| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| elise8 |
Posted - 05/07/2005 : 14:41:27
Hi all. I just posted a long post and it got deleted because I did not log in first. So to make it a bit shorter. I have finally got rid of most of my dizziness with upper cervical chiropractic care. Make sure you see a chiropractor who specializes in upper cervical care. (NUCCA) National upper cervical chiropractic association.
I was very skeptical as I was convinved it was TMS. But I know my body and I understand TMS. Not all things mentioned in Sarno's books as equivolents are necessarily TMS. I got rid of my shoulder capsulitis/frozen shoulder with physical therapy and it worked. I usted positive thinking and TMS techniques to make the healing faster. It worked. I am back to normal range of motion. No relapses. The PT did really help, a lot.
About six weeks ago I decided to give upper cervical chiro a shot for my dizziness and vertigo problems. Well even with all my skeptisism it worked. They took x-rays, found my C2 (axis) was very twisted and pushed backwards causing my brain stem to be narrowed, not allowing the full amount of blood to go to my brain, hence dizziness, balance problems, vision problems, vertio, brain fog, etc. Now at first I really was kind of skeptic but decided to let him give me a series of adjustments.
Now after six weeks I am holding the adjustments for a week at a time and feeling really great. I could feel the change after the first big adjustment. WOW! Talk about waking up the brain! He said as my muscles get used to the new position the adjustments will hold even longer, I eventually will just come on an as needed basis. I am a bliever. It has not been instant, at first there were some real "changes", but I stuck with it and I am so glad I did. I really did research on this before I found the right chiro. My insurance even covers half so it costs me only about 20 bucks each visit.
The initial with the x-rays were only 100 dollars but he gave me a discount of 50 dollars. So you can think what you want but unless you have this dizziness ongoing you do not understand how horrible it is to live with. I tried to convince myself that it was TMS but it just did not work. I wanted to believe it was TMS and not some structural cause. Some things just need a different approach. i still believe in the TMS theories and use them for many of the little annoying pains I sometimes get. And they do go away with proper thinking and TMS techniques. This vertigo was another story. I really do think there can be missaligments in the upper cervical vertebrae that can cause symptoms. The case histories are just too many to ignore in which people were helped with dizziness, vertigo problems with proper upper cervical chiro care.
Be opened minded. Go to the NUCCA site on the internet and check it out. Read, do research, read case histories. Then find a good NUCCA chiro and just go try it.
I will post in another month to let you all know if I am continuing to have relief but I really think I will be fine now. I am going to stick with what works and what gives me relief. And it is not a drug!!
Take care
Elise
Elise8 |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| FlyByNight |
Posted - 03/03/2006 : 11:00:04
Erratum !
working ( ON YOUR TMS ) will help you prevent these vertebra tilting because your muscles will work properly from a biomecanical perspective.
|
| FlyByNight |
Posted - 03/03/2006 : 10:58:56
just to clarify
my previous message means that I DO BELIEVE THAT VERTEBRAL RESTRICTION OR MISALIGNENT OR WATHEVER ARE TMS SYMTOMS or the RESULT OF TMS SYMPTOMS..
working will help you prevent these vertebra tilting because your muscles will work properly from a biomecanical perspective.
I am begining to see it working on myself actually ... I always had vertebral motion restriction for the last 20 years ... chiro always helped for 1 day or 2 just like you guys. ...
Thinking emotional is helping me far more than anything I did in the past, and yes I truly believe it can restore verterbal motion and alignment to its normal physiological state...
P. |
| FlyByNight |
Posted - 03/03/2006 : 10:52:28
well I would reformulate this
As a medical engineer specialized in medial imaging I am used to see musculo squeletal xrays and CT SCAN. Despite the fact that our spine is very resistent to tork and stress, our vertebra CAN become misaligned but the misalignment has to come from two potential sources
1) huge trauma such as severe car accident or
2) muscle spasm that can tilt a verterbra or two(yes you can clearly see it on xrays ).
In the first case, you will probably need serious surgery to fix the problem. In the second case, it is logical to think that releasing the muscle spasm (by means of working on your TMS For instance) will remove the cause of the vertebra tilting and everything will come back to normal afterwhile.
The problem with chiropractors is that thet work on bones without removing the cause of what create the vertebral misalingment.
So yes its true to say that the spine does not come misaligned BY ITSELF but can be twisted if significant muscle spasms, which are common TMS symtoms, are coming into the way.
P.
|
| Dave |
Posted - 03/03/2006 : 10:09:16
quote:
Originally posted by mtdew_98
...SO, I am a little worried that maybe my dizziness is not from the neck misalignment.
Our vertebrae do not get misaligned. Chiropractic doesn't work, except sometimes as a placebo.
Did you read Dr. Sarno's books? |
| n/a |
Posted - 03/03/2006 : 07:54:23
For chiropractors they seem to always find something "misaligned." No suprise, their whole living depends on it. I have said it before and I will say it again here, chiropractors are liars, crackpots, snake oil merchants and unscuienfitic charlatans. They are also dangerous and, according to many studies, actually cause harm.
Please see: http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1721
You are playing with fire by visiting these bafoons. You might as well have your plumber look at your back as they would be just as much help.... |
| mtdew_98 |
Posted - 03/02/2006 : 20:54:59
Hello Elise,
I am having the same dizzines for 10 months and have seen over 35 doctors and noone knew what's wrong with me. And finally I went to see this Chiropractor which is specialized in Upper Cervical Chiropractor instead of just regular Chiropractors which I used to.
This UC Chiro did some x-rays on me and said my C-1, C-2 is misaligned. He gave me an adjustment during my 1st visit which is 1 week ago and I am seeing him about twice a week. This is my 4th time seeing him and my dizziness is not getting any improvement.
A lot of people said they get instant improvement after the 1st adjustment, but I don’t . SO, I am a little worried that maybe my dizziness is not from the neck misalignment. How soon do you feel improvement since you have seen your Upper Cervical Chiropractor?
quote:
Originally posted by elise8
Hi all. I just posted a long post and it got deleted because I did not log in first. So to make it a bit shorter. I have finally got rid of most of my dizziness with upper cervical chiropractic care. Make sure you see a chiropractor who specializes in upper cervical care. (NUCCA) National upper cervical chiropractic association.
I was very skeptical as I was convinved it was TMS. But I know my body and I understand TMS. Not all things mentioned in Sarno's books as equivolents are necessarily TMS. I got rid of my shoulder capsulitis/frozen shoulder with physical therapy and it worked. I usted positive thinking and TMS techniques to make the healing faster. It worked. I am back to normal range of motion. No relapses. The PT did really help, a lot.
About six weeks ago I decided to give upper cervical chiro a shot for my dizziness and vertigo problems. Well even with all my skeptisism it worked. They took x-rays, found my C2 (axis) was very twisted and pushed backwards causing my brain stem to be narrowed, not allowing the full amount of blood to go to my brain, hence dizziness, balance problems, vision problems, vertio, brain fog, etc. Now at first I really was kind of skeptic but decided to let him give me a series of adjustments.
Now after six weeks I am holding the adjustments for a week at a time and feeling really great. I could feel the change after the first big adjustment. WOW! Talk about waking up the brain! He said as my muscles get used to the new position the adjustments will hold even longer, I eventually will just come on an as needed basis. I am a bliever. It has not been instant, at first there were some real "changes", but I stuck with it and I am so glad I did. I really did research on this before I found the right chiro. My insurance even covers half so it costs me only about 20 bucks each visit.
The initial with the x-rays were only 100 dollars but he gave me a discount of 50 dollars. So you can think what you want but unless you have this dizziness ongoing you do not understand how horrible it is to live with. I tried to convince myself that it was TMS but it just did not work. I wanted to believe it was TMS and not some structural cause. Some things just need a different approach. i still believe in the TMS theories and use them for many of the little annoying pains I sometimes get. And they do go away with proper thinking and TMS techniques. This vertigo was another story. I really do think there can be missaligments in the upper cervical vertebrae that can cause symptoms. The case histories are just too many to ignore in which people were helped with dizziness, vertigo problems with proper upper cervical chiro care.
Be opened minded. Go to the NUCCA site on the internet and check it out. Read, do research, read case histories. Then find a good NUCCA chiro and just go try it.
I will post in another month to let you all know if I am continuing to have relief but I really think I will be fine now. I am going to stick with what works and what gives me relief. And it is not a drug!!
Take care
Elise
Elise8
|
| mtdew_98 |
Posted - 03/02/2006 : 20:51:37
quote:
Originally posted by elise8
Hi all. I just posted a long post and it got deleted because I did not log in first. So to make it a bit shorter. I have finally got rid of most of my dizziness with upper cervical chiropractic care. Make sure you see a chiropractor who specializes in upper cervical care. (NUCCA) National upper cervical chiropractic association.
I was very skeptical as I was convinved it was TMS. But I know my body and I understand TMS. Not all things mentioned in Sarno's books as equivolents are necessarily TMS. I got rid of my shoulder capsulitis/frozen shoulder with physical therapy and it worked. I usted positive thinking and TMS techniques to make the healing faster. It worked. I am back to normal range of motion. No relapses. The PT did really help, a lot.
About six weeks ago I decided to give upper cervical chiro a shot for my dizziness and vertigo problems. Well even with all my skeptisism it worked. They took x-rays, found my C2 (axis) was very twisted and pushed backwards causing my brain stem to be narrowed, not allowing the full amount of blood to go to my brain, hence dizziness, balance problems, vision problems, vertio, brain fog, etc. Now at first I really was kind of skeptic but decided to let him give me a series of adjustments.
Now after six weeks I am holding the adjustments for a week at a time and feeling really great. I could feel the change after the first big adjustment. WOW! Talk about waking up the brain! He said as my muscles get used to the new position the adjustments will hold even longer, I eventually will just come on an as needed basis. I am a bliever. It has not been instant, at first there were some real "changes", but I stuck with it and I am so glad I did. I really did research on this before I found the right chiro. My insurance even covers half so it costs me only about 20 bucks each visit.
The initial with the x-rays were only 100 dollars but he gave me a discount of 50 dollars. So you can think what you want but unless you have this dizziness ongoing you do not understand how horrible it is to live with. I tried to convince myself that it was TMS but it just did not work. I wanted to believe it was TMS and not some structural cause. Some things just need a different approach. i still believe in the TMS theories and use them for many of the little annoying pains I sometimes get. And they do go away with proper thinking and TMS techniques. This vertigo was another story. I really do think there can be missaligments in the upper cervical vertebrae that can cause symptoms. The case histories are just too many to ignore in which people were helped with dizziness, vertigo problems with proper upper cervical chiro care.
Be opened minded. Go to the NUCCA site on the internet and check it out. Read, do research, read case histories. Then find a good NUCCA chiro and just go try it.
I will post in another month to let you all know if I am continuing to have relief but I really think I will be fine now. I am going to stick with what works and what gives me relief. And it is not a drug!!
Take care
Elise
Elise8
|
| ssjs |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 11:04:39
My chiropractor was so kind and sympathetic to me!
Let's beat this thing, he said!
He showed me x-rays and explained where all of the problems were.
I was so relieved to have met him!
After a few "adjustments" I noticed he was double billing my insurance company. Around the same time I found Dr. Sarno.
I "adjusted" myself, and called him up saying I wouldn't be needing his services anymore, to which he replied "you'll be sorry!"
Very professional. This was around 20 years ago, and my mother in law still goes to him!
As I said in another post...
Don't let the bastards scare you!
Sandy |
| Logan |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 09:45:59
All I can say to your post M, is DITTO! I read MBP in one sitting and decided, before even putting the book down, that I would never ever go back to chiro. I wish I had the $4,000+ I spent on it and all the other "naturopathic" treatments that made me feel good only as long as it took me to walk to my car.
I have been pain free for THREE YEARS!
Viva Sarno!
quote:
Originally posted by Maryalma8
Dave,
After spending thousands of dollars on chiros, I have to agree with you. Total placebo effect is what chiro is. I swear to the good lord above on my father's soul, I have NEVER in all the visits I have had with chiros over the past ten years, EVER gotten any relief past maybe a one night of temporary placebo effect, then right back I went, three times a week, more money spent, asking for more adjustments, out of nothing but pure DESPERATION and miseducation. You're so right. Cracking the vertebrea, what a crock. WIth all the money I spent I could have gone to NY and taken Sarno's lecture class, stayed in a ritzy high price fancy schmantzy hotel for a month, drank and ate like a pig the whole month and still have money leftover to celebrate all the relief and cure I would have gotten out of Sarno's lecture. So now here I am, $1000's of dollars later, I can't even count how much I spent on chiros, and all I did was buy Sarno's $14 books and bingo! It worked.....
P.S.
I can honestly say these books saved my life. I wanted to kill myself in Jan/Feb/March of this year from the excruciating pain/frustration/hopelesness. I'm not kidding. I was ready to check out
|
| Scottydog |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 07:40:46
I've had dizzyness on and off for years - usually when I did something that involved reaching up.
Most of my TMS symtoms have gone or vastly improved but the dizzy spells occur briefly and regardless of what I'm doing so I'm sure they are TMS too.
I had Hellerwork (deep muscle massage )last summer and it improved my synmptoms but probably chatting to a kindly and sympathetic therapist was doing the good rather than anything else.
Scottydog |
| Wilf |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 21:01:48
I had Chiropractic treatment for the best part of 30 years. I, too, had some temporary relief, very short-lived. I, too, spent a ton of money. Shortly after the "adjustments", within a day or two, the pain would always come back, but not necessarily in the same place; my pain moved around: upper back, lower back, neck or chest. The pain would become incresingly more intense as I approached the 10-day interval for my treatment. What kept me coming back was the fact that I would get some temporary relief. I would blame myself for not getting better, because the Chiropractor wanted me to set up a systematic program of stretching, but I would not because stretching was too painful.
Three years ago, I was given Sarno's books. I stopped all treatments and the interesting thing is that the pains for which I was receiving the chiropractic treatment went away and have never come back.
I am sure that most readers of this Forum have similar stories.
|
| Baseball65 |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 20:31:53
quote:
P.S.
I can honestly say these books saved my life. I wanted to kill myself in Jan/Feb/March of this year from the excruciating pain/frustration/hopelesness. I'm not kidding. I was ready to check out
I can relate to that....in spring of '99 I was laying in bed contemplating how to do it in such a fashion that would look accidental,so my wife could cash the life insurance policy.
...and THAT might be why so many of us who've been to the deep dark bottom are such TMS purists.
I went to a chiro ONCE since I have been TMS saavy....I had a frozen neck(from anger over a cheating coach in little league)...I knew it was TMS,but instead of painkillers,thought I'd get a few hours of respite from a really deep grinding massage...I expected NO resolution mind you...just a little respite...didn't feel like eating a handful of vikes.
So...I went to the chiro/massage place and told him "Look...I just need a deep tissue massage...there is nothing wrong with me,I'm just really angry"...he looked at me sort of odd,and insisted on Xrays(which my insurance covered)...I said "whatever....just DO NOT tell me what you think the problem is.I don't want to see the Xrays..shut up and dig"
He was really taken aback....I could tell by his "oohing" and "ahh-ing" that he found "subluxations"(biggest LIE in medicine after ADHD)
None the less,he was built like a line backer and had the hands to painfully twist and grind a little blood flow back into the ischemiatic TMS area.I went home and immediately took advantage of this window of opportunity...worked out really hard to challenge the conditioning.The pain came back the next day,not quite as bad....I than realized(the "aha" moment) what it was that I was in a rage about...I threw about 200 pitches in batting practice,and the symptoms were gone.
The chiro told a mutual friend that I was the weirdest patient he ever had.
If my wife had stronger hands,I probably could have had her do it....sometimes when I used to have a spasm,a deep gring losened it up enough to get back to the REAL Tms work...trying to understand what unacceptable emotion has been repressed.
If I wasn't such a dope fiend,I imagine I could have just taken some Narcotic painkiller,but me and them don't get along really well.
but,again Chiropractic care is one of the biggest scams on the planet.....they feed off of peoples frustration with conventional medicine(justifiably) but offer a different sort of PLACEBO
Many Chiros will pretend to agree with Sarno/schecter/Brady type of treatments,but it's an agreement by subtraction .."Oh yeah...we don't believe in modern medicine,so we must be allies,right?"
WRONG
subluxations
ADHD
Depression
Hell...even my OCD is a sham.....don't get me wrong,it was terrifying while it was going on,like back pain,but,like back pain is just another distraction from the realm of the emotions.
Sorry if I sound biased.....I came too close to leaving 2 orphans to allow any BS like that to filter through....somebodies life may depend on it.
Hell...I sometimes wonder if people with "minor aches and pains" even have full blown TMS....I only talk to the very frustrated and desperate...everyone else is using it buffet style...take what you need and leave the rest
pieces
peace
Baseball65 |
| Fredarm57 |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 18:51:15
Mary: Glad to hear you're doing better! Fred |
| marytabby |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 15:46:15
Dave,
After spending thousands of dollars on chiros, I have to agree with you. Total placebo effect is what chiro is. I swear to the good lord above on my father's soul, I have NEVER in all the visits I have had with chiros over the past ten years, EVER gotten any relief past maybe a one night of temporary placebo effect, then right back I went, three times a week, more money spent, asking for more adjustments, out of nothing but pure DESPERATION and miseducation. You're so right. Cracking the vertebrea, what a crock. WIth all the money I spent I could have gone to NY and taken Sarno's lecture class, stayed in a ritzy high price fancy schmantzy hotel for a month, drank and ate like a pig the whole month and still have money leftover to celebrate all the relief and cure I would have gotten out of Sarno's lecture. So now here I am, $1000's of dollars later, I can't even count how much I spent on chiros, and all I did was buy Sarno's $14 books and bingo! It worked. Thank God for this board and all the people on it who woke me up and said get with the program Mary. Wake up and get moving, stop laying in bed feeling hopeless. My time had to come and it did when 6-8 weeks or so ago (I don't do the counting/calendar thing anymore, Sopher says it's bad)I saw a quick segment on my local Boston news about Doc Martinez and Sarno's book and said, "hey, that sounds like me!" I bought the book that night and read it in three days flat. Hallelulah! Free at last! I am free at last! I am sure I will have my bad days but I feel 98% better, thanks to my hard work and belief in the diagnosis, and all of you!
Yahoo! Right on! Yabba Dabba Doo!  Mary
P.S.
I can honestly say these books saved my life. I wanted to kill myself in Jan/Feb/March of this year from the excruciating pain/frustration/hopelesness. I'm not kidding. I was ready to check out
|
| Dave |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 14:37:27
quote:
Originally posted by elise8
Well I guess if I have my choice of being hooked on MDs with all the drugs or surgery or a once a month chiropractic visit, I will take the chiropractor any day. I agree chiropractic is not warranted for TMS. But if it is not TMS then I think chiropractic care or physical therapy can be very helpful.
Physical therapy certainly has its place ... rehabilitation from serious injury or surgery, or from atrophy that develops from years of untreated TMS (e.g. frozen shoulder). But chronic TMS is often misdiagnosed leading to physical therapy that does not solve the problem, and can even make matters worse.
As for chiropractic we'll have to agree to disagree. As hard as it was for me to reach this conclusion, chiropractic adjustments are useless. Our bones do not get misaligned. Our vertebrae are strong. A chiropractic adjustment does nothing more than to release gas from the joints and provide temporary placebo relief. |
| elise8 |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 11:48:26
Well I guess if I have my choice of being hooked on MDs with all the drugs or surgery or a once a month chiropractic visit, I will take the chiropractor any day. I agree chiropractic is not warranted for TMS. But if it is not TMS then I think chiropractic care or physical therapy can be very helpful.
I have a couple friends who are are elderly and take very good care of themselves. One is 88 and the other 90. They do not go to medical doctors, are extremely healthy, take no medicines. Both of them go to chiropractors regularly and have done so for many many years. Wow, I think I will take that plan of action any day over the one most people chose today, that is,going to MD after MD, taking one toxic drug after another or undergoing pointless surgery.
I can see that this is not a popular topic on this TMS board so I will curtail the posts for a while. If my symptoms do come back I will let you all know. However, if they abate and require me to only go for a once a month check up and then eventually once very few months, I will also let you know. I just think that if I find some relief after 2-3 years of suffering, then there must be some validity to it.
I was also hooked on chiro for my lower back for years. But the funny thing is, I did not get more than 2 days relief at a time and had to keep going back and back and back. I finally quit going, found out about Sarno, read the books and the severe back pain ended. (I still get occasional stiffiness). This situtaiton is different, at least for me. The Sarno techniques just did not work for me in this situation. Nor did they for my frozen shoulder after an injury. I chose a different option (PT) and it worked. No more shoulder problems. I did not get "hooked" on PT. I do not plan to get hooked on chiro. I hope to wean down to once a month and then if I have no problems I will stop.
So, if some of you just are too focused only on TMS as the cause of all evils than so be it. I will sign off for now and talk to you all later. No hard feelings and it has been an interesting discussion.
Elise
Elise8 |
| Dave |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 11:22:29
I was hooked on chiro for years. My chiropractor was a good friend.
Now I cringe whenever I think of those neck adjustments. How did I ever let someone do that to me? It seems crazy now.
Anyway, I don't want this thread to turn into a protracted debate about chiropractic. Suffice it to say that chiropractic care is absolutely contradictory to TMS. So, make your choice ... it cannot be both. |
| elise8 |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 11:06:35
Actually Paul, my primary physician is an osteopath and I talked to him. He said that chiro could help. He would adjust me but a chiro would be better as they do it all day long and have much more practice. My primary hardly ever does adjustments. He even gets adjustments from a chiro friend of his. My primary mainly just orders diagnostic tests and writes prescriptions. Wow, they really learned a lot in med school I guess. Prescription writing and test ordering can be difficult! Physicians these days just rarely actually do any hands on stuff. Very rarely has my doctor actually palpated me to see what is wrong. Mostly the he just puts the stethoscope over my heart and lungs and then gets out is RX pad. Anything that is FDA approved and they can't get sued.
But since they go to med school I guess they are more qualified to evaluate what is wrong with you versus a chiropractor ---not always.
So far I still feel great. Am going for another visit to the chiro this Wed. Also have recieved relief in other areas. He has been adjusting my mid back also. I have been breathing much better these days with much less lung congestion. Amazing.
I have in the past had some not so great chiropractors that really do not know how to evaluate properly for subluxations in the cervical area. You have to shop around and find the right one. Just like physicians. There are some good ones and some bad ones.
I will post more later on and let you know if this relief is temporary or not...
Elise
Elise8 |
| Caroline |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 10:10:31
quote:
Originally posted by elise8
I have finally got rid of most of my dizziness with upper cervical chiropractic care.
Hi Elise,
It is quite possible that the chiropractic care had a real beneficial impact on your dizziness. I suffered from dizziness and vertigo for several months and it went away by itself (mainly because the TMS moved to my neck!) but a physical therapist had given me some relief by working on my C2 joint. I also got noticeable (though short-lived) relief from an acupuncturist. I think physical therapy and chiropractic care are similar to drugs and surgery in the sense that they may provide relief but do not solve the problem. If you see a resurgence of these problems, you should probably do some serious TMS prevention work or you'll be in and out of doctors' offices for a long time to come.
Good luck Elise, I'm glad you are feeling better! |
| pault |
Posted - 05/08/2005 : 08:11:49
Placebo all the way! See what the mind can do? Chiropractors have no real medical training,if you showed those x-rays to a Radiologist he /she would laugh.There is no way those foolish adjustments wiil work.That is a non-scientific business for good reason.Too bad their medical trainning is not a good as their sales training.All of this is T.M.S. If you want to do spinal manipulation at least see a real Medical Doctor,like an Osteopath who has been to med school.Good Luck to You! Paul. |
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