| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| joan |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 13:48:29
Has anyone suffered from anxiety and deprerssion from their tms pain? If so would medication help relieve this symptom??a Any thoughts would be appreciated |
| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 07/31/2013 : 22:01:40
Ace,
I probably didn't explain the story very well... but they both had blood clots.
One of them is an anxious mess, the other has lived a happy life and actually, I just watched him compete in another company basketball tournament today, healthy as can be.
He travels, has a great family... and obviously exercises. He hasn't let a physical issue or fear of a physical issue destroy his life. |
| Ace1 |
Posted - 07/31/2013 : 16:58:33
Dear Bryan, the guy wth the blood clots is a major repressor. He s just not afraid of his symptoms. This person is stil very prone to illness but not as much as te person who ALSO fears their symptoms. |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 07/31/2013 : 12:25:41
Joan,
Of course. Every single person here (who has not overcome their TMS) is an anxiety personality. Read the posts. Nothing but fear, worry, concern. Many of the people who have recovered don't even believe in Sarno's theories of TMS, but many do. I personally think TMS and anxiety are one in the same. Sarno said as much, only he called anxiety a "TMS equivalent." He says tomato, some people say tomahto.
Here's one thing I do know... anxiety (or TMS) cannot exist without fear and worry about the symptoms.
Here's a story I posted a while back about an interaction I noticed one day in my workplace. It's a bit long, but to me clearly defines the difference between sufferer and non-sufferer in the face of medical issues and why so many say that anxiety (TMS) cannot exist without the fear mindset...
As a side note: The point of the story is NOT to tell anyone to disregard a clear medical issue. The point is how the same thing happened to two people... one's life was in shambles and one went happily about his business.......
So, a coworker brings a friend into the office and we're all sitting in my office chatting for quite a while. It becomes obvious this friend of his we'll call Matt has been through a real spell of health concern. Essentially, he's had two very minor blood clots in his leg. Neither were threatening and both treated right away. But, he had to be on medication and he was extremely nervous about it. Said the medicine gave him side effects, etc. He thought it made him an old person. He was obviously nervous about the condition and took it personally, as well. He mentioned he had lost weight due to worry, and felt weak. (He had been a runner prior to the clot.)
Through conversation, it also became clear that he was an anxiety personality. (Takes one to know one.) He fit the bill. Creative guy (musician).. very intelligent, very caring and seemed like a good person. Pretty much the standard profile for anxiety. He seemed consumed with the effects this could have on his life. He hated the idea of wearing a little bracelet because of the medication. He also spoke of various aches and pains that moved around his body. (Sound familiar?) He essentially admitted to having great anxiety over the problem, though it was apparent he had great anxiety in general. (He also spoke of financial worry, etc.) This man was inside his head... often. Wasn't hard to recognize.
After all, I am in the process of recovering from a myriad of health issues, mostly stress/anxiety-created and sustained.
So, just then I remember... hey, another co-worker of ours we'll call Pete had blood clot issues. I thought, hey... let's call him down into my office and see if he's wiling to share a bit. (He's a very cool, laid back guy.) So, we call Pete down. He comes in. I take the lead to ask some questions for Matt's sake, since the two didn't know each other...
Me: So Pete, you had a couple of blood clots, no?
Pete: Yeah, two big ones, one in each leg.
Me: So how is it now?
Pete: Oh, fine. No problem.
Me: But are you on meds?
Pete: Oh yea, meds for life or until I hear differently.
Me: No issues?
Pete: Nah.
Me: But, don't you worry about bleeding issues if you cut yourself?
Pete: Not really. They wanted me to wear this stupid bracelet but I threw it away. If the mediation is doing its job, I'm where I need to be anyway. I'm not worried about it. The only annoying thing is the compression sock I have to wear, but I just take it off when I play basketball.
Me: Oh right! You play ball at lunch twice a week here outside right?
Pete: Yeah. You've probably seen my calves after I play. They swell up like a fat old lady. (Laughs)
Me: So is that dangerous? Aren't you worried about playing?
Pete: Nah. It goes down after a while.
Me: Wow, but didn't you tell me you were close to losing your leg after one of your blood clots?
Pete: Yeah. But here they are.
Me: That could have seriously affected your basketball game.
Pete: No, probably not. (Laughs) .... anyway, awesome meeting you Matt, I have to jump back to work. Have a great visit!
--
Pete walks out, closes the door... we all just sort of sit quiet for a minute looking at each other. |
| njoy |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 23:50:00
I am firmly in the "forget it" camp on this one. I'm pushing 70 and can't think of a single person I know who was anxious, took antidepressents, and recovered to a normal life, long term. Plus:
"The television program, 60 Minutes, recently addressed the volume of research on the lack of efficacy of anti-depressant medications. This research began over a decade ago and has shown that anti-depressant medications are not much more effective than placebo (sugar pill). In fact on 60 Minutes, Dr. Irving Kirsch (associate director of the placebo research program at Harvard) questions whether the only benefit they have is the placebo effect. The placebo effect creates an expectation of healing so powerful that it can actually decrease symptoms. The placebo effect works with pain, irritable bowel syndrome, knee pain and much more. Even though individuals with depression may get better taking these medications, it may not be due to the medication, rather to the placebo effect."
Source: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/real-healing/201202/do-anti-depressants-really-work
I love the way these articles/doctors/scientists/drug companies,etc. say "oh yes, the research proves it doesn't actually work so maybe it's placebo but it's quite a good one so go ahead and take it, anyway." Is that logical? No, it's not.
I would be all for placebos if they were harmless and made people feel better, long term. Neither is true. So, what is true? Anxiety is TMS. It's just one more way your mind has to prevent you thinking about uncomfortable stuff, stuff you don't want to even start thinking about. Depression is a bit different. In my experience it is a way to live with an impossible situation. TMS (in all its myriad forms) is often both. Ultimately, none of these (anxiety, depression, TMS) are useful solutions and neither is medication, except perhaps in the direst emergency.
If you are determined to throw yourself off a building unless the pain stops NOW then take the pill and good luck to you. Otherwise, I vote no.
I am really getting sick of being surrounded by people who won't even consider that their suffering is psychosomatic. "That would mean I'm crazy!" they say. That's ridiculous. TMS (or whatever you want to call it) is the human condition, Sarno says. Those of us who are here, on these forums, can feel proud that we are in a tiny minority of people willing to explore the possibility that we are not victims, that we actually have some control over our own lives. Let the wussies take the pills.
*****
"It's worth considering that tms is not a treatment but rather an unfolding of the self, and a way of living as an emotionally aware and engaged soul." Plum |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 18:40:14
Joan,
Here's some excerpts from a post I wrote a while back on the topic, I'll try to find some others:
" Nothing wrong with taking anti-depressants if they're needed, the right one for you, and prescribed by a competent physician for the short term to get you through a rough patch.
" I can't quote you chapter and verse but I believe Dr. Sarno mentions anti-depressants, read the books and do a search here using the "SEARCH" tab above right.
"I've seen some reports in TMS complementary back books using small doses of anti-depressants, Celexa, I think. They do make you kinda' "separated" from the now. If your "now" is a highly anxious worried state, then it might be beneficial for a short stint.
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts
Posted - 09/16/2006 : 17:58:37 Show Profile Email Poster Reply with Quote
I use antidepressants (particularly Effexor, Cymbalta, and nortriptyline) with many of my patients diagnosed with TMS. My rationale is that it can give people a "kickstart" to feeling better, both in regards to mood and pain issues, and make them better able to start the TMS work. Also, people want to feel like you are "doing something" for them, giving them information about a book to read does not fall under that category for most.
As a side note, I have been trying to keep track of the patients I give a TMS diagnosis. I estimate that at this point, 50% or fewer show up for a second appointment, and fewer than 50% of the people that actually do follow up have any interest in pursuing the concept. Maybe half of those have any improvement. Talk about frustration!
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That's a small sampling of doing a search on "anti-depressants". I recommend you do a "SEARCH" here and you will find pages of threads on the topic, then make up your own mind on which direction to go with.
G'luck
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| joan |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 17:43:14
quote:
Originally posted by joan
Has anyone suffered from anxiety and deprerssion from their tms pain? If so would medication help relieve this symptom??a Any thoughts would be appreciated
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| icelikeaninja |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 16:35:55
Well spoken.
The anxiety will just perpetuate and make you doubt tms. Thus a vicious cycle.
For instance I have not had pain in quite a few days, can honestly say 99-100 percent better.
Today been having a little bit of a flare up, noticed my anxiety was being more than usual as well. I put it together that the pain is not what is causing the anxiety it is the situation I have put on myself that is causing the anxiety.
It would be to easy to blame my anxiety on my pain today but really it has nothing to do with it.
There are triggers we do not know about, it takes an intellectual understanding of what I mean but on a deeper level. It really has to sink into the unconcious mind.
It took me three months of doubting and going back and fourth is this tms or no? TMS doctor says so, regular doctor says so, but I know my body its not tms.
But really it is. We put ourselves in this and we can get ourselves out, it really is based on when we come to terms with tms.
**Sure I can lay down on a bed of nails and not have pain but why am I having back pain when laying down on a soft mattress? |
| art |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 16:14:06
Hi Joan,
I agree with ice above wholeheartedly. These kinds of medications tend to create additional problems, even if they're effective, if taken on a long term basis especially. IN the case of anti-depressants, they really won't work if you've got genuine, situational sadness in your life. In other words, if you're unhappy because of unmet needs for a prime example, medication can't help this.
Tranquilizers are addictive, disruptive to short term memory, and increasingly ineffective with repeated use. Ultimately, by far the best approach is to learn to deal with anxiety without chemical aids.
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| icelikeaninja |
Posted - 07/28/2013 : 14:05:17
I have been wanting to post about this so badly. We usually tend to think the pain caused our anxiety but it is usually the other way around.
Be very wary of medication. I was on Lexapro for anxiety after my girlfriend broke up with me. The anxiety went away so I weened myself off Lexapro, then I got pain. Now when I dont have pain I have massive anxiety when I wake up in the morning.
There is no magic pill for what ails us. A common misconception hat people have is that they'd be better without the pain or do this without the pain.
I noticed with the pain you have to fake it until you make it. Live with the pain and do your best to get on with life.
**Sure I can lay down on a bed of nails and not have pain but why am I having back pain when laying down on a soft mattress? |
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