| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/10/2006 : 13:18:35
As I am sitting here, trying to think Psychological instead of wondering WHY my neck is tightening even more I felt some vertigo or slight dizziness...Can stress/TMS cause that too? A year and a half ago when i had that bad high speed adjustment to my neck i came home and every time i turned in bed the whole room was spinning...It was beyond a nightmare...A friend who was a cranial sacral specialist 'fixed' the dizziness generating from my neck...Thank God i don't have that turning in bed thing anymore...But...I am wondering why i feel so lightheaded just sitting here...I could maybe use a little more sleep...and I am coming off a major sugar binge...so i suppose it could be sugar withdrawals...but didn't Dr. Sarno mention something once about dizziness also being a TMS equivalent?? |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 10/14/2006 : 10:26:04
Good idea to proceed as if it were TMS, it probably is...Mine happens sometimes in response to working out if the back of my head gets tight...I think it is conditioning that then brings on the temporary dizziness when turning in bed...Because mine also has happened during times of amplified stress...
~Karen |
| mensabuttercup |
Posted - 10/12/2006 : 21:46:10
i have had episodes of vertigo for the past three years. it comes and goes-at times of stress and high emotion, it is much, much worse. from what i've read so far, i'm almost sure it's tms related although my doctor tells me labyrinthitis. i'm going to proceed as if it is tms and see what happens. |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 10/09/2006 : 11:00:47
Hiya MullLady,
I had some phone therapy sessions w/ him and it was very helpful! I also got alot out of Dr. Sarno's videotaped lectures..I watched them over and over again...We cannot overdo that...Hope you feel much better very soon...on my way out so can't write much now..
God bless,
Karen |
| MuLLady244 |
Posted - 10/08/2006 : 11:47:27
Yes I did HAVE vertigo really bad although I found relief before discovering TMS. The issue that I have been dealing with is a roaming vertebrate (self description) in my lower back but not much pain, more fear and anxiety then anything else. I have been blessed with skepticism in regards to the medical community I never ever take things at face value, never from them “avoid surgery”. I think that comes from my defiance as a kid, they used to attempt to force me to take Ritalin, I would act like I swallowed it then spit it out when no one was watching.
With that said prior to finding Dr. Sarno’s work I thought I knew the answer and that all I needed to do was to follow www.egoscue.com and I would be cured. Their belief is that all back pain, neck pain, vertigo, etc.. can be fixed by following a regime of exercise they subscribe that is individually customized, so that we can get our structural alignment back in place. Now that I have found Dr. Sarno I believe what he states is correct although I am NOT convinced the Egoscue group is 100% incorrect BUT I am a firm believer that I must do the internal work recommended by Dr. Sarno to resolve my internal conflicts to prevent the symptoms from moving “the old switcheroo”.
One thing though I plan on pursuing this all the way meaning that once the money is there full on psychotherapy whether I have psychosomatic symptoms or not. It cannot hurt to become aware of those demons down there in the sub-conscious basement. Just like I will continue to do the exercises because hell their exercises and I did fix my Vertigo permanently, it can’t hurt to strengthen my core muscles. In my mind I would rather do too much then too little this is my life I am talking about.
BUT that brings up a personality trait that I would like to correct or at least compromise with. Now that I have discovered Dr. Sarno’s position I am resentful and would rather do his way and not worry about anything else. But in the end Dr. Sarno does without question recommend exercise the goal is to get in better shape then before since now I will not have to deal with being stopped by injuries as long as I do the work of course.
I ordered Dr. Sarno’s DVD’s and am finishing his book the Divided Mind. After that I plan on ordering Dr. Schechter’s stuff. Then maybe do a phone consult with Donald Dubin and after that maybe go visit a doctor versed in TMS. When it comes to personal growth this is an area that I want to continue to improve. So did you follow everyone’s advice and rigorously study Dr. Sarno’s stuff if yes how did that help? If no what have you been studying and did that help?
Enjoy the day,
MuLLady |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 10/08/2006 : 06:47:36
HIya Mulllady,
Sorry for the delay, I haven't had a chance to be online much lately..Yes I did find relief, but then it returned for a short time..It came back after I lifted weights, particularly the bicep machine at the gym...I felt a tightening in the back of my head...Probably it was conditioning..My brain thought "Ah ha, you hurt your neck again, up high where C1-C2 could be involved.." It took that as an opportunity to start up the TMS Dizziness when turning in bed thing...I struggled w/ applying what i learned at the forum and not thinking that it was from tight muscles or misaligned vertabrae...I applied heat (probably conditioning again..) and within a week or so it was gone..It happened just as I was getting ready to come to NYC for an extended stay..Lots of stress, huge life changes, etc...what a 'coincidence' that the TMS acted up again at that time of my life...Have you been dealing w/ Vertigo? and...have you thought about how that could be related to what is going on in your life right now?
Take care,
Karen |
| MuLLady244 |
Posted - 10/07/2006 : 00:24:05
I am interested to know if months later have you found relief from your Vertigo??
MuLLady |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/12/2006 : 08:51:58
I agree with you Jim,,,and I fall into the category you speak of...I am gradually increasing my walking and it is definitely helping on many levels...As I read the books, journal and ponder that this MUST be TMS and cannot be structural...I know I will recover...I am only going to the gym once a week, when i can get a ride there..Driving is still almost impossible...And when I go to the gym, until the neck is much better i am sticking to a lower body workout only... |
| Jim1999 |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 22:51:35
quote:
Originally posted by redskater
the one thing I tend to disagree with Sarno on is waiting until the pain is almost gone to resume physical activity. To me, if is there is nothing structurally wrong why wait.
Gaye,
I think that this really depends on the patient's confidence in the diagnosis. For someone who's very confident, resuming physical activity quickly may increase the speed of recovery. However, for someone who's struggling with accepting the diagnosis, there can be a major setback. The unconscious mind can increase the pain, as if to say, "See, the activity caused more pain, so the pain is physical. It's time to stop that Sarno stuff once and for all." I'm pretty sure there are patients who've given up on Dr. Sarno as a result of this.
In my case, I increased activity fairly gradually over a few weeks. I didn't wait until the pain was almost gone, but I didn't try to challenge the pain too much right away. It seems like it would be a good balance for many patients.
Jim |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 19:58:08
Hi Slimmylou,
I am so glad you wrote...It's kind of cosmic, actually...Because I was just thinking about you this afternoon...I came across some of your replies and thought that you sounded like a nice person I would like to connect with..Maybe somewhere inside I had a feeling you were a fellow artist...Thanx so much for understanding me..I am sorry you are suffering w/ the neck as well..And I think it's great how you can get your mind off of the symptoms by painting, baking etc...I still haven't been able to pick up a brush but i feel it coming..Normally i paint daily...I have started by forcing myself to walk every day, sometimes twice a day...I am going to try to paint agian tonight, even for a few minutes..It could really be the missing link for me...Stay in touch...
Hugs,
Karen |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 14:24:17
I think you are right Dave and in my case,,,it is borderline...I did the walk and it was great...I had some pain and I talked to my brain and kept going..I kept doing my best to think Psychological and I finished the 25 min walk...Then, however, on the way back from TCBY when i tried to turn my head enough to make a right hand turn, my neck freaked and locked up even more...It's things like that happening that make it hard for me to take that 100 percent leap of faith i know i so desperately need to take...It's hard not to wonder "What the heck is going on w/ me that I cannot turn my head.." But I really am doing my best on all fronts...I am hopeful I will GET IT soon! Very soon...I just have to. |
| Dave |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 14:19:51
quote:
Originally posted by redskater
the one thing I tend to disagree with Sarno on is waiting until the pain is almost gone to resume physical activity. To me, if is there is nothing structurally wrong why wait. If I had waited till the pain was almost gone I would probably still be waiting. I had to jump in with both feet and go for it. Yea, sometimes it hurt worse while I was doing the activity but it never stayed that way and I would always wake up no worse for wear.
I agree, if you're at the point where you have truly repudiated the structural diagnosis, and banished at least most of the fear that you may bring on an injury by performing physical activity.
If you're not there yet, the fear of injury could fuel the TMS, making the symptoms even worse, and adding doubt.
I remember the first time I worked out at the gym despite having lower back pain. As I was doing leg presses I was thinking to myself, "Take that, brain! Go ahead, bring on the pain! I don't care. I know it's not structural and this exercise will not make it worse." |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 13:52:21
You guys are all so great...I mean it...I feel teary eyed right now because I am soooo touched by your caring and supportive msgs..Thank you TT, Beth (my new sis!) and Gaye, really thank you! I think I will pick ALL of you as my guru, Dave and the rest too, lol! I have learned something valuable from each and every one of you, truly...I just got back from driving a short distance to the park and then TCBY for yogurt...The walk was very good, but I had to talk to myself several times...I felt pain in the left index finger and my first thought was "Oh no, that is the C6-7 disc region..." I caught myself and said instead "STOP IT YOU TMS GREMLIN...I KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING!!!" and i kept w/ my walk..Then i had a pain in my right calf..and the right side of the neck, different area then usual..And I thought "Holy Cow this things is STUBBORN!!!! Kind of like ME!" And i kept going and did 25 minutes in the heat..I survived...
Listen to this..I met this elderly couple in their late 80's...85 and 89 years old at the park..They were walking around in a circle where there was shade..We spoke for a long time...I love older people, used to work in a nursing home once as a recreation therapist..was a blast...Well...I was watching them and quite inspired by them...Their necks and backs seemed FINE!!!! They had had other health challenges and realized that all the worrying got them nowhere! I remember Dr. Sarno saying that most TMSers are in their 30's and 40'...Well...I am in my 40's so i am right in there...I could see the gentlemen's neck juding (sp?) forward and was thinking "Gee, I bet his neck doesn't have a great perfect curve in it either,, yet he is pain free and moving it freely in all directions..no restrictions.." We spoke a while...and turns out that they never had children...How interesting for that generation! They loved to travel and never wanted to be bogged down w/ kids...It made me feel better about the fact that I don't have any, I am not the only one! They were a joy to speak with...
Then I kind of pushed it too much because I drove to TCBY...There were these sweet teenagers working there...I know I had some feelings aobut seeing them because my teen years were pretty good overall...My parents were still married to one another til later teen years..They were alive and well...i was living with them and doing great in high school...I was relatively happy...So seeing those kids reminded me of when i was that age and I felt a sort of nostalgia and sadness come over me a bit...I went on my merry way and when i was going to turn into the street my neck was stuck even more then usual...It was pretty scary...It hurt like heck and was terribly tight in the back of my skull and very top of the neck esp. on the right..I keep thinking to myself...OKAY WHAT IS GOING ON KAREN, WHAT ARE YOU FEELING!?
Anyway, made it home and tried some other things to bring relief and then came here to see if any of my pals wrote me...What a journey this whole thing is... |
| h2oskier25 |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 12:33:06
Hi Karen,
I agree with Red Skater. The pain is Benign in nature, so exercise away. I never had problems working out. I always did that, it was my J.O.B. that I felt I had to restrict my motions at.
I agree that it's open season for advice from all. Pick your guru.
Since you and I have SUCH a similar background and current situation (It's almost freaky), and I've been cured over 8 months, I'm a good candidate. Gee, I feel like I'm applying for a job.  I'm a real team player . . .
Hugs
Beth |
| redskater |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 11:59:17
the one thing I tend to disagree with Sarno on is waiting until the pain is almost gone to resume physical activity. To me, if is there is nothing structurally wrong why wait. If I had waited till the pain was almost gone I would probably still be waiting. I had to jump in with both feet and go for it. Yea, sometimes it hurt worse while I was doing the activity but it never stayed that way and I would always wake up no worse for wear. This is just how I experianced it, but it got me back to living a lot quicker. I liked Fred's book it really helped me to conquer the fear, but you have to really understand Sarno's books to get it to soak into your subconsious.
Gaye |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 11:16:42
K,
Your're undoubtly feeling whip-sawed by all the advice you are getting. It would be much preferable if you had but one Guru as a guide through this difficult period. This is inevitable if you put yourself out on the www. You are open-season for advice, from amateurs like me. You will have to pick and choose what will work and not conflict.
My basics : read Sarno and exercise with attention.
If you pay attention to anyone's post let it be Dave's.
On one of Shechter's tapes, Don Dubin says, the most sessions it took to "cure" someone of TMS was 15.
Good luck,
tt
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| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 10:55:12
Thanx TT! Love your posts! You always help me...Fred Amir talks about setting short term and long term goals in his book "Rapid Recovery from Neck and Back Pain.." That is why I was thinking ahead of myself..I have to believe and imagine that i will play tennis again or I will REALLY get depressed...
I so appreciate your openness in sharing about your own experience...It is very 'real' and I need to be more 'real' and definintely more in the NOW...
The trouble is that my NOW is not very good...ie..physical pain, cabin fever, money issues, loneliness...So my natural inclination is to want to escape the pain in any way I can...I am wise enough by now to know that I cannot escape the emotional pain without dire repercusions in my body...so i am pressing on with the introspection...and it is scary and exciting at the same time...
I have put Divided Mind at the top of my list..that and my walking...
Hugs to you,
Karen |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 10:46:22
Mornin' Karen,
GOOD ! You're on the right track. I would prefer that you change your priorities to put reading THE DIVIDED MIND at the TOP of your to-do list, rather than at the bottom, but at least you got the message and you are reading it.
From your post, I gather a sense of not living in the NOW. You are alluding a lot to the future: "can't wait to play tennis...picking up speed...". Don't set up a strawman-gremlin that will knock you down when you DON'T accomplish all the goals you are setting up for yourself.
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S. principle--"keep it simple stupid". Read Sarno and exercise. As Drziggles said, "consistency" will help you "dig deeper". Don't create a laundry list of future expectations that are unobtainable and set yourself up for another TMS fall--another TMS distraction from living in the now.
My depression was clinical, and a TMS affective equivalent. I witnessed, as it was occurring, first-hand, the primary and secondary gains, I was rewarding myself with--but felt powerless to do anything to stop, during the free-fall. Depression allowed me to get out of doing things I did not want to do--it was the excuse. I sloughed off tasks onto my brother.
In retrospect, my loving girl-friend "helped" me, but now I feel a resentment that she ENABLED me to create and remain in my depressive state. The best thing for me would have been to HAVE to get out and do the basics of daily survival, like shopping for food, doing the laundry, taking out the garbage, etc.
I could have done these minimal tasks, but she "nursed" me and helped create a hospital like setting for me. The only thing that prevented me from becoming a total vegtable, was having to get out, and do my two psycho-therapy sessions a week. I became very paranoid about driving and overly careful, which can also create road accidents. In reality I am an excellent driver. Depression put me under an unrealistic self-view--a distorted, psychological, electron microscope.
I do miss some of the positive things about being in a clinicaly depressed state, like watching a LOT of TV and being very well informed. Also, watching Cramer's Mad Money. Now I hardly get to see him anymore.
Hope this helps--it did me,
tt
p.s.
To get back to normal activity, try going to the edge of your pain and listen to it. Back off slightly to the point at which you can bear it. Do ten reps slowly. |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 10:33:44
I know Dave, I understand your frustration..But I also know that I am not the only one who has read the books and yet still has some struggles/doubts fully accepting the diagnosis...The brainwashing of the white coats can be really hard to clear out of one's system...I am working hard on this, I assure you...maybe even too hard...As I do realize that I am on this forum far too often out of my own loneliness living in a town where I barely know anyone...It is very refreshing to be on a forum with people who understand TMS..I am learning so much and I REALLY REALLY REALLY want to get out of my own head and way and just ACCEPT 100 percent the TMS DX...really I do...Tom pointed out that I should temporarily put the other TMS books aside and just read the Divided Mind..I am going to take his advice on this... |
| Dave |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 10:26:40
Don't want to beat a dead horse here, but it's all in the book. And this is why I'm curious (and maybe a bit frustrated) because reading (and re-reading, and re-reading...) and comprehending Dr. Sarno's book(s) is clearly the most important step in TMS recovery. |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 09:56:12
Dave,
That is interesting...I didn't know that...You clearly have alot more knowledge and experience in this then I do..So it shouldn't be a surprise that I am still learning...Thanks for pointing this out...
~Karen |
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