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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
 Posted - 09/29/2008 : 10:55:53
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I did'nt want to hijak his tread from the 25Th and seem negative towards it because I could be wrong. After all, I'm in pain, he isn't, so I cant argue w/ his method.
I'm wondering has anyone had success using his stuff?
I bought his book last year and gave the meditations and thought swapping everything I had for a long time.
His writing seems so good, and he seems to have a grasp on it all. But now I just feel his writings leave me stressed because it gives the impression I'm doing something wrong. As if I'm at fault for being in pain because I simply keep losing focus according to his way.
I'm all for "do what works for you", and maybe it's not my ticket, but is anyone out there who's been susscessful w/ it? |
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altherunner
Canada
511 Posts |
Posted - 10/02/2008 : 21:35:30
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| I read his book and bought some of his cds and had success with them. I was already a convert to Sarno and well on my way to recovery. I found his work insightful.Literally, IN-sight full. Looking into your true self for answers and an end to pain, not to any exterior source. I was also reading Eckhart Tolle's books at the same time, and the two authors resonated with the same message. |
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Monte
USA
125 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 09:02:07
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Skizzik and Al -- thanks for your comments.
Skizzik, realize that I learned about tms from Sarno and believe 100% in his diagnosis....Reading Healing Back Pain 7 years ago was the beginning of my "end of pain".
what I found though was that not all of my pain went away. I still had piriformis even though it was caused by tms. Why? my back pain and stiffness and soreness left why not the piriformis. I kept reading Sarno, believed 100% what was going on, stopped all physical treatments, and I was thinking psychologically...But still in piriformis pain.
So I took the route of--"what does think psychologically really mean"? If we are strivers and controllers and we worry and try to please and be perfect and are very self-conscious --how is that part of tms? All of these personality traits have "our specific thought patterns" woven into them...meaning we all say certain things to ourself over and over in a chronic way--these chronic thoughts are building our inner stress, tension and anxiety and causing our system to go into oxygen deprivation ---Sarno is exactly right!
So when Sarno says you need to think psychologically what he really means is you need to know what you are thinking when you are in one of your Type A personality traits.....what I am telling you is that you also need to Change these chronic thoughts.
I have consulted with 100's of Sarno patients...they got out of pain after reading his book by shifting away from the body and understanding that it was not an injury but a psychological issue....But now after 1 year or 5 years these people are back in Pain. Why? They never have changed their chronic thought patters. IF you are a worrier or a controller or a people pleaser and that is causing your inner stress and then pain...and you never change -- eventually your pain is going to come back.
So "my stuff" is simply expanding on Sarno's think psychologically...and it is reinforced to me every day that it is necessary because every day I speak with someone that has read Sarno and just like me they got rid of some of their pain but not all of it or it is back and they cannot get rid of it. And they admit that they have never changed their dominant chronic thouht patterns...that is always the underlying truth/fact that comes out of these conversations.
Each one of us has to take full responsibility for the creation of this disorder in our life....and yes I deliberately want each person to know that only they can fix this...just reading a book or listenning to a tape is not going to end your pain. Finding that one big huge emotional issue from your childhood is not going to end your pain.
You have to do your inner work --that is the cause right? we all agree to that--it is psychological--it is your thoughts mixed with your personalilty mixed with your feelings..and this is all energy....energy that gets stuck.
Reading a book can help you, listening to a tape can help you, a conversation with me can help you....but at the end of the day each of us has to do our inner work...that is my message and it is not different than sarno or schechter or any of the tms docs.
We all need to stop searching for "how am I going to end my pain"...we know that answer...."change the cause". When we are searching--in books, message boards, new docs, new treatments, etc.--we are in this pain strategy and we are stuck and it is not going to go away...
Until we do our Inner work.
Monte Hueftle
http://www.runningpain.com
monte@runningpain.com |
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 11:16:57
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Monte- what kind of pain did you have that you got rid of?
Skizzik- I have not read Monte's book, so I don't know.
I see you went to Dr. Schubiner md, I was thinking of going to
see him, I don't know. I guess I would like a tms doctor to tell
me yes its tms, instead of me dx. myself.
I don't know the answere either. |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 11:48:56
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Luv2Sew: though I enjoyed hearing Dr. Sarno say "young lady, you have TMS", you can see that some on this Board got the TMS diagnosis from a doc and are still struggling. So it is not the heal-all for everyone--being told by a TMS doc. Truthfully though, I am glad I got to hear those words and I fully believed them.
Others in this thread: I agree that a change in mindset is required for full and true healing. Thinking you have a little TMS will heal you a little. Thinking some of what you has is TMS will heal you some. Belief it is all TMS (especially when a doc has told you so or they've found nothing "wrong" with you!), and doing the work to change your beliefs and clear out emotional trash, will heal all of it.
I was listening to Louise Hay the other day and heard her ask where do our beliefs about [whatever it was] come from? Are they the beliefs our parents or others in authority had? Do we feel deserving of health and happiness? If not, why not? We can change our beliefs. A repeated thought becomes a belief. I know I've said that sentence a lot lately. It is true!
"I'm not getting better" repeated over and over becomes your belief! dangerous stuff!
I'm not perfect, and get an occasional headache or other type of issue. I had an eye thing the other day and when I gave it some thought, realized I didn't want to SEE SOMEONE I had to deal with that day. I had to adjust my attitude to make it ok.
WE CAN DO THIS!! IT IS SO WORTH IT!!
-Lori |
Edited by - mizlorinj on 10/03/2008 11:54:37 |
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 12:14:42
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Lori- thanks, yes thats why I haven't gone to see him yet as what can he do except tell me its tms, I do have the neck and back mri's that shows quite a bit of stuff, wish I never had them done. So even if he did say TMS I still need to do the work and even he can't help me unless I help myself, so why bother going really.
Did you find help from Louise Hay.
I agree with the saying "You become your thoughts".
I'm glad your feeling better, it sure helps me when I read about other people in so much pain and that they have been helped.
My husband works in construction and he comes home with aches and pains and hes able to shrug them off and go back to work the next day, wish I could do that.
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 13:59:35
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LuvtoSew, I have found Louise's books excellent and upbuilding. You can't go anywhere but up listening to or reading her stuff. I'd say it's: learning to be empowered. Taking back our power. Despite all that's around you. She says WE CHOOSE EVERY THOUGHT WE THINK. I love that!!
I listen to her I Can Do It cd in the car regularly and pick up something different each time from it. The topic I mention above really caught my attention this time around, yet I've heard the cd many times! LOL
You Can Heal Your Life is one of the best books out there. It talks a lot about thoughts become beliefs. The Secret has a similar theme I think. and The Power of Positive Thinking--which puts a spiritual component in the mix moreso than the other 2 above. I love that book too.
-Lori
Skizzy, sorry for hijacking your thread!  |
Edited by - mizlorinj on 10/03/2008 14:56:08 |
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 15:04:19
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I know I have heard a lot of people like Louise Hay, I have a hard time getting past some of the things I read in reviews at Amazon tho such as "we pick our parents".
I am going to download the Power of Positive Thinking one tho.
Hey I read your story, and what a success story.
I see you read the book Your Body is Talking by DR. Martin, that one looked good also. |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2008 : 19:42:14
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Luv: yeah, a lot of ppl comment on that particular aspect--we choose our parents. I have found so many good things in her books that I think something like that can be looked past with "well, ya know, I just don't know about that" or "don't agree with that particular idea." It's minor in a lot of very helpful, healing and wonderful words!
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Edited by - mizlorinj on 10/03/2008 19:56:17 |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2008 : 08:39:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Monte
I have consulted with 100's of Sarno patients...they got out of pain after reading his book by shifting away from the body and understanding that it was not an injury but a psychological issue....But now after 1 year or 5 years these people are back in Pain. Why? They never have changed their chronic thought patters.
After doing "your stuff" (meditations, thought swapping) are any of the people you consulted out of pain now?
quote:
Originally posted by Monte
IF you are a worrier or a controller or a people pleaser and that is causing your inner stress and then pain...and you never change -- eventually your pain is going to come back.
So you can change your personality? Sarno says you can't.
quote:
Originally posted by Monte
You have to do your inner work --that is the cause right? we all agree to that--it is psychological--it is your thoughts mixed with your personalilty mixed with your feelings..and this is all energy....energy that gets stuck.
So is it stuck energy causing the pain? Or distraction theory?
quote:
Originally posted by Monte
We all need to stop searching for "how am I going to end my pain"...we know that answer...."change the cause". When we are searching--in books, message boards, new docs, new treatments, etc.--we are in this pain strategy and we are stuck and it is not going to go away...
I recall your blog stating how you got rid of achillies tendonitis thru massage and icing for a while several times a day. And that you knew the difference between a real injury and tms, and you said if people w/ tms would simply commit several times a day to doing "your stuff" for a while they to would see results. I did this, w/ little kids, annoyed wife demanding hours at work etc...I still made time to do the meditations, thought swapping, "inner work", I would tell my wife I was going into another room w/ ear plugs and spent so much time doing what you reccomend many times a day, for a long time! I did it between jobs at work in my work truck. I'd set my alarm on my cell phone and put in the ear plugs and sunglasses so no one thought I was sleeping, and here I still am. So, if your retort is that I was trying too hard, then you would contradict yourself in your blog statement of how we had to work harder.
quote:
Originally posted by Monte
Until we do our Inner work.
Whats the inner work? I've read all your posts here, read all your blog posts on your site up until summer I think. Read your book where you take hundreds of pages to describe this stuff and I still can't figure out what this "inner work" is? Because I did it, I did what you said to do.
Perhaps you've guided many to the promised land, and will continue to do so, so I don't want to rain on that parade. I don't know how to convey my thoughts or what I'm going thru w/ out sounding fustrated or negative in print, it's not what I'm trying to convey. I don't see you responding to this because how can you convey what you've been conveying here and in your blog and books anymore than you already have. I will take no offense if you do not reply. Like I said b4 if it were my purpose to offend you I would've replied to your thread from the 25th, but if someone found your threads useful in the future, I in no way want to interfere w/ their recovery if they choose to read all your threads.
In all fairness, the amount of stress I'm under at work, and home, and family issues is very overwhelming in addition to my obvious ocd w/ trying to be rid of tms. Is it ocd? Or is my pain and resultant depression and dizzy/fog I'm in from the pain pushing me to rid myself of it? Sarno mentions somewhere (a year ago I could've quoted the paragraph, line and page..lol..) that some reasons for the continuance of pain when knowledge and therapy are not enough is that the person does'nt realize the amount of rage they're in, or actual stress in their lives must be changed or too much. Maybe I'm in the latter, there's just too much on my plate right now.
Let me also mention I am not against someone making a living off consulting tms treatment or profiting off of it. I'm actually all for it! I commend Monte for that. The reason tms is so unknown is that no-one is really capatalizing off of it. Nothing would push tms into the spotlight like the free market, and Sarno for now is an underground movement. He states in one of his interviews that he's careful w/ his tone because he doe'snt want to sound like he's just selling books.
mizlorinj, how dare you and luv hijak my thread in the vane of helping others!
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2008 : 10:05:24
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SKIZ: directly from my notes from Dr. Sarno's lecture in January 2007:
You may not be able to change your personality, but you can modify it.
I don't view that as the point though. A change in our thinking is what's necessary. As Louise Hay would say: change your thinking and it will change your life.
And are you journaling or going to a therapist Skiz? You list things in your post that are bothersome to u. Perhaps you need to get them off you (which is the inner work). Start to peel the artichoke layer by layer and see what's at the heart. . .
HUGS. . .
-Lori
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Edited by - mizlorinj on 10/05/2008 10:10:07 |
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JohnD
USA
371 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2008 : 08:58:12
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Sarno was a genius in the way he discovered and articulated the true cause of this pain disorder. That said, he doesn't know everything about everything. I think its easy to change your personality IF you have the correct tools. I have done this myself and I know people who have as well. It doesn't mean that I'm totally different than I used to be from the outside perspective, but there are so many changes in the way I operate and its natural and automatic.
Skiz - I think it would be a good idea for you to interface with people who don't know anything about TMS, but are just physically healthy and start talking to them about your pain and ask them questions about their bodies and what they do when they get pain or what it means to them. I think you might start to get exactly what you need by doing this. People who have recovered from TMS have a unique perspective and that is to be valued, but there are many more perspectives that can helpful as well. Why not learn from those who never got any type of severe TMS (atleast physically) and learn how they prevented it? |
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Hestia
21 Posts |
Posted - 10/21/2008 : 20:32:29
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| Thank you Monte. Just what I needed to read right now. I am one of those people who have been better but still struggle with TMS. I have been doing really well the past year or so. Recently, my original problem is speaking to me slightly, whispering in my ear. I have been thinking today that if I do this and this and this, it will be okay. But no, I don't need to play in to it. It will all be good. |
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positivevibes
204 Posts |
Posted - 10/21/2008 : 23:19:28
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I'm going to jump in here. I'm still a relative neophyte to TMS, having only dealt with it since January of this year.
But several things seem clear to me (from my own personal perspective):
1. TMS is very much about repression of emotions -- some totally buried, some that we are totally unaware of, and some not so buried that we are afraid to face.
2. Dr. Sarno says that it is not necessary to change your personality to get over TMS. However, if you take a good look at yourself and realize that certain behavior or thought patterns aren't working in your life...that you are being an "enemy" to yourself and causing some of your problems....then if you have the courage and wherewithall, you will probably feel better if you work on changing these behaviors and improving yourself and your relationship with the world and with yourself.
3. "Loving yourself unconditionally" can be extremely challenging if you have been undermining yourself for much of your life. Those patterns can be very deeply ingrained. There's a certain comfort level in staying in that "bad groove," and jumping into new territory can be really hard. The old stuff tries to hold on, just like TMS does.
4. Maybe you'll figure out why you believe certain things about yourself, and maybe you won't. Either way, it's important to learn to love and accept yourself, and try to change the things that you CAN change. I mean, you can't change your childhood, but you change the way you feel about it.
Mizlorinj wrote, "do we feel deserving of health and happiness?" Wow, that's a great one, it hits it right on the head for me. It's all so entwined...our childhoods, how we feel about ourselves, the behavior patterns we continue to engage in.
Some people are "cured" of TMS symptoms immediately upon reading one of Dr. Sarno's books. Maybe those people don't have some of the issues that others of us do. I think it's a very individual and personal thing where "your results may vary."
Anyway, I have not read Monte's writing, but I think that anyone who tries to put a new spin on TMS to help people deserves some credit, whether they profit from it or not. TMS really tweaks your head. What works for one person may not work for another. So I think that the more decent literature or "programs" out there for TMS the better. I found that reading Sarno's books along with listening to Schechter's audio CD has been really helpful, because Schechter brings a slightly different perspective to TMS that resonated with me a little more accurately.
The important thing, I suppose, is to keep at it.
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monte hufftle from "runningpain".com
