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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
 Posted - 09/14/2008 : 16:25:40
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Jena,
The neuro-like symptoms--twitching, jerking, shaking...are all certainly benign. I know those (and other) symptoms only two well during the few times over the past several years I was convinced I had MS, but didn't. Purely the brain doing its thing! It's so hard to grasp that the brain can create symptoms so ominous, but it can. I have for many yrs experienced a smorgasborg of symptoms for which I have, in EVERY case, been give a clean bill of health.
In short, I am a hypochondriac and I'm pretty sure I always will be. What I would consider success is to greatly dampen the symptoms and the fear and catastrophizing associated with the symptoms. It is crucial to gain some control over hypochondria because each relapse makes the next more likely. At some point, Jena, we simply need to draw a line in the sand and refuse to check, refuse to ruminate, refuse to give in to the fear.
I still have a long way to go, but one thing I have at in the past three yrs is to strictly avoid checking symptoms on the net or going to the sites where people discuss their diseases. Even this site, I rarely check nowadays. |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2008 : 13:01:38
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Thanks for the responces. I really do not know what to do I stopped checking but I had an appointment with an ENT doctor who felt my collar bone lymph nodes and said they are enlarged and wants to order me a PET scan. I cant take this stress. I thought I was all done with this since my biopsy. Now he wants to check if I have a cancer anywhere in my body. I really do not know what to do because the amount of radiation I am getting in the past three months is insane!
My hemotologist was not concerned about these nodes and he is. Now I am taking myself right to new york city to another doctor to get a 3rd opinion! I realize this is not tms related but I have to vent because I dont know where else to go at this point. I just want to stop thinking about all this. This has consumed my entire year so far.  |
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winnieboo
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2008 : 14:04:45
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Jena,
So sorry you have been going through all this! However, in your first post, you did say
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I have been able to feel my lymph nodes for years and years.
Jena, did you mention this to the doctors? It's worth considering, as perhaps the way these nodes are is normal for you. You've felt them for years and years and if they were threatening your health (after all these years) you surely would have seen something blatantly wrong in your blood work or in the many tests you've had already.
At some point, you will have to trust when a doctor "signs off" on your symptoms. If the hemotologist was not concerned, why do you need another opinion? In this day and age, if a doctor has ANY concern, they order tests because they have so much liability! You can keep going to doctors and ordering more tests, but I can tell you from experience that your world is likely to become more confusing, not less. At some point, you have to believe the doctor's answer and/or take a leap of faith that those nodes--that have been there for years and years--are normal for you.
We are not all the same. I have very large lymph nodes in my neck. I've had them for years--I have lots of environmental allergies and I chalk the swelling up to that irritation. Since, like you, I went through a period of time when I had numerous tests, I've learned that I have all kinds of abberations here and there that make me less than perfect. not like other people--and since I'm prone to cyberchecking too, I know I could look every abnormality up and find them linked to an illness.
You mentioned in an earlier post that you were interviewing a new therapist. Have you had that appointment yet? Since you have already spoken to Sarno, perhaps he could recommend a person if that didn't work out. You are dealing w/a lot and it seems a therapist could help to sort it all out with you. I see so much of myself in you, and I know that they only way I've progressed and calmed down is by having a qualified therapist show me how to extinguish these kinds of fears.
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Nor
152 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 20:42:24
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To Dor, Jena and all the other hypochondriacs among us....
I've read the most recent posts on health paranoia and I've got a small tip. Its pretty simple but it really helps me. I wikipedia'd "hypochondriasis" and bookmarked it. Whenever I have a scare, I read and re-read it. I find that no matter what the paranoia du jour is, my symptoms of hypochondriasis match up better than anything I can create in my mind. So many of the co-morbidities are TMS equivalents! Its amazing to read. I felt like it was written about me. Hypochondriasis doesn't scare me. I know its all part of TMS which I feel more control over.
Here's to good health! Nor |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 01:39:21
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I've googled hypochondria a few times it does make me feel better but it doesnt last long. I'm truly at the end of my rope. I've been journaling and talking to my therapist. I went to another doctor for hematology cuz I think i have lymphoma actually the doctor I went to was in the same hospital SArnos in. I should of made a pit stop to him haha. So far 3 doctors 2 agree I don't have cancer just palpable lymph nodes and1 dr. Wants me to get a pet scan! Thats when I got my 3 rd opinion and he said I'm to young for all this radiation if I had cancer my ct scan with contrast would of picked up something suspicious. Well I was so happy when I left this doctor office and then 2 days pass and here I go doubting my dr. I read way to much online.
Now I'm suffereing with horrible chest pain and have convinced myself its from enlarged lymph nodes that have grown in 2 months in my chest. It hurts to breathe! Im so scared I truly am. I'm sorry and apologize if I sound redundant and annoying but idk whats wrong with me. Lymphoma? Tms? That article about enlarged nodes and chronic fatigue syndrome was intersting except I'm not fatigued. Do I just continue to go to doctors and find out why my nodes are palpable or let it go like my 2 out of 3 doctors mentioned.
Sometimes the pain radiates down my left arm. I've had by heart checked out I'm fine?! Unless they missed the cancer on my biopsy and it now in 2 months spread to my chest and thymus gland. Idk if tms can cause this type of pain. I was so good at curing back pain whats my problem now? |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 04:00:14
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Jena,
try writing your stressful "what ifs" down and applying Byron Katie's 4 questions to them, what she calls "the work". Look it up, lots of youtube videos of her doing the work. Or, get her book "loving what is".
In the meantime, if all else fails to bring you relief, I'm beginning to see this method linked below as a possible cure to tms ailments.
Warning, do not download on your work computer. Strong language.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wS5xOZ7Rq8 |
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Dor
67 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 05:22:09
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Oh Jena, I can so relate! What you are dealing with here though is a huge amount of health anxiety. You are running around looking for reassurance and totally imagining the worst. I get it, I really do. One thing I find is that when other things in my life are upsetting, my health anxiety soars, so look around in your life and find out what things are upsetting you. Health can be huge when other things are bothering us. It is often easier to worry about our health than it is to worry about other things we can't seem to face. Sounds weird doesn't it? Who wants this? But, as Sarno says - the mind can be a huge distraction.
You have to do what feels right and good to you. No one can tell you that is wrong. If going through with the medical tests are going to make you feel safe then do that. Do whatever it takes to put your mind at ease. Once you are feeling safe then it will be easier to work on the emotional issues in your life. Maybe some people with disagree with that thinking, but even Sarno says to get things checked out by a doctor first.
Also look into your past a bit. For example, I was recently visiting my parents and we were out to lunch. I ordered a salad and my mother said - don't get the salad, the lettuce could be bad. What??? Is it a wonder that both me and my sister have health anxiety issues? Health and the fear of was always big in my family. So many uh oh's to worry about! Did you have a similar background? If so, can you see how you learned it?
Most of all find the things that make you comfortable. What doctor did you like and trust the most? Trust is very important when dealing with health anxiety. I recently had a mole biopsy and spent two weeks scared to death. However, I had to keep reminding myself that the wonderful, kind doctor never seemed at all concerned and left the room saying - See you next year! Would he really have let me leave the office if he had feared melenoma? Would your doctor really have let you leave the office if he feared cancer? Isn't it a doctor's responsibility to make sure his patient is made aware of a serious problem? And you know what - my doctor was absolutely right. Biopsy fine - no need to worry!
It is hard Jena. Every day can be filled with worry. But, look at your life, look to who you can trust and trust them, remind yourself of all the positives you have been given, and give yourself some time. Time to think, but more importantly time to relax and distract yourself. Distraction, if only temporary, gives your mind time to let go and that can help a great deal. Also remember, you are not alone. If that were the case would there be any reason for this board or Dr. Sarno?
You are going to be just fine. Take it from a fellow health worrier.
Dor |
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winnieboo
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 08:28:07
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Dor's post was excellent. I can relate to it and to all of what you are going through. How did your third opinion in NY pan out? As Dor says, feeling safe is extremely important. Tests, trust in your doctors and looking back to the past and the habits that have formed throughout your life regarding health, are all important. Once you feel safe, you can start doing the TMS work that is helpful to you, be it journaling, reading or therapy.
One thing that I think is key to to shaking the hypochodria also, is to find a way to stop checking. For me, I first had to stop checking my body for aches, pains and other symptoms, then I had to stop checking the internet, then I had to stop reading self-help books related to physcial health. I even have to discipline myself when watching the 6 o'clock news...you know, all those drug commercials! I am so suggestible that even those will work me up! I have to remind myself that the people on the commercials are "not me." Sounds crazy, but the checking and worrying and ruminating are just basically bad habits, but on the positive side, they can absolutely be changed. |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 19:30:09
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Great advice everybody! Winnie my third opinion went very good and I felt excellent right after. Than the next few days I doubt what doctors say and I read about other peoples lymphoma was missed and i automatically assume mine was also. The doctor I went to is at NYU hospital and was literally rated top 3 in the tristate area from 12,000 doctors taking this vote. He is supposed to be the best of the best. What he did was he felt my lymph nodes and was not concerened he did say that lymphoma is tricky to test but I had a good biopsy he told me to stop going to doctors.
I have a few palpable lymph nodes and Idont think he felt 1 of them i really wanted him to feel but either way he said he is so confident and he told me not to get the PET scan! He must of been pretty confidant because the pet scan was the very next day that I canceled. Now though I am worried because i am afraid they missed something and now it is spreading to my chest cuz I am having horrible strange chest pains. I am thinking about getting an xray. They say with fine needle biopsy it can miss lymphoma but I also had it combined with a core needle and something called flow cytometry so he said I should not be worried. My biopsy didnt even come up inconclusive it came up benign. I dont know I have all of those websites stuck in my head about enlarged clavicle lymph nodes 98% cancer!
Tms or lymphoma? will i ever stop worrying??!? thanks for listening everyone |
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winnieboo
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 20:20:59
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With a reputation and rating as high as you say this NYU doctor has, he cannot afford to be wrong and certainly wouldn't take a chance. Think of it from HIS standpoint, he would not want and can't afford to be liable!! So, if he was AT ALL worried, he would have run more tests or encouraged your PET scan. And he didn't!
I tend to mistrust doctors, too, but when a doctor CONFIDENTLY hears my concerns and then recommends I cease and desist further doctor visits, that's when the buck can stop. Phew! That's excellent news, Jena!
So, I hope you will allow yourself to now relax and do the TMS work. I think I also remember you saying that Sarno once told you had TMS. Good luck and yes, you will stop worrying! Don't check the internet. It might take a few days or weeks, but the information you have stuck in your head will fade. Try to turn away from the thoughts of illness, treat them like an obsession or your pain and turn back to your life... |
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mcone
114 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2008 : 21:10:44
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Jena,
Your experience sounds sooo much like me, and I've had bouts of serious chest pain radiating into my left arm as well...for hours at a time... (most of September) but my distressing conviction isn't lymphoma - I've become convinved that my unrelenting chest pain means some type of atypical heart failure (imminently about to stop me dead in my tracks) or some type of arterial damage and spasm - due to badly degenerated arterial health. And I can think of dozens of reasons I'm suffering from this...
but I have few of the classic risk factors for heart disease - never smoked, normal weight, normal blood lipids, reasonably active, reasonable BP, etc.
And not a single objective test has come up with anything either. In fact, echocardio = normal, stress test = normal, heart enzymes blood testing = normal, carotic artery ultrasound = normal. And my pain *lessens* when I exercise - the day after I got out of ER, I bicycled nearly 20 miles. I feel like I could run for 2, 3 or more miles (but for my knee and foot, another story!) And yet, when the pain would escelate, I would be certain I was a gone.
It is UNEQUIVOCAL that the onset or aggravation of symptoms coincided with certain types of mental stress...like despair and frustration and morbid cognitive interpretations of the symptoms themselves...and symptoms abated with a lifting mood and a re-assuring interpretation of symptoms *that is genuinely believed*. Sooo much evidence is there for a psychogenic phenomenon, but I still get trapped in *doomful* thinking repeatedly.
Does ANYONE have a clear explanation for psychogenic chest pain?Increasingly, I'm thinking that this applies:
http://www.fibromyalgia-symptoms.org/fibromyalgia_chest_symptoms.html
Basically, some kind of peculiar aggravation of of all those connective tissues in the chest cavity...for me symptoms relieved temporarily with exercise, that whole blood flow thing...supports the Sarno TMS diagnosis. |
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Dor
67 Posts |
Posted - 10/02/2008 : 05:10:33
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Jena, At some point you have to begin to trust. You are already second guessing this well respected doctor. He has the education, not you. He also has the experience. Why would he tell you to stop going to doctors if he suspected that anything was wrong?
Jena, think on this. When you have been extremely worried about a health issue for quite a while and you go to a doctor and get good news it might take a few days for that to sink in. You have been on high alert and it is almost impossible for that to go instantly away. Give yourself some time. Think back on everything he said, remember his words. Tell the words in your own head to be quiet and remember his.
Chest pain now? Definitely anxiety.
Dor |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2008 : 21:08:46
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| I have to try and keep telling myself this that it is TMS but I am having such problems believing. I think I believed a lot easier when I had back pain was because I was no a hypochondriac than so it was easier for me to believe but now I constantly think its the worst thing possible. I cant help but think the doctors keep missing something.. I am getting pain in my heart, in the center of my chest taht radiates to my back, and near my spleen! Spleen enlargement = lymphoma. I know how crazy I sound but I cant help it. Back pain was obviously more physical but chest pains and deep heart pain makes me think its more of a disease or something. I am a patient of Sarno but I was wondering does he have an email address? I think he does and I used to have it but I lost it, does anyone know it? Thanks |
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mcone
114 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2008 : 21:34:44
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I am getting pain in my heart, in the center of my chest taht radiates to my back, and near my spleen!
* * *
I know how crazy I sound but I cant help it. Back pain was obviously more physical but chest pains and deep heart pain makes me think its more of a disease or something.
* * *
I have very similar symptoms. Pain feels like it's right in my heart and around my heart, sometimes aching, burning, or stabbing pain and sometimes radiates to my left arm. Geez...how can this NOT be frightening? Oddly, what helps allay my fears at this point is given the severity, persistance and nature of the symptoms, if it was a heart problem, it would have either shown up on one of the many screenings and/or I would be dead by now. Seriously. people with significant heart disease that have heart attacks aren't having symptoms this bad.
Paradoxically, its the overwhelming severity of the symptoms combined with my continued ability to exercise normally and have normal physical activity endurance that COMPELS the conclusion that something else is going on, i.e., autonomic nervous system running amok which is somehow aggravating the nerve paths of the heart and/or chest wall muscles.
This is a bizarre phenomenon that is quite unbelievable to anyone who hasn't experienced it, including doctors who MUST and DO completely downplay and trivialize the symptoms - because they cannot believe symptoms can be so severe without an identifiable organic cause - and this dynamic (for me) does tend to feed anxiety at times, becauses the doctor's perception and seeming disbelief that symptoms are severe only serves to re-inforce the notion that they must be missing something. And what they may be missing (I guess and hope) is that TMS/anxiety actually can and does cause very severe physical distress.
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Edited by - mcone on 10/06/2008 21:42:41 |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2008 : 22:26:35
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| mcone its nice to knwo someone has the same symptoms as me even though I dont wish this on anyone not even on my worst enemy its so horrible. IDK if you read my other post but I am actually not worried about my heart but what I do think I have is enlarged lymph nodes in my chest or my thymus or spleen is enlarged. I obscess with lymphoma. I constantly think I have it and i know if i didnt think I had it making the TMS diagnosis would be so much easier. |
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playsinpain
28 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2008 : 08:29:54
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| The only way to get out of this cycle is to make peace with God, fate, the cosmos, whatever you believe in. Stop making yourself the center of the universe....if you drop dead, well then you drop dead. it happens thousands of times a minute. The awfulization process seems like a pretty frequent characteristic of TMS...it is an extension of narcisism and abates when you start focusing outward. If Drs. say you are healthy, believe them...if they missed something and you drop dead, well - pardon the pun - that's life. But one thing is for certain: living life minute to minute in constant fear that you are going to die is no life at all. Fully accepting this truth is the most necessary step toward resolution of these symptoms. |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2008 : 10:13:35
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Playsinpain seems to have a grasp on the attitude u need to have. It also is alot like Byron Katie's take that your'e gonna die when you should die and not one moment earlier or later. Regardless of how you go.
She goes on to say there are 3 Types of "business" in life; yours, their's, and God's. When youre in the other 2 and not your own you're in suffering.
She's not that religious, and substitutes the word God and reality often. But she clearly states God already knows when your'e gonna die, leave it at that and get out of his business.
I don't know if any of us will ever accomplish that level of thinking, but it goes hand in hand w/ what playinpain says, and my earlier link that is meant to be humorous, but isn't it the truth.
Btw, she doe'snt advocate not going to the doctor's, I guess you gotta read her to understand. And like Sarno she explains that "the brain gets wrapped around physical symptoms in preference to emotional pain".....hmmmm |
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swmr1
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2008 : 11:30:22
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quote:
Originally posted by playsinpain
The only way to get out of this cycle is to make peace with God, fate, the cosmos, whatever you believe in. Stop making yourself the center of the universe....if you drop dead, well then you drop dead. it happens thousands of times a minute. The awfulization process seems like a pretty frequent characteristic of TMS...it is an extension of narcisism and abates when you start focusing outward. If Drs. say you are healthy, believe them...if they missed something and you drop dead, well - pardon the pun - that's life. But one thing is for certain: living life minute to minute in constant fear that you are going to die is no life at all. Fully accepting this truth is the most necessary step toward resolution of these symptoms.
This is SOOO true. This type of thinking has been essential for me this past year. I had a bilateral pulmonary embolism (blood clots in the lungs) last November as a result of the Yaz birth control pill. Right after I was discharged from the hospital I had to deal with fears that my blood would clot without my realizing it and I could die. I would find myself focusing on any kind of breathing abnormalities, calf pains, chest pains, you name it.
I finally decided that there's only so much I can control. Someday I'll die. Until then, I'll listen to my doctors and live my life. I'm no more in control of my blood clotting too easily than I am of a truck slamming into my car on the highway. Walking around constantly worrying about what could happen is such a waste of our limited time and energy... |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2008 : 17:31:57
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I understand what you are all saying; however, I cannot just tell myself "I am going to die when I am going to die! Ok great now I feel better". My mind is not letting me let go of this obsession. I do journal and I do go see a therapist. I understand its in Gods hands but that doesn't make my feeling that I have cancer go away. Playspin has a great attitude towards death but I do not have the same attitude unfortunately. I dont think I ever will. If i drop dead i drop dead? I dont know if I am reading your post correctly but there are people who ignore symptoms and than yes one day they do drop dead because of their ignorance. I have no control over my death but what I do have control over is deciding whether or not I should continue to get checked out because I am feeling this strange and horrible pains. My problem is I have read to many people explaining that they should not have listened to their doctor and believed themselves because they did having something serious. My problem is I do not know when to draw the line and say tomyself "jena the doctor is correct you do not have cancer" in my head its like an OCD thought I keep getting this thought as much as I try and ignore it " jena hes wrong he missed the cancer just like other people have had their cancer missed".
I have obsessive thoughts that drive me mad! I wishhhh I could think like many of you can and I used to not be so afraid but I am now. I keep thinking early detection early detection! I need to fully trust my benign diagnosis to fully move on with TMS and that is the obvious problem that I am having. playsspin i cannot help by living in fear I am trying by going to therapy and journaling and reading sarnos books but in the mean time icannot think like u do about death. I accept I am going to die I know that but I cant accept living in this constant needing assurance that i do not have cancer! Its all because of these lymph nodes I am telling you. If most people were able to feel theirs I would feel like it was normal but since most people cant I am afraid. |
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Jena
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2008 : 17:33:05
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your right playspin has the attitude i should have and need to have but getting there is the problem.  |
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TMS, Anxiety, and most importantly Hypochondriasis
