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hsb
149 Posts |
 Posted - 08/05/2010 : 17:32:53
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| dave, therein lies the rub. is achilles tendonosis something where running is contraindicated/???? |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2010 : 19:14:53
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Hey Art,
I hope you are feeling better sweetie..Thinking about ya!
~Karen |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2010 : 04:43:21
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quote:
Originally posted by hsb
dave, therein lies the rub. is achilles tendonosis something where running is contraindicated/????
Of course it is. And dave's just covering his bases. None of us are all-knowing. And there are no quarantees.
The question you should be asking yourself, or the question I'd be asking myself is, how likely given my incredibly long history of sustaining every running injury under the sun, often many times over, injuries that go on and on for months at a time despite not running during that time, injuries that you've conceded can't be real...how likely is it that this one is an actual injury?
Not very is the obvious answer.
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Edited by - art on 08/06/2010 04:44:31 |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2010 : 11:57:53
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Art & Hsb,
Running barefoot or with flatter shoes is not as traumatic as you would think. I know it sounds painful, but it's really not. You just have to be very conservative with it at first.
My somatizing the past couple of weeks seems to be mainly about my back. The minor gym over-stretch was the trigger and I have gone through the usual catastrophizing about it (herniation...even though I read this is extremely rare for the thoracic area). The pain level varies from hardly noticeable to sometimes moderate. This is an area that I have had occasional problems with for 30 yrs. Several yrs ago I even had an x-ray and all was well. At the time the doc said to treat it as simply muscular (rhomboids) and sent me to pt, which simply seemed to prolong the problem.
When I get stressed (most of the time), I focus more on it and it bothers me more. On the positive side, I have made no concessions to it. Yesterday, I ran 20 miles.
I realize this (health anxiety) will probably be a lifelong problem, but it would be nice to lower the intensity. |
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art
1903 Posts |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 08/11/2010 : 20:05:16
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Hi Art,
I read the article and I generally disagree. First, a lot of those injured barefoot or Vibrams runners probably did too much too soon. It's like a couch potato suddenly trying to run a marathon. Coming from very cushioned, controlled shoes and orthotics, the feet and ankles are very weak. They need to very gradually be built up before they can tolerate any degree of barefoot running.
Take the case of plantar fascitis. I've read the best way to weaken an arch is to support it. This is true of feet and bridges. An arch is a natually strong shape and doesn't need; in fact, weakens with support. So, theoretically, if you take away shoes and strengthen the muscles that support the arch, you should be less prone to pf.
Second, the idea that only a few lucky individuals have the body mechanics to be able to run barefoot without injury is unsound (note: Sarno and other TMS docs would probably agree that the feet and body have evolved over the eons to deal successfully with their environment without aid of the latest hi-tech running aids). In the 70's and early 80's when the running boom was taking off, serious runners were putting in a lot more miles than they do now and in primitive running shoes. Twenty years of advances in shoe technology and most runners doing fewer miles haven't changed the injury rates a bit.
There certainly are some individuals who should probably not run barefoot. Everybody is different. And anyway, most people, even those who have no problem with barefoot would probably not run barefoot fulltime. I run mostly with shoes, but occasionally try vibrams or barefoot and my goal is to increase the ratio of barefoot. So far, so good.
Do you remember how podiatrists were pushing expensive custom-made orthotics for nearly everyone who walked into the office, as though most feet are deeply flawed and need to be corrected? I have heard of studies that show that only a very small percentage--maybe 3% of people actually have feet that need to be corrected by some sort of device and cheap otc inserts have proven to be as effective. I am an expert on expensive custom made orthotics, as I have four $600 pairs in my house, only one of which I ever thought was worth a damn (that is, didn't seem to make matters worse).
Finally, the only way to know if minimalist running is right for you is to give it a try, but beware of going about it the wrong way. The best thing I experienced with it in the very little (so far) I have done it is that I am forced to be very mindful of my body and surroundings, how I land...instead of zoning out, one is naturally tuning into each light footfall, and that is a pleasant experience.
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2010 : 08:23:31
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It's all very interesting. I absolutely agree with you on orthotics. I threw mine out years ago.
The best point in the piece in my opinion is that the current "Born to Run" craze is probably overdone. Human beings are all over the map with respect to their abilities. Some are born to run. Some not. I'm sure you agree with that.
I think my essential point is that for those of us prone to hypochondria and TMS, the switch to something so radically different is full of peril. I've enough trouble trying to sort out real from TMS in my running now. I see that potentially expanding exponentially...
All that said, there's no doubt in my mind it's a great option for some. |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2010 : 19:21:07
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| Art--Maybe I missed it, but did you get your mri results? |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/13/2010 : 11:54:56
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i decided to skip it when I went out for a successful run. So far so good, except for a few scary twinges like today. Ran anyway.
It's a dog's life :>) |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 08/17/2010 : 20:12:20
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| Glad to hear it, Art. Keep up the good work! |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2010 : 09:08:05
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It's been a rotten summer all things considered. I'm running, but speed seems to make the hammie worse, so I'm basically just limping along..
Wonder how HSB is doing??? |
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hsb
149 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2010 : 12:39:11
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hi art-
i'm still here!!! thanks for checking up.
i am still running albeit with the achilles pain. i would have to say it hasn't gotten worse but not better. is that good or bad??? who knows? i still have my thoughts about this tendonosis being a "forever" thing as the doctors and info says. i also still think about taking tons and tons of time off but i have sort of done that already but really don't want to do that.
so i plod along in pain. it's not like it's excruciating, but not all that fun. as i have written in the past - i love running and this pain makes it not so much fun. i am somewhat calmer now because i am trying not to catastrophize, perhaps it is more "resignation". one day i hope the pain will just disappear as it has in the past.
glad you are still out there running art. and wrld - 20 milers - i'm jealous!!! |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 08/18/2010 : 20:07:46
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Hi Art & HSB,
Better to be staying in the game (activity) in some way. That's its own success.
I'm doing pretty well. The pf I've had on/off since March no longer intimidates me and I no longer even bother icing it. I can go for days at a time with no symptoms and then it pops up for a few hours or day and disappears again. I did a very hilly trail run today; my goal was to keep running (no walking) until I reached top, which I did. I reached almost 100 degrees this afternoon, but was only in the 80's when I ran. I love it.
Meanwhile, the back "injury" is pretty much gone too, but, like the pf, symptoms pop up randomly. I'm no longer worried about it. |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 08/19/2010 : 10:37:01
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hs,
That it's not worse is fantastic. You've rested it for months and months. Keep running! I have pain much of the time, but it only bothers me the extent I pay attention to it.
Happy for you/ You've come a long way.
A> |
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hsb
149 Posts |
Posted - 09/01/2010 : 13:17:27
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Hi Art and Wrld.
So i have been running a bit more. i would say the achilles pain is more low grade now. it's definitely there but i am running through for sure. i think somewhat better but not nearly 100%.
i have been biking alot more these days. i am not a big biker - too uncomfortable. it bothers my neck and back and i was fitted for the bike.
i have been riding some pretty steep hills and last saturday i tried to stay in the big chain ring (harder to pedal). guess what - yesterday my hamstring started bothering me. i do NOT think it is from the running. i have had hamstring issues in the past (a couple of times) and they stink (art you should know that). those lasted a long time as per my usual. TMS panic is starting to set in. always does at the beginning of something. i know you guys can relate. i am going to go to a spin class tonight and see what transpires.
my brain is saying, "here we go again". |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2010 : 10:57:04
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hs,
You have to find a way to understand and accept that you're always going to get the "next thing." It's the nature of the beast. Running through this supposedly chronic condition of yours is a great victory, but it's only a single battle in the larger war against TMS.
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hsb
149 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2010 : 13:32:01
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hi art-
i did not take spin class last night, figured i wouldn't irritate hammie. yes you're right the enemies keep popping up. had the hamstring thing before and it's scary. but i did run this morning. and i will try to bike this weekend. god it's always something to stress about - wrld you talked about this.
thanks |
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2010 : 20:19:43
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Hsb,
It's good to hear you are making progress on your achilles. You're right; the hamstring is a scary area, but probably not scarier than the achilles.
Yes, it does seem to be one thing after another and I don't think it is any accident. For me anyway, I seem to strongly require a physical symptom at nearly all times in order to to distract me from where my life is at 56. I understand the pattern, but it is very, very exhausting!
This week I will effortlessly put in probably more miles than ever (50 plus). Meanwhile, none of the usual chronic things, eg hamstring, pf... Instead, a few days ago I discovered a lump in my testicle and had an ultrasound that fortunately found it to be a benign and very common spermatacele (cyst), which is quite harmless. Doesn't matter. Hearing that good news didn't make me feel much better because the thought of the lump there made me squeamish and paranoid and I wanted it gone. Now, I can't keep my attention off the area and think it feels a little sore, but I can't be sure. Oh well, and next month a PSA and probably another urology visit (earlier in the year a high PSA, a biopsy--completely normal)...I wanted to leave it at that, but of course, they want you to stay on the treadmill awhile longer. The thought of an unending string of symptoms for the next 30 or 40 yrs sounds very exhausting indeed! |
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hsb
149 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2010 : 16:10:59
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hi
sorry about the lump. glad you are getting that taken care of.
my hamstring is getting worse. i have had a history of hamstring issues in the past and of course they took months to heal. i do believe it is from the biking. i ran this morning and things are worse. i am planning on taking a bike ride tomorrow morning. i just cannot believe that i started biking in june to cross train because of achilles and now i'm "injured" from it. i know there is the possibility of saddle issues, positioning, etc. but darn it, it's not running. i am not even over the achilles stuff.
i will challenge this but alas the fear is back. |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2010 : 11:13:10
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hs,
The fear never goes away completely in my experience. Try to take the long view, understand your history and how that relates to current situation....
What helps me is that many mainstream sports docs (that is, non-tms espousing types) are now believing that it's frequently best to run through tendonitis anyway.....So, you see, you're covered from a couple of angles now... |
Edited by - art on 09/08/2010 11:14:54 |
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Do I need to beat the hypochondria first?
