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Bobbypols
Canada
46 Posts |
 Posted - 12/11/2008 : 12:00:10
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Well as my story goes - age:28 - diagnosed with DDD, spinal stenosis, arthitis, 4 bulgding discs, 2 disc protusions, facet hypertropy etc. Dealing with pain for about 1.5 years. 1 year ago the pain spread to the knees and then settle in the left one. Been around and back with traditional medicine. Got turned onto the dr. sarno about one 1 week ago and pain is 90% gone, with some lingering in the left knee. I returned to weight lifting (ever so slightly for fear of relapse). So as you can tell im a big proponent of TMS.
My question is this: Dr. Sarno says that ulcerative colitis is the most extreme case of TMS...has anyone had success with this condition through a tms approach? It is for a friend, but to be honest I really cant tell whether or not it will work for a number reasons? From my search, I see that people are 50/50 about whether or not ulcertive colitis is tms. He is on a few drugs right now and i can tell as the years go by they are taking their toll... |
Edited by - Bobbypols on 12/11/2008 12:02:38 |
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stanfr
USA
268 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 13:17:33
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| I dont know whether its a TMS equivalent or not, but i dont see how it would hurt to explore the possibility, particularly if drugs arent helping any. |
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mk6283
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 17:42:39
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UC is NOT TMS or a TMS equivalent. Emotional factors can definitely be involved in exacerbations, but that's really a separate issue.
I don't think Dr. Sarno ever said that either.
Best,
MK |
Edited by - mk6283 on 12/11/2008 17:44:25 |
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fadoozle
33 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 17:55:58
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Just wanted to put out there this excerpt from The MBP (p. 33):
Physician psychoanalysts have been the only group to retain an interest in and continue to write on the subject, but their scope is limited, since they see only the most severe examples of mind-body disorders, like ulcerative colitis.
It seems like this is not a direct TMS equivalent but on the spectrum of mindbody disorders such as the others he explores in the book.
As someone who has had UC for almost 20 years, I can testify to flare-ups being 100% related to stress levels, repressed emotions, etc. It may not be TMS but it's pretty darn close in my view.
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mk6283
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 20:48:23
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I see no utility in calling something TMS or a TMS equivalent if it cannot be succesfully treated as such. Patients with ulcerative colitis still need to continue taking their medications. They still need to continue to get screening colonoscopies. They still need to continue to follow up up with their GI doctor. Ulcerative colitis cannot be CURED via a mindbody approach (that is the key point). Of course, I agree that psychological factors are important in disease progression and addressing them is definitely beneficial, as it is for nearly every medical condition. Diagnosing something as "TMS" implies it is an entity curable without medication and/or surgery. That is usually not the case with UC.
Best,
MK |
Edited by - mk6283 on 12/11/2008 20:52:06 |
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Bobbypols
Canada
46 Posts |
Posted - 12/11/2008 : 23:27:00
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Thanks Crew - unfortunate but you guys maybe right. Thanks fadoozle, as your input seems to be most prevalent, as with all responses they are welcomed.
Thank you. |
Edited by - Bobbypols on 12/11/2008 23:28:28 |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2008 : 06:49:21
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There are so many conditions that are being recognized as stress-related (or emotionally-caused) so why can't UC be a mind/body condition too? I don't get hung up on whether to call it TMS or its equivalent.
Bobbypols, since you are asking for a friend, keep in mind we cannot make anyone else see or believe that their emotions are likely playing a role in their condition. I've tried and it has left both of us frustrated. We have to know when to put the possibility out there, and when, though painful it can be to watch, to let them explore on their own.
Best wishes. |
Edited by - mizlorinj on 12/12/2008 07:24:38 |
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Bobbypols
Canada
46 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2008 : 08:13:51
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Excellent post and very true. You hope that you can point friends in the right direction and away they go, but that doesnt often happen does it?
Fadoolze - can you elaborate on your experience with Dr. Sarno's ideologies and their response to your UC?
Thanks. |
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hottm8oh
USA
141 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2008 : 08:16:04
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There are many "real" conditions that are aggravated by stress or negative emotions. I don't think that means they are caused by TMS or are TMS equivalents. I think it's just another example of how the mind can aggravate an already existing condition.
One of the hallmarks of TMS is that there is no physical evidence of the pain. For example, patients with chronic pain or IBS have no structural or chemical abnormalities in their bones, backs, joints, or digestive systems. Inflammtory bowel diseases are diagnosed by blood tests and intestinal biopsies. There is physical evidence to diagnose IBD.
I have heard that the Specific Carbohydrate Diet is very helpful for patients with IBD. It's a tough diet to stick to, but there are a lot of patient testimonials swearing by this diet. Look up an author named Elaine Gottschalk. There are also several cookbooks on the market for SCD diets. |
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fadoozle
33 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2008 : 11:24:42
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Thanks for this interesting thread, Bobbypols. I agree with what people have said about UC involving a structural abnormality, e.g. ulcers in the colon. But to me this is similar to what Dr. Sarno has said about stomach ulcers. In my case UC seems to run in my family, and I know that I have to be responsible about colonoscopies, etc. It's not the same as a herniated disc or whatever in that sense.
However, in my long experience with the disease, I can almost always directly tie flare-ups to stressful life circumstances and repressed emotions along the lines of what Sarno says about TMS. And lately, now that I am dealing with acid reflux for the first time, the colitis has almost completed calmed down. So for me it's a fuzzy line, I guess. I am trying not to get too hung up about whether something is definitely TMS or not, because the underlying approach to TMS can also benefit other conditions in my experience.
I have experimented with that SCD diet but never had much luck. I have never really bought into flares being related to diet because in remission I always have eaten and drunk whatever I wanted without a problem. I think that a lot of gastrointestinal stuff is quite mysterious, and that the mind-body connection affects a lot of these ailments.
I would certainly not advocate people not following their doctor's advice when it comes to UC. But I can also say that the medication has sometimes worked for me, sometimes not. A lot of it seems tied to where I am in life at the time of the flare.
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2008 : 12:30:57
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Regarding things being diagnosable: there are many conditions that are diagnosable that are TMS or its equivalent. Herniated discs are very common, easy to spot, and always blamed for back pain. Many of those diagnosed with TMS whom I met while working w/ Dr. Sarno had diagnosable ailments. On the other hand, some had ailments that were a mystery to doctors and had no medical name.
While a healthy diet is always good, moreso important are balanced emotions so we can assimilate what we are eating in the way most beneficial to our bodies.
Fadoozle: you are having very enlightening experiences with your pain and its causes. Good for you!! It's great you can see parallels with things in your life. |
Edited by - mizlorinj on 12/12/2008 12:36:41 |
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scd1833
USA
124 Posts |
Posted - 01/08/2009 : 20:40:20
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IBD's are REAL organic diseases, involving infection and changes in tissue, but I strongly believe that there is a strong emotional component to the diseases also... in many ways they are very similar to tms syndromes...IE: the cause of these afflictions are mysterious and the cures are equally mostly hit or miss... also when my back pain was at it's worst(acute) about 15 or 20 years ago, that summer I had virtually no chron's symptoms, the back pain literally took over my life and there was no need for the chron's(seemingly)
I am on scd and it is very difficult to maintain. everything has to be made from scratch, I rarely eat in restraunts, it's very restrictive, but it works for me... though it took me literally months and years, really to implement the diet correctly. I don't take any medication at this point except for an over the counter probiotic(Digestive Advantage Chron's and Colitis formula) but really for most of my life I always avoided taking any medications and to use diet restrictions (vegetarianism, health food) to manage my condition. the SCD has really had the most effect of anything i've used, but I'm kind of stuck on an even MORE restrictive version of the diet, and I would like to get to the root cause of the disease(the emotional sphere) |
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Hi everyone, new here a question and a thought
