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floridaboy
40 Posts |
 Posted - 11/15/2004 : 20:17:00
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I will try to keep this short...but I might not be able to contain my excitement. First of all the cold hard slap in the face...I am not "cured" and I still am fighting TMS gremlins everyday just like most of you. I truly belive a day will come when I am not in pain...but for now, I will take my progress over the past 6 months ANY DAY
OK...the story. My plan all along was to run my first marathon in January(The Disney). When I saw my TMS doctor in June she said I could do it...I made the decision right then to sign up. I signed up and paid...all the while only being able to run a little bit (2-3miles...that was June.
I have been seriously training for 9 weeks. I have fought TMS HARD through this process. Shin & calf pain kept getting the best of me. Hip pain and other leg pain has had its day too. I even had a terrible side effect from a cholesterol drug that I wrote a post about. Well, this weekend I planned on doing 18 miles at a real-life marathon event. A simple training run to get experience at what it is like at a real race. Since over a week ago I was struggling with inside shin splints on my left leg. My right leg was fine. Left hurt...BAD. I started to obsess about it. Constantly touching, pressing and testing for pain. Evertime I felt pain, I got more affraid. The most I have ever run was 16.5 miles. Fear was a big factor. 18 miles was a big deal. On Wednesday I started back on my journal and reading with force. This saturday night I was tempted to cancel the whole thing (18 miles next day). I test ran in the house and you will never believe what happened. BOTH my shins hurt! I laughed out loud and went and found my wife and told her the news. Hey, Honey guess what? Both my shins hurt now...she looked sad and I said, "no, you don't get it...that was the sign I was looking for...my right leg is fine,,,how could it start to hurt tonight when I haven't run since Wednesday? This PROVES it is TMS!" Not that I should have needed the proof, but I did. I said to her..."I am running all 18 tomorrow (I was contemplating not going or just doing a small run instead). I know for sure this pain is emotionally induced. 3 Cheers for right shin pain".
The plan was for my wife to pick me up at mile 18. It was pouring rain...we have a newborn...long story short...she made a difficult decision to let me find a way back to my car on my own and stayed at home with the 6 week old baby rather than brave the elements with him. When I got to mile 18 and she ws no where in sight (I knew why because of the weather)...I decided to just keep going for a while. Well...a while turned out to be 26.2 miles! I did it. I ran a marathon. My left shin tried to play tricks on me at the beginning...but obviously it was a game. I hurt bad today...but it is all "good" pain. And the funny thing is...NO SHIN PAIN! Those of you who know shin splints...these are "overuse injuries". How can a shin that was overused and causing pain...run a marathon and feel better? No Orthopedic Doctor on the planet would have let me run that marathon without weeks of rest and lots of pills!
If all of you knew me and saw me when I was at rock bottom with TMS pain, you would have seen a guy who:
1. Could barely walk across the street without terrible knee pain
2. Could not write without use of an adaptive pencil holding tool (RSI in wrists and hands)
3. Could not type three letters without nearly coming to tears
4. Could not drive a car without a hand drive adpative kit ($10,000 installed) due to ankle pain
I could keep going, but you get the picture.
Well...there you have it. THe night before I almost quit. The day after I became one of the few people on this planet that can say they ran a marathon. By the way, I ran the WHOLE thing non stop, no walking. My time was 4 hrs 9 mins 30 secs. I guess I will do Disney in January and do it under 4 hrs! Hip Hip Horay for Dr Sarno...(and me )! |
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jack
27 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 04:36:59
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Florida Boy -
Great great job on finishing your marathon and for letting us know all about it. Good for you.
I wish I could write such a success story. My groin is still killing me. I ran this weekend, 12 miles Saturday and 8 miles Sunday. All the while the groin was just on fire. The pain is definitely worse after running. How do you prove to yourself that the running isnot making the pain worse? How do you prove to yourself that stopping and resting isn't the answer? Those are the doubts I constantly go through. I was supposed to run this morning but the pain is too much and it seems that the running irritated things or is that just me saying running is the trigger?
I constantly battle with myself - to stop running or not. If I run it hurts and am I only making it worse?
Florida boy - you must have gone through these questions internally all the time?
Could you help me perhaps? I want to run but the internal battle wages on. Do I give myself 2 weeks and see?
Thanks
Jack |
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floridaboy
40 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 05:59:40
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First off...I am not one of those, "read the book, got better" kind of guys. I have and actually expect to be again at some point right where you are now. TMS is mean, nasty and unforgiving...it is the perfect enemy if you are in a war. It hurts you BOTH physically (pain) and physchologically (fear). Pain and fear...a vicious combination.
Here is my advice based on my internal war/battle. First off, if you have not seen a TMS doctor, you need to make that happen. Had I not seen Dr. Segal in Washinginton, DC, I would never have had the courage to keep running. If you ask me, the TMS Doctor is the key incredient to success for people who are "stuck". Everytime I found myself in serious doubt, I would reflect back to conversations with my doctor. My wife attended the session so she was a big help reminding me of what the doctor said. I asked my doctor point blank if I could run a marathon. At the time it was a pipe dream...like, yeah right...like she is going to say it is ok...you know what she said? SHe looked me in the eye and said, "You look in the mirror and see a person who is weak and afflicted with pain all over. You see a man who needs to take care of his body or it will hurt. You see a guy who is not powerful or strong...someone who is fragile. I will tell you what I see....I see a young (38), fit (200lb, 6ft muscular build) man who is incredibly healthy. You are not weak, or fragile you are strong and powerful". I resisted and asked again, "so you think I can run a marathon?" She asked me, "is this something you really want to do?" I said, "all my life". She quickly replied, "well as your doctor, who has done a thorough physical examine on you, I can tell you that "physically" you could run a marathon with a refridgerator on your back if you wanted to! There is nothing preventing you...you can train and run a marathon just like anybody else". You see the doctor gives you courage. So, go see one or go back if you already have and are doubting.
Second, EVERY single time I get complacent with TMS study I get a reoccurance of major symptoms. Let me be clear, the minor symptoms have never gone away. I have some pain while typing this to you, some pain while driving in my ankles (even as of yesterday)...but it is just an annoyance...the major stuff sounds like your groin...my shins, my calfs...the "Oh my GOD this hurts, pain". When I say TMS study, I mean the following:
1. Coming to this site and reading Tennis Tom and others who "keep the faith" and help others "think through" their doubts. I skip over the "bad news" posts or other negativity.
2. Reading pages of MBP, healing BP or Dr Sofer's book before bed or when I wake up to start my day.
3. I really like Dr Brady's video tapes (he is out of Orlando. Itry to watch tape #2 repeatedly...taking notes each time.
4. Following Dr Brady's journal techniques and writing in my journal nightly.
5. Finding time to pray and read the bible. I am a Christian and find my faith to be an integral part of my ability to follow the TMS receovery plan. He gives me strength as the saying goes.
There are many days when I do NONE of the above. In fact I can go over a week or more without doing anything. One thing is certain...when I stop, I get a major symptom at some point in the near future. 100% of the time!
Not being a doctor, take my last piece of advice lightly...I receommend you take a week off of running. NOT because of the physical pain...but because of the mental state you are currently in. You are afraid and you doubt. This is a horrible state to go into combat. Immerse yourself into "TMS Study" as I call it. Get convinced without any doubt that this is what is going on with you. Do whatever you need to do the re-engage you brain so that you are completley convinced and ready to wage war. Remember during this week or however long you choose to prepare for running again..this is not time to rest your groin. The time off has NOTHING to do with your groin. Your groin is NOT the problem. My left and right shins were killing me the morning of the marathon. I just didn't think about them. I KNEW with every fiber of my being it was TMS. I was literally laughing a real laugh at the sillyness of it all. This is a very different state of mind than one of fear. When you get your mind in the right place, regardless of how your groin feels (remember it is not about the groin...THINK PHYSCHOLOGICALLY), go run. Run when you see yourself as strong and powerful and not weak and fragile. It is hard to describe, but ask yourself how you "see" yourself in your mind's eye? Do you see fragile and weak...or strong and powerful. I translate the fear that is discussed in the books into that type of context. Unfortunatley, it just seems to be good old fashioned HARD WORK for some of us. But...I wouldn't trade it for a the state I was in a year ago for all the money in the world. Best of luck and let us know how it goes. |
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jack
27 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 06:12:18
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Florida Boy-thanks for responding so rapidly.
Maybe I am not seeing it yet, but I suppose it is fear. I have been running for 15 years and have been plagued by one "injury" after another. I cannot for the life of me figure out why I would run for 5 months then get "hurt" and be out for months and months - treatment after treatment. As we wrote about before - most runners don't go through this. Every time a pain hits me, I sort of panic and say to myself - here we go again - another 6 months off of running - more time treating, resting, not running, being depressed. Also every time this happens, I say to myself, okay, this will be only one week and it won't follow true to course. That is what I am trying to convince myself of this time. Take a week off, the pain will go away ...... but after 7 days, pain is still there, thoughts of going to a doctor - get an MRI, get a bone scan, what can cure this.
You had said previously Florida Boy that certain of us have a propensity for TMS. This is what I am trying to say above - people in my running club get achilles tendonitis, shin splints, knee pains, but it never ever turns out to be what I go through. I wish I could get up tomorow morning and say "wow the pain is gone, I can go run without fear of it never going away", etc.
I hope I am explaining myself clearly. This is hard to verbalize. Sometimes I don't seem to express what I am going through.
Thanks for letting me vent.
Jack |
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floridaboy
40 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 06:29:42
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| your inability to "explain" what is happening tells me it is TMS. You need a plan for your brain not your body. Fix upstairs and your body will surprise you. You reply is very "physical" in its context. It is NOT a physical problem. |
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jack
27 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 07:06:24
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Thanks. Fix upstairs. Hmmmm. It's easier to take off from running, to go PT, take NSAIDS, etc. I suppose I am not there yet.
Too many obsessive thoughts rolling around: (a) it won't get better if i run; (b) running will still aggravate it; (c) it just hurts so much when I do something I love.
I ran this weekend and by Monday I was in so much pain.
Is it possible to be a combination of mind/body stuff? |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 08:46:47
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quote:
Is it possible to be a combination of mind/body stuff?
Of course, we can get injured. Of course, if you abuse your body, it can hurt. You can twist an ankle, break a leg, strain a muscle, through strenuous physical activity. These bodily injuries will heal completely.
On the other hand, running in and of itself is not "bad" for the body. People train for and run in marathons all the time with no pain. Our bodies were designed for running.
In my opinion, if you think physical in any way early on in the battle against TMS, you will not make any progress. If you have any doubt that the pain is psychological, you will not make any progress.
You cannot expect relief from TMS pain while still having the mindset that running has anything to do with your pain. If you cannot shake that belief, you will not get better.
If you haven't already, you might want to read Dr. Marc Sopher's book. He presents the TMS theory in a down to earth way from the viewpoint of an athelete. Maybe it will sink in better for you than Dr. Sarno's books. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 09:26:58
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 BRAVO FLORIDABOY !
You finnished your marathon, and also fooled the TMS gremlin  ! That's a very respectable time too. You fooled the gremlin by running with no EXPECTATIONS for the outcome. This is an excellent strategy. We put a heavy emotional/psychological burden on ourselves when we measure ourself by winning or losing. To paraphrase the poem by Kipling "IF":'you can treat winning and losing the same, then you will be a man my son'.
You told the gremlin, "I'm just doing a trainig run-I don't intend to finnish,", only 18 miles-no burden, (refridgerator), loaded onto your psyche.
My tennis coach has often told me, if you can't do the shot in practice, you won't be able to do it in competition. He's so right. What makes one go out and think they can do something in the heat of competition, with all the pressures, outward and inward, that entails, and pull it off? IF YOU CAN'T DO IT IN PRACTICE YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO DO IT COMPETITION !
I have experienced this several times firsthand. When I first started playing tournaments, I was headed for a 0-6, 0-6 loss to an excellent player. He took pity on me and tried to let me win a game, the infamous "courtesy" game, now called the bagel-stick. I sensed that he was trying to give me the game. And try as I might, I couldn't take it on a silver platter. It was laughable to me but taught me an important lesson about the heavy psychic weight the burden of EXPECTATIONS, of winnig and losing can create.
I have also experienced the corolary of this. I have played my best tennis, when I have tried to throw a game, or when I did't keep track of the score. My technique became perfect and couldn't miss--no INTENTIONS for the outcome.
I've witnessed this in almost every match I play. My opponent, returns an "out" serve, perfectly, but it doesn't count. The next serve "in", may be within inches of the first and at the same speed, and they miss it due to the pressure, because it now counts. It's amazing to me that this can happen in an instant. The ball can be going at 100 miles an hour. The sub-conscious mind can decide to relax the biceps/triceps for a winner, or tighten them, so they work in opposition to each other and choke the stroke-in the speed of TMS!
Congratulaions Floridaboy, as much for doing the distance, 26.2, as well as fooling the gremlin,
tt |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 09:42:51
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quote:
Originally posted by jack
Thanks. Fix upstairs. Hmmmm. It's easier to take off from running, to go PT, take NSAIDS, etc. I suppose I am not there yet.
Too many obsessive thoughts rolling around: (a) it won't get better if i run; (b) running will still aggravate it; (c) it just hurts so much when I do something I love.
I ran this weekend and by Monday I was in so much pain.
Is it possible to be a combination of mind/body stuff?
Jack,
I don't remember if I have given you this TMS tip yet, but I've certainly been giving it to others here. I feel it is the short-cut to facing the emotions that are causing TMS pain.
Go immediately to page 26 of MBP and look at the Rahe-Holmes list of life's stressful situations. Identify those that apply to you now or have applied in the past. This is the drowning pool of repressed TMS rage. When it overflows it results in psycogenic TMS pain.
You mention you are having "too many obsessive thoughts rolling around"-OCD is also a TMS equivalent. |
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jack
27 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 09:54:34
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as dave said:
"you can strain a muscle".
I am fighting now - did I strain my groin muscle or is it TMS pain? How do you discern that? I think that might be the crux of it all. Maybe I just don't see it...... I guess the bottom line is that I don't want to take off any time from running. Wouldn't that be the test though - if it doesn't feel better after one week of no running, then it is TMS?
Jack |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 10:22:07
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quote:
Originally posted by jack
as dave said:
"you can strain a muscle".
I am fighting now - did I strain my groin muscle or is it TMS pain? How do you discern that? I think that might be the crux of it all. Maybe I just don't see it...... I guess the bottom line is that I don't want to take off any time from running. Wouldn't that be the test though - if it doesn't feel better after one week of no running, then it is TMS?
Jack
Unfortunately, no, that's not how it works. A big part of TMS is conditioning. You fear that running causes pain, so it does. If you stop running, and the pain stops, it can be totally due to the conditioned response, and not the physical act of running.
I'm a firm believer that unless you do something specific to injure your body, it is TMS. A baseball player who pulls a hamstring simply running to first base as he has done a thousand times before is experiencing acute TMS. On the other hand, if he trips over the first base bag, or stretches awkwardly to reach it, then maybe he got an injury.
If you have an injury, it will improve on a daily basis. It will heal completely. If the pain is persistent weeks or months later, it is TMS. As long as you believe the pain might be due to something physical, TMS will stay. It's goal is to distract you. If it succeeds, it will continue the strategy for as long as it works. You need to learn to ignore the pain. |
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jack
27 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 11:51:39
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Dave-
Thanks for your explanation. It is not an easy thing to grasp -- pain is not an injury. That is why I think so many people laugh at Sarno - "so any time I have a pain, it is mental/emotional?" It is difficult to argue with people.
Maybe it is the chronicity thing I am not getting. That is why I am fighting about taking time off from running to see whether or not there is improvement.
This weekend I ran 12 miles and 8 miles. I definitely tried to ignore the pain. I was able to run but Sunday night I was hurting. I didn't run this morning because I was thinking about taking a week off. But at the same time I think I am giving into the pain. It is a double edged sword.
Thanks again Dave for your patience. It is an easy concept but hard to believe it.
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Irish Jimmy
USA
52 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 15:46:05
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| FLA. BOY, Great story!!!! Congrats on the Marathon. It is good to hear a TMS success story like that. Your story can be of great incouragement to people just starting out on the TMS path. Again good job. |
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Hestia
21 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2004 : 16:02:53
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| Thanks Floridaboy for that inspirational post. I am fighting with TMS running injuries myself. The shin splints up the side of my calves I could ignore but I am having difficulty with the knee pain I have had for the past week. I am running a little through the pain but it is hard to will it all away. On one level I know it is caused by TMS but I guess on another level I am having trouble with the pain. It is so frustrating because I have been working so hard on making my foot pain (plantar fasciitis & tarsal tunnel) go away and now this. I will be running on this knee again tomorrow. It was a little better today. |
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Michele
249 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 11:34:01
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Oh my gosh, I wanted to cry Floridaboy!! WOW! And you've beat my best time by 14 minutes!
Thank you for posting that story, it is awesome. I love the "good pain" comment as well. I've had the post-marathon pain and I'm always very proud of it!
Keep up the great work!! |
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holly
USA
243 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2004 : 15:34:20
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| Great story! The more of these I read the better I feel.Where did I put my book??? |
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pault
USA
169 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2004 : 04:44:13
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| Good job Florida boy , Bravo! It shows people that you have to believe in the system and go with it ,without always understanding the cause.Having a tms doctor diagnosis was a big help to me also! keep up the good work! Paul. |
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TMS Success Story
