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yogaluz
USA
81 Posts |
 Posted - 09/16/2012 : 17:50:53
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Hi All, I actually posted this on MichaelB's thread about his wife's dizzy spell and trip to the ER and realized this should be it's own conversation:
"My 15 year old daughter had a similar spell this last Monday. She was as white as a sheet, 'gibberish of mouth' as you call it, telling me she couldn't hear and then almost fell. I took her to the ER but they didn't do any head scans because she'd complained of an intense pain in her abdomen (which disappeared at the hospital) so they thought she had nearly passed out from the pain and that the cognitive abnormalities were just a result of temporary lack of oxygen to the brain (being shocky). All that day and the next she was extremely tired and lethargic - could barely lift her arm above her head, so I took her to her regular doc who tested her for mono (negative) and then told us to go home. She suspects it was a viral infection. It wasn't. My daughter didn't have a fever, runny nose, cough, sore throat, or anything of the like.
Interestingly, my daughter just entered therapy the week before to help her deal with some eating issues (which are of course emotional issues) amongst others and after her first therapy session, she told me how hard it was for her to bring up her emotions and she wasn't sure she could do it, it was so uncomfortable. And then bam, this 'medical' thing happened. I suspected TMS (she certainly has all the Type T attributes and comes by it honestly) but my mind couldn't wrap itself around something that extreme being just TMS. Now reading this and thinking more deeply about the therapy connection, I'm starting to believe that's exactly what it was.
How on earth does one get a 15 year old to accept something like TMS theory when she can't even look honestly at many of the issues she's dealing with (overeating, losing friendships etc.)? She is in full denial about a lot of things, such as her weight and how she got to that weight, so how can I help guide her to thinking psychologically? I did speak to my daughter's therapist about what was happening with her as my daughter had to miss an appointment (light bulb going on) and she asked if we thought it could be emotionally induced so it's good the therapist is on board with that line of thinking.
Have any of you had to help a young family member come to terms with having TMS? If so, how did you handle it?"
Bugbear also posted on that thread:
"I don't want to hijack MichaelB's thread which is very interesting. However in answer to your question, Yogaluz, I have a 20 yr old daughter with various physical and mental health complaints who refuses to see a therapist because she doesn't want to talk about her emotions. She would rather repress them. I took her to a homeopath recently to see if I could get her to at least accept the connections between her emotions and her illnesses. Perhaps this needs another thread."
Thanks for your comments....
pain is inevitable, suffering optional |
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Bugbear
United Kingdom
152 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2012 : 23:53:32
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| I will reply to this, possibly after work if I get a chance. |
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Bugbear
United Kingdom
152 Posts |
Posted - 09/18/2012 : 16:57:40
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"How on earth does one get a 15 year old to accept something like TMS theory when she can't even look honestly at many of the issues she's dealing with (overeating, losing friendships etc.)?"
It's hard enough for a majority of adults to accept TMS, let alone a 15 year old with her hormones all over the place, peer and school pressure. Hopefully the therapist will work with your daughter to gain a greater understanding of her emotional issues. Your own experiences and successes may help her to take the next leap in accepting the link between her emotions and her physical symptoms.
My own daughter does have a type T personality and it is no wonder she has eating issues (undereating, bulimia), depression, anxiety, poor immune system. As I mentioned she does not wish to discuss her problems with any professional. She wants to forget unpleasant events and pretend like they never happened. She has been bullied at two schools. Now she is at university and living independently from me which will bring her new stresses and tension. I can't see her accepting the concept of mind body disorders any time soon. Maybe someday though.
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Edited by - Bugbear on 09/18/2012 17:06:30 |
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yogaluz
USA
81 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2012 : 08:40:48
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Having your daughter be out on her own and knowing she's not dealing effectively with her issues must be so worrisome. It's one thing to suffer from TMS ourselves and quite another to see our children heading down the same road. Heartbreaking for me. Still, I try to remember the gifts this 'condition' has brought into my life - the knowledge I've gained about myself, my past... even the general understanding of just how strong and resilient we T types are. And fortunately our kids have us to help guide them when/if they're ready to explore their issues.
pain is inevitable, suffering optional |
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SteveO
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2012 : 11:17:22
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The younger the person is the more intense their anxiety. I'm often amazed when people can't understand that babies suffer the worst from panic. Babies have extreme emotional separation anxiety when they can't hear mother, or they're not being held for comfort. They need constantly touched and held to ease their worry. But time and time again people say, "oh, what could a baby know about TMS conflict?" They know plenty, and the separation anxiety begins with birth. It is a cradle to grave phenomenon.
Teenagers carry that life-burden into adulthood. I've never spoken to any of the TMS docs about teenage TMS-understanding. I've been watching my own demographic for my book and it's 20-75 yos. Even though TMS carries from birth to death, the people who seem to care about TMS are between 20 and mid 70s. Before 20 there is just too much life being thrown at them to have time to reflect on life, and not really enough life to reflect on. After 75 they seem to be saying, "I lived with this 60 years, what's another few years?"
Even the 20 year old I met who had severe TMS back pain couldn't really focus on its cause. He seemed too preoccupied with life to be able to grasp the concept. So the youngest I've seen who could understand it and who has focused on healing is 23. But that's only what I've seen, I'm sure the clinicians have seen younger.
My kids, like all kids, have had TMS bouts. But they haven't lasted because I taught them about TMS when they were pre-teen and early teens. They weren't able to understand the psyche and unconscious behavior at that time but they did understand symptoms and emotions, and not to panic. Now, as adults, they fully understand and accept their symptoms as TMS. They are both Type T and highly aware of the space around them.
I think it's wise for all parents to begin educating their children on TMS, very early. And by that I mean to begin putting them in touch with their emotions sooner. We are taught in modern societies to repress our shame early on, and that's why we have epidemic proportions of health problems. If you get to your children sooner they will have less health problems. But the main problem is the parents are just beginning to figure out their own lives at midlife, as their children are growing. And also that the children are part of the parents' TMS, and the yin chases the yang...
The work can be done, however. It begins with knowledge, not information.
Steve |
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yogaluz
USA
81 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2012 : 20:59:46
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Steve, you're spot on. They're still entering life as it were - so much thrown at them during those years that it's hard to have that inward look. I have spoken with my daughter about TMS in very simplistic terms and she has no problem with the concept, just with accepting her own mind/body issues. This is one of the reasons I'm having her see a therapist.. for her to hear another voice outside the family dynamic, which I believe can be a great source of shame, even if parents aren't purposely shaming.
For example, my daughter is overweight and so when she reaches for something to snack on right before dinner, I ask her to please wait, dinner is almost ready. While this is a perfectly reasonable request of a child without an eating disorder, to my daughter, this is an indictment - a reminder that I'm trying to control what is so out of control in her. It's an odd dance we have in our household.... steering her towards health while shining a light on her 'problems' and impacting her self esteem. Sometimes I hold my tongue to preserve one and other times I speak out to preserve the other.
These well intended actions and words from parents can have deleterious effects on children and yet, we can't walk around in fear of the impact of every word and deed. If we show concern and love while gently steering them clear of danger.. well, what more can we strive for as parents? Like you mentioned Steve, communicating openly with them about some of the more complex, deeper issues will eventually serve our children, even when they're in denial or lack clarity at this stage of life.
pain is inevitable, suffering optional |
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SteveO
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2012 : 14:04:34
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Very nicely said yogaluz, I'm virtually applauding you now.
You are spot on in everything you wrote. I'm glad this thread was started, after so many years of explaining TMS it gets old. So I focused my research on "why" TMS is, and not primarily "what" TMS is. I wanted to know why, Dr. Sarno had already showed what it was. The "why" TMS is took me back to childhood/birth, and separation panic/anger/anxiety---rejection and ego. The essence of this effect begins to manifest when we are first shamed, or more precisely, when we first become aware that others are observing us; then guilt invades and permeates our lives, with TMS available as a tool for self-punishment against thoughts of pleasure.
This is why ego is so heavily involved in pain, and in denying TMS as true within themselves. Ego shields full consciousness as the person suddenly becomes an individual--separate from the whole.
That "odd dance" you mentioned is why I put the balance symbol on my book cover. It is the essence of life. But to what end?
I also wrote about the discernment of dukkha. When we do one thing it gives rise to something else. From the arising of this, comes the arising of that, when this isn't that isn't. It has been labeled as karma, and Isaac Newton proved scientifically that an action causes an equal and opposite reaction.
So trying to be a good parent will certainly have an opposite reaction at some level. Dr. Sarno had called this "subtle abuse" by the parents, as the well-meaning parents also do harm, sometimes more harm. I was fortunate, my editor was an MD, one of the fathers of the worldwide Wellness Movement. He showed me early on how praise can damage a child. There must be balance, but to what end? When is right, right, and wrong, wrong? As the long lost Wavvy has confirmed, the answer is love, no matter what the question.
I also wrote about Oprah Winfrey and her binge eating and how her trainer got her to stop running to the fridge when she needed food as her TMS anxiety soother. As soon as she stopped doing that she began to have back pain and headaches and muscle spasms. The symptom imperative is a predator when there is underlying conflict.
The last paragraph of your last post here was well stated. You can only do what you do for love, guided by your own template of experience. As I wrote in my book, all parents, including myself, damage their children in some way. You can only hope the end game or end result, is the happiness of the child. That's why I stated that the goal is happiness in life. There will be pain in life, it is unavoidable, and yet we can't know happiness unless we are in touch with pain... and the yin chases the yang...
You give the child framework, then you sit back with white knuckles and TMS and you watch them fail and succeed, finding their own path. This is life. And it's beautiful.
Happiness
Steve
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km118
USA
15 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2012 : 19:32:51
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Hi yogalulz, I hope I can offer you a different perspective. I'm a 17 year old female and it sounds like your daughter and I have dealt with very similar situations. I've been through overeating, bulimia, loss of extremely close friendships, and complete loss of self esteem. By the sounds of it, your daughter has a hard time opening up, as do I.
My TMS symptoms are chronic, as I have pain throughout my leg and buttocks and have for the past 4-5 years. It has only gotten chronic and sever the past year or so. I went through the ringer with doctors, physical therapists, neurologists, etc. No one could help me. I was basically feeling completely helpless and had serious bouts of depression and self loathing due to my circumstances.
I came across TMS myself in a pain forum, and didn't accept it. About 6 months later I came back to it and here I am now. I'm completely aware of TMS and it's impact on my body and life. So my advice for you is this; don't push anything on her. It must be hard to watch someone suffer when you know they don't have to, but getting over TMS can NEVER be successful if you don't truly believe you have it. She has to come to terms with it by herself.I would suggest possibly leaving a Sarno book in her room, or lightly suggesting it. Plant the idea and step away from it. If TMS was forced on me, I never would've accepted.
Also, she is in a vulnerable place in her life right now and TMS can be very embarrassing for her(it is for me sometimes). I can't really talk to friends about it because they don't understand, so just be patient with her. It sounds like she has a lot going on, and I can most definitely relate, it's almost scary how much this reminds me of myself! = So my advice to you is to stay supportive, gently approach the idea of TMS, and just help her stay educated about it. She will hit a wall and realize TMS is her issue. That's what happened to me at least, I lost all hope in everything and then looked into TMS and realized it was there all along. You have to go through the ringer to truly believe you have TMS, especially at such a vulnerable age. I hope this helped, just wanted to give the perspective of someone who's right there with her! Good luck to her and you, I hope for the best! |
Edited by - km118 on 09/20/2012 19:35:44 |
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Bugbear
United Kingdom
152 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2012 : 11:25:42
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quote:
Originally posted by yogaluz
These well intended actions and words from parents can have deleterious effects on children and yet, we can't walk around in fear of the impact of every word and deed. If we show concern and love while gently steering them clear of danger.. well, what more can we strive for as parents?
Wise words so eloquently phrased.
Speaking of wise, km118, you sound wise beyond your years. It is so true, many of us, not just teens, have to hit the wall before we can step back and seek another way through it.
I would love to give my daughter a book for her to absorb but realistically she isn't a great reader and would be unlikely to get through a book like SteveO's or one by Sarno.
I just spoke with her and she is ill once again, this time it's throat and ear pain. One good thing came out of her trip to the homeopath. She, the practitioner, convinced daughter to wean off the strong anti-depressant drug she had been prescribed only 6 weeks earlier (unbeknownst to me). She told my daughter her symptoms were definitely caused by her emotional issues. I wanted her to hear this from someone else apart from me because I am just a mother. What do I know? 
As you say, we can't push anything onto a young person but if they hear things enough times from different sources, they may come round in their own time. Here's hoping.
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Teens and TMS
