| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 04/06/2013 : 06:47:58
Topic removed due to too many negative and hateful comments. |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| gigalos |
Posted - 04/08/2013 : 19:12:47
I normally don't do this, but it's letting the child in me ask questions ;)
What is this urge to try to explain/prove/dismiss any of these theories? And why do people put so much energy in those efforts? Is it me, am I just too lazy or ignorant?
What is so difficult about accepting that there is a significant number of people who really benefit from a certain method. Therefore give it a try or don't if you feel it is not for you or it might negatively influence you. Analyzing it to bits won't help you or anyone in my opinion. Negative analyses might bring the 'believers' down about something they might benefit from. Positive analyses only confirm what is already established by a large amount of testimonies.
Ah well, time to hit the sack. I'll reserve some time to regret this post tomorrow. 
In the mean time something way more important. Shawn, I haven't known you for that long, but from the short time I have been here I really appreciate you and frankly I am a bit worried... hope you are well... |
| alix |
Posted - 04/08/2013 : 17:01:56
Dr.Robert Scaer in the following article attempts to explain TFT and its successor EFT. The hypothesis is at the end of the article:
http://www.traumasoma.com/excerpt1.html
It is really interesting and the fact that Dr.Scaer has focused a lot on psychogenic pain makes his views very relevant.
OT but I love the following comment from a reviewer on Amazon:
"Scaer is a retired medical doctor who no longer gives a rat's butt about being censured by the AMA. Just my kinda guy! And he has definitely NAILED all the ways that unresolved embodied trauma directs virtually everything in our lives from the kinds of work we do, to the kinds of parents we become, to the kinds of health issues and illnesses we encounter" |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 04/08/2013 : 10:22:44
Thank-you Plum for the kind an insightful words. I am always so afraid to bring this up with people for fear of being ridiculed and considered crazy. I see you are like me. I just feel that I cannot stay in the closet with this forever. Sometimes it is like a curse and other times it is definitely a blessing. Often I think that my physic ability may interfere with my sleep because I am so aware of the aliveness of nature. (possibly in other dimensions, String Theory has pretty much proved that other dimensions that we cannot sense exist) |
| eric watson |
Posted - 04/08/2013 : 08:03:03
chickenbone I thank you and plum and shawn and pspa
he ask the questions and it brings out information
Also,Dr. James and for tennis toms patience-I got to give you a call tom.
this is really a great thread for us advanced learners
and you all know who you are
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| eric watson |
Posted - 04/08/2013 : 07:47:43
quote:
Originally posted by pspa123
Eric you're a good man. It can be a fine line to walk between healthy skepticism (not believing every cure that comes down the pike or over the internet just because it's supported by testimonials etc.) and being overly cynical and demanding an impossible level of proof.
pspa were here to see what does work as tried by each individual
if I believed everything that came down the pike I most certainatly wouldn't be able to help those in need
I cant go but to only the boundries that I know work for all my friends ive helped over the years
I too went about like a ship with out a rudder until I just got the understanding
as youll see in dr alexanders book - the understanding is there
and sarno opened both our eyes
first this is a forum for sarnos fight for our freedom to know the truth guys- don't forget that
lets not be weary in saying what else has helped us in our journeys even though others think it wont help them
it was like when I fisrt got it- then all the studies that id lost hope in- really were real
im not here to convince you - I think everyone so far on this thread can vouch for that
your rd is your own
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| plum |
Posted - 04/08/2013 : 03:54:35
chickenbone, I come from a long line of healers and psychics, and the ancient arts and magical crafts were everyday fare during my childhood. Nothing about the Inner Ways seem weird to me at all (whereas humanities violation of Nature does). I've studied psychology for over twenty years. Moonshine and sunlight and I cherish it all.
Skepticism, sarcasm and fear from others, all known and ultimately irrelevant. Today's bigots are yesterdays witch-finders.
I understand there are matters best left to a caring professional. I have spoken with James about one such incident in my life. For reasons I do not wish to air (for now at least) on a public forum, I have good reason not to seek therapy and so am reliant on skills I can use myself, as and when.
Robert Smith doesn't bother me. He may seem a bit carny to you but I sense the freedom and joy of the traveller. Some escape artists hit the road, others go offshore, yet others put down strong roots and let the winds of change blow wild in their nightdreams.
To each his own, to each her own.
Blessed Be. |
| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 21:06:53
http://harvardmagazine.com/2013/01/the-placebo-phenomenon |
| Dr James Alexander |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 21:01:48
i have just had an article accepted by The Neuropsychotherapist, on a possible neurological action for EMDR (taking in discussion of memory reconsoldiation as well as some neuroanatomy)- apparently, it is only for paid up members of the magazine, but i have been told that i can make it available to friends who request to read it. So, if you want to read it, email me and i'll send you the URL to access it. I think there are conditions under which EFT successes could also be explained by the same proposals which i offer re EMDR.
James |
| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 20:34:36
Placebo recoveries are very real it is a question of mechanism do you not understand this? I could find many ofnthe same anecdotal reports of dramatic recoveriesnusing homeopathy, chiropractic, various detoxes, acupuncture, matrix erergetics, quantum touch, nutrienergetic systems, field control therapy, neural therapy, himalayan crystal salt. Check out the claimed cure rate for anynpain relief center. |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:41:12
Eric, you said it all. I want to thank you publicly for all the help and inspiration you have given me.
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| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:37:07
Eric you're a good man. It can be a fine line to walk between healthy skepticism (not believing every cure that comes down the pike or over the internet just because it's supported by testimonials etc.) and being overly cynical and demanding an impossible level of proof. |
| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:31:49
Alix I watched it, very interesting. |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:23:02
Plum, I have watched more of Robert's videos. I guess I just do EFT so differently that I can't imagine his way working for me. I have had such good results with the way I do it. Before I started with it, I just watched one video to get the idea. But I just couldn't even imagine taking instructions like that from anyone. I get input from my unconscious mind when I am doing it and also about what situations I can use it for. For example, when I was so traumatized by a certain childhood memory. (Eric was trying to help me, bless his heart. He instructed me to imagine the frightening scenario, but this time with my adult self there to comfort and merge with the child to take the sting out of the emotional experience) However, when I tried this the first time, I became so emotionally upset that I could not do it. I was so upset that I resolved to only bring it up again with a therapist. Then, while mediating, it popped into my mind (literally) to try it with EFT. Also, when I imagined the scene again, the figure of my adult self (trying to comfort and merge with the child) in my imagined healing scenario changed into a young man. I did not do this consciously, but felt the switch from conscious to unconscious, with my conscious as the observer, but not doing anything. The young man introduced himself to the child as her "animus". Then I did the EFT session and all the bad emotion was gone. I believe that it was this young man who rescued the child, not my adult self, who is considerably less powerful. I have been rescued or helped many times by a presence from my unconscious mind. So it did not freak me out. For example, I was saved from being raped by a presence.
A lot of people think I am physic. You probably think I am crazy. I think it is just that I have such a rich unconscious life. Recently, a friend passed away in the hospital in the middle of the night. I did not find out until 3 days later because they live out of town and in the confusion we were not notified right away. Anyway, the morning after he died (I did not know he had died), I had a dream that he died while I was there in the hospital. It was somewhat of a nightmare and I told my husband about it, but I did not want to believe it. My husband believed he was dead because this sort of thing happens so much with me. We heard about it several days later. My dreams are not predictive, they happen in real time. I think I am starting to come out of the closet about it which I guess is why I have been relating much of it on the forum. Sometimes I forget that others are not like me. Sorry if I confused everyone. |
| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:18:06
Eric, I never said it didn't work, or that it WAS placebo, or that I wasn't willing to try it (again, as I already have). I was only saying that the mere fact that some people say it works doesn't, in my mind, distinguish it from lots of things many of us (including Dr. Sarno) would say are placebo treatments like chiropractic. |
| eric watson |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:16:40
alix as you know
for information purpose-
Robert works with three systems
NLP,
EFT
TMS
he calls it faster eft
and we have to remember there's power in regular Craig eft too - I love both styles I use them everyday right along with sarno and the bible with my psychology and all teachings that really heal
from me to someone just entering the board - always do sarno first. |
| alix |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 19:09:51
pspa, I agree with you. It is like the elusive book-cure. The way EFT works maybe completely different than what we think. Maybe it simply allows you to access repressed memories more easily (something that is outside of the scope of the randomized double blind placebo).
If you look at some of the faster EFT videos, you can clearly see that Smith works with associations. He taps on the back pain but then the patient suddenly remembers her brother then they tap on that. Little by little they go all over her issues. It is very ritualistic and maybe the power is there. It is hit or miss obviously.
But jumping to EMDR (which is blasted too by many), have you seen this video:
http://youtu.be/xhUTEaNmCJg |
| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:58:55
Eric yes it could be placebo in the case of some of these things. The placebo effect is extremely powerful. Several studies have shown that false acupuncture (needles in random locations not on so called meridians) works just as well as real acupuncture. If people believe it can work, then it can work. Fake knee surgery was shown to work just as well as real knee surgery. Countless thousands swear by homeopathy, chiropractic, detox foot pads, anything and everything. In some drug trials as many as 50 percent of people who took a sugar pill for depression made substantial improvement. It goes on and on. |
| eric watson |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:53:11
[quote]Originally posted by pspa123
Shawn millions of people testify to the efficacy of homeopathy too. As you know controlled studies sometimes are useful to weed out placebo effects. I am not debunking EFT or faster EFT, just pointing out that testimonials alone aren't necesarily convincing.
[/quote
Eric)- There convincing to me - its been around 5000 thousand years-
how much more evidence do we need =
the Chinese use it in
different forms- it comes in tai chi I think and reflexology, qi gong, and so many more- This is the system they use to heal from everthing.could that many people a billion be wrong after all this time? do you think all these people are lying or its just a good placebo?
And ten yrs. ago when I took my two year course I doubted the whole time and didn't get nothing but the lessons after I started to tap the way I felt it in shifts I knew I had a tool and I added it to my nlp and psychology with visualizations and have a style or form thats used with sarnos book leading the way
Pulling it all together- it gave me a chance to believe again cause eft and faster eft and tms healing therapy mixed with TTT or tensive thinking therapyGuys its a lot of love ya know- love
let me clear the air on my learnings
I've stated many times I healed from the pain reading sarnos book
this was after id given up and lay bedridden for a year
initially ten years prior I was healed by a faith healer - it sent shock waves through me and boom - healed, all except the sciatica-
and the fear of the pain returning along with a lot of distress did bring it back on ten fold- hence sarnos book
we have to know I studied therapeutic psychology for 15 years as a hobby because that's what I've always loved -by the time I was 30
This was all home study except the 2 years of psychology I got from college- by the time I went to college I knew it would take me at least six to eight years of their studies before id get close to getting to where I already was-So I opted for the two year degree and moved on.
As I've stated before I was in helps - hands on for 13 years-
These helps consisted of preaching , Faith healing, Higher learning teaching and becoming an nlp practitioner.
I've seen so many miracles at the hands of faith healing alone that if I was to tell you - it would be hard to believe but it still holds true- I just didn't think it was possible for me and in my heart I knew id find a way and I did. As you all will
I just couldn't get my own subconscious to know self healing was put here for me and every other person looking to self heal
So to sum it up- after all these studies and more than I can add to one thread I ran across sarnos book and it was almost like I was reading the parables of Jesus coming from an MD. I read Steve Ozanichs book and
I jumped right to it.
After the body pain left I still had extreme anxiety which I fixed with Robert smiths fastereft and Claire weekes books along with the nlp training which has the reconsolidation process also Robert smiths faster eft has the reconsolidation process.
Then those memories that I couldn't get outta my head that were screaming at me by day and night. with the revived hope that self healing is true. I resumed my nlp studies which quickly vanished the phobias or nightmare scenes id lived with for so long. this type of fear I know can be healed with fastereft, eft, nlp, emdr,
See I had to have my own eyes open from sarno then all my combined studies could come to fruition.
that's a lot of studies - and id rather keep it simple
I learned a long time ago different people heal in different ways and that's why I don't argue if 1 method is better than the other
I know sarno is the eye opener as if the lady that sent shock waves through my body wouldn't have been an eye open -
it took me 15 yrs to understand nlp so unless you want to start at 101 I wouldn't go there less you know where to start- its real and it works
claire weekes works just look at baltos post and hill billys
fastereft is awesome and the reconsolidation process is an experience to get. you have to stumble upon it unless your eyes are open to it.
this is truth- all great teachers lead to the rd of healing if it works for you and if it don't I wouldn't knock it cause one day that practice might be the one that heals you
, nlp works and a lot of tolle and aces keys- Claire weekes amd with notes from steveo and his book with to many studies to mention I got that uh-huh moment and they all clicked and now I haven't met a person yet that doesn't like some combination of those forms,
its like were scared to say we use other styles with sarnos teaching- we all have our own built in self help system then what weve learned then we watch ,and having someone to help with these styles isn't bad but if you got about a year and dedicate yourself you can learn enough to heal anything from terror to anxiety to pain,
We truly do have the answer- its about knowing sarnos works if that's the silver bullet- it was for me when I learned all this really is true and it isn't just about positive thinking cause most time im feeling not that great before I work whatever style that day that helps me in my own mind- or other forms works in different ways releasing negative energy and the more of the you loose the more you begin to heal
we should all read sarno first then if something helps you when you apply another style and it helps you no matter never forget that style but in time you'll want to venture and see the grass on the other side
Get all the books of hope and wisdom that you can get your hands on, before this is over everyone going to be grabbing all the great teachers books. there's tons of tapping styles, there's tons of nlp styles. Theirs the tms healing style, and there's soothing styles are meridian lines are proven scientifically to exist and it has no merit with bats wings - I didn't know about if they were there till I learned the system- eft has tons of attributes the same as faster eft 2 members of the same team.
all these styles that psychotherapeutic are from sarno and he back them up and Dr. Alexander backs up these styles. |
| pspa123 |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:37:22
quote:
Originally posted by shawnsmith
Not a solid argument pspa123
*************************
“Living up to an image that you have of yourself or that
other people have of you is inauthentic living – another unconscious role the ego plays.” -- Ekhart Tolle
So you accept homeopathy, acupuncture, chiropractic, Matrix Energetics, detox foot pads, and so forth based on testimonials? If not, what's the difference? |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 04/07/2013 : 18:35:12
Ok, Alix, thanks. I understand. |
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