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Suz
559 Posts |
 Posted - 07/25/2005 : 11:04:56
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I had a terrible but very enlightening weekend. Many of you know that I have been having terrible back spasms and fatigue.
Over last weekend, i realized that my fiance and I have radically different ideas about marriage. I have been experiencing terrible anxiety about the impending marriage. My fiance broke to me that he is unable to support himself (he lives with his mother) and he has no idea when or if his job will turn around. It is commission based and takes about 10 years to get anywhere. He told me that he is basically expecting me to support him as his mother does. He wants me to work for the rest of my life and we hope to have children that he wants his mother to bring up as our nanny. He said that she never got the opportunity to be with her children. He thinks that my desire to be home with children is not attainable and unrealistic.
I sat with him last night and cried and cried for about an hour and a half. I really made my point and realized that I cannot do this kind of marriage. My last marriage was fraught with terrible money issues as my ex husband did not have any security.
I believe that this is the root of all of my terrible pain. My pain started 12 years ago during engagemnt to my ex husband. I always thought he was too immature and not ready. I ignored the signs. I have been doing the same time this time round. It must have been creating a terrible conflict in me.
I am very very sad as I love him but I have always known that something is wrong. I think I love him as a wonderful friend but that is not enough. A voice in me has often said "this man is not right for you" - not only because of money but other things too.
Last night, my back wasn't painful at all. Today, I have no fatigue even though I didn't sleep that well.
What a difference. I am a bit of an emotional wreck and seem to be crying a lot. I guess I am really dealing with this instead of numbing |
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Laura
USA
655 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 11:33:51
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Suz,
Thank God all of this happened now before you got married. What an eye opener. I think that "voice" that you spoke of is there within all of us - we just have to listen to it when it speaks to us. Yours has been telling you all this time that this wasn't the right person for you. Your body was trying to tell you the same thing. Now you have chosen to listen to both. That is wonderful. It is good that you are crying and "emotional" and dealing with things. Better that than taking it out on your body. Go through the emotions and deal with them as they come up. Know that by ending this engagement you are doing the best thing for yourself AND for him. You should not be expected to do everything in your life on his and his mother's terms. What about your terms? You matter and your feelings count. To enter into a marriage where you are expected to work and support your spouse indefinitely and hire his mother as your nanny (while at the same time not having the pleasure of being home with your own children) would sound scary to anyone. It seems like everybody's feelings (his and his mother's) count but not yours. No wonder your back has been hurting so much. You know the source of the pain though, and you can work through this.
Good for you! It is wonderful you have had this eye opening experience BEFORE getting married. There is someone out there who is perfect for you and in due time you will meet them. In the meantime, keep working on yourself and keep working through the emotions.
Laura
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 11:45:20
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Thank you Laura. You are so kind and supportive. He really is a good man but sort of got used to everyone taking care of him. This was a big eye opener for him too and I know he feels very bad. I feel so awful for him. Part of me feels like a demanding person as I want so badly to be able to be at home when bringing up children (If I am even blessed with them) I know that is a very old fashioned and not what many women do. But it is so important to me. Also I would be going into something with everything on my shoulders as I would never know if he would make any money.
We have not officially broken off the engagement but are definitely not getting married in November. I also wonder if marrying him was to please him and not think enough of myself.
How strange it is that my body was talking to me. It has been amazing lesson to me to listen and really let myself feel. I am learning to trust my own gut and instincts. This has been a big lesson to me.
It is very painful but since seeing the psychologist, I seem to find it very easy to cry now and let go. That is very new for me. |
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Albert
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 12:09:04
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I agree with Laura. The voice that you spoke of is in all of us.
It's kind of interesting. You had to be your own mother during life, and that tendency has sort of carried over to your choice of men. Men that need to be taken care of. |
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marytabby
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 12:14:17
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Good news to hear of your breakthrough. I agree with Albert. I too had to be my own mother all my life and in turn tend to pick men that need mothering. Thank God I never married any of them is all I can say. I am 39 and never married. Still single but not regretting any of it because I'd be divorced now if I married any of them.
Good for you that you figured this out now. |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 12:25:14
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It is good that you figured this out. Love or not, it seems you two are simply incompatible. That type of marriage would be the source of so much rage. Trust yourself.
Don't forget to address the mother issues as well. No doubt she will see this as a victory, that you are submitting to her wishes. Careful how you handle that because it could just lead to more repression. |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 12:25:43
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| Wow - that mothering thing is very true. I never thought of it like that. He has been very kind and supportive to me but I often feel like a mother with him. I felt that my last husband was very immature. I think it all felt like a repeat. I don't know - maybe he will pull through and everything will be alright. Maybe I' m dreaming! |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 12:33:26
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| Tell me about it, Dave. I don't know what I will say. I can't even face it. I need to really think about this and talk about it with the pschologist. My mother will run down a long list of all the things wrong with him - making me feel like a fool and a failure again. My dad will just tell me off as he does not give me any kind of credit for anything I do. He talks to me like I am about 11 years old. I am not going to call my parents for a while. I told my sister who was really sweet and promised she wouldn't say anything |
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NLK
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 12:47:05
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Congrats, Suz, on realizing that you weren't in the right relationship. Sometimes we ignore that little inner voice because we don't want to hear it or acknowledge it. It takes GUTS to listen, and TONS of GUTS to act.
I'm really proud of you for acknowledging what hasn't been working for you. It's scary to do, but life promises to be terrific (and pain-free) in the future!!
Good job, kiddo.... keep listening to that inner voice.
Nancy |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 13:03:22
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| Thank you NLK. I feel a bit shaky and weird over the whole thing. I feel a bit like I will never meet anyone. It will be very strange not to be with my fiance. I keep thinking that things will turn around. I am probably second guessing myself right now as I am scared |
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Laura
USA
655 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 13:33:22
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Do not second guess yourself, Suz. Trust your gut feeling. If more people went with their gut feelings they would save themselves a lot of grief and heartache down the road. Trust yourself.
And, Dave's right about your mother. I'm sure talking to your therapist about all of this is the best thing. Again, good luck!
Laura
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Albert
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 16:22:03
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Suz:
Of course you're the only who can tell whether it's time to end the relationship. It's hard to find relationships that are perfect, if at all. Perhaps if you made a list of pros and cons, you might get a better feeling. Make certain that any reservations you have aren't just usual pre-marriage fears.
I don't know how the mother/wife factor plays into it. I don't know whether such a thing could be worked out. I don't have any experience in this area. It's worth thinking about though. |
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NLK
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 18:09:27
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Suz, no need to second guess yourself. You made the right decision. Don't let habit convince you to go back, or that "he'll change", or that "it'll be ok". The very fact that you've had such a remarkable absence of pain would seem to indicate just how much of a mismatch you were. It's tough to be alone right now - but maybe you can think of it as an opportunity to be with yourself for awhile as you continue to work through all this with your doc.
Take a good long while to work this out and integrate everything. There's no rush, and when the time is right, Mr. Right will come along. If you rush it, you'll find another mismatch, but if you're patient, you'll find someone who exceeds your every expectation. I'm living proof of that :-)
Keep up the good work and keep posting here... we're all here to support you!!
:-)
Nancy |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2005 : 20:21:20
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Thank you everyone. I am feeling totally upside down and scared this evening. I am angry and feel like I don't even know my fiance. I think it is significant that my pain has gone. The pain in the upper back was excruciating and after I cried for a couple of hours, it left me - just gone. I was crying at how sad it all was. I so wanted to get married and thought he was my best friend in the world. It just seems that the circumstances are against us and all that I suspected about him was true. He never wanted me to be able to be at home and bring up children- he always wanted me to work. I also never knew that he could not support himself - and he is 35 years old. He depends on his mother. I really respected him for persevering with his career - that takes a long time to have success in. But he told me it would possibly take 10 years to make any money. I feel used - as if it was all up to me. I am paying for all the wedding details and honeymoon and moving into a new appartment. I was also about to buy him a car as his lease was running out. He was very grateful and said that my offer to do this really showed what a team we were. I never felt like we were a team - it was just me doing it all.
He is so so angry at me and I feel like I am the bad guy.
He proposed to me back in April - around a time when we were arguing all the time. It was as if he thought that a ring would make it all go away. I was also at fault for accepting. He spent thousands on the ring - all his savings - which is crazy. I don't want to wear it now as I feel so depressed. We are supposedly still engaged.
I feel very lost as he has been my closest friend for the last 4 years and I don't know how I will manage without him. I have my faith to get me through this so I am praying a lot which helps.
It is just that the loneliness is scary. I also have guilt that he might be in pain. This all happened so fast and I feel that the wind has been knocked out of me.
Thank goodness for this wonderful forum - I appreciate all the support so much right now - thank you to all of you.
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Kajsa
Denmark
144 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 02:10:57
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I can see that this was a hard decision Suz !
And it is absolute natural that you get a kind of back-lash - you were going to be married and now
you are not getting married.
But it sounds to me like a very good step (though it hurts). Actually your body told you so.
I think you made a brave and very important step! Crucial for your health.
Yes ,”reverse therapy” is ALL about emotions. How emotions creates fear in your body -
and how to deal with it. You find a lot of information on the webb.
I can tell you more about it later - right now I guess you have a lot of other things on your mind.
All the best
Kajsa
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Albert
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 10:12:31
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Suz:
Now that you've provided more details, it seems like he's depending on you too much. My guess is that you're looking to be a wife, not somebody's meal ticket. Ten years before he'll make any money? Maybe he needs to come up with a better plan. |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 10:42:46
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Suz- You are going through a lot of emotional pain right now but isn't it a lot better than going throught the TMS pain.
I can really relate to what you are going through because many years ago I was in the same situation- wondering should I take the plunge or not. Finally I decided to go for it and then my body - my gut feelings- interveined in a dramatic way telling me it was wrong. It showed up as inability to sleep and finally panic attacks (the first and hopefully the last time).
You are now listening and feeling what you need to feel right now and you will choose a more compatible man next time around because you are more connected to your feelings. Feeling definitely have wisdom and can steer you in the right direction for you.
Good for you Suz - you are very courageous! |
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Baseball65
USA
734 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 11:02:49
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Hi Suz.
Like Joan Rivers says,Can We Talk?
Advice and opinions are abundant in times like yours,but I thought if I illuminated an anecdote,it might convey some wisdom(that I didn't follow)
So.I'm a singer in a Rock Band in Hollywood,Ca.
I make my living doing construction,just keeping body and soul together.I live in an empty house that doubles as my bands rehearsal studio,sleeping on the floor.My rent is 200 dollars a month,and I make about 2000.I eat Ramen Noodles and Hot dogs and spend the rest in clubs and Bars.I am as Happy as a Pig in %#@!
I'm Peter Pan
Than,I meet this girl.A wonderful girl if ever there was one.I ditch every other prospect and start going out with her exclusively.She's PerFeCt!! She's sweet,fun and Beautiful.We hit it off right away and We decide to get Married.Yay.
After the initial infatuation wears off,I realize she has a severe personality flaw.Any time we get into an arguement and she's clearly 'wrong' or 'out of bounds',rather than discuss it to it's resolution,she goes silent.She has obviously been brought up in the 'just ignore it and it will go away' school of humanities.This is exasperating beyond my patience,as I grew up in a 'work it out through reason and open discussion' way of life.She is also constitutionally incapable of saying the words 'I am sorry'...
My best friend and Drummer lives with us .He sees My Fiance' do this,and tells me that we better work it out before we get married or it could become a BIG problem.He was married for 10 years and just recently divorced
I decide that ,in spite of our engagement to be married in 5 months,that I want her to move out until after the Marriage.I assumed that the distance and time apart might give me the leverage to encourage her to address her sullen/silent/denial way of dealing with stuff...and that way I can escape her reign of psychological tyranny,for that is what it amounts to.Also,in spite of my 100% faithfulness,she's starting to get awfully clingy when I have to go and play music...Jealous.She's starting to become an Anchor,not a buoy.
So,I'm going to tell her to move out...today.She comes home from work and before I say anything,she tells ME she has something to tell ME.
??????????
I tell her "You go first",hoping that it's something like:"I want to move out,because...."
No such luck.
She's Pregnant.
"So...what were you going to tell me?" she asks.
Uhhh....nothing.
Now,I don't need to recap what you've probably seen me posting about for the last month or so.She has still NEVER gotten over that problem,and we've had a LOT of friction for the last...uhhh...13 years? I was a likely prospect in the Music Biz,but had to try and squeeze that in around being a 'straight' guy and being a Father(Moral Imperative).If I had had the courage to confront her back then,it might have averted a LOT of pain for both of us.Any scorn and rejection from Family members about being unwed parents would have been a light sentence compared with the Hellish conditions we have subjected ourselves to for a decade plus.
I have No regrets about being a Father..hell,we even intentionally had another.The point I'm trying to illuminate is that I should have pressed the issue when I had some leverage....now we're still having the same fights about the same stuff,But I have No music career,gave up doing what I loved whilst she has moved up and onward with her own career.There is an extreme imbalance between our Karmas.Somewhere along the way,I guess I tricked myself into believing that I LIKED being a construction worker,that I LIKED being a Housewife,That I LIKED being ignored and left alone,while she goes on all her business trips.It wasn't until I recovered from my Back Pain that I dug really,really deep and realized that I had been lying to myself for a long time.
Hell,at one point I thought she was having an affair with a co-worker and I wasn't angry...I was relieved!.THAT'S SICK!!
I could now leave the relationship and have the moral High ground.Unfortunately,I was wrong,or at least it appeared as much
I stopped being me,but she went right along being herself......something I got a sniff of back in '91 is all but rotted away.
People don't change.They grow,they evolve,they regress,they become well and they become sick,but they do NOT change.
sorry to sound so bleak.....I usually like to be upbeat about these things,but lately I've been viewing the world through dark blue lenses...no roses to be found anywhere!!
peace
Baseball65 |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 11:22:32
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Miehnesor,
Thank you so much for your input.
I had the best night's sleep last night without any pain. I don't have any tiredness today. I am eating whatever I want - even had a sandwich for lunch. I haven't eaten wheat and cheese in 10 years. I do have some neck pain and a little upper back pain - but I stopped paying attention and it went away.
My emotions are very very uncomfortable - sort of swing from wanting to cry to anger to dismay.
I heard that my best friend's husband had a talk with my fiance - a long one. Apparently, my fiance was very angry. Who does the hell does he think he is being angry??? He is angry that I don't want to work for my life and want to bring up children at home - I would like to educate them. He told me yesterday in a furious tone that it was as if I was expecting him to work himself into the ground while I lie around doing nothing - hmm, child rearing is nothing. I told him I would live in a small rented appartment to do this. This man obviously has no intention to work and wants a free ride. He has always commented on how smart I am and how much he thinks I could earn. I feel so used. I have this doomed feeling that if I marry him, he will be totally inflexible and just expect me to do whatever he wants. My friend said he went away last night with a lot to think about.
I am so turned off by it all now. I don't know what would ever turn me around. The bottom line is that he is not capable of supporting a family and I can't risk that. he is not mature enough and has no idea about marriage. My ex husband was very irresponsible and had a hard time keeping a job. I will not repeat this.
Phew! I guess I am angry - very angry and I feel let down.
Our relationship has been up and down for the last 3 years. I really think I have been thinking of his feelings and not my own.
For some reason, I won't budge now and that is it.
I just find it amazing and almost unreal that this pain has come from this terrible torment inside. Now I have uncovered it, the pain has gone.
I guess I should have known that it came from this because my pain started 12 years ago during this time. I thought the whole thing was just related to my mother as my relationship is so difficult with her. In fact, the psychologist has always supported my relationship with Jerome and it is only through a friend that all of this came through. I wonder now how to deal with this with the pschologist. Part of me feels that I might be ok now on my own.
It will take a lot for me to stay with this man - it may not be possible. He does have wonderful qualities - I just can't see them right now |
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 13:14:25
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Baseball,
I am so so sorry for all you are going through. I guess - a congratulations though for the pregnancy. Is there no chance that you could pursue something else at this point in time? Could you start thinking about your desires and still do it in the context of your marriage?
I guess you are trying to tell me that I should look at the red flags now - the warning signs when I have the ability to. This has all been on my fiance's terms and not mine and he is furious. It is as if I have seen the light.
I just had a conversation with my mother - aaaaagh! She is so relieved as she never thought he was right. She thought that he was very immature and has been dying to tell me but didn't want to break it to me. She said that I seemed so happy. I don't want to be swayed by my mother's opinion as her influence is normally very strong over me. I have not made up my mind as to what to do. I just hate that she might be right. |
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Baseball65
USA
734 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 13:36:55
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quote:
Is there no chance that you could pursue something else at this point in time? Could you start thinking about your desires and still do it in the context of your marriage?
I guess you are trying to tell me that I should look at the red flags now - the warning signs when I have the ability to.
Let's see.I have no job going on right now.I have been writing songs and playing guitar for a week.My wife will come home tonight and ask what I did all day.I'll tell her I worked on Music and she'll be angry.
After she didn't get her 'big score' i.e. being a Rock stars wife,she's never realized how many thousands of hours it takes to be a successful musician.
so,NO I do not think I could ever be professionally successful in a home in which she lives.I am made to feel like a BUM for pursuing my dreams.
Baseball65 |
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Massive breakthrough
