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johnaccardi
USA
182 Posts |
 Posted - 03/27/2008 : 07:32:08
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Hi everyone,
I have posted a few times before. I am a college student who has developed many symptoms related to disorder, "Sjogren's Syndrome". I still have these symptoms: Dry mouth, dry eyes, dry skin... I learned about TMS about 2 months ago and read 3 of Dr. Sarno's books since. It hasn't worked for me as the symptoms have actually gotten worse. This morning I woke up and noticed a rash on both my arms, this rash is known to be related to Sjogren's. Could the progressive symptoms even with the knowledge and study of TMS be hinting to me that I have Sjogren's or does it still look like TMS as Sjogren's is quite uncommon for a young male. What do you guys think? I really need some reasurance on this...it hasn't been a good morning.
Thanks a lot,
John |
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mk6283
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 07:56:28
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Go see a rheumatologist already! Why have you waited this long to rule out Sjogren's syndrome? Even Dr. Sarno says that you have to rule out any organic causes first partly to eliminate doubt in the diagnosis. I still doubt that you have SS and are probably just overreacting to some other skin rash. Stop posting here until you see a doctor because I promise you that you will get nowhere w/ TMS if you are still worried about something that can easily be ruled out.
Best,
MK |
Edited by - mk6283 on 03/27/2008 08:47:56 |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 08:24:45
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You're stuck. You've managed to convince yourself that you have a syndrome (which in and of itself may be TMS) that is exceedingly rare for young males. You clearly have a great deal of anxiety and have been unsuccessful in treating your symptoms as psychogenic.
The fact that you immediately equated a rash to Sjogren's is proof of how your thought process is in total contradiction to TMS. A rash is a symptom of thousands of medical conditions. Your mind has latched on to his Sjorgen's and it's doing a wonderful job convincing you that you have it.
You need to see a doctor and rule out serious disease or illness. Maybe then you can learn to start ignoring the symptoms and do the work to recover from TMS. |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 09:03:35
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John, sorry to hear you are still stuck in physical thinking. And that you're having these symptoms. I agree with the others--please go get checked by a doctor about this disease you fear you may have.
BTW, I met a man at Dr. Sarno's lecture who had dry eyes. And it was diagnosed as TMS.
After mind/body studying this past year and learning the power of the brain over the body, my reaction to any physical manifestation (had one this week) ALWAYS has me say "what is going on that you're afraid of/angry about/conflicted about, etc." I also consult Louise Hay's YOU CAN HEAL YOUR LIFE book's charts to see what emotion she suggests it could be. She also suggests affirmations. I like I EMBRACE GOOD HEALTH!! Every affliction has gone away in a few days. But I automatically go to what is my brain doing?
I do not check the internet for ANY symptom anymore. Why scare myself. That is the only purpose it served for me in the past.
You need to accept this for yourself though. No one will be able to make you see it. Have you tried writing your feelings out? I can't emphasize the importance of writing enough. You'd be amazed at where it can lead.
Best wishes to you for healing,
-Lori
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johnaccardi
USA
182 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 09:22:03
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Thankyou everyone,
Your advice is very good for the information I have provided. The problem is that Sjogrne's Syndrome is still a very mysterious and unknown disorder. There are several tests that can be done but none are of great diagnostic value. I have been to two rheumatologists and one said I might have it and the other said I don't have it. There is no black and white answer to this, it's a very grey area as are all the autoimmune disorders. In other words, it is impossible to completely rule out Sjogren's from a medical perspective and because I know this the thought will always linger in my mind. As "Dave" said I really do feel stuck. If I have Sjogren's the symptoms continue and progress for the rest of my life...leaving me miserable. If it is in fact TMS I fear I may never be able to end the doubt and this will keep the symptoms around forever.
What do you guys think, any advice?
Thanks so much |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 09:42:23
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John, um, advice? How about re-reading everything we have all told you already for the past few weeks? Have you done anything with the suggestions, e.g, reading Sarno's books again, writing? There is work involved here. Fears to be overcome. It can be done.
It is up to you!
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 09:48:54
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How about seeing a TMS doctor? I do believe if you tell them what you've told us, they will break down what your psych causes are and help you along those lines.
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 11:45:21
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If there is no option for treatment for Sjogren's (which is what it sounds like from your post), and no definite diagnosis, you might as well do the TMS emotional work whether you decide to treat your symptoms that way or not, and more or less ignore the symptoms except to cope with any serious effects they have. Plenty of people have chronic conditions that are an ongoing problem but they manage to cope with them and don't let them make their lives miserable.
From what you have written here so far you have the usual batch of problems, some family issues and anxiety due to a recent life transition. You're a student -- go to the counseling center and talk to a counselor about your worries, anxiety, past issues, etc. Just to get them off your chest. This is one of the only times in your life you will be able to get cheap counseling easily!
I have to say the fact that you immediately jumped to "This will make my life miserable" indicates that you have the kind of negative thinking habits about symptoms that TMS can easily seize on. Change those and your life will be better in more ways than determining whether or not you have TMS!
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It's not 100% belief that's required, but 100% commitment. |
Edited by - armchairlinguist on 03/27/2008 11:48:19 |
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h2oskier25
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 12:03:59
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I must second what ACL has said. If Sjogren's is such a "grey" area, and you're getting conflicting answers from your Docs, then here's your chance to take you health into your own hands.
DECIDE that you were right all along, and Sjogren's IS very rare in young males, so you just farking DON'T HAVE IT TO BEGIN WITH.
Now, it's time to make some progress on the mind, so it quits trying to get your attention with all of this physical stuff.
Going off to college is a fun and great thing, but I went through a hel| of a lot of stress my first year. It's normal to be freaked out on a very deep level, as your life changes, and you are expected to make all sorts of big decisions and stuff.
Quit being an expert on Sjogren's and start being an expert on what's going on deep within JohnAccardi's mind RIGHT NOW.
Beth |
Edited by - h2oskier25 on 03/27/2008 12:04:50 |
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windy
USA
84 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 12:09:30
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| I would just like to add that the problem with going to docs to "rule out" problems other than TMS is that then you get the word soup diagnoses like "tendinitis" "tendinosus" "rsi" etc. Tendinitis and tendinosus can be accompanied by tears in tendon that may or may not be the real pain producing pathology. My new rule of thumb is if it doesn't "crackle", doesn't swell & you can still bear weight and move it, then it's TMS |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 12:39:10
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| Don't rule out the possibility the Sjorgen's IS TMS, as is fibromyalgia and other "syndromes" that the medical profession enjoys giving names to. |
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h2oskier25
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 13:15:54
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Hear!! Hear!!
Well said, Dave.
Beth |
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johnaccardi
USA
182 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 16:04:31
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Thanks guys, the posts always help. Whether I can really take this advice and genuinly use it is not for sure but your posts always help get me through a few more days and that's what matters right now for me. Dave, about the Sjogren's being TMS, that might be true but in "The Mindbody Prescription" Sarno specifically lists Sjogren's Syndrome under the list of more serious chronic autoimmune disorders. Deep down inside I don't think it's Sjogren's I can't think it's Sjogren's because in my mind things go like this:
Sjogren's = Despair
TMS = Hope
Cure = Self satisfaction |
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Dor
67 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 17:29:09
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Gently, go gently in all things. I don't believe that Sr. Sarno thinks that we should be so difficult on ourselves or on one another. What works for one may not work for another - ie journaling or just moving past. Sometimes a diagnosis from a conventional doctor is needed before one can move on to acceptance - in fact, Dr. Sarno suggests that! One can not safely assume that it is TMS nor can one safely assume that it is a serious illness until certain avenues have been explored. I tend to think that John is suffering from stress and the first year at college, however, until he can accept that it may be necessary to relieve his mind as to not having SS. There is nothing wrong with ruling out all avenues, coming away with a difinitive diagnosis, and dealing with that dianosis or understanding that it is TMS and working on that. It bothers me at times that some people are so vehement on TMS while the writer may just need compassion, understanding, and a difinitive diagnosis. Woould Dr. Sarno suggest less?
Dor |
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johnaccardi
USA
182 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2008 : 20:46:03
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| Dor, you really are like a mother to me, haha. Your post here is 100% true in my eyes, Thank you. |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2008 : 06:57:46
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I feel we have shown compassion and kindness with the many, many suggestions we have made to John's questions--they seem to be the same questions over and over again with the same answers given over and over again. There comes a time where it is time to set loving limits with yourself and others--which also means getting "tough". Therefore, tough words (or those that could be interpreted as tough because they are difficult to hear) need to be spoken in a gentle way. I speak from experience as a parent.
Dr. Sarno does not see patients who will keep bringing up the physical aspects. In fact, you are interviewed briefly on the phone with him before he will even see you. Therefore, he has his limits too.
John, I do hope you find what helps you. I know we all wish you well as you make your way through your symptoms.
-Lori
PS--Emotions (ok, "stress" is used often) cause(s) up to 70% of ailments. It was in the Parade section of the newspaper a few weeks ago, not to mention myriad other places. Therefore, if 70% of ailments are emotion-induced, 70% of ailments ARE indeed TMS or its equivalent (and some think that percentage is understated). |
Edited by - mizlorinj on 03/28/2008 07:00:13 |
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johnaccardi
USA
182 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2008 : 11:16:47
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| Sorry for posting so much of the same thing, I didn't know this forum was such a small, tight community and that the same people would be coming to repetedly read all of my similar posts. Your advice, mizlorinj, on "toughing it out" and being tough is good advice. I am an amateur boxer so I know how to take a punishment physically and keep moving, now I just need to learn how to fight mentally. Thanks everyone. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2008 : 14:59:09
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John, don't worry. It is hard to realize that your brain is going over and over on the same stuff. That's the distraction at work. Realizing the amount of repetition may help you realize how little it makes sense to obsess on it that much. And I can assure you you are not the worst case of this on the board. :)
I was going to expand a little on what I said about chronic autoimmune disorders not necessarily making life miserable. I have a friend who has had rheumatoid arthritis since she was 13 (for 13 years now, half of her life). I have known her since shortly after she was diagnosed. It also is a chronic, progressive autoimmune disease. I believe it may be one that Sarno thinks there could be emotional involvement with, but that's beside the point here as my friend has no experience with that. For her it's a physical problem.
It can cause very bad pain and swelling of the joints to the point of near-immobility. She's been on and off various strong medications, and even just during the few years of high school it went from only her knees to infest most of her peripheral joints (shoulders, hands and fingers, etc). We used to play in a band together and sometimes she couldn't play because her joints were too swollen to move properly. Writing or typing were also sometimes difficult for her.
Her doctors recommended that she stop skiing and playing softball because those activities are hard on the joints. This might have been good medical advice -- I can't really say -- but she did not want to do that because she liked to do those things. So she continued, though with reduced intensity.
We are not close anymore but I do see her regularly. She doesn't seem happier or less happy than I am. We have many of the same concerns (being of similar ages, backgrounds, and professional standings). She is still fairly active, goes to the gym, travels, has tried scuba diving, rides a motorcycle, etc. I don't know what her pain levels are, but she is still on various medications. But I have always admired the way she does not let this disorder rule her life or even interfere with it very much, though there are certain things she doesn't or can't do. She hardly ever even mentions it, except if it is on topic (medication costs when insurance coverage changes, for example).
So whatever happens (and I maintain it is unlikely you have Sjogren's -- TMS is far more common), you are probably not headed for a lifetime of misery. Go see a counselor and see if you can't sort out some of the emotions and see how you feel thereafter.
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It's not 100% belief that's required, but 100% commitment. |
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johnaccardi
USA
182 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2008 : 15:32:57
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Thanks Armchairlinguist, I know what you say is true about being able to live happily with a chronic disorder. It just might take me some time to genuinly realize that. Thank you for the encouragement.
I found out that the rash I have is called Psoriasis. This kills me because Psoriasis is directly related to autoimmune disorders. I had never seen this name before so it concerns me that it is not TMS. If I had read about it, my mind would have known what symptom is related to Sjogren's and could have picked Psoriasis, but because I had never heard of it, I worry. It's like every time I come close to dimissing the thought of Sjogren's another symptom hits me or my mindset changes, when will this end? Could the Psoriasis simply be another TMS equivilant, it would seem to me that this would be a nearly impossible coincidence.
Thanks for the responses |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2008 : 16:22:21
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Actually it is. :) stanfr, I believe, had psoriasis and was able to get rid of it.
How long will it take you of having TMS-equivalent symptoms to realize you have TMS and stop thinking physical?!
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It's not 100% belief that's required, but 100% commitment. |
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Dor
67 Posts |
Posted - 03/29/2008 : 06:08:12
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John,
Well, mother Dor is back and I did some searching. Did you know that 90% of the people who get Sjorgren's Syndrom are women!! And did you know that most symptoms appear after the age of 40!!! And, it is commonly genetic related to other diseases such as lupus, thyroid disease, and juvenille diabetes. And there are simple tests to diagnose it such as blood tests and a simple biopsy of the lower lip. Have you had any of those tests done, especially by the doctor who said you had it??
It seems highly unlikely that you have this. Have you discussed this with your parents? Do they know what you are worrying about? School will be ending soon, why not have them make an appointment with your family doctor at home? As for the TMS theory, I do believe that this may be your cause. However, Dr. Sarno always suggests that a medical diagnosis be ruled out, especially when it is not pain related such as back, leg, or arm pain.
As to the psoriasis, yes, most definitely this is related to stess and anxiety. My husband had it for years and when he retired it went away!! Removal of stress maybe??? I did not find any links to a rash being a major part of SS!
Another thought. More often than not you do NOT need to fight, you need to float. In other words, the more you fight the more you body produces adrenalin, the more you have the symptoms. I am a true believer in the work of Dr. Claire Weeks and I urge you to read her books. Being a psych major it will help in your studies as well as she was a leading expert in the field fo stress and anxiety. When I first read Dr. Sarno I was amazed at how close his theories were with hers although presented in a different way. Sarno does not suggest that you fight your way through pain or a day. In fact, he suggests you float your way through it. In other words you feel the pain or the dry mouth and go on any way understanding that it can not harm you. It is the fear that harms, not the thing!!! It is Dr. Week's theory and when you really examine Dr. Sarno it is his as well.
I do believe that the mind has to believe and if that means going to your doctor at home then do that. Sometimes we do need an expert to help us reduce the anxiety until we can begin to reduce it ourselves. And I don't think that a few feel good measures hurt either like sucking on some sugarless lemon drops and sipping water through out the day. Sometimes they even work. If lemon drops keep your mouth moist and that can convince your brain that - wow, my mouth isn't as dry as I thought it was, then you relax, your worry relaxes, and your mind begins to accept.
I am thinking of you. Right now my own college son is worrying about his heart because his chest hurts. There is no reason at all to think it is heart related. What do I think it is? Most definitely stress related to school, work, and being 21 with a lot to deal with. I am giving him the same advice that I am giving you. Go gently with yourself, float through your days don't fight through them, give yourself all the reasons why you don't have SS many times during the day if you have to beginning with you are not a woman and you are not over 40.
Hang in there. Trust me, you are going to be fine!
Mom Dor |
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Not TMS after all?
