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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
 Posted - 12/02/2014 : 21:58:19
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Hey guys! Only a year between posts this time, I'm getting better (or is it worse?).
I actually sprained myself again about six months ago, same foot different tissue, but I had the same course of healing as before - difficult, with relapses not explained by tissue pathology. I've been startlingly unwilling to consider it TMS this time, I guess because I just keep thinking I must have done something terrible to my ankle and that's why it keeps hurting.
Recently I've been considering it again though because I realized that at this point the anxiety about the pain, the analysis and concern over every little twinge, is worse than the actual twinges, and that not infrequently, my uninjured but overburdened right foot feels worse than my "injured" but underused left foot.
Not really thinking about TMS, but thinking about the emotional component and possible neural miswring, I started researching "pain and hypervigilance" on the web and came up with some interesting links where they discuss the neural sensitization that can occur, and I even found an article from the Cleveland Clinic about "chronic nonmalignant pain syndrome", which after reading I realized is the fanciest newest medical talk for ... TMS. http://www.clevelandclinicmeded.com/medicalpubs/diseasemanagement/psychiatry-psychology/chronic-nonmalignant-pain/ Oh yeah, I know something about that thing...
I must say it's a great comfort to me to come back here and find you all still here, healing and helping others heal. It feels a bit like coming home. I was looking for people who understand what I've been dealing with, and here you are.
Aside from advising paced return to activity, where Sarno is much more full-on, and not giving as much airtime to emotional components (though there's plenty of mention of mindfulness and relaxation - similar idea), the advice for coping with what they call CNMP or neural oversensitivity is basically the same as TMS. I think I might go more that direction for now (it's basically the advice the doc/PT have been giving me anyway) just to not overwhelm myself with the fear that's been such a big obstacle to progress.
Any thoughts and encouragement welcome. BTW, I did have some big stressors in my life this year as well. In fact I had LITERALLY just moved into the house I bought, the day before I sprained my ankle again! And a few months before I had changed jobs. So, moving, owning a house, new job. Those are just some minor stressors, right? 
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What were you expecting? |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2014 : 00:35:53
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ARM- Sorry to hear the ankle acting up. Sounds like a lot of potential
financial stress might be at play here. Is it internal or external pressure
or both? What do the significant people in your life think about all
these changes? Any criticism coming your way? Food for thought.
Any one of these changes could put big pressure on the inner self. |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2014 : 15:23:59
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quote:
Originally posted by armchairlinguist
I've been startlingly unwilling to consider it TMS this time, I guess because I just keep thinking I must have done something terrible to my ankle and that's why it keeps hurting.
That is precisely the goal of TMS.
quote:
...I realized that at this point the anxiety about the pain, the analysis and concern over every little twinge, is worse than the actual twinges...
This is another hallmark of TMS symptoms. They are designed to grab your attention. This one is succeeding, so it is likely to continue.
quote:
I started researching...
Classic TMS ... focus on the symptom and obsess about finding a diagnosis and treatment. Even if you believe it may be TMS, searching for alternative answers feeds the doubt that feeds the symptoms.
quote:
Aside from advising paced return to activity, where Sarno is much more full-on, and not giving as much airtime to emotional components (though there's plenty of mention of mindfulness and relaxation - similar idea), the advice for coping with what they call CNMP or neural oversensitivity is basically the same as TMS. I think I might go more that direction for now (it's basically the advice the doc/PT have been giving me anyway) just to not overwhelm myself with the fear that's been such a big obstacle to progress.
If you accept that this is TMS, why are you going in a different direction? It seems you are still searching for alternative answers. You may consciously believe it is TMS, but your subconscious is not convinced. It thinks that this new "advice for coping with ... CNMP" might offer a better chance for relief. It is still searching for alternative explanations, which whether you realize or not, is undermining your belief in the TMS diagnosis.
quote:
I did have some big stressors in my life this year as well...
Finally, at the very end of your message, as an afterthought. The potential emotional stressors should be in the forefront of your thoughts, whenever you are aware of the symptoms, rather than all the other stuff you are doing that actually draws attention to the symptoms.
My advice would be to keep it simple and go back to reading Dr. Sarno's books and following his treatment suggestions. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2014 : 22:03:48
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LOL, Dave. CNMP IS TMS, that was the whole point of my post. I simply don't have the physical or emotional wherewithal to make a wholesale change right now. In time, I hope. Gradually increasing physical activity isn't a different direction, it's the same direction at a slower place. Lots of Sarno's advice recognizes that getting back to full activity will take time for most people.
I suppose most people (especially newbies) need the kick in the ass from your posts, but doesn't it get a little boring for you to only ever tell people that they aren't doing well enough at reading Sarno and following his advice? I left the forum in the first place because I'd gotten enough of doing that for the time being and was exploring other emotional modalities in depth. Sarno is not the only person in the world with wisdom to share in the area of emotional struggle or chronic pain.
miehnesor, those are great questions. Something to ponder. For sure becoming a homeowner is fraught with conflict for me. I never had a great desire to do it, and feel it mostly as a burdensome way of achieving other goals (freedom from a landlord and my own walls, mainly, also stability). It seems very possible that staying in pain is partly a way of resisting facing up to the burdens I feel "unfairly" placed on me by doing it. Doing it by myself also has turned out to be more work than I expected (another thing that my inner child no doubt thinks is unfair). Turns out there's probably a reason other than financial most people own homes jointly...Anyway, I think there's also external pressure (and maybe internal?) to be enjoying it. Having put a large chunk of money into a purchase and made this big decision, people want to know that I like my house and don't regret doing it. Having conflicted feelings about a house isn't as frowned on as having them about children, but it is definitely a vibe. I guess I'd like to feel happy about it as well but mainly because otherwise I feel stupid when people ask, you know? The financial aspects of it might not be as salient for me as for some people; because of the way the loan I have is structured I actually have more disposable income than I had previously (although of course most of it does get disposed on the house, taxes and improvements and all).
I've also had some work struggles. I really like my job, but my level of investment in it makes it harder to take when things aren't going well, and I had some criticism leveled at me a few months ago about communication style that felt very personal (and also subtly sexist, which is never fun). I guess I feel like I did explore that at least in some journaling I did, but there are more ongoing ups and downs than there were at my old job because the intensity is just way higher. The intensity was kind of hard to cope with at first as well, in general. I'm more used to it now but it can still get to me.
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What were you expecting? |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2014 : 10:20:26
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My point is that by Googling for alternative explanations for your symptoms, you are undermining recovery. By "exploring other emotional modalities" you are undermining recovery.
I believe repetition is important. The unconscious mind is stubborn. The TMS concept has to sink in. This takes time and constant reminders to yourself. Understanding TMS on a conscious level is not good enough. It has to be hammered into your unconscious and reinforced over and over again via your thoughts and actions.
Many people get frustrated when they do not gain full relief of symptoms. Many posts indicate they do not have the full commitment that is necessary for recovery. The main enemy of TMS recovery is doubt. The unconscious mind seizes the doubt and does whatever it can to undermine your belief in TMS. The simple act of Googling for explanations of the symptoms indicates a lack of commitment and sends a message to your unconscious mind that there is a seed of doubt that can be exploited.
Many feel my "hard line" approach is over the top, and I can appreciate that opinion. I am simply sharing my own experiences in the hope it might help some people. Long-term relief requires long-term acceptance. Whether or not you follow Dr. Sarno's advice to the letter is not important. It is all about your mindset. It is about how you react to the symptoms. It is about diffusing their ability to hijack your attention. It is a life long change in your thoughts and behavior that requires commitment and discipline. How you get there is a personal journey, but one way or another, you need to get there or the symptoms are likely to remain. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2014 : 11:52:40
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Dave, I do think your point is good. I would not be back here if I weren't trying to get to a truly mindbody view of my symptoms, but I've found that my ability to separate injury from damage from pain is really impaired when it comes to sequelae of acute injury (in a way that it wasn't when I had TMS in the form of RSI), and there clearly is still a part of me that isn't convinced that I don't have damage / am not doing more.
I am trying to convince it, and so far I haven't found pure Sarno method (check physical situation with traditional practitioner and get a clean bill of health, then charge ahead) something I can progress with. So in that respect you are totally correct, I am not there yet. In the respect that only Sarno's method can help or that it is always the best help, we may have to agree to disagree for the time being.
I am scheduled to see an occupational therapist this week who works with people having pain issues primarily (vs many OTs who work with e.g. stroke victims). She is also a counselor who should be able to help me unpack the issues around the pain itself, and hopefully find some fruitful focuses for general emotional investigation. Part of the problem I have had is that I don't have enough people to ask me interesting questions like miehnesor did to provoke reflection on issues I might not have deeply considered. I tried journaling but seemed to keep retreading the same paths.
I seem to remember that there is a list of journaling resources somewhere, either in one of the books that is often read or somewhere online or in this forum. Anyone have links or suggestions on where to look?
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What were you expecting? |
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RageSootheRatio
Canada
430 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2014 : 17:36:20
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Quick reply re the journaling:
I think there is a journalling resource on the TMS wiki.
Also, in Scott Brady's book, "Pain Free for Life," he has a whole section.
RSR |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2014 : 18:55:02
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http://www.tmswiki.org/ppd/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
==================================================
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation” – Plato
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
"Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint." Mark Twain and Balto
"The hot-dog is the noblest of dogs; it feeds the hand that bites it." Dr. Laurence Johnston Peter
"...the human emotional system was not designed to endure the mental rigors of a tennis match." Dr. Allen Fox
"Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise" - Thomas Gray
"All my friends in Los Angeles are the sensitive type. They all have like all the diseases like Chronic Fatigue, Epstien Barr, Fibromyalgia. Like all the diseases where the only symptoms seem to be you had a really crappy childhood and at the prospect of full time work ya feel kinda achy and tired."
Posted by Skizzik @ TMSHelp from comedian Maria Bamford
======================================================
"If it ends with "itis" or "algia" or "syndrome" and doctors can't figure out what causes it, then it might be TMS." Dave the Mod
=================================================
TMS PRACTITIONERS:
John Sarno, MD
400 E 34th St, New York, NY 10016
(212) 263-6035
Dr. Sarno is now retired, if you call this number you will be referred to his associate Dr. Rashbaum.
"...there are so many things little and big that are tms, I wouldn't have time to write about all of them": Told to icelikeaninja by Dr. Sarno
Here's the TMS practitioners list from the TMS Help Forum:
http://www.tmshelp.com/links.htm
Here's a list of TMS practitioners from the TMS Wiki:
http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Find_a_TMS_Doctor_or_Therapist
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Edited by - tennis tom on 12/08/2014 08:47:59 |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 12/09/2014 : 12:14:04
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quote:
Originally posted by armchairlinguist
...there clearly is still a part of me that isn't convinced that I don't have damage / am not doing more.
Exactly my point. Assuming the symptom is in fact TMS, it is succeeding and likely to continue. The process is very clever and will give you the symptoms most likely to make you believe there is a physical problem.
Again, it is not a matter of following a "pure" Sarno method, if such a thing exists. It is about finding your way of eliminating the doubt and accepting the symptom as benign and created by your unconscious mind.
quote:
I am scheduled to see an occupational therapist this week who works with people having pain issues primarily (vs many OTs who work with e.g. stroke victims). She is also a counselor who should be able to help me unpack the issues around the pain itself, and hopefully find some fruitful focuses for general emotional investigation.
This is optimistic, but probably not likely. Few therapists accept that the mind can be the cause of symptoms. Some accept that emotional factors can exacerbate an existing physical problem, but this still reinforces the belief that there is a structural issue.
You really cannot have it both ways. You have to commit one way or another. You cannot hope to gain lasting relief from TMS symptoms if your actions send a message to your mind that there is still some belief that the symptom has a physical cause. Even if you cannot "convince yourself" 100% that the pain is TMS, you need to act as if you believe 100%. Until you get to that point, you might as well continue with physical treatments. Perhaps exhausting all of those possibilities will make it easier for you to commit to the TMS diagnosis.
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alexis
USA
596 Posts |
Posted - 12/10/2014 : 22:34:20
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| Hi again ACL, Great to see you stopping by here occasionally too. Since you're reading the broader research on somatic disorders you know the Sarno approach to belief isn't the only way. i think for some it is better than for others, depending on the person and condition. Unless you are generally good at willful belief it seems to me unlikely to work well for questionable conditions like you describe (I say this to you but wouldn't to many others) ... and I doubt it works well for anyone much as they age and their bodies really do fall apart. It's a great trick when we're young, desperate, and relatively healthy...and for those lucky folks who can, for instance, pick a religion despite contrary evidence because it makes them happy. But for many of us this will never work, and the idea that the Sarno way is the only treatment for all psychogenic pain...and especially for only possibly psychogenic pain...is as crazy as saying sulfa drugs or penicillin can be used to treat all bacterial infections in all people. I think Sarno worked for your RSI because you had better evidence and evidence matters. I agree with your instinct that this is a different situation that may call for another approach altogether, be it psychogenic or physically induced. If it were me I would be tackling my emotions whether or not the injury is real...because picking just one scenario as possible is really only half of tackling what the world throws at us. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 12/10/2014 : 23:33:15
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Dave, you obviously haven't met many bodywork-oriented therapists that use alternative modalities. It's nice that you have your opinion, but we aren't going to fully agree on this right now, so you might as well take the patented Sarno Smackdown(TM) to other threads.
I found this OT quite interesting. She reminds me of some of the energy work practitioners I've run into before, but more grounded in traditional medicine and with a much greater insight into emotional aspects of life and how they relate to pain. At one point she informed me that she was having trouble seeing that my left foot was actually on the ground, because the energy in it appeared to her to be "flying up to the ceiling". She also said that the left side is the feminine, intuitive side, which grounds us and represents our trust in ourselves.
I don't regard this kind of stuff as literal truth, but I think it can be quite interesting or illuminating to consider. It's like the questions that miehnesor asked me - a vehicle for insight. Do I feel ungrounded? Very much yes...this house doesn't feel like home, and I resent it for the burden that it's placed on me. I don't feel like I've had a real 'home' for some years, since I moved to my current location from CA where I was. I am not going to talk about my love life on the internet (it's not respectful of the other people involved), but it could use some investment/improvement; I had a tough breakup a few years ago and I'm honestly embarrassed to even admit it still affects me, but it does in subtle ways. My job is extremely focused on the rational and analytical side, and while I like my coworkers a lot it's not a good place for emotion or gentleness; that's just not the vibe there.
Afterward I found that I felt better physically - not dramatically better, but my body seemed happy enough to stand evenly or even more on my left leg, which was a great feeling compared to earlier today when it was arbitrarily acting up. It was also a nice experience in that a lot of my physical therapy and exercise and even the massage I've had has been oriented to injury rehab basics like breaking up scar tissue and muscular knots and it's not that nice or gentle even if it's effective, and this was gentle. There's always something therapeutic about being cared for (that's part of what the placebo effect is) so in that sense it's also nice, even if that part is probably a placebo. But use psychology to fight psychology, why not.
It seems like her focus will be on my whole body and on my emotions through her own lens of energy and intuition, and those are both helpful changes of focus for me. Thanks alexis for your message, I agree - this pain infection is resistant to Sarno's penicillin. We need some amoxicillin here stat. :)
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What were you expecting? |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 12/10/2014 : 23:47:34
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quote:
Originally posted by alexis
If it were me I would be tackling my emotions whether or not the injury is real...
Welcome back for your regular bash at the Good Doctor. Glad to see you finally got the POINT. That's all Dr.Sarno has ever said to do: When you feel the pain switch your thinking to the emotional. It's all the psycho-blabbing the self-confused needlessly tack on that mucks up the simplicity of the theory. TMS/psychosomatic dis-eases are about 80% of the ailments that plague wo/man kind and Dr. Sarno's theory does a wondrous job of covering them. When will humanity come to the realization that the earth is rally flat!?!
==================================================
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation” – Plato
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
"Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint." Mark Twain and Balto
"The hot-dog is the noblest of dogs; it feeds the hand that bites it." Dr. Laurence Johnston Peter
"...the human emotional system was not designed to endure the mental rigors of a tennis match." Dr. Allen Fox
"Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise" - Thomas Gray
"All my friends in Los Angeles are the sensitive type. They all have like all the diseases like Chronic Fatigue, Epstien Barr, Fibromyalgia. Like all the diseases where the only symptoms seem to be you had a really crappy childhood and at the prospect of full time work ya feel kinda achy and tired."
Posted by Skizzik @ TMSHelp from comedian Maria Bamford
======================================================
"If it ends with "itis" or "algia" or "syndrome" and doctors can't figure out what causes it, then it might be TMS." Dave the Mod
=================================================
TMS PRACTITIONERS:
John Sarno, MD
400 E 34th St, New York, NY 10016
(212) 263-6035
Dr. Sarno is now retired, if you call this number you will be referred to his associate Dr. Rashbaum.
"...there are so many things little and big that are tms, I wouldn't have time to write about all of them": Told to icelikeaninja by Dr. Sarno
Here's the TMS practitioners list from the TMS Help Forum:
http://www.tmshelp.com/links.htm
Here's a list of TMS practitioners from the TMS Wiki:
http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Find_a_TMS_Doctor_or_Therapist
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alexis
USA
596 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2014 : 05:46:54
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quote:
Originally posted by armchairlinguist
I don't regard this kind of stuff as literal truth, but I think it can be quite interesting or illuminating to consider. It's like the questions that miehnesor asked me - a vehicle for insight.
This is an approach I believe in intellectually but with which I struggle personally so it's encouraging to see you implementing it what seems successfully. It's so easy to find the errors that make a whole system weak to the foundations, and yet systems with weak foundations offer benefits for many reasons...like drugs which work but whose mechanisms are wholy different than initially imagined. My great accomplishment this year has been not leaving Yoga claases when they discuss things like chakras (something I consider unfounded in reality). Not only that, but I no longer really care when I hear this stuff. I know that the speaker still has things to offer and that the ideas and approaches can serve a purpose even when the "reality" is in doubt...or more than in doubt. And the alienation doesn't stab at me as it once did.
But it's still hard to find the balance. Most of these folks do believe in the literal reality of their concepts, and there's still that potential for alienation as a result, on top of the old drive for logic. Sometime for me that alienation is as big an issue as the cringing I do at knowing they are literal. The human evolutionary standard of a community shared reality is out of the reach of so many of us, and learning, over so many decades, to find a good way to live with this is really for me a major focus now. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2014 : 08:35:58
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Hey, I thought tom's post was okay. He has a style, just like Dave does.
alexis, that's interesting that you are really focused on the issue of community shared reality and the alienation that can result if people are on totally different pages. I think that can be a very tough thing to experience, definitely a source of anger and pain.
I came to where I am pretty gradually, with tarot actually being the first thing that I was able to do that with. Yoga was helpful for me too. I had a very wise yoga teacher - she was excellent physically, and was studying to be a counselor so she had a lot of emotional insight. She really was not all that into the chakra or other stuff, but she was definitely not a literalist and read us a lot of poems and parables. We sang mantras as well and I found them comforting even though a lot of the words were kind of mystical. I didn't need to believe in Hanuman or think I had to have a guru to find strength in the story of Hanuman or sing about bowing to the great teachers. (I generally don't mind singing religious music, especially in other languages - music is one of the ways I access the transcendent anyway.) I still shake my head sometimes when I hear the things people believe but I try to pick out what seems insightful and leave the rest. At least where mysticism is concerned. With real life that's not so easy (politics).
I am a literalist in general so symbolic thinking is still not natural to me. That is actually an appeal of Sarno, or related concepts like CNMP. It's not physically generated but it's still scientific and literal. The processes they describe are physical like oxygen deprivation or amplified neural feedback. I think that a lot of people actually find this description just as mystical as the notion of 'energy' (which I believe is partially literal in that the human body as an electrochemical object clearly has an energy and activity about it) so perhaps it's just the case that my religion is science. ;)
I woke up this morning thinking about how even though I said something about all the journaling I did, there's really a lot I never covered. Some of it's a bit older, but some of it is since last year and I still just hadn't thought to consider it. Doing a little chronological inventory should give some good topics to consider. The fact that I missed all that stuff, I can see the denial operating.
In the traditional Sarno mold I am also trying some small steps. Mainly, to consider the arbitariness of when my foot acts up, as well as how I've seen the pain try to transfer into the right foot (easy when people keep telling me it must be overloaded). From there to try and sit with minor flares and not accommodate them by doing something like taking my shoe off or putting my foot up. It's such a habit that I barely notice I'm doing it most of the time! And, to sit or lie in ways I have not been, like lying on my left side with no pillow under my left leg, at least until I notice some discomfort. Basically not avoiding discomfort pre-emptively if I'm just doing something normal and relatively neutral.
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What were you expecting? |
Edited by - armchairlinguist on 12/11/2014 08:38:54 |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2014 : 08:40:19
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Alexis, I'm honored that you are dialoguing with me in a thread and not in your bio anymore. I'm happy to be a fool for Sarno 24/7. At 66, I'm happy to be referred to as "juvenile". Where have you been hanging out, at the Mensa site? Honored to have you here even if it's so rarely, you really are much too smart for the Good Doctor's simple theory.
Cheers,
tt/lsmft |
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alexis
USA
596 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2014 : 10:57:31
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quote:
Originally posted by armchairlinguist
Hey, I thought tom's post was okay. He has a style, just like Dave does.
His style is your standard fare passive aggression. He doesn't expect people to be able to answer statements like "Where have you been hanging out, at the Mensa site? Honored to have you here even if it's so rarely, you really are much too smart for the Good Doctor's simple theory." That's why he uses them. "Glad to see you finally got the POINT" is an insult intended to say "You were ignorant and stupid, but even with your slowness you finally understand as much as I do." It's standard pragmatics and he knows what he's doing. Tom also knows full well that he is misrepresenting me as "bashing" Sarno, but he also knows he can get away with it because most people either don't care or don't pay enough attention to anyone else's conversation to know the history. He wants to distract and waste my time and try to maintain this one outlet that validates his ideas about himself. Whatever, it's his turf as no one else is going to bother to spend so much time here.
On more interesting topics, I have a similar struggle with literalism and scientific thought and where to draw the line. I actually often make the error of treating others' beliefs as less literal than they are, because I think they couldn't REALLY believe THAT literally (and they do correct me!). And I know full well the limits of the scientific approach, and as a result those who are generally scientific like myself often seem like extremists to me, even as those who are into chakras etc. seem illogical. And yet I suspect that the me now would look at the me just three years ago and in various areas think the same of myself!
Historically despite knowing the necessary falsehoods and inventions of out realities, I have still broken the world into true and false (at least emotionally). My more recent approach has moved to seeing it all as false (emotionally rather than just intellectually). I'm not sure yet how successful it will be, but so far it is an improvement.
Yeah, I don't get traditional "symbolism" either, which is funny since metaphor in language development is one of my linguistic interests. Isn't metaphor, a necessary part of language and concept development, just a form of symbolism?
I know what you mean about the preemptive precautions. I find after an injury I do that to. On the other hand constantly testing certain injuries isn't great either, so when I have an injury it's a constant sanity check of "am I over-treating this" and I do have to know the data on that specific issue/non-issue because it isn't all the same.
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2014 : 20:21:42
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I guess I swim in a sea of passive aggression, so I just don't notice. It's seriously one of the things that makes me crazy about the local culture...I couldn't figure out drivers here until I realized that they aren't aggressive, but passive-aggressive. Not usually a driving style you hear much about. Unfortunately it infects my workplace as well even though I don't think most people are locals originally (though they may have lived here a while). That was part of what lead to my difficult time at work - people were getting upset with me, but not telling me about it, so I didn't change my behavior, so they got more upset, etc. My manager got stuck "giving me feedback". He's very diplomatic but I'm sure the inner child was not too interested in that. I was pretty mad for a while anyway.
Interestingly today I got a raise and a level up (like going from I to II in a position - not quite a promotion). So things have settled down there.
Today I tried to put my foot on the ground normally when walking or sitting, and I wore my shoe all day even though my foot was doing its low-level burn. I can't really tell if it has made much of a difference. Still trying to convince myself that all these little things can't be doing real damage. That was one place the OT I think was directly helpful. She just seemed really skeptical that aside from my initial trauma and acute recovery, I should have this level of issue with pain. Not skeptical in a bad way, like she thinks I don't, but like she thinks I don't need to. It is kind of a line between over-testing myself and over-protecting. Just trying to do small, normal things if I notice myself doing them anyway seems like a good idea though.
Oh TOM, related to your post above. The OT coded me for "arthralgia" and I noticed your quote from Dave that if it ends in algia it might be TMS. :) (She coded me for insurance purposes. I did notice that nothing she wrote down was an actual injury. I believe it was arthralgia in the ankle, acquired pelvic deformity, abnormality of gait, and something else. Basically: your ankle hurts so you stand and walk funny.)
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Edited by - armchairlinguist on 12/11/2014 20:25:30 |
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alexis
USA
596 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2014 : 07:28:39
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I never thought about passive-agressive driving, but now that you mention it I think I can identify it. Since there are repercussions for true agressive driving and no real way for most people to work things out, I imagine it's more common even than passive aggressive speech (which is so particularly annoying because there are so many better alternatives). The alternative in driving seems really to be to have a broader perspective and understand there are reasons others are doing what they do, but many people will never develop that skill in any context. i will definitely be considering passive vs. passive agressive driving from now on...I think this is something my partner comments on occassionally, but without ever using the term passive-aggressive, so I hadn't thought it through.
Congrats on your raise and level bump! I read about some study or survey recently about reviews and how much everyone hates them and thinks they are relatively useless. One of the specific comments was on how you don't get feedback in a timely manner with a review only once or twice a year...so of course people go months without knowing about people being unhappy. I could imagine how just like in relationships some would wimp out and take the passive aggressive route to handling conflict. It really is the worst to deal with because there's no good way to handle a snidely intoned or phrased "It's fine" ... And you can't even fire people for this type of counterproductive attitude problem because you can't document it well enough for HR. I think the best thing would be for every teenager to learn these passive-aggressive pragmatics as part of high school psychology/social skills, and then we as a culture would be a lot less tolerant of the behavior.
Good luck with the foot. My foot issues (achilles and plantar faciitis) have responded well to stretching exercises and use, though I know there are other issues where this can damage the tendons (as in posterior tibialis ruptures). My achilles was almost certainly TMS aggravated. I picked up some magazine at the dentists office the other day which as part of a chronic pain article covered the "personailty types" associated with chronic pain (the stuff we all know already). It was interesting to see it out there in relatively mainstream media. |
Edited by - alexis on 12/12/2014 07:30:09 |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2014 : 08:03:12
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quote:
Originally posted by alexis
His style is your standard fare passive aggression. He doesn't expect people to be able to answer statements like "Where have you been hanging out, at the Mensa site? Honored to have you here even if it's so rarely, you really are much too smart for the Good Doctor's simple theory." That's why he uses them. "Glad to see you finally got the POINT" is an insult intended to say "You were ignorant and stupid, but even with your slowness you finally understand as much as I do." It's standard pragmatics and he knows what he's doing. Tom also knows full well that he is misrepresenting me as "bashing" Sarno, but he also knows he can get away with it because most people either don't care or don't pay enough attention to anyone else's conversation to know the history. He wants to distract and waste my time and try to maintain this one outlet that validates his ideas about himself. Whatever, it's his turf as no one else is going to bother to spend so much time here.
I must be losing my touch, I meant my tone to be sarcastic, not passive/agrressive--I better take a writing class. Not to but into you'lls thoughts on kali drivers, but I think the best explanation for them is most of them are stoned on medicinal canabis. I drive defensively assuming, everyone on the road is stoned. This will be even more so now that the in-Justice Dept. has legalized the growth of herb on Indian Reservations--well, there goes the Empire...
Cheers,
tt/lsmft
==================================================
"All my friends in Los Angeles are the sensitive type. They all have like all the diseases like Chronic Fatigue, Epstien Barr, Fibromyalgia. Like all the diseases where the only symptoms seem to be you had a really crappy childhood and at the prospect of full time work ya feel kinda achy and tired."
Posted by Skizzik @ TMSHelp from comedian Maria Bamford
"...there are so many things little and big that are tms, I wouldn't have time to write about all of them"
Told to icelikeaninja by Dr. Sarno
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Edited by - tennis tom on 12/12/2014 08:07:06 |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 12/14/2014 : 14:05:10
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Tom, FWIW I find you entertaining, which I take to be your goal most of the time, except occasionally when you are making a serious point about Sarno. :)
I have been doing better the last few days. Mainly what I decided is that I set some thresholds on what I believe cannot damage me. Since currently I don't have unlimited confidence, I am going with what I have. I feel confident that walking ~1/2 mile at a time (up to about 2 mi per day), doing light housework, and biking ~3 miles at a time cannot do damage. Also sitting down with my feet on the floor, standing for 5-10 minutes, and miscellaneous small things.
This is basically, not pushing myself, and working to believe that these things (which I have often done without pain, but don't always do without pain) are consistently within my capacity. I sometimes do more but am not trying to unless I feel like it.
I expect if this is successful that I will keep expanding these limits til my limits are what a normal limit for someone in decent health would be (walk up to 5 mi per day, stand for an hour, bike 15 mi, for example), then perhaps work on getting in shape further.
One challenge for me is that the muscles and fascia in the left ankle are tight, and can cause some pain when trying to use them normally, if they're in the tight state. Tight doesn't indicate a pathology - it's consistent with TMS - but it does make it harder to use and move normally. So for the time being I am continuing to get some physically-oriented therapy on that. This is not consistent with Sarno, but it helps me feel better and be more confident that my tissues are ready to use fully. I am working to reframe it as assistance in helping get full use of basically healthy tissue and hope to be able to taper it off in the new year.
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Oh, back again, back again.
