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bribeavis
USA
7 Posts |
 Posted - 09/05/2008 : 23:35:59
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I was introduced to Sarno by my brother. He also convinced me to read some Jiddu Krishnamurti books after reading Sarno. Krishnamurti talks a lot about observing the mind and ones own thoughts. According to Krishnamurti, self observation without condemnation or justification helps to awaken intelligence. This "intelligence" operates on you(e.g. your mind). Reading some of his books helped me to eliminate back pain, and I also noticed some other surprising changes in myself. For example, I stopped biting my finger nails which I wasn't even aware I had been doing for countless years. I now cut my finger nails on a weekly basis. Another key Krishnamurti concept is that change or relief(the ending of back pain among other things for me) comes uninvited. It cannot be forced by some sort of pattern. The only thing you can do is continue this self observation. I've read a lot of frustration posts on this board, and I think people need to be aware that relief will eventually come uninvited if you continue to observe all your thoughts and feelings. This whole process is true meditation according to Krishnamurti. I believe the Sarno solution is the same type of meditation. I realize these may be some abstract concepts, and I recommend this only as a possible supplement for people who have thoroughly read all Sarno's books.
BTW, the Sopher book is also good.
Hope this can help someone. |
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moose1
162 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2008 : 07:07:17
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bribeavis,
great post. i haven't read Krishnamurti but i heard eckhart tolle mention him in a youtube video.
you paraphrase him as saying that "change or relief (the ending of back pain among other things for me) comes uninvited." i am really interested in how this happened for your own symptoms. did you just notice one day that you hadn't had back pain (or other symptoms) for a while? and what were your other symptoms?
my main TMS symptoms presently are anxiety and depression, which of course have the sole purpose of distracting me from my painful emotions. i am in therapy for this and it's a very painful process of discovering and processing current and very old, very painful feelings. my distraction mechanism is extremely stubborn.
thanks,
moose |
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bribeavis
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2008 : 21:17:13
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moose1,
"I" was unaware when the "uninvited" relief from various symptoms first came. I believe there is an uninvited death of the entire thought process responsible for creating the symptoms. This death of psycholigical thought is very important as it allows for new life. Have you ever noticed that when you are truly happy doing anything, whether it be at work or at play, "you" get lost in it. There is no more self-awareness. The "you" is dead. It is a state in which time doesn't exist, and there is unlimited energy. Krishnamurti believed that there is no formula or path to this state except for observing all your thoughts when you are not in this state of mind. IMHO this is completely "out of the box", and is the genius of both Sarno and Krishnamurti. Our whole lives we are taught by society to escape from thought via distractions or control it with discipline... If you're stressed, go on vacation, or have a beer. We are taught by religious leaders, teachers, and gurus to control "bad" thoughts, be disciplined and follow or focus on some pattern, method, or set of rules in order to be happy, achieve goals, or go to heaven. In this case, the methodology or pattern itself can be used by the mind as a distraction. As Sarno has shown, the irrational subconscious immitates, and takes this concept to a whole new level with the use of pain as distraction. Furthermore, I think the subconscious mind combines dozens of these distractions to form a psychological wall to hide "bad" thoughts..
When you do become aware that symptoms are gone I think its useful to ask where the symptoms went to reinforce the fact that they were created by the mind. This is advised by Marc Sopher in his book. Then, all you can do is begin the meditative process again.
In regards to my other symptoms besides back pain, I've had headaches, a pulsating eyelid, and anxiety to name a few.
Also, IMHO, I don't think it's important or possible for "you" to discover and process all the buried painful feelings(culprits). Simply be aware of, and watch of all your conscious thoughts. If you are frustrated by the process of trying to dig out old memories, or find yourself resisting thought, just be aware of this and watch carefully. I remember reading about a teacher's conversation with Krishnamurti in which she(the teacher) expressed frustration in getting students\children to be quiet, behave, concentrate and learn. He responded by saying something like ...if the teacher's mind is quiet and in order, and he/she(the teacher) has true interest and love of the subject being taught, the students will become quiet and interested, and will learn. He continues to explain that... you can think of your conscious mind as a teacher and your subconscious as a student/child. If you put your conscious(teacher/parent) mind in order by watching all thoughts w/o condemnation of justification, the subconscious(student/child) will follow suit... In our case, the subconscious will learn to stop repressing thought with distractions such as pain. The quieting of your entire mind, or death of all psychological thought via this route is "the end". It is nirvana.
Apologies for getting too abstract and or deep. :-)
Hope this helps. |
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moose1
162 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2008 : 21:11:03
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thanks for the reply, bribeavis. i should have my copy tomorrow or the next day from my local book store. i'm looking forward to reading it.
i agree that quieting the mind is a major goal, but man, it is NOT easy. we are so busy, so distracted and so stressed every day that we become conditioned to NOT turn off. i continue to work on this skill.
best,
moose |
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Awakening Intellligence
