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gezondheid
50 Posts |
 Posted - 07/14/2007 : 04:56:42
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Floorten,
What i'am trying to say is that spiritual learnings have multiple meanings. They are like a diamond. the colours constantly change. It is difficult to compare those teachings with a theory which comes from another vector. Actually they say the same without Sarno knowing about painbodies. It is a question of levels and perception.
I think a side effect is that people who are struggling with their pain start to question their possible healing and stop themself. This is not what you intended but i think it happens.
This TMS board is unique and i see more and more posts with doubt and diversion. I think we should be much more supportive. Nobody else sees tms as cause. In mine opinion doubt is a killer and a strategy of your brain. Anyway it is not personal, its how i see it.
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stanfr
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 07/14/2007 : 17:38:48
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Gez;
I wholeheartedly agree that support is important: see the Candida post by Docsprocket as a great example how support can be immensely valuable and it does take place on this forum.
Doubt is not necessarily a killer. It can be compared with skepticism, which most definitely is a life-saver. Without it, i might be wasting my time treating myself with magnets or coffee enemas. The problem as i see it, is that TMS most definitely has a "spiritual component", but if you take the attitude that it is all spirit, that can be a hindrance towards general acceptance of the very disorder you are trying to 'defend'. There most definitely is science behind the TMS/psychosomatic mechanism, and unless that is addressed, TMS theory will always be just the 'fringe' feel-good method of a bunch of desperate sufferors. I don't want to see that. |
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vegomatic
24 Posts |
Posted - 07/16/2007 : 00:18:05
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Thirdly, I have a real problem believing that your subconscious is doing this benignly for *your own* protection! Sarno always argues that the pain is a distraction tactic that your mind is creating to protect you... but what kind of protection is crippling fibromyalgia or backache - the kind that makes you wish you weren't alive, and has already lead to some assisted suicides in the past?
An excellent point. My answer is because pain is one hell of a distraction. A much better one than pleasure. And as bad as fibromyalgi and backaches can be (believe me I know), the mind believes it is nothing compared to what would happen if the repressed rage escaped. So even if someone commits suicide due to the physical pain, he may probably do it quicker if the unconscious pain breaks through and he doesn't know the cause.
See the story of Helen that Sarno has written about in detail in the Mindbody Prescription and touched upon in The Divided Mind. Her repressed rage made it into her consciousness and it was so bad that for 48 hours she wanted die before recovering fully. She relived sexual abuse from 30 years before like it happened the day before. The mind sees that as much worse than any physical pain. I would personally take 48 hours of deep emotional pain to recover as opposed to years of physical but the mind doesn't see things like that.
For example let's say that you are about to be killed by a gang of thugs. What will cause a BIGGER distraction to prevent you from being killed, therefore protecting you? A beautiful bird chirping (pleasure) or a car spinning out of control hitting you, breaking your leg (pain) but causing the thugs to flee? I would choose the latter. Your leg may be broken but you are alive. TMS is that car hitting you to save your life.
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It also explains why I, and many like me, have been unsuccessful in healing TMS symptoms with just the knowledge of TMS theory from Sarno's books. Personally, I had still been believing that the symptoms and my reservoir of past pain had power OVER me, and therefore not creating the disassociation and awareness necessary to dissolve them. I was believing that I was at the mercy of my subconscious and this weird "protection mechanism".
This protection mechanism was still part of "me", as far as I was concerned, and so I wasn't making the necessary disassociation of identity from the TMS symptoms. I am finally making progress in my TMS symptoms now I have figured out this missing piece to the puzzle.
Whatever works for you is great. Cherry picking what works and discarding what doesn't is great too. However in The Divided Mind Sarno eloquently and humorously explains the protection theory. Check out his severe gastroesophageal reflux anecdote while traveling with his wife on p.125-126.
My history (good and bad) defines me and what not to do to live a productive future. Living in the moment is wonderful but we must be mindful of the past so we do not repeat it in the future.
My TMS pain is in me and not some outside force trying to make it's way in. When I have control and knowledge about what is inside me I will then be better able to deal with whatever the world throws at me. So bring it on you stupid world! I can take it. 
Seriously regardless if it's for protection or not (and I see your point - it is a strong one that will make me think), the most important thing is that the pain is a distraction and that is something we can agree with. As long as distraction is there, the reason for the distraction (protection or not) can be rendered irrelevant.
I am so glad you have found your way. Each person must find their own way as everybody is different. Variety is truly the spice of life. I hate ending on a cliche' 
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Edited by - vegomatic on 07/16/2007 01:28:36 |
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floorten
United Kingdom
120 Posts |
Posted - 07/16/2007 : 07:41:58
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Vego,
You're quite right that it doesn't really matter whether or not it's protection or self-survival. It was just an issue for me because I wasn't confronting the TMS, because I was thinking it was "part" of me and therefore would somehow want to co-operate.
I have no problem believing that distraction is occurring though. This much is 100% clear.
Now I see the TMS as something other than me, an imposter or such, and I'm finding it easier to get that crucial disassociation required to think psychological and carry on regardless. With my symptoms being so pervasive (24/7 headaches) I was finding it really difficult to just detach from the distraction effect enough to view myself psychologically. I'd always just keep getting caught up in the drama of the pain. Very tricky when you can't think straight cause your head is throbbing!
Greg.
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"What the Thinker thinks, the Prover proves."
Robert Anton Wilson |
Edited by - floorten on 07/16/2007 07:46:38 |
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Curiosity18
USA
141 Posts |
Posted - 07/17/2007 : 20:44:09
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floorten,
What an inspiring thread! I plan on listening to Tolle's CDs again more thoroughly this time. One question I have for you- How do you reconcile the idea of the "not-me pain body" with total acceptance of self? I always believed that in order to have true healing unconditional self-love was critical. I wonder if another way to look at the pain body would be to think of it (compassionately) as something that I created, that I completely acccept that I created it, but that it is not me, and is not serving me.
Thanks again,
Curiosity
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Towards a revised model of TMS using Tolle (long)
