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SarnoSoldier
16 Posts |
 Posted - 04/28/2005 : 06:27:49
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| I know I have TMS and that is all it is. I get back pain every day of my life. It goes through stages. Some times it is sciatica, sometimes it is just in the back, and sometimes it all goes away. I am going through a real rough time right now. I am fine when I sit, but when I get up to walk, I get a real intense strange sensation in my low back. It is so uncomfortable. I am so scared and anxious about how long this will last and when i will be normal again. This has been going on 3 years now. I started reading Dr. Siegels book Backsense since Dr. Sarno's books I have memorized. I was conditioned to experience pain as I went about my day, but now everything is different. Today, my pain is more of a reaction to walking. I need help breaking this routine that I am in. Please help me. I am such a worrier and always let these symptoms take over my life. |
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MikeC
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 07:16:10
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SarnoSoldier,
I would think the first thing that you should do is to find a TMS physician to get a diagnosis. A diagnosis that says it is TMS will help your psyche immediately. Once you have done that, put the programs that the doctors recommend in action. I believe that Sarno and Siegel are similar enough that you can do both simultaneously. Pick an activity(ies) that are very simple and plan them out like Dr. Siegel recommends. COntinue to do them and notice that the pain is probably dissimilar everytime you do them which means that the activity isn't the problem. Continue on this course with expanding your activities. Meanwhile, think psychological. Think of all the stressors from your past and present that is contributing to your pain syndrome. The more you think about the pain, the worse it will get. I used to think that was nonsense but I have seen enough examples of it that it must be true.
Finally, you should use this forum if for nothing else but to vent your frustrations. You will get frustrated. See what Dr. Siegel says in his book about dealing with frustration, anger, and depression. Also, you should probably see a psychologist. One reason would be to help dig up all your emotions and the other reason is to have someone help veer you to the right path of thinking when you are starting to go off course. I cannot tell you all the negatinve thinking patterns that I started to develop once you have been in pain for awhile. They are better known as cognitive distortions.
Good luck,
Mike C |
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SarnoSoldier
16 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 07:32:44
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| Thanks so much for the response. I have the most negative thinking patterns that I know. My wife always tells me that I scare her with my negativity and my pessimism. I scare myself. I just always worry about having to live like this forever. I am seeing a therapist who is mostly just listening to me. I don't think it is one thing that stresses me out. It is like a general anxiety towards life. I now have double the anxiety due to worrying about going through my day and wondering what will cause pain and how long the pain will last. I had a traumatizing experience where my back pain came in a horrible spasm pattern which lasted a month. I did not sleep or function. Since then, I am so scared of that situation again, it doubles my daily anxiety. It is the fear of losing control. |
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almost there
109 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 08:09:04
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SarnoSoldier-
Don't believe we have heard from you in awhile! The good news is that you KNOW the pain you are experiencing is TMS....and by your accepting this you are more than half way there....pain IS frightening, depressing and anxiety provoking.... regardless of whether it is caused by repressed emotion or something structural....try to relax...hard to do I agree...but think about relaxing your lower back before you get up to walk...visualize the blood flowing to this area....tell your brain to let it go....in other words "Knock it off"! Stay in touch with this Forum...just reading the posts makes you feel connected and not quite so alone...this works...you know it does!
P.S. Loved your line....that you have every word of Dr. Sarno's book memorized! |
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Fredarm57
USA
72 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 08:19:57
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SarnoSoldier: Try some of the mindfulness techniques described in Dr. Siegel's book. Most of our anxiety, worry, etc. comes about our fears for the future. It's much less of a burden to just deal with what is going on in the present. You don't know what's going to happen with your back next week any more that you know what the weather is going to be. If you can accept that, and not worry so much about what might happen, you will be much less tense, and consequently much less likely to have a pain episode. TMS can be like a self-fulfilling prophecy--the more your worry about it, the more likely it is to happen.
Also, consider seeing a doctor or psychatrist for some medical help. A drug like Klonopin can be very helpful for breaking the pain/worry cycle in the short-term (it's not for long-term use due to its habit-forming tendencies) and one like Prozac, Zoloft or Welbutrin can be helpful over the longer term. There is a condition called Generalized Anxiety Disorder which can be helped by these meds. Some of us just need a little help with our brain chemistry. There's no shame in that. Fred |
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Allan
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 09:09:55
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Sarnosoldier,
Your focus may be too much internal, that is you appear to be focusing on yourself almost exclusively. The result appears to be a lot of unnecessary complexities in your life and possibly way too much seriousness.
How do I know this may be the case? That was my problem some years ago.
Believe it or not, Ann Landers helped me. (Hello Verdammt) I never wrote to her but her consistent advice to many people was to join the compliment club. That is, pay everyone you meet during the day a sincere compliment. It must be sincere, not frivolous.
The idea is get you thinking about other people and to get the focus away from you.
Try it. It may be helpful.
Secondly. You may have memorized Sarno, but it appears that in the process you either didn’t get his message or didn't understand it, particularly on treating TMS pain. Go back to page 70 of Healing Back Pain and try to understand his suggestions for a treatment procedure. It appears that you are not following it. If you were, chances are that you would be making more progress.
Allan.
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SarnoSoldier
16 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 09:11:00
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| I agree with everything you say. I have been seeing a therapist, but what I notice is that all I think about is my back. On good days, I say, "Why is my back not hurting?". On bad days I say, "How long will this last and will this bring on horrible spasms" Right now I am in a bad way because I am dealing with this strange sensation that occurs when I get up from sitting and walk. Strange because two days ago I could run and now after doing nothing physical, I have severe pain when I walk. No sciatica though which makes no sense at all. I am always squirming in my chair and i am very impatient with everything. I always feel on the edge and anxious about life itself. I just wish someone could tell me I will be okay and nothing that is happening is dangerous. |
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Allan
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 09:38:58
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SarnoSoldier.
You are making good progress, you just don’t realize it.
“Why is my back not hurting?” The first sign that you are making progress is when the pain starts to move around. It is here one day, gone, then back again or in some other place. It’s not hurting now because when it did hurt it was TMS pain. If it were structural, it would hurt all of the time.
“No sciatica though which makes no sense at all.” This is the whole key to everything making sense. The fact that you had sciatica pain one day and not the next appears to be conclusive proof that the earlier pain was TMS pain and not from a structural condition.
“I just wish someone would tell me I will be okay and that nothing that is happening is dangerous.” You have TMS pain not structural pain. It is emotionally induced. It is not from a pinched nerve, herniated disc or spinal stenosis or anything structural. Dr. Sarno says that TMS pain, although very real, is harmless.
Can you see the proof in all of this?
By the way, I had severe sciatica pain in both legs from my hips to my ankles for months. For four years now, no pain at all. Dr. Sarno’s theory does work.
Did you read his first book, Mind Over Back Pain? The diagrams are great. I recommend it for a basic understanding of TMS pain.
By the way, MikeC gave you some good advice regarding seeing a TMS physician.
Allan.
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 09:41:13
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You are still very much focused in the physical realm.
You must learn to ignore the pain. It is essential. You must accept that the symptoms have a psychological origin, and that there is nothing physically wrong with you.
You must learn to accept that those terrible spasms will never come again, because you now know the cause, and you simply will not allow it to happen. When the pain gets noticable, you will simply shift your thoughts to the psychological realm.
Treating TMS is a reconditioning process. You must recondition yourself to think psychological whenever you are aware of the pain. You must explore all the sources of rage in your life. Basically, you have to follow Dr. Sarno's treatment suggestions.
Unfortunately you haven't been able to get past step 1. The reasons for this are not clear. Your obsession with the pain is a distraction in and of itself. Perhaps the psychological issues that plague you are so severe that your mind is incapable of giving up the distraction. Or, perhaps you really don't believe in TMS, though you are paying yourself lip service by saying that you do.
Assuming you have truly "done the work" diligently and regularly, and tried your best to ignore the pain, and you still have not made significant progress after 3 years, then it is time to see a different therapist. Maybe you need to see a psychiatrist and take some anti-anxiety medication as a short-term boost so you can refocus your thoughts.
Remember, the fear of the symptoms is worse than the symptoms themselves. The fear is harder to banish than the pain. But it can be done, it just takes focus, belief, and hard work. |
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MikeC
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 10:05:15
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SarnoSoldier,
Please don't think that you are the only one who is going through this or has gone through this. I will almost guarantee that everyone on this board at one time or another doubted they had TMS or thought about their backs all day long. Back in January, my sciatica was pounding in both legs to the point that I would have crying episodes and was very depressed feeling that I would never improve. At that point, I made an appointment with a psychologist in March and cried and screamed over dealing with back issues over 20 years. I felt that the pain would never stop and I would be stuck like this forever. Three sessions later and the pain has stabilized. I'm not great but I don't scream and cry anymore. My doctor gave me a meditation tape, a list of cognitive belief errors, an exercise called triple disassociation, and a couple of books to review.
While my psychologist doesn't think pain is solely from repressed emotions, he thinks they at least contribute to them. The sad part is (and Sarno clearly states this) you never know which thought it is that is causing the problem. Usually for us chronic people, it is an accumulation of things over the years and we don't realize it. It can be something as small as a traffic jam or something huge like death and everything in between.
We are so programmed to think that everything is due to structural issues that nothing can be caused by emotional issues. A lot of the stress we inflict on ourselves and we don't realize it. One example is watching the newscast on a daily basis. There's nothing better for your emotional psyche than to listen to a 24hour news station telling us about murders, rapes, diseases, war, taxes, etc. to put us a dreadful emotional state.
As I suggested in my earlier post, find a TMS physician and work with him/her as well as follow the advice of Sarno and Siegel. I know it is hard to ignore the pain. If you need a further morale booster, go look on Amazon.com under Dr. Sarno's books. There are too many success stories out there for this to be a coincidence.
Good luck,
Mike C |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 10:40:54
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SarnoSoldier,
Having reviewed your archived posts, it sounds like you are as stuck now as when you first came to this board seeking help. You are still fixated on the physical symptoms rather than the emotional aspects of TMS. Reading the books, for some, is not enough. It sounds like you fit into that catagory. All I can reccommend, at this point, is that you make the effort to see a TMS doctor and a TMS psychotherapist and follow their advice.
Good luck |
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SarnoSoldier
16 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 11:20:11
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| I know I dwell on the pain because this pain is so different from my normal TMS pain. This feels like I have a nerve gone wild and it just flares up as I start to walk. It is extremely scary. I do realize that I have a lot of stresses in my life and that I am a hypochondriac. I worry so much about health and death, family and friendships. I worry about being the perfect husband and never ever want to slip up. Over the past couple of years I have watched my wife's family get divorced, both grandparents die of cancer, my best friend die of cancer in 3 days, have a sister who has major personality disorders and extreme anxiety, grad school pressures, job hatred, jealousy toward family members, want for better sex life, low self esteem, a new house, job changes, a pregnant wife (presently), and the horrible image in my mind that I cannot lift weights, be in shape, participate in contact sports, and much more. I know that I am the perfect candidate for TMS. I just hate that my pain is not the type to keep me in bed, but it is enough of a problem to always distract me. I can never explain to anyone the strange sensation that my pain involves. I wish it was as simple as sciatic pains. I am also afraid to depend on pain killers or anti-depressants. I just have this hopeless mindset that I can't break free of. |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 11:33:18
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TMS symptoms vary widely. It is not uncommon to experience completely different sensations than you ever have before. Sometimes that is a good sign because it means TMS is trying harder to keep you distracted.
Your anxiety is a TMS equivalent. You are so full of rage, yet you have not accessed any of it. You need help. Your therapist is no good if you have been in this rut for 3 years. You must get past the anxiety and for that you might have to accept that medication is the only answer.
There is no indication in any of your posts that you have actually done the work necessary to investigate the sources of the rage. You mention in passing that your wife is pregnant. Have you tried at all to figure out the deep, hidden emotions that this stirs within you? For example, I bet you are terrified that you will be a horrible father.
Bottom line: you need help. I would seek out a psychiatrist. This is one case where I think medication is probably essential. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 11:33:43
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SarnoSoldier,
Did you read my post to you? If you did I would appreciate a reply to my suggestion. |
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MikeC
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 11:47:56
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SarnoSoldier,
I agree with Dave. You need to see a new psychologist if this is still going on. It sounds like you are on the verge of a emotional collapse. A good psychologist will force you to take each of those issues that you mentioned and make you dig down deeper. They will also make you realize that a lot of the stresses that you are creating are of your own doing by the way you automatically perceive things. Sometimes we can do that ourselves but in the emotional state that you are in, you should seek out a professional.
For instance, I thought that I could not be a good father because I could not do things with them because of pain. His response that children only care that you are present in the household. Watching TV with them will make them happy. You don't need to do everything with them as long as you are there.
At this point, you should see that the activities that you are doing have no connection to your pain or they would happen all the time. THerefore, the pain must be psychologically driven.
Find a psychologist who will help you with your pain AND everything going on with your life. It should help you.
Good luck,
Mike C |
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SarnoSoldier
16 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 12:11:24
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Tennis Tom,
I know what you are saying, but there are NO TMS Dr.'s in my area. I don't know any therapist that will honestly say that pain is purely emotional and not at all from an injury. That is the problem. What do you do if you cannot see a TMS doctor? |
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Scottydog
United Kingdom
330 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 13:45:18
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Sarnosoldier,
Write things down, write things down - worries, childhood fears, relationships even good things about yourself. Write things down.
Really - it helps.
Scottydog |
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molomaf
119 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 14:00:52
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Dave said
"TMS symptoms vary widely. It is not uncommon to experience completely different sensations than you ever have before. Sometimes that is a good sign because it means TMS is trying harder to keep you distracted."
This is so true! I had surgery in January on my back that was not TMS. I, of course, was convinced that it was sciatica even though I couldn't stand up. I saw Dr. Martinez and he said he thought it was Cauda Equina Syndrome which it was when verified by MRI. He told me that I would probably doubt myself in the future because of this event. For four months, the healing process was distraction enough but when I started to walk and drive again, my brain decided that I needed a better distraction. I got sensations that I had never gotten before and never noticed in Sarno's books because they didn't apply to me. I called Dr. Martinez and he said he had expected to hear from me before this!! I told him that I was 90% sure it was TMS and he heard the fear in me. He asked me some questions and told me it didn't sound like anything serious. It took me about a week to get my head around this one-shocklike sensations across the top of my buttox. It felt like I had to be on guard as if someone was going to scare me and damn if it didn't work. I was scared. I was distracted. But once I got the courage to face it head on, I got past it and it has pretty much stopped.
It takes a lot of courage to face your fear head on. If the sensations/pain stop and start, that's your proof that it is TMS. It wouldn't stop if it was real. I should know and it fooled me anyway!
Dr. Sarno says somewhere in the books that if you continue to fear the pain, it will continue. So challenge yourself. Take little steps. Do physical things to prove to yourself that nothing worse than being uncomfortable will happen.
Michele |
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Allan
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 18:03:30
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SarnoSoldier.
When are you going to get the message and take some action?
Never mind the responses along the lines of "Yes, I agree, but. . ."
MikeC has given you some excellent advice about TMS physicians. Your response was: “No TMS physicians in my area.”
So what? What law limits you to your area of the country?. Get on a plane (or a train or a bus or whatever) and go see one. What is a few hundred dollars compared to the potential relief of a lifetime of pain?
Regarding Dave's advice, you say: “I don't know any therapist that will honestly say that pain is purely emotional and not at all from an injury.”
Who does? I don’t either. The point is, go see one anyhow. The objective is to get a professional evaluation and a suggested course of action to get you out of your misery.
Dave has a history of analyzing these situations presented on the forum and cutting right to the chase with some excellent advice. In your case, it appears to me that he is right on target. Take his advice. Go back and read his two postings. You have the answer. What more do you want? Do it!
It is about time that you recognized that you have the football and that it is your call. Take some action. Make some progress. Three years is too long to stay in limbo.
Allan.
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marytabby
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 18:10:11
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Soldier,
I have only been at this a month. So I am very new to this, but I read all three of Sarno's books a few times, and Siegel's. I am having intermittent pain still in my buttocks and the thing everyone on this board says makes sense: if it were from a disc problem, etc it would hurt all the time. It only hurts when I run, which is the trigger activity that started all this crap in December. So I figure my mind is not ready to stop the pattern, it's going to try to keep me locked into the trigger, the running. In pain I continue on, I do my best to keep running. I am sitting now hours after the run and I feel ok. Not perfect but not horrible. I have to believe it's the brain playing games with me. Also, I recently hooked up with a therapist and I do have a low grade anxiety disorder, similar to how you describe yours, and she did not put me on Klonipin or any type of suppressive med, she put me on something that is in the SSRI family. SSRI meds balance out serotinin levels in the brain. It's a tiny dose to start but it's to get a grip on my anxiety, which is probably from all the stress and trauma I've endured with family deaths/abuse/neglect/safety issues as a kid. As others have said, get to a therapist and get a med consult soon, so you can try to get a grip on the anxiety that is running amuck. I am trying it finally after many years and if it doesn't work for me, I will still soldier on, and work the program. For now, I visit this board several times a day to get ideas and support and I read, read, read the books and try to use the ideas. Good luck and hope you feel better soon.
Mary |
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Fredarm57
USA
72 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2005 : 19:46:34
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SarnoSoldier: When I first dealt with this, in 1991, there were no TMS doctors in my area (Boston) either. I got on a train to New York and went to see Dr. Sarno himself. I was able to combine the office visit with the first lecture and went down the next week for the second lecture and then back again for a follow up a few weeks later. That's 4 1/2 hours each way on Amtrak, with back pain, for three round trips! The point is, I agree with what Allan says, find your closest TMS doctor and do what it takes to get there. There is a good list on the Tar Pit Yoga web site, http://www.tarpityoga.com/directory.html.
Get some pharmaceutical help at least for the short term to damp down the anxiety so you can start to get out of this rut that you're in. Heck, your primary care doctor can prescribe Klonopin, Valium, or one of the other benzodiazipines to stabilize you until you can get to a TMS doctor. You may also want to get a referral to a psychatrist as it also sounds like you could be a candidate for one of the SSRI's (Prozac, Zoloft, etc.). Don't worry alone! Get help!
Fred |
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Please Help Me
