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oz_tgap
10 Posts |
 Posted - 03/12/2007 : 07:56:58
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Hello all - this is my first post. I have been suffering from tinnitus [7 years] and lower back issues [12 years, worse in part year], and nobody can find any underlying physical basis - so I am thinking TMS.
My initial question is this. I have read that chronic back pain is caused by a "feedback loop" being extablished in the brain, so even if the intial "injury" goes away, the pain persists. How does this jive with TMS? Is that statement hogwash?
Thanks,
-Paul |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 08:43:01
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I never heard the term "feedback loop" but the idea is consistent with TMS. Old injuries become targets for chronic psychogenic pain because it is a successful distraction. We believe there is some residual damage from the injury so the pain is considered structural, and we keep busy going to chiropractors and accupuncturists and physical therapists and ultimately surgeons trying to "fix" it.
The first thing to do is read one of Dr. Sarno's books. |
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oz_tgap
10 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 09:56:50
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Thanks Dave. I assume this means that the "feedback loop", if it exists, is not necessarily permanent since TMS can be effectively cured. Is this correct?
-Paul |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 10:17:07
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"Feed-back loop" sounds like a new-fangled word for Pavlovian conditioning. Perhaps some new-age type came up with it to "feed" the money "back" to his wallet from people who were "loop"ed.
TMS pain is psycologicaly conditioned and is cured by a de-conditioning process based upon Dr. Sarn0's brand of "Knowledge Penicillin". |
Edited by - tennis tom on 03/12/2007 18:17:13 |
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Bliss
Canada
33 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 10:29:23
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Hi oz tgap
I have tinnitus too. Was a real bummer at first. Before I knew about TMS, I had had a back pain episode going on for about 3mths. At the last minute, my husband and I were offered awesome seats at the Rolling Stones concert back in summer of 2005 - we went, I had a blast dancing in spite of the backpain (actually no pain dancing cause I did not realize that I had put it on the backburner esp when songs like 'Honky Tonk Woman' came on!)....but during the final encore when everyone was cheering, whistling and screaming for more I experienced seering right ear pain like never before and actually doubled over - OUCH!
I've had tinnitus ever since - BUT - now the intensity, volume and occurence is way less. I might have it one day a week now - no biggie. I was thrilled to learn that the tinnitus can be TMS related. It made sense. Tinnitus does not rule my world anymore :-)
Bliss |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 10:49:14
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As usual TT is correct. The term "feedback loop" is just another fanciful, scientifcally sounding term for Pavlovian conditioning. Those who have had TMS for quite some time develop this conditioning and it is the brain's way of making you think you have a physical / structural problem and that the pain is due to certain movements which must be avoided. It is a real challenge to undo this conditioning, and requires a lot of self-talk on your part.
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Sarno-ize it!
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oz_tgap
10 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 12:42:04
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Thanks all. I have two of Sarno's [three?] books, but have only skimmed them in the past. I am now in the process of reading them more carefully. I think I understand his basic premise - the question is how inaccessible my repressed feelings are and what it's going to take to turn things around.
-Paul |
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Stryder
686 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 16:37:26
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Your brain can and will use past pain against you. A memory of pain from a previous injury can be called up to serve as the distraction.
The "feedback loop" (for lack of a better term) in severe chronic low back pain (LBP) for me was the [spasm, pain, fear, avoid normal activity] cycle that prevents you from getting better and that's how TMS can keep you under its evil control.
I had chronic low back pain for 20+ years. That is gone now thanks to the Good Doctor. I do have a handfull of minor TMS equiv, though, and tinnitus is just one of them (but to be honest with you I'll take the ringing any day over the LBP ;-)
Take care, -Stryder |
Edited by - Stryder on 03/12/2007 16:44:53 |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 18:41:42
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quote:
Originally posted by oz_tgap
- the question is how inaccessible my repressed feelings are and what it's going to take to turn things around.
-Paul
You don't need to do a lot of soul-searching, self-analysis and inner-child work. The beauty of Dr. Sarno's TMS "cure" is that all you have to do is understand the basic premise of the theory. That is that repressed rage creates psychosomatic pain. The pain is real but harmless. When you feel the pain swithch your thoughts from the pain (physical) to the emotional (psychological). Ask yourself what is bugging you causing the structural symptom?
It doesn't matter if you discover the reason or not. Just shifting your brain-wave patterns is enough to de-rail the pain. How long it takes is up to you and your brain. Like snowflakes and finger-prints, everyone's brain/life dynamics are different.
The proof that you have succeded in wrapping your brain around the Good Doctor's theory is when you gradually return to the "normal acitvities" that your symptom was preventing you from participating in.
Good Luck! Keep Reading! Start Doing! |
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carbar
USA
227 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 19:16:55
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quote:
Originally posted by tennis tom
Good Doctor's theory is when you gradually return to the "normal acitvities" that your symptom was preventing you from participating in.
Definitely off topic to this post, but I just had to share that I got the biggest smile from thinking of Tennis Tom coding the strike-through on GOOD DOCTOR for the rest of his days on the forum... |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 19:50:34
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quote:
Originally posted by carbar
quote:
Originally posted by tennis tom
Good Doctor's theory is when you gradually return to the "normal acitvities" that your symptom was preventing you from participating in.
Definitely off topic to this post, but I just had to share that I got the biggest smile from thinking of Tennis Tom coding the strike-through on GOOD DOCTOR for the rest of his days on the forum...
Hi Carbar,
He, He, He, ya I can barely remember why I started doing that--Oh ya, now I remember. There was concern on the board that referring to Dr. Sarno as "the Good Doctor" we were creating a cult following. In an attempt to de-condition myself from the habit and prevent us from drinking the "cult of Sarno" Cool-Ade, I now strike through it sort of like an act of exorcism. |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2007 : 20:41:12
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Heaven forbid that we should be thankful to Dr. Sarno and refer to him as being good!!!!!!!!!
TMS types are anally rententive.
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Sarno-ize it!
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oz_tgap
10 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2007 : 12:21:12
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Lot's of valuable info on this board - thanks.
Do most people need to see a "TMS doctor" or is reading the material and attempting to address the problem on one's own usually sufficient?
-Paul |
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Wavy Soul
USA
779 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2007 : 02:57:29
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Very few of us have seen TMS docs. Reading the books and really getting it is very powerful.
The docs provide what TMSers call the "white coat" effect.
xx
Love is the answer, whatever the question |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2007 : 08:57:20
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I personally have not seen a TMS doctor and don't intend to. Many other people on this board also have not seen a TMS doc. Some may need to in order to reinforce the diagnosis in their minds.....
Read Dr sarno's The Divided Mind if you already haven't.
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Sarno-ize it!
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Suz
559 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2007 : 08:59:25
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| Shawnsmith - does Sarno talk about insomnia in "The divided mind"? |
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oz_tgap
10 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2007 : 12:18:32
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I am reading the book now, and I am mostly through it. I do not recall him discussing insomnia. One would not think of insomnia [in anmd of itself] as good diversionary tactic for the brain.
-Paul |
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