| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Peaceful Warrior |
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 00:44:20
Hi all, I have a gut feeling that I found this website just in the knick of time. I found out about TMS almost a year ago and have stopped all treaments entirely for about a year. I had just scheduled a dr appt for tomorrow which could have really set me back on my whole "mission" as a warrior fighting this whole thing, i'm so thankful that i found this forum, reading some of the messages has convinced me to cancel my appt first thing in the morning.
I'm only 22, in fact i'd love to know if there's anyone who's that young out there and has TMS, i got it when i was 18. That really bothers me, that I got it when so young, the time in life you're really supposed to enjoy. It started with intense lower back pain for 2 yrs, then neck pain after that, and since 6 months intense knee pain. I've done the whole hundreds of appts thing and more than 12 differnet therapies not to mention numerous xrays, mris, catscans, and basically everything comes out normal, at most is a mild disc herniataion but they say its so mild it shouldnt cause pain and most people have that much of a herniation. The pain is of course chronic and there the entire day. There are days when im doing better, but right now im doing really bad which is why i schedulded that darn appt!
I really don't know what im not doing in order to see the kinds of results you all are seeing. I feel like i really try with the new way of thinking, but im not seeing the kinds of results i think i should. It's very obvious to me that this condition, the sypmtoms etc. are ridiculous and that it really is a mind thing, a matter or de-conditioning, but that seems to be the tough part. AS SOON AS i wake up in bed, the first thing i think is, "oh the pain, i hope it doesn't come" and it does within a minute and lasts the entire day, i sleep like a baby though.
I have a feeling talking with you all will help me on my mission to get better, im sick and tired of this, im graduating from college in may and have a job lined up, but i have to get better in order to work full time!
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| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Peaceful Warrior |
Posted - 01/31/2005 : 11:04:06
HI all,
First of all, I'm going crazy trying to figure out why I can't post a new topic. It keeps saying invalid username or password although I know I'm typing the right thing. ???
It's a been a while since I wrote, just been really busy. I was wondering if any of you experience intensified symptoms when the weather is cold? Have I just been conditioned to be in more pain when it's cold or is there some logical connection between the blood flow b/c of lack of oxygen and stuff when it's cold? I'm really battling the knee pain which has spread now into the thighs. But I'm absolutely sure its TMS, in fact thanks to the knee pain I'm able to attribute TMS to all my problems. This is because the knee and thigh pain only comes when I sit in my classes or at my computer at home, entirely conditioning, well and when its cold. But I must say, the more the thighs and knees pain, the less the back and neck pain, at least thats how its been for the past couple weeks.
I started singing my mantras/affirmations in tunes that I really like, the pain went away within minutes. Postitive signs like that are always a boost. I really do need a boost every few days.
Has anyone considered recording their own voice while saying a positive affirmation and having that play while they fall asleep at night? Or is there such a CD/tape related to tms existing that I can purchase?
Thanks! |
| Baseball65 |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 16:46:24
Hi PW.
GW was Gordnar Wayne...He was an ex-crip from South Central Los Angeles(the street gang)...G.W.was a lot easier than "How do you spell that??" (LOL!)
He helped me get out of my criminal type of life I was living,and turn it around(unwittingly setting the stage for TMS later on)
As far as your friends,I too,like every TMSer has to go through that phase where we tell everybody were fine even though I wasn't yet....it was a tough time,but I just kept going,and that was when the real miracle of healing began.In fact,I called disability and told them I would be back at work in a month.5 weeks later I was back at work pain free...kind of like babe Ruth pointing his finger at the center field wall and calling his shot.
The book said 2-6 weeks so I split the difference with them.We don't beat TMS in one fell swoop...we beat it one conditioned activity at a time,one anger source at a time.
It is imperative that if you are not frightened,you must resume activity...not like that one weenie who posted on the board all the time and never did the work...he kept doing the activity part ,but skipped the mental work.Than he bitched about the result.You don't sound anything like that...you've obviously come a long way down the TMS Highway.
If you are reasonably confident in the diagnosis than you must begin to do all those things,help lift those things,and meet people at those places that you used to associte with pain.
it is a crucial and imperative portion of recovery!!!
K.I.T.
peace
Baseball65 |
| lobstershack |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 10:40:47
Baseball,
That was a very interesting--and curious--post. Perhaps you're righ, that we--the younger generation of TMSers--are at a stage in life where the unconscious is particularly hard to reach; but part of me wants to think that this is soley mandated by society and that once one realizes this, what once was compounding the situation will slowly dissolve.
Seth |
| Peaceful Warrior |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 10:38:14
Baseball "dude",
Thanks for your kind words. When I get compliments like that I wonder if it means I need more of that from others, b/c it really does make me feel good. Yes, the PW book really is good, btw, what does G.W. stand for? if it's personal that's totally fine, but if it's something of common knowledge that I don't know, please do tell! I have my own spiritual "guru" too, and without him, honestly, I could'nt have made it through the past few years.
One thing I haven't yet mentioned that seems to really bug me is what on earth do I tell all my friends and the people I meet regularly about what's going on with me and my health? It's always been a huge issue with me, I'm overly concerned about what other people think..something I really need to work on overall. I always got sympathy and stuff and everyone knew I was suffering, but after reading about TMS, I took a differnt strategy. I basically lied to every one telling them I'm fine now, b/c I didn't want them constantly bringing up the topic since i wanted the word pain out of my vocab. However, this added a little stress b/c if I can't drive one day to meet them b/c of pain or can't help lift something, then they'd look at me questioningly. Of course, I should just drive or lift b/c I know it can't harm me, but there are sometimes when it's so intense that I really don't want to simply b/c I don't want to make myself more uncomfortable than I already am. Do you or anyone else think it would be wrong to go back against the "I"m fine now" thing and tell them that well, it's still kind of there so limits me at times. Or would this be totally in contradiction to the path of recovery that I'm on. I guess the only benefit in telling every one I'm not really 100% ok would be that I won't have to worry about them not understanding why I'm not hanging out with them, engaging in physical service project etc.
Take care |
| Baseball65 |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 09:33:40
Hello P.W.
My old spiritual mentor was G.W. and he told me about P.W.(The book)
anyways....I just read this whole string,and a couple of others this morning.You are very young,as are some of our other regulars.When I was in the chronic pain facility when I was 33,I was shocked to see so many really young people.
I do remember that the absolute worst case in the whole joint was only 18 or 19....I almost recovered just watching him.He couldn't get from one room to the other without a big whining bitc# out session.
He was super-resistant to all suggestion.
After perusing all these younger people's posts this morning,I can't help but speculate that perhaps younger people take a little more work to recover.Age 18-mid twenties is sort of a crucial development stage into individuality.Perhaps the subconscious is particularly strong at that phase,as it would have to be by necessity????
You're just out from being the minion of your parents ,Teachers and the "system".You can go to any church you want to,or be an atheist.You can get out of bed at 3AM and drive to Jack-in-the-box.You are finally making all of your own choices.You live by yourself,can turn left or right at will.
I've seen Mormons who drop their faith.They don't just become mild christians,or moderates...they snort coke,drink,get tattoos,grow their hair long and wear FTW t-shirts.
Perhaps young TMSers are in a sort of unconscious backlash stage ,if you will.....this is a time when you need desperately to "be your own person" and yet you are afflicted with a malady that necessitates a constant questioning,introspection and self-parenting.This is just an outsiders speculation.
You seem to be thoughtful,well spoken and intelligent.Your conscientiousness can be felt across the internet in your posts.When I was 22,I was living an outlaw,FTW,completly hedonistic lifestyle....and having no symptoms even though I suffered from OCD,and had had earlier bouts of TMS in childhood.
My TMS didn't engage until I was forced to "mature" to the moral imperatives that were deep down the whole time,just not being acted upon.You and the other younger TMSers are waaaaaayy more mature for your age than I was OR am.
.....so,It would only follow that it will take a little more work.I've been in construction my whole non-criminal life.I can demolish any wall. If it's wood and Drywall,all I need is a sledgehammer and some tin snips.If it's Brick and Mortar,I need a Jackhammer and a giant steel pry-bar.
It sounds like you are doing all the right stuff.You just might have to get out the Jackhammer...either way,the wall comes down....and ALL walls can come down,some just take a little more work and planning.
I think the very fact that you mentioned helping others is a sign of your maturity,and that ultimately you will do just that.
quote:
I'm a little confused about how many of you have actually seen substantial relief. I'm assuming that if you're still here in the forum, then you still have recurrent attacks or something, but I could very well be wrong, you could just be here to help the rest of us who haven't made it yet!
On another note, I get this feeling that all of us could really help so many people in the future who suffer from tms or any psychosomatic problems. Perhaps we're lucky to have this condition, for we can truly help others in the same position better when we've experienced it for ourselves.
BTW...I and several others have NO recurrent attacks.I joined the forum because G.W. told me a long time ago,that to have a complete and fulfilling life it was absolutely necessary to be of service to others.I have benefitted greatly from this forum and learned much(I no longer have the continual respiratory problems that I thought were NOT related to TMS)...but I really only come here because I remember the Fear ,anger and frustration.....it's the very least I could do for a Dr. who saved me that I never even met.
In fact,I was never diagnosed with TMS....No TMS doctors were around back than,and the only one in Los Angeles was on Sabbatical or something when I called...fortunately I was recovered before I ever thought of calling again.
you are right on brother!!
just thought I'd drop in an observation
peace
Baseball65 |
| Fox |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 09:10:53
By the way, Peaceful Warrior, it took me about 5 months to start getting benefits and now I am 80% better with my sciatica (which is wonderful!), 90% better with my tinnitus, 40% better with my acid reflux, 75% better with my headaches, and 100% better with my knee pain. I had to live and breathe Sarno. I had to read and reread the books and listen to the audio tapes until I could quote them. I had to force myself to look for the anger when the pain turned on. And I had to learn ways of releasing the anger -- being more assertive, hitting the heavy bag, visualizing assault on the object of the anger, and screaming/beating the driver's wheel in the car. It is still, and I suspect always will be, a constant battle -- especially trying to defeat the conditioning. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 09:10:35
Regarding TMS psychotherapy, I found it interesting and reassuring, that Don Dubin, said on Schechter's tapes, that the most sessions he had to have with a TMS patient was 15, to help them. |
| Fox |
Posted - 01/26/2005 : 08:52:19
Peaceful Warrior -- if the TMS Doc says to do the daily reminders and meditation, then just do it. Once your pain levels decrease, maybe you can gradually reduce the frequency of the "rituals". If you miss a day, I doubt that you will ruin your pain elimination program. You'll just have to face and float through your irrational guilt on those days you miss the "rituals." Don't let these unconfortable feelings of guilt sabotage your anti-TMS program. That's just what your tricky brain would like -- for you to give up and keep the distraction process that you're used to going on indefinitely. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 01/25/2005 : 23:43:19
PW, I recommend you go back to your TMS doctor and get a referal to a psychotherapist. Short of that read Sarno's books. No where does he reccommned PT. You seem very confused about TMS theory. Read the books again, you are missing the point. |
| Peaceful Warrior |
Posted - 01/25/2005 : 23:25:35
TT,
Let me clarify, I saw the TMS dr. a few months ago. I of course didn't see any drs. after that, but just last week was when I really broke down and couldn't handle the pain anymore so I decided to try out seeing my GP to see if he could recommend a kinisieologist as I heard about someone who was really helped by kinisielogy. I guess I thought some physical therapy to complement this tms treatment may be helpful, but I'm glad I didn't go...thanks to finding this forum! The doc I saw was John Sklar who was personally taught by Sarno, he was really nice. He said its surely TMS, without a doubt. He strongly recommened the daily reminders and daily meditation. I did start the meditation for over a month,but don't do it necessarily every day...same with the daily reminders. See, I feel that if I MUST do these like rituals each day, then I feel that there is something in fact wrong with me and that's why I have to do these things, then if I forget or don't have time, I feel guilty or bad that I didn't do it. This in itself is added stress for me, and I'm really trying to limit my stress levels!!! What do you (and any one esle) think on this point of doing the meditation and/or reminders daily as a "must do thing"?
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| tennis tom |
Posted - 01/25/2005 : 23:13:00
peaceful warrior,
There is an inconsistency in your posts. If you saw a TMS doctor why would you see another doctor? Which TMS doctor did you see? What did he tell you?
_____________________________________________________________________
1/25/05
"I too saw a TMS doctor, but it bothers me that reading the books and seeing him havent helped me that much."
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1/21/05
" I had just scheduled a dr appt for tomorrow which could have really set me back on my whole "mission" as a warrior fighting this whole thing, i'm so thankful that i found this forum, reading some of the messages has convinced me to cancel my appt first thing in the morning."
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| Peaceful Warrior |
Posted - 01/25/2005 : 21:44:52
Hi all,
Thanks for replying and stuff. I was doing much better over the weekend but I'm really having a horrible time the past couple days. It's tough to not get depressed at times like this. I just can't believe that it started out as back pain which was enough to deal with, but now I have the neck and knee pain, all 3 at once, I feel like an invalid sometimes!!
I must clarify that its not really pain in the knees, its the front of the lower thighs right above the knees and boy does it hurt!! But I know there's nothing "wrong" simply because of how it started only when I was doing an internship b/c I had so much anxiety and its completely related to my stress/worry levels and conditioning. When I come home and watch TV the pain subsides to decent levels but when I go to class, its almost unbearable. And, the stupidest thing of all, whenever I sit at my desk at home it comes within 1 minute!!!!...but not necessarily if I sit at some other desk. The neck and back pain is more constant throughout the day and not so obviously determined/caused by what I'm doing at that point in time.
I too saw a TMS doctor, but it bothers me that reading the books and seeing him havent helped me that much. I know we're not supposed to feel guilty, like we're doing this to ourselves, but I can't help but get mad at myself for responding better to this treatment although I know what I have is TMS. Could some of you please tell me how long it took you to get relief after reading the books and/or seeing a tms dr?
I think one obstacle getting in the way of my being cured since I found out about tms has been this idea in my head that this is a really hard thing to do, to control the mind. It's really lodged in my head that I have such a difficult task to undertake that most people dont have to do. I mean, do you guys think its hard?
I'm a little confused about how many of you have actually seen substantial relief. I'm assuming that if you're still here in the forum, then you still have recurrent attacks or something, but I could very well be wrong, you could just be here to help the rest of us who haven't made it yet!
On another note, I get this feeling that all of us could really help so many people in the future who suffer from tms or any psychosomatic problems. Perhaps we're lucky to have this condition, for we can truly help others in the same position better when we've experienced it for ourselves.
I've ordered the dvds and cds, hopin' they'll help...ahhh this stupid mind of mine!
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| pault |
Posted - 01/25/2005 : 05:03:18
Hi T.T. it went well.Most of the viewers in the Boston/Cape area of Ma.I find it tough to look at because I hate seeing myself in pictures,so this is worse.I sent copys to Susie,Ed if you would like a copy let me know.I think Ed was going to get them put on disc,and cut out the ads.I have two options,one with Verizon,one with Mac which allows me to create a site for displaying pictures etc. I will see if I can put it on and let you know.Anybody have suggestions on airing movies on line? We fix all models but favor Toyota's,Japanese cars.Heading to work now,I will be back on line later. Thanks Paul. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 01/23/2005 : 09:01:00
Hello Pault,
Did the TV feature on TMS you were involved with a while back get aired? How did it go? If it did is there any way to stream it on the board?
Regards,
tt
PS: If I recall you have an automotive repair shop or are a mechanic. I gave my mechanic a copy of Sarno years ago when he complained of back-pain. It helped him. We haven't discussed it since but he does't appear to have any more pain. Do you specialize in a particular make of car? |
| pault |
Posted - 01/23/2005 : 07:28:20
Happy events cause a great deal of stress.Your unconscious brain is not logical.I had a great deal of success with tms but I never really discovered most of the reasons for it.You have the right attitude and will be successful.I personally believe 3/4's of my tms is childhood initiated.Keep reading the book(s) as your unconscious brain will relate to the information as time goes by,even though you may not realize it.If you believe in the system it will work as well as you want it to.Try not to over due the mind sesrching and just have faith it will work.I got a great deal of benefit from seeing a tms Doctor(Dr.Sopher)as it was very benefitial to have a Doctor diagnose you and tell you ,you are fine and the pain is harmless.Good luck,Paul. |
| Peaceful Warrior |
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 23:17:30
Hey all, I hope I'm doing this right..hitting the reply button to my own original message with the same topic. I'm really thrilled to see the enthusiam with which you all want to help me and every one else. I had a much better today, I'm sure part of it was due to hearing from you all and part of it b/c my job interviews etc came to an end after a busy week. I don't know why this idea of starting work causes so much pain. In fact, I never had an inkling of knee pain until i started an internship this past summer, it literally would come with intensity as soon as i entered the office everyday, although the internship ended in august, the pain's been there since. I really have a lot of warrior attitude today and I hope it continues. What do you guys do when for some reason the pain comes back reallly bad after you've had some "good" days?, it's hard to stay as positive and upbeat
To answer some of your questions, I have read both main TMS books but twice each,I'm guessing I should read them more? I try and meditate every day and say positive affirmations throughout the day (I got these from Louise Hay's book which I saw someone had mentioned, I like her thoughts a lot.) I try to do things that I would never do before, like sitting on the floor, in fact it's so funny that I've conditioned my mind to now think sitting on the floor is more comfortable than a chair! I go to the gym to use the cardio machines and I stretch. I clean my place and do dishes and laundry.....all these are things I was too scared to do before. However, I've been doing all this for the past 8 months but not much relief overall, although I must say there is some. What else do I need to be doing??? Unfortunatley, yes, all three (neck, back, and knee are present at one time) back is basically all day long, neck is only the left side and is the least debilitating, knee pain is whenever I sit at a computer (haha!) and in classes and whenever anything about starting work after college comes up. I don't even know why I have this fear, it's so ridiculous. I mean, my grades are great, and I'm doing so well in job interviews. The craziest thing is (forgive me if I seem like I'm boasting) but things are going really great for me. That's the mystery, when things are going well why do I have these fears and stuff?
I'm surely going to try the tip about telling the pain to get away from me in the morning, thanks.
I would like to know if most of you have helped yourself through your own efforts, or did you see a TMS doctor or attend lectures and group sessions etc. Also, I didn't know any tapes, videos existed, how do I get these???
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| lobstershack |
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 21:55:04
Hey Peaceful Warrior,
Don't despair; I developed full-blown TMS at age 17 (I'm 23 now), but suffered from symptoms for many years before that--just nothing of a chronic nature. I'm relatively new to the board and have found it to be a tremendous help. And remember, it's healthy to vent your feelings on this board, don't shy away--I did just that in the beginning and slowly worked myself up to posting almost everday. In fact, I look forward to it. We're in this fight together. Good luck!
Seth |
| Louise |
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 14:08:03
Oh yeah, I developed what I now realize was TMS when I was in college. I had intense knee pain in my left knee, the same knee that I later had surgery for torn cartilege. It's still my hardest spot to kick, although the knee pain disappeared when I had horrible sciatic pain, so I know that it's TMS. I look back on it now and realize that at the time of my onset of knee pain, my mother was about a year away from dying from cirrhosis of the liver from chronic alcoholism. I now realize now that at that time, my growing up and away from her was making her even more miserable so she drank more and more. So, add guilt to the already potent mixture of spreading my wings and testing my independence, the pressure of figuring out what I wanted to do with the rest of my life, classes, grades, dating, sex, and two constantly fighting alcoholic parents, and yes, TMS reared its' ugly head!
I just wish that I had heard of TMS back then, but I don't think that Dr. Sarno had written his first book at that time (20+ years ago!).
Good luck. Work on de-conditioning yourself with that morning pain. Just say "whatever" or "F-off" to it - don't pay any attention to it beyond that. It really does work.  |
| Hilary |
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 13:26:35
Hello, Peaceful Warrior!
I I've had TMS in one form or another since I was about 20. I'm 37 now.
I totally agree with Alex in terms of planning to be healthy, rather than planning to be in pain. Visualization works in many different areas of life, but you have to focus on what you want, rather than on what you don't want. I've only realized this very recently. |
| UK james |
Posted - 01/21/2005 : 11:31:20
PW
I am 26 now but my tms symptoms started when I was 13 after my parents spilt and I had to change schools as a result (pressure!). Since then I have suffered from:
- Painful heels at about 13
- Groin strains from about 16-20
- Backpain from about 20-25
During what should have been some of my best years with happiest memories, I was physically restricted and in a load of pain (no sport etc). However, I can't go back and am just grateful that I have learnt about tms now and can have a better future.
I think that when you get tms depends on your upbringing - if you are in a loving, supportive family environment you will probably be ok, if not you may repress emotions like I certainly did.
Since learning about tms I have been 95% better with the occasional flare up but NOTHING compared to what I used to get.
James |
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