my pain very much. I don't want to be taking this medicine all the time however because I don't think I will really heal that way. This tells me thought that when fear decreases pain subsides as well |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 01/03/2012 : 19:34:41
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"I experience panic with my pain symptoms."
I can guarantee, Becb, that this is exactly what will keep it around! It is so very hard to believe that symptoms that feel so real, and even seem to react to what we do or don't do, may actually not be harmful at all; that they could even be the product of our own aroused nervous systems.
A quick example: I had a chronic arm pain and stiffness for almost a year. Thanks to an enlightened physical therapist who told me there was probably nothing physically wrong with the arm and pointed me to the brain's input, I am almost 100% better. But get this! Three days ago, I had a full-blown relapse and when I got into bed that night I expected it to continue. But 8 hours later, the pain and stiffness were absolutely gone! I would not have believe that were possible if I hadn't experience it first hand.
The point is, and what the physical therapist was talking about (also pointed me to some great online videos on the subject) is this: First, the old idea of chronic inflammation is absolutely wrong. All injuries heal and if they don't it is not because of inflammation, but because of the nervous system. Since all pain comes from the brain and not the "injured" body part, whether pain is experienced or not is up to the brain's perception of the threat. When the sensory neuron travels from the body part to spinal cord and finally to brain, the brain makes a quick assessment. Danger? Overreaction? The brain responds accordingly. If danger, the sensation of pain. But there does not actually have to be tissue damage to have pain. Or there can be horrific tissue damage without pain.
There is much more to the story, but those are the basics, the basics that describe so well how I was able to go to sleep with an "injured" painful arm and wake up cured. Also, I would not be worried if the pain started again at some point as now I know that it is not my arm, but my nervous system. It might take the pain to come and go a few times to change the programming. Meanwhile, I am trying to apply the same idea to other symptoms that illogically come and go on a daily basis, eg pf, neuroma... |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2012 : 11:10:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Hillbilly
Teachme and Art,
I don't believe a syllable of distraction theory, unconscious in a blind rage, nor in seeking Freudian psychotherapy when all else fails.
Amen to that Hillbilly. I don't believe a syllable of it either. Fortunately, it is not necessary to believe it in order to recover. |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 01/06/2012 : 14:31:03
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quote:
Originally posted by shawnsmith
Amen to that Hillbilly. I don't believe a syllable of it either. Fortunately, it is not necessary to believe it in order to recover.
Recovery from TMS is a highly personal journey. Getting caught up in semantics and trying to understand the scientific details of TMS, or question Dr. Sarno's theory, or come up with your own alternate theories, are not helpful and may actually be detrimental to recovery.
Ignore the symptoms. Banish the fear. Resume normal physical activity. Address your emotional health. How you get there is up to you. The most important thing is to truly accept that the symptoms are benign and to stop focusing on them. The science of TMS is not important. I believe humans do not have the capacity to understand the true physiological and psychological details. Dr. Sarno's explanation has worked for thousands of patients. If you find another approach that works, good for you. |
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FEAR!!!
