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greenelvis
USA
21 Posts |
 Posted - 02/16/2007 : 11:17:08
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Just curious, in the process of me becoming deconditioned to certain activities, will the body try to find new ways to "condition" itself?
Like, if driving the car no longer is a problem, but all of a sudden kneeling down to get the laundry out for the first time bothers me, is this the mind's attempt to find a new way to "condition" itself>?
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Edited by - greenelvis on 02/16/2007 11:53:21 |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 02/16/2007 : 11:51:31
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| You got it. Once the unconscious mind learns you are on to its tricks, it will try to stay one step ahead of you, and give you new symptoms even more likely to make you believe it is a structural problem. |
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Bliss
Canada
33 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2007 : 11:33:34
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So, do we just keep pushing through every new challenge that the unconscious mind throws at us? Sometimes I feel that my subconscious is the young kid in me that was ignored /stayed quiet. I've given her permission to come out and she's someone that I now want to care for....but, wow - is she ever DEMANDING !!
Your thoughts?
Bliss |
Edited by - Bliss on 02/17/2007 11:34:41 |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2007 : 09:48:33
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Eventually your unconscious mind will give up, if you just laugh off it's attempts and refuse to be tricked. You thwart the strategy by confronting "forbidden" emotions whenever you are aware of new symptoms.
For many, it is a lifelong battle. Many will have recurrences throughout their lives, at times of stress, or when one is "lying to themselves" and avoiding their true feelings. But as long as you recognize the symptoms as psychogenic, the recurrences should be of lower intensity and shorter duration. The key is to ignore it as best you can and go about your life. If it doesn't serve as a distraction, it will slowly fade. |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2007 : 11:17:55
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Page 157 of The Divided Mind reads:
Some patients report that their symptoms (usually pain) have begun to move from one place to another. This may be taken as a favorable sign that therapy is having a beneficial effect and can also be used to reassure patients that such a pattern is more consistent with psychological rather than disease-induced symptoms.
And Dr. Marc Sopher has this say on page 352:
"On the flip side, it is important not to be discouraged if symptoms
arise during the course of an activity. It simply means that more
mental work must be done. It is easy for fear and its compatriot,
doubt, to creep in. “Maybe it isn’t TMS, maybe I do have a physical
problem” are common thoughts. The best advice is to simply
acknowledge this fear as part of the old conditioning, of the brain’s
strategy to have you believe there is a physical problem."
It appears to me that evey single question asked on this board is answered in Dr. Sarno's books in one way or another. It is amazing!
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Sarno-ize it!
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Victoria008
USA
26 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2007 : 16:15:03
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I have always had pain that moved around. It is so similar to the panic disorder I have had for years. I would learn to accept and not be afraid of a "nervous symptom" such as lightheadedness or palpitations, and then I would have something else such as trembling spells etc. As I traverse through my TMS journey the first thing I noticed less of was pain in my lower body, and then it became more pronounced in my upper body. For me this has been the pattern.
Victoria |
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greenelvis
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2007 : 21:46:17
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Posted - 02/19/2007 : 21:38:56
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Ok this is making me grumpy tonight. Last night, I did so good. I yelled the pain away, told it to leave, and it did. I slipped into bed without any pain and fell right to sleep.
Tonight...no that's not working, and I really don't want to take any Advil. Especially b/c I feel like my whole conditioning pattern is to have pain at night, and have pain in the morning, which gradually dissipates
I've been reading the MBP and it is good, I feel like I am learning so much, and really starting to let this thing sink in.
I suppose that's precisely why it is putting up a fight tonight?
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Karma
USA
23 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2007 : 21:58:48
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It often gets worse before it gets better because the mind puts up a fight when you challenge the pattern it's established that has been working so well to distract you from the underlying anger that you probably don't even know is there.
Keep reading, then read it again and start the treatment program  |
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Stryder
686 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2007 : 23:14:47
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Dave said: Eventually your unconscious mind will give up, if you just laugh off it's attempts and refuse to be tricked...
...For many, it is a lifelong battle. Many will have recurrences throughout their lives, at times of stress, or when one is "lying to themselves" and avoiding their true feelings. But as long as you recognize the symptoms as psychogenic, the recurrences should be of lower intensity and shorter duration...
Here's a good example.
True story.
I've been pretty much pain free for over a year or so. Yesterday I go out and do about an hour of snow shoveling.
About 6 hours later, I'm just standing there in the kitchen, standing straight up, feeling just fine. Then I start thinking about a family member that I'm not getting along with at the moment, and,,, zing,, I get cramp in the lower back that runs down my right sciatic nerve to my foot, and I'm hunched over.
I'm like, what the F... brought THAT up? And its not going away.
In my past life before I got Sarnoized [(tm) ShawnSmith)], I would have crawled into bed for a couple days since I could stand up straight, and I "must have torn something in my back".
Instead, I rested for about 10 minutes in bed, let the cramp subside, did a couple stretches, got up, and IGNORED it for the rest of the day. No, I didn't obsess "Oh My, I'm Going To Be A Mess In The Morning", like I used to. I just ignored it.
Today, I was fine. 100%.
Yes, you can recondition your mind and choose how you think.
Thanks Doc, -Stryder
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Edited by - Stryder on 02/19/2007 23:20:59 |
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greenelvis
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2007 : 02:00:48
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Ok, I get the conditioning thing. But, I am getting pissed, the past 2 nights I haven't slept good, the pain seems to be jumping up now in the middle of the night. This is new. I suppose this is good. I'm trying to just ignore it. But, thinking psychologically at 4am, I can say the only thing I'm visibly aware of being upset over is the fact that I am in pain. Which I know is not good. So, seriously is it better to not take pain meds that will knock me out and get me through the night? Or, should I keep fighting through this? Anybody have any thoughts? Or I suppose I could try journaling about things that my unconscious is upset over.
I've been re reading MBP before going to bed, and been talking, actually more like yell at my brain before I go to sleep, which seems to dissipate the pain.
Anyways, any thoughts would be appreciated!
Thanks! |
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Wavy Soul
USA
779 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2007 : 02:28:40
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quote:
at times of stress, or when one is "lying to themselves" and avoiding their true feelings.
This is extremely profound, the thing about "lying to ourselves." Thought my problem was health, but perfect marriage. It took him suddenly bailing and my health improving (as I felt unbearable emotional pain) to realize I had been "lying to myself."
quote:
thinking psychologically at 4am, I can say the only thing I'm visibly aware of being upset over is the fact that I am in pain
Yeah, I know this one - in fact I do all my forum haunting in the wee hours and it basically sends me back to bed. It's so easy to think it's the pain which is pissing us off!
Go away pain, I hate you.... er.... mommy? Daddy?
xx
Love is the answer, whatever the question |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2007 : 05:43:55
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Even Dr. Sarno and Dr. Sopher recommends taking pain meds if the pain
in severe. This is done to take the edge of the pain so that your are
in a position to do the psychological work. Just be careful not to
become dependent on the pain meds, keep telling yourself that this is
only a temporary measure and that you are aware of the real source of
the pain.
Here is a direct quite from Dr. Sopher's book:
"It is reasonable to take non-narcotic medication for pain, like
aspirin, Tylenol, ibuprofen or naproxen (all available over-thecounter). However, each time you do, it is important to remind
yourself that these drugs will not fix the cause of the symptoms and
will just temporarily take the edge off while you continue to apply
yourself mentally."
Best wishes.
Shawn
*************
Sarno-ize it!
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Edited by - shawnsmith on 02/21/2007 09:41:37 |
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New Conditioning?
