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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
 Posted - 08/05/2006 : 18:25:56
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I'm new to the forum, but a veteran of the back wars. Years ago, I cured my back pain by reading and believing Dr. Sarno's first book. Now I'm struggling with digestive problems, which have been diagnosed as acid reflux and that catch-all, IBS. Had an endoscopy -- no ulcer, but a "small hiatus hernia," whatever that means. Symptoms include coated tongue, sore throat, "lump in throat," hoarseness, stomach pains that come and go, belching, nausea, etc. Prescription drugs help, but I worry about the side effects (and the cost). I've tried drastic dietary changes, supplements of various kinds, acupuncture, homeopathy, relaxation exercises -- you name it.
I've searched the forum archives for posts on reflux but found very few. It would be so helpful to hear some success stories!
Peony |
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tallpaul
15 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2006 : 19:01:03
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peony,
I had "IBS" really bad for 10 years (I am 35), but my symptoms were not the same as yours. I just had bad stomach upset all the time. After trying many docs (who found nothing), potions, pills, snake oils, homeopathy, hypnosis, etc, I finally tried homemade yogurt and my symptoms are 90% gone now for about a year. Store bought yogurt did not work nearly as well - don't ask em why. The link below is a good IBS self help forum. BTW, in my opinion IBS is a term the docs use when they cannot find anything wrong and want to call it something.
http://ibsgroup.org/groupee/forums/a/frm/f/43110261 |
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flyefisher
48 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2006 : 20:58:56
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I think my first significant surfacing of TMS a few years back was acid reflux. I'd get nasty heartburn while driving. I had to take medication, and that would clear the symptoms, but it always came back. When my financial situation stabilized it more or less went away. I had back pain around the birth of my first child last year and since.
It can most certainly be TMS. |
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Scottydog
United Kingdom
330 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 01:22:30
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I had the belching, nausea occasional diarrhoea which got worse at a v stressful time for me. A gluten free diet "cured it" - not easy, no bread, pasta etc - but then I read Sarno and it has gone for good with only occasional occurrence when I can usually spot the cause. So you could try the gluten free diet, it helped me cope in a work environment.
Anne |
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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 05:14:46
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Thank you all so much for your prompt and thoughtful replies.
I'm now reading The Mindbody Prescription, which does touch on gastrointestinal trouble.
I've haunted the self-help forums for months and tried almost every doggone "cure" in the book. It's enough to drive a person into a repressed rage. Homemade yogurt is a new one, though, Tallpaul. I'll give it a shot while working on my emotions. I've also wondered about gluten intolerance, Scottydog.
I do hope someone sympathetic to Dr. Sarno's ideas will do more research on digestion and TMS. Dr. Sarno talks about an epidemic of back pain. True, but there's also an epidemic of GI upset. Mainstream doctors don't seem to have a clue about the cause. They just hand out prescriptions for the symptoms. I've read that acid reducers are among the biggest-selling drugs in the world -- something like $6 billion a year for one brand. As I've discovered, the drugs are addictive, too. Very convenient for the pharma companies.
Thank you all again.
Peony (always a good girl, responsible, caring, perfectionist about many things, placid on the surface, anxious as heck underneath).
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flyefisher
48 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 08:08:33
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I don't see any pharma company conspiracy going on. It's just easier and cheaper to give you a pill. Diagnostic tests would benefit those companies but they are avoided due to high cost and the possibility of longer doctors' visits etc. Having suffered from low back pain, I know how the system is very dysfunctional. They'll treat you half-ass so that you have to come back to them and give them another $150 for 15 minutes. If they can't fix you in 15 minutes, they brush you off and give you a pill. Or send you to weeks of physical therapy based on a hunch, not a definite diagnosis. The insurance companies hack at them if they order the diagnostics and actually take the time to find the real problem. It's not about you and getting real results to the problem. It's a business. I can understand how it works, but when you are in pain and caught up in the system, this alone can be cause for depression.
Bottom line is, you have to be your own best advocate. Don't assume our stellar medical system is going to cure you. You can cure yourself, however, if you look deep inside and take time and perseverance. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 09:29:14
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Excellent post FF, good overview of the med/industrial complex today. Dr. Sarno does mention g/i, esophagal and digestive sypmtoms as possible/probable TMS sites. His latest book THE DIVIDED MIND, cites them.
I found it to be a curious TMS fact, that we never think the Good Doctor, makes enough mention of our TMS symptom. While his earlier works mention back problems and are mentioned in the titles of first two books, his theory has evolved to include every part of the body that has capillaries or nerve receptors. This pretty much covers our entire corpse I would believe. TMS sites are based more on conteporary social mores.
During Freuds day, hysterical symptoms, became TMS epedeimic--because HE wrote about them, thus popularizing them. A few decades ago, stomach ulcers became the TMS norm. That TMS epedemic ran it's course, when it's cover was blown, as being caused by stress.
Ulcers are now being re-popularized by a new generation, do, to the "discovery" that it's cause "may" be a bacteria, (e pilori)--"everthing old, is new again". (Sarno vigorously refutes this notion, but it's hard to fight Noble Prize winners-someday Sarno will get his much deserved Noble and hopefully not postumously
When we run out of anatomical symptom sites, the TMS gremlin, changes tactics and invades our immune systems and our psyches, with affective emotional symptoms, such as, depression, anxiety, ocd, cf, etc.
In conclusion, to fight TMS, you have to make/take the leap-of-faith from your micro-TMS symptom site to the macro-TMS universe. The TMS gremlin fights a guerilla war and will snipe at you from anywhere--mind/body/soul. But, it won't face you head-on, in order to slay him, you have to do that.
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2006 : 11:18:02
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In my experience, GERD/IBS is seen in a high percentage of TMS patients, maybe up to 50%. Everyone's on prevacid or nexium or something of the like, so for most people it's not a major problem, however, I think it's usually a symptom of TMS, and amenable to the same treatment.
Naturally, consult with your doctor before making any medical decisions. Good luck. |
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miche
Canada
283 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2006 : 14:20:43
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Here is what Walter McQuade and Ann Aikman have to say regarding digestive problems in their book, "Stress" :
When infants do not get enough affection and reassurance while being fed, it may demoralize them or at least their digestive functions permanently.Unconsciously, in later life they connect feeding and love and long deeply for both.Some may develop a weight problem, from constantly feeding on snacks whether hungry or not.Some may become compulsive eaters, prey to secret , panicky binges in which they gobble up everything in sight till they vomit. Others may turn into one of the estimated eight millions Americans who suffer from ulcers. People with stomach ulcers have gastric systems that are in constant motion, or it could be said in constant emotion.
I am curious as to how many of us were bottle fed, the bottle being propped up by a blanket in our cots instead of us being held in our mother's arms , will we see the decline of ulcers in our young as the return of breast feeding is on the rise and mothers are more inclined to feed their infants when they are hungry instead of sticking to a timetable as our mothers were thaught to do for fear of spoiling their children? Just a thought! |
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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2006 : 16:38:34
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Drziggles, thanks -- that's what I was hoping to hear. My GI told me that stress was not a cause of my symptoms, "although they cause stress." I didn't and don't buy that, as I know how much sicker I feel when over-stressed -- or even just a bit anxious. I also can't accept my family doctor's conviction that I have to stay on Prevacid (plus a motility drug) for the rest of my life. Drugs like Prevacid and Nexium treat only symptoms and have unknown and possibly dangerous side-effects.
I'm happy to say that I feel quite a bit better since I stopped obsessing about my symptoms and diet and stopped reading the GERD/IBS forums. I'm still hoping to hear from folks who cured stomach/esophageal/throat issues through the Sarno approach. It gives one inspiration and hope, just as stories about pain relief do for those of you with various kinds of pain. Because of the rise in esophageal cancer in recent years, GERD has become a very scary deal. And of course the fear leads to more stress and worse symptoms.
Miche, interesting theory. I don't think I was bottle fed, but there certainly was a lot of tension in our home when I was a child. Then again, who doesn't have some unhappy childhood memories?
Peony |
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whitris
USA
26 Posts |
Posted - 08/11/2006 : 16:04:40
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| TMS has worked well on my GERD, but it does recur sometimes. The drugs, I find, are a slippery slope...the body/mind is looking for an outlet and in my case tries to trump the drug action. I think this is why folks are always looking for stronger drugs. Several months ago when my GERD was getting really bad, I abandoned all treatment, did basic Sarno work and got better fast. The problem is that this can be scary to do,as you have noted. Are you really ready to confront what is eating at you and make changes? After I get better I find that I can eat anything, drink alcohol and basically break all the dietary rules that are said to ward off GERD. I believe in exercise/yoga and healthy food/sleep, but it is not what cured me. (note: I have written one other past post about GERD, too.) Good luck! |
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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2006 : 15:07:40
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Thanks, Whitris. You give me hope. You were brave to quit the meds, if that was part of your treatment. The prescription drugs can have a terrible rebound effect.
If my GERD is caused by a structural defect and not TMS, I'm in trouble because I've tried all the "cures" except surgery. I've now given up my severely restricted diet, as well as all the digestive enzymes, herbal supplements and acid-reducers I used to take, and have donated my wedge pillow to one of the dogs. I still have work to do on my demons, but I feel better, not worse. Just the fact that my stomach pain disappeared more than once when I had toothache confirms my suspicion that this is TMS.
It's instructive, if depressing, to peruse the GERD forums. Many people (like me) have multiple symptoms that come and go, and most are on prescription or OTC drugs -- including, in some cases, Xanax.
Everybody's suffering, and in many cases very scared. It's wonderful to hear from someone who actually got better.
Peony
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MichaelO
7 Posts |
Posted - 08/12/2006 : 17:19:29
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| I've been struggling w/ reflux/nausea problems for the past 9 months. A little over a month ago i started Dr. Sarno's treatment. The hardest part i think to assimilate is the diagnosis that there is nothing structurally wrong - that our digestive systems are more hardy then we attribute to them. When you feel so bad for so long, and the doctors keep treating you like your body is a machine breaking down, it's quite a big hurdle to leap. So far, i must concede that this past month (working thru Dr. Sarno's stuff) has been the best i've felt in over a half year of dealing w/ these stomach troubles. Today was a good day. I almost felt perfectly normal like my old self. What's really cool to me is that the truth really does set you free. The correct diagnosis - that the majority of gastrointestinal disorders are emotionally induced (albeit unconsciously) - is the paved way to getting better. What that means for me is that i don't have to pretend to believe it and hope everthing gets better - like rubbing a Genie bottle or something. All i have to do is apply it consistently everyday and wait for the truth to permeate my whole being. That's good science and medicine in my book. |
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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 08/13/2006 : 05:49:49
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Michael, good for you! It really does take a leap of faith to do what you have done. Doctors will tell you that GERD can cause everything from asthma to cancer, and that we MUST take medication (even though those billions of dollars spent on prescription drugs don't seem to be stemming the tide of esophageal cancer).
In all the research I've done, I've never found an "expert" who can say what causes GERD. It used to be blamed on hiatal hernias, but lot of folks have those with no symptoms. I suppose that's another signpost pointing to TMS. On the other hand, vets tell me that dogs and horses can get acid reflux, so what are we to make of that?
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 08/13/2006 : 11:23:50
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quote from Peony:
"On the other hand, vets tell me that dogs and horses can get acid reflux, so what are we to make of that?"
I believe that the fellow creatures that share our planet, are just as subsceptible to psychosomatic issues as the rest of us homo-sapiens. We just don't have the
communications skills to understand them. When my cat pees all over the place and on me, when I try to put her in her carrier, it sure is a physical response to an emotional issue.
Some trauma in her past, before I adopted her, has made her deathly afraid of being put in a carrier, and she fights, claws, resists and pees. It works really well as a deterrent to me from ever wanting to transport her from where she feels secure.
Dr. Sarno says, in THE DIVIDED MIND, that TMS, the repression of frightening thoughts, may have evolved, as a survival tool in our brain's evolution--(the id, ego and super-ego stuff).
Several years ago I got a duodenal ulcer, which I have posted exstensively about here. It's "structural" cause was due to abuse of Alleves, taking 3 to 4 times the reccommeded dose.
It also had a defintite TMS psychological component that became the trigger for it's full-blown ER room visit. Numerous stress-full life situations nexused one evening involving the usual TMS ""dis-ease causing suspects: relationship, job, and family.
Once in the hospital, I was off the TMS "battle-field" and my symptom, the duodenal ulcer, evidenced itself as having healed-over on the scope test. The bleeding stopped within 24 hours of being hospitalized. My hemo-globin count was about half of normal.
Three days in the hospital, a few pints of blood and I was as good as new. I played a national tournament match the day after being released. I warned my doubles partner that I might pass out or have to retire. The match went well and I felt great for having played it.
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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2006 : 05:34:06
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Excellent point, TennisTom. I should know better -- I'm the one who's always pointing out that animals are just like us. We have an Irish wolfhound with a wicked sense of humor, a Lab-mix who sings/yodels out of sheer joy (apparently)and a beagle with a phobia about flyswatters, despite the fact that we adopted him as an adult and no dog is ever hit, or threatened, in this house.
Interesting about the ulcer. I have a hard time getting my head around TMS and structural disorders. I suppose an over-simplification would be that TMS finds a weak spot and moves in. Considering your experience with the ulcer, it seems as though a recurring tooth infection might disappear as well. Sure hate to lose that tooth. |
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Logan
USA
203 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2006 : 07:42:29
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Peony,
I've read about others who had "IBS" or "Chrohn's" curing it with Sarno's methods. In fact, before ever reading Sarno's books, I read a book called "The Street Kid's Guide to Having it All," in which the author (forgot name) recounts his severe, severe gastro symptoms (he once crapped his pants while chauffering around a VIP client and had to change into extra trousers in a gas station bathroom) and how he cured them by getting in touch with his anger of a tough childhood and then focusing on his life goals.
I know when I'm stressed my digestive system locks up, knots up or lets go, especially now that I've kicked TMS neck pain. I take immodium, gas-x or fiber pills as needed but that's to treat the symptoms not the cause.
Good luck. |
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peony
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2006 : 15:23:02
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Thanks, Logan. My symptoms manifest mostly in the stomach and throat. There's a fancy name for that -- laryngopharyngeal reflux. Perhaps it really should be called TMS. I know that many people are taking one, two or three drugs for "LPR" without getting much relief, if any.
How do you feel about treating symptoms? Sarno (if I read him correctly) seems to feel that it's best not to, although I suppose taking Gas-X would be the equivalent of taking a pill for bad pain. I'm trying hard to ignore symptoms as much as possible. Not always easy, especially if one had the gastro complaints of the poor guy in your story! |
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Logan
USA
203 Posts |
Posted - 08/15/2006 : 18:28:06
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Peony,
I haven't really thought too much about taking gastro medications because I know the symptoms are a TMS equivalent, therefore they don't cause the same kind of anxiety or fear that my neck pain, which I thought for so long was structural, did.
I know the symptoms are blatant "TMS" and that they are fleeting. I'm under no delusions that they are part of some larger syndrome or anything like that so I feel like if I take the medication it's not feeding into any larger belief system.
Sarno does advocate taking pain meds in the case of severe pain, in order to get the mind clear enough to focus on the psychological. I feel like taking immodium, or fiber pills as the case may be, is the same thing. It's just practical, immediate help so I can deal with the "stuff" in my life that caused the problem or contributed to it at the very least.
Also, I think it depends on how much of a problem gastro things are for you. If they were/are your sole TMS manifestation, then I would say try to forgo meds and really work at getting free of them by thinking psychological.
As it is, I have kicked the pain that ruled my life and am working on all of my psychological "stuff" but I still and always will have the odd TMS equivalent such as gastro symptoms or a hive like rash I call my "stress rash."
In fact, the stress rash, which is hive like bumps I used to get in large swaths over my knee, elbow, hip, ankle and finger joints was something I had always had even as a young child whenever I was under extreme pressure; but that went away when I got neck pain that I thought came from a car accident.
I see it's occasional return (now just a bump here and there on my fingers or feet) as a sign that I've got what Sarno sees as a normal somatic response to stress. In fact, I was so happy the first time I got the stress rash back after starting my TMS recovery, that I rejoiced and "told" my body it could have the stress rash as a sign that I was taking on too much and that I would respect it and heed it.
So, long story short. I see my very occasional gastro trouble as a similar but more annoying sign and I try to treat the symptoms while also aknowledging the rage/grief/fear that the body is trying to distract me from. And I never leave the house without immodium. : ) |
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digestive problems and TMS
