| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| RikR |
Posted - 02/26/2013 : 07:56:27
I know a deregulated nervous system can not only produce physical symptoms but also mental: anxiety – morbid thoughts – insomnia –OCD - panic and so on. I don’t see much discussion of these from members here.
Are these not common with TMS??? |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 02/28/2013 : 05:36:31
"If someone has more, knows more, or can do more than I, the ego
feels threatened because the feeling of “less” diminishes its imagined sense
of self relative to the other. It may then try to restore itself by somehow
diminishing, criticizing, or belittling the value of the other person's
possessions, knowledge, or abilities. Or the ego may shift its strategy, and
instead of competing with the other person, it will enhance itself by
association with that person, if he or she is important in the eyes of others." -- Ekhart Tolle |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 18:23:13
quote:
Originally posted by RikR
A real clue is when a person calls themselves a coach or a counselor. There are terms that fly under the state licensing requirements. In order to call yourself a therapist or a psychologist there are state licensing regulations.
If you really want to sort the wheat from the chaff ask them if they have malpractice insurance. When I was licensed we were required by law to have insurance to practice. Most insurance companies wont insure you unless you were educated at a well recognized accredited college.
In most states if a patient harms themselves or someone else and as a mental health professional you should have known, or failed to report it you can be sued.
I have to agree that there are functional idiots with MD’s and PhD’s. One told me I was terminal 6 years ago and that was what started this whole mess
OK Rik. I guess I misunderstood you to be claiming one of these people was misrepresenting their qualifications. They seem to be plainly listed, as Shawn pointed out. I mistook what you said, perhaps. Because as I see it, they appear perfectly suited to what they are doing. They're certainly light-years ahead of the many "experts" I had the displeasure of wasting my (and my company's) money on when I was first "sick."
One of the advantages they have is that they are indeed specialists. They don't put "anxiety" on their website bio like your average therapist does to bring in more business.
(Or "slots" as one of my old therapists used to call us... we were "slots.")
Their counselors meet weekly, take continuing education, and solely work with those who have suffered from nervous system disorders. So, while their walls my not be decorated as nicely as some of the higher paid therapists, they live and breathe this disorder 24/7 with people. Hence, it's not a surprise most have found their help to be so far above the average.
Then again, I've stated before... the people who helped me with my recovery the most thus far... had no medical credentials. They were people who had lived it. People like Hillbilly, Balto and others I've met in the journey long before I found this site. So, it may be that very nature of having lived the disorder that has made them so effective for many of us, as opposed to an expensive diploma.
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| RikR |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 15:47:07
A real clue is when a person calls themselves a coach or a counselor. There are terms that fly under the state licensing requirements. In order to call yourself a therapist or a psychologist there are state licensing regulations.
If you really want to sort the wheat from the chaff ask them if they have malpractice insurance. When I was licensed we were required by law to have insurance to practice. Most insurance companies wont insure you unless you were educated at a well recognized accredited college.
In most states if a patient harms themselves or someone else and as a mental health professional you should have known, or failed to report it you can be sued.
I have to agree that there are functional idiots with MD’s and PhD’s. One told me I was terminal 6 years ago and that was what started this whole mess |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 14:32:10
Here are the bios of all the Anxiety Center personal coaches along with their credentials: http://www.anxietycentre.com/personal-coaching.shtml
*************************
"The urge to just be done with what we are doing and to go on to the next task is the number one cause of tms and everything is compounded on top of this. It is so ingrained that most will not see it even when they are told that it is there. It took me a long time to see this and figure this out through deductive reasoning. It also explains why our society has a lot of back pain but it is non-existent in the tribal community." --- Ace |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 14:09:46
quote:
Originally posted by RikR
Bryan
Having a master in counseling has little meaning unless you know the institution that granted it and the course work. A real master in counseling is a 6 year program – there are schools that confer an MA in a year or less or all on line. My education was a 9 year program and I was totally unprepared to know about true anxiety therapy.
I have a second doctorate – this one is a Doctorate of Divinity –want to get married I can do it. A good friend bought the degree for me as a joke 20 years ago.
The really good anxiety therapists have a PhD – studied in an anxiety only treatment setting and had a mentor therapist who had been an anxiety therapist for a significant time. People like Dr. Paul Foxman or Dr. Ed Bourne
Well I certainly can't argue with your credentials.
But I can speak from experience and say that the two people who almost killed me where highly credentialed, MD's, PhDs, etc. I've dealt with scores of anxiety "experts" via my insurance company with a laundry list of letters after their names. None has been as effective in treatment as the one I'm working with now. Not even close.
I'm wondering how many average people have access to the top level, anxiety specialists you speak of? I'd imagine there are only a handful of people like this in the world. The average doctor/psych's true understanding of anxiety out there is frightening.
I will admit, AC's approach does seem a bit more "by the people for the people" than your average anxiety "expert" in one's Blue Cross plan. But, in my estimation... and my research has been extensive both in data collection and in experience... I find their approach to be second to none.
So, I do understand your delineation in credentials between various treatment professionals. I guess I just hoped you would be more specific as to which counselor at their center you found to be lacking credentials or unfit. There are a small handful, most have been working for years... and a couple I've spoken with. Seems that with the kind of warning you put forth, it would be prudent to elaborate a bit.
In fact, I can quite easily obtain the information on any of these therapists and we can search it out ourselves here, and potentially save anyone the concern? |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 13:38:26
RikR, Thanks a million. The link you sent me is wonderful. I think, and my husband thinks too (he is a doctor) that my undiagnosed parathyroid problem caused me a lot of mental issues. The stupid doctors didn't think I had it, even though my calcium was over 10 and PTH was in the high normal range. It wasn't until I found Dr. James Norman's website parathyroid.com, that I discovered that all the doctors were wrong and I did have a tumor after all. This is a very common story.
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| RikR |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 13:30:09
Chicken
This part of my note to you got left off....sorry. Amitriptyline has an action on several neurotransmitters – the major being norepinephrine which is hormone that is part of the fight-or-flight reaction.....and yes it certainly can hype you up. |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 12:24:39
What is this, a competition to see who has the most degrees? One does not have to possess a PhD to be an excellent therapist, just like one does not have to possess a PhD in Divinity to be close to God. I have lots of degrees in a number of areas and I still don't know a damn thing about anything. Ekhart Tolle writes:
"I usually congratulate people when they tell me, “I don't know who I
am anymore.” Then they look perplexed and ask, “Are you saying it is a
good thing to be confused?” I ask them to investigate. What does it mean to
be confused? “I don't know “ is not confusion. Confusion is: “I don't know,
but I should know” or “I don't know, but I need to know.” is it possible to let
go of the belief that you should or need to know who you are? In other
words, can you cease looking to conceptual definitions to give you a sense of
self? Can you cease looking to thought for an identity? When you let go of
the belief that you should or need to know who you are, what happens to
confusion? Suddenly it is gone. When you fully accept that you don't know, you actually enter a state of peace and clarity that is closer to who you truly are than thought could ever be. Defining yourself through thought is limiting yourself.
"PREESTABLISHED ROLES
"Of course different people fulfill different functions in this world. It
cannot be otherwise. As far as intellectual or physical abilities are concerned
– knowledge, skills, talents, and energy levels – human beings differ widely.
What really matters is not what function you fulfill in this world, but whether
you identify with your function to such an extent that it takes you over and
becomes a role that you play. When you play roles, you are unconscious.
When you catch yourself playing a role, that recognition creates a space
between you and the role. It is the beginning of freedom from the role. When
you are completely identified with a role, you confuse a pattern of behavior with who you are, and you take yourself very seriously. You also automatically assign roles to others that corresponding to yours. For example, when you visit doctors who are totally identified with their role, to them you will not be a human being but a patient or a case history."
*************************
"The urge to just be done with what we are doing and to go on to the next task is the number one cause of tms and everything is compounded on top of this. It is so ingrained that most will not see it even when they are told that it is there. It took me a long time to see this and figure this out through deductive reasoning. It also explains why our society has a lot of back pain but it is non-existent in the tribal community." --- Ace |
| RikR |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 12:08:52
Chicken
Most of the current research shows the genetics are the deciding factor in how hard is it to stop a psyche drug and if there will be any withdrawal. An excellent site is: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?s=3f282e7bc0602c8102369f69aa213fd1&act=idx or Paxil Progress.
Don’t look at the horror stories as many of these people have other major problems. That you stopped the Ambien without problems is a very good sign.
Bryan
Having a master in counseling has little meaning unless you know the institution that granted it and the course work. A real master in counseling is a 6 year program – there are schools that confer an MA in a year or less or all on line. My education was a 9 year program and I was totally unprepared to know about true anxiety therapy.
I have a second doctorate – this one is a Doctorate of Divinity –want to get married I can do it. A good friend bought the degree for me as a joke 20 years ago.
The really good anxiety therapists have a PhD – studied in an anxiety only treatment setting and had a mentor therapist who had been an anxiety therapist for a significant time. People like Dr. Paul Foxman or Dr. Ed Bourne |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 11:08:51
RikR, I find it so interesting about your background in psych drug detox and recovery. I am struggling with trying to stop a small dose of amitriptyline. I have taken a low dose (25) for about 20 years. For about half of that time I took it as triavil (4 50). I only took it because of sleep problems and anxiety, not because of depression. I got on it after my first husband passed away from cancer about 20 years ago. It always gave me some sedation at night, but not enough so I added a small dose of Ambien for the last 8 years (because I no longer had access to the triavil). Now I am off the Ambien for about a month. I had a parathyroid tumor removed (benign) five months ago. Prior to having the tumor removed, I was having a lot of mental problems due to the high calcium in my blood. After the surgery, it was like a miracle in the way I felt. Anyway, the only problem I still had was sleep which I have been working on. Now, after the surgery, the amitriptyline no longer gives me sedation at night, in fact it seems to be hyping me up. So I stopped it at night and take half of the 25 in the morning with an intention of getting rid of it completely. How long do you think it could take for me to completely rid myself of the effect of the antidepressant? |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 09:38:36
quote:
Originally posted by bryan3000
quote:
Originally posted by RikR
My only caution is his counseling staff, many have no certified credentials
Hi Rik,
I'm also a big fan of AnxietyCentre. After doing tireless research into nearly every anxiety resource available online, and seeing a laundry list of "real" therapists, I finally was led to AnxietyCentre. (By someone who had used their info in their own successful healing.)
To me, there is AnxietyCentre, and everything else is a distant second. I have worked with one of their counselors and have found it tremendously helpful.
But, your post strikes me as worthy of following up on. The site states that their "coaches" are Masters Level Counselors. Each coach lists credentials in great detail, including their own history with anxiety/panic. ("TMS")
So, I'm wondering since you mentioned it which one of their counselors is not credentialed as their bio states? Of course, people fake medical and other licenses all the time... but I'm curious as to specifically what information you have and on which counselor? Since many here have used and recommend the site, it seems like a disservice to only imply this info... as opposed to following up with exact details.
Here are the specifics with regards to their program. (Of which I am not affiliated, of course.)
The therapists we list in our Personal Coaching section are the result of our search. Each recommended therapist was selected based on a strict set of criteria.
For example, each therapist must have experienced anxiety disorder, must have successfully overcome it, and must be medication-free for at least the last five years. We believe personal experience with anxiety disorder is an invaluable asset when helping others.
We also required that each therapist be professionally trained as a therapist, so all of our recommended therapists have attained their Masters Degree in counseling (or equivalent, or above). We believe this level of training also is required to provide effective counseling services to those who are struggling with anxiety disorder.
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| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 09:32:16
Balto/Shawn - great points. |
| RikR |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 08:30:54
The only brain chemical imbalance in anxiety is after you take a psyche drug. I spent 12 years working in psyche drug detox and recovery - the withdrawal can take years to recover from
TMS program= no side effects and no withdrawal |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 07:46:35
I did use their counselors, but I agree with you that the information contained on Jim's page is of tremendous value and subscription is relatively inexpensive. I learned a lot from that website, including the anxiety is a learned behavior and not the result of a chemical imbalance which requires medication to correct. Mindfulness exercises are also great for anxiety.
*************************
"The urge to just be done with what we are doing and to go on to the next task is the number one cause of tms and everything is compounded on top of this. It is so ingrained that most will not see it even when they are told that it is there. It took me a long time to see this and figure this out through deductive reasoning. It also explains why our society has a lot of back pain but it is non-existent in the tribal community." --- Ace |
| RikR |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 06:52:11
I know Jim Folk and his anxiety web site is full of great information and he has a really good grasp on the condition. Jim has no formal education or professional license but has done a great job in collecting information and learning from his own recovery.
My only caution is his counseling staff, many have no certified credentials and from several people I have known that tried them they were not effective.
You have to be careful with on-line therapists. Many have purchased credentials and have not done the real educational work a competent therapist has. Ask them for their college name granting their degree and look it up. Then ask if they have a state license and what it is.
Most state license boards prohibit licensed therapist from doing telephone and on-line therapy. Coaches are permitted to do off-site counseling but they are not licensed to do therapy and there are no oversight on their competence or if they are anything but a guy in his underwear talking to you on the phone.
This is not to say that fully licensed psychologists are competent. Many I know concern me and I know a lot of them as colleagues. If you do not feel like you are making progress in a few visits seek other options. If you are looking for anxiety treatment find a therapist that treats only anxiety disorders – you will make the best progress as anxiety treatment is not something most schools teach in enough depth to make a competent therapist. |
| KristenG |
Posted - 02/27/2013 : 05:16:51
quote:
Originally posted by shawnsmith
quote:
Originally posted by KristenG
I found a website online and ended up doing a program from that site. It was a tremendous help to me. I don't know that I should mention the program
Jim Folk's anxiety website is the best on this subject.
http://www.anxietycentre.com/
*************************
"The urge to just be done with what we are doing and to go on to the next task is the number one cause of tms and everything is compounded on top of this. It is so ingrained that most will not see it even when they are told that it is there. It took me a long time to see this and figure this out through deductive reasoning. It also explains why our society has a lot of back pain but it is non-existent in the tribal community." --- Ace
Haha! I like that you just put it out there, Shawn!
That is not the site that I used though.I am glad you've found something that works for you. Someone has already emailed me to ask which site it was. Once I told him/her, they proceeded to tell me why it wasn't any good.<shaking my head> Um...It was good for ME, that's all that mattered at the time. YMMV
Kristen
Worry is the misuse of imagination. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 02/26/2013 : 18:51:50
quote:
Originally posted by balto
I really think tms, anxiety, panic, cfs, ibs, gout,... are just different symptoms of the same disease, mindbody disease.
Agreed Balto, that is why Dr. Sarno, after conferring with Dr. Marc Sopher, changed the wording of the acronym TMS from Tension Myositis Syndrome to THE MINDBODY SYNDROME.
http://www.tms-mindbodymedicine.com/ |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 02/26/2013 : 18:42:33
quote:
Originally posted by KristenG
I found a website online and ended up doing a program from that site. It was a tremendous help to me. I don't know that I should mention the program
Jim Folk's anxiety website is the best on this subject.
http://www.anxietycentre.com/
*************************
"The urge to just be done with what we are doing and to go on to the next task is the number one cause of tms and everything is compounded on top of this. It is so ingrained that most will not see it even when they are told that it is there. It took me a long time to see this and figure this out through deductive reasoning. It also explains why our society has a lot of back pain but it is non-existent in the tribal community." --- Ace |
| KristenG |
Posted - 02/26/2013 : 18:23:31
quote:
Originally posted by chickenbone
I think there is a see/saw effect (TT is right about this) between our mind and body symptoms. If we feel more physical symptoms, such as chronic pain, IBS, etc, we will generally feel less psychological symptoms like anxiety, panic and depression.
AND
It is useful to remember that once we get down to the nitty gritty with our healing process, and we begin to successfully rout out our physical symptoms, we are likely to at least temporarily experience more anxiety, depression and even panic. This is because we have "blown the cover" so to speak, of the TMS strategy itself. Once we have it on the run, we can also expect that the strategy will strike back by creating even scarier physical symptoms in a desperate attempt to not allow the mental issues to come to light. The decision to heal should not be taken lightly because we must be prepared for the consequences which could be most unpleasant. Our healing involves this back and forth and back and forth until the strategy gives up. This can be quite nerve-wracking and not for the faint of heart. If we are serious about healing, I think we do well to expect this sort of thing.
I couldn't agree more with what you've said, chickenbone.
Worry is the misuse of imagination. |
| susan828 |
Posted - 02/26/2013 : 17:53:40
Rik, years ago I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia. Way before I knew about Sarno. Now I see that fibro and TMS are just about the same. I was in a fibro chat room for 2 years. I started to see a "fibro" personality. We all have anxiety, panic attacks, depression. And basically, this was a really nice bunch of people, sensitive, too sensitive for this world. It's the same thing here. I know you're relatively new here but yup, anxiety is so common. Type it in the search bar and you'll most likely see posts or type fibromyalgia anxiety in google, same thing.
I left that chat room because the people there were resigned to a life of complaining and getting on disability. I didn't want to see myself as a "fibro person" (they had a pet name which I forgot). I went to a rheumatologist here who was wonderful; he told me he can see that I am a fighter. I knew little about it then and thought I'd wind up in a wheelchair; I was in that much pain from head to toe and I was scared to death. Reading Sarno was amazing. Finally someone understood me. |
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