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Baseball65
USA
734 Posts |
 Posted - 11/03/2009 : 09:00:31
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Do any of you 'lifers' get a bit irked when you see someone sort of using the Mind/Body idea's, but than gluing on a 'physical' remedy?
I was in a book store. I saw a book about 'healing your back pain...the mind-body solution' or something like that. I thought "Oh cool...other Drs. are finally getting hip to the reality of the source."
Than I skimmed it, and though it seemed to focus on all the correct factors (anger, stress, anxiety) BUT the book was Chock full of diagrams and exercises and 'physical' stuff to remedy the situation.
I think back to how OCD I was at the beginning of my recovery, and knowing myself, I probably would have thought something like "I'm not doing this perfectly, that's why I'm not recovering" at the sign of the first set back.
Just as Sarno explains his evolution of technique (dropping the PT to go 'pure'), I sometimes see an analogy with AA. Many Alcoholics had recovered via spiritual means before AA was written,but there was still no cohesive logic or burning urgency, as most people still viewed it as a moral and ethical issue.
However, when Dr. William Silkworth wrote "The Doctors Opinion" first citing it as a fatal illness, it gave the readers a LOT more motivation to explore the spiritual realm (Grow spiritually or DIE) the numbers of recoveries skyrocketed.
But...than other 'professionals' started throwing in their 2 cents, diluted the power of the message, and now modern AA is an amalgam of personal growth,psychology,Anti-depressant use and rote dogma...I think Stanton Peele researched it and said the recovery rate these days is about 3%...nothing like 50% plus from the late 30's.
Likewise, Sarno made the distinction that the problem arises out of the brain, and any physical or structural idea must be dropped....that was the 'keystone' in my personal recovery. I wonder if the slow dilution of the concept might hinder other recoveries, seeing as perfectionism is one of the causes and none of us can ever be perfect.
Maybe I was irked for nothing...maybe it's a good thing that they are even beginning to acknowledge the psychological factor at all, but turning my attention away from the physical was an integral part of my recovery. I still cringe and turn away from charts, diagrams and injury reports on the sports ticker. I never stretch or warm up before I play sports, I never lift things 'correctly' and I am a Manual laborer. Whenever something twinges,stiffens,throbs I think "Ok...what's bugging me...or NOT bugging me"
Just food for thought. |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2009 : 14:22:17
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yeah, I often said how come the book was enough for me the first time around. I never really essayed or whatever.
Then the relapse, and I went bonkers and read and wrote everything out there. If there was a protocol to recovery, I'd have found it. The perfectionism of having the perfect recovery put me on the one way ticket bullet train to severe chronic pain.
As I eased up, so did the pain.
What I gotta do to get rid of the rest? Well, that pattern of thinking is what keeps it there to a degree. I don't think theres a way to change that. Just good ole fasion time, and more time. |
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la_kevin
USA
351 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 18:07:24
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Before I came to the TMS idea, I was involved with an online physical fitness 'trainer'. He stressed stretching, 'muscle balance' and the like. He now admits that many chronic back pain sufferers might have an emotional component (TMS) but he prescribes stretching as his main gig in his courses.
It's illogical.
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"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans"- John Lennon |
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MatthewNJ
USA
691 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2009 : 20:02:22
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i don't believe we are having a slow dilution of anything. I think we are having more and more amazing folks log on and share great ideas. Use the one that works for you.
I was OCD too, but not what is diagnosed as "full blown" ocd, I was a mild case. Were you a diagnosed "classic" OCD, or like me with more than subtle OCD tendancies? Just curious. I saw one of the foremost OCD specialists in the country (OCDONLINE Dr. Phillipson NYC) and he called my condition "baby ocd". He felt I was really mild. Needless to say my wife wouldn't agree with that. Also OCD is another form of perfectionism gone a little wacky in my mind. I forget what drug I took for it (this was before my TMS Journey started), but when i went off the drug, I found I had much better control of the OCD without the drug. OCD responds extremely favorably to CBT (very NOT in TMS vogue).
Eckert Tolle, Michael Brown, Jon Kabat-Zinn, Dr, Sarno to name just a few are ALL SAYING THE SAME THING. Read between the lines. They just have different approaches. What it comes down to (and I think most are in agreement with this) is our psycological "side" affects or physical "side". Parenthesis use to indicate a concept, as we all know the mindbody are one.
As far as relapse are concerned, I think that is because we feel better and then forget about that pain (I mean like who wants to remember pain) and then are not proactive about preventing it (thank your unconcious there). Now that I am proactive about mindfulness and being in the moment with my somatic experience and meditating I NEVER intend to have a relapse again.
And I have hugh things affecting (stressing)me: My mom is not well, my marriage is a mess, my wife just got laid off (again - second time in 2 years) and I have a 13 yo daughter in 7th grade and a very stressful job (on call 24/7). I mean just shoot me now. BUT, I have minimum symptoms. My stress was MUCH less 1 1/2 years ago and I was on a 75 MG fentinyl patch for pain of 10 on a scale of 10 while I worked with my counselor to find the real issues. WE succeeded .
Matthew
Ferretsx3@comcast.net
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The difficult we do right away, the impossible just takes a little longer. |
Edited by - MatthewNJ on 11/04/2009 20:07:26 |
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golden_girl
United Kingdom
128 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2009 : 17:48:42
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I had "OCD" MatthewNJ, and it was horrendous. I feared almost everything, I was paranoid and thought even my mother was trying to kill me. CBT did little to nothing to help me, and I never took any pharmaceuticals. I then developed a physical symptom (TMS) which took my mind off everything OCD.
I'm slowly, but surely, learning that the only thing I "suffer" from is fear, and all of its bizarre manifestations. Roosevelt was right.
"F.E.A.R.
Forgive Everyone And Remember
For Everything A Reason"
Ian Brown |
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2009 : 08:23:17
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To play devil's advocate, I would remind you that for better or worse, the majority of patients with stress-related illness are not willing to accept that as a diagnosis; some people may be willing to buy that stress plays a role, but not that it is the sole cause. I can't tell you how many people say to me: "so you just want me to read a book?" They do not feel that is a treatment, or that their issues are being taken seriously. For some of these people, having some physical aspect may make a treatment feel more "real". Another argument would be that for many people certain physical modalities may help with stress/relaxation, such as acupuncture, massage, etc.
Trying to be a TMS "purist" will get you nowhere with most people, so having some flexibility may make it more likely that you can provide help to a greater number of folks. Trust me: it doesn't matter how correct the Sarno method is, if people aren't willing to buy it! |
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Hillbilly
USA
385 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2009 : 09:31:49
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quote:
Trying to be a TMS "purist" will get you nowhere with most people, so having some flexibility may make it more likely that you can provide help to a greater number of folks. Trust me: it doesn't matter how correct the Sarno method is, if people aren't willing to buy it!
Amen, amen, and a-men. It isn't necessarily the movement or exercise that brings on the benefits, so much as it is the framework of movement with a guiding hand that relaxes the person enough to begin to do things that were otherwise banished due to fear of worsening pain. Dr. Sarno wrote in his first book that any intervention that helped the patient break through the fear could be curative, then he went completely against that statement in his subsequent books. Despite this move toward absolutism and pre-screening patients to gauge their openness to his theories, his treatment outcomes did not improve, but rather, worsened.
I hate quotations. Tell me what you know.
Ralph Waldo Emerson |
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Plantweed
USA
109 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2009 : 14:21:52
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| Yeah, when I started yoga, I approached it not as a physical cure, but as a challenge to my fears. I was scared to do basic bending and stretching in everyday life, so I figured I would decondition myself by putting my body through extreme bending and stretching. So far, it's working, I'm on an upswing. I also like the mind/body aspect of it, it dovetails nicely. |
Edited by - Plantweed on 11/16/2009 14:22:14 |
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marytabby
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2009 : 06:45:38
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Baseball,
You were the person in 2005 who first helped me with my TMS when I found this site and started reading the Sarno books. You were instrumental in helping me to understand the concepts and you encouraged me all the way assuring me that all the tricks my mind was playing was causing the TMS. I agree with you, people have a "quasi-acceptance" of the TMS concepts yet they still maintain that old "but I know that I injured myself three winters ago when I pushed myself shoveling too hard." And they continue to seek therapies that Sarno specifically admonishes against. I did what you said to do, I threw away all the devices, stopped all the therapies and took a long, hard look at my patterns in my life and my emotional tendencies and now, 4 years later I can honestly say I am pretty much pain free. I now know exactly the onset of some occasional neck stiffness when I'm upset or worried and I do not panic as much as I used to when it comes on, because I can always attribute it to what's going on in my job, personal life at that moment.
Mary in Boston |
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Maybe it's just me but.....?
