| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| All1Spirit |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 16:25:04
I don’t want to challenge Dr. Sarno’s ground breaking work but consider this. It is well accepted in psychology that behind the emotions of: frustration – shame – grief – anger and rage is the core emotion of Hurt.
When I came home at age 8 and found my father was packing to leave the family I was not initially angry, I was hurt, then sad then angry. When I found my former wife having an affair I was at first hurt then angry.
Hurt precedes these other emotions and anger can be a smoke screen to deny hurt. In fact in psychology when we teach assertiveness skills you don’t report the anger you report the hurt.
So when your friend stands you up, you can go to anger and risk a confrontation or you can report the core emotions: “ I am really hurt you forgot our date.”
So as I begin this work and look at all the disappointments I feel the need to go deeper than anger and rage and see the source of hurt and feel how it hurt!
I also suspect that since it is our inner child that is a prime emotional part, that mine is really pissed that I have allowed all this unfelt emotional energy to be heaped on him and he is not having any more of it.
"Around and Around the Circle We Go....
The Answer Sits In The Middle and Knows..." |
| 10 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| balto |
Posted - 02/18/2013 : 20:17:33
hi All1spirit, I think what happened to you is that your whole life you keep maintain this "I am a victim" mentality in your mind and that is what feed your mind with negative emotions. The past is the past, just let go of it, forget it, forgive the past, move on. Yes I know it easier said than done, but you have to if you want to heal. It can not be healthy for you living in the past or hold on to the angers and the hatred or whatever negative emotions you are holding on to. (I'm a not believer in the subconcious emotions)
I hope you don't think that I'm trying to make the pain in your past seem insignificant, but if you look around the world, there are million of people who have it much much worse than us and yet you rarely have tms symptoms.
Take my country Vietnam for example. The country was colonized by the French, it wasn't easy living life at that time. Then the Japanese invaded during ww2, more than 2 million people die from starvation, imprisonment, tortured, rapes, execution... My mom used to tell me there are not a single family in her village that didn't loose some loveone to the Japanese. Then after the Japanese leave, we endure another 20+ years of civil war (people called it the Vietnam war in the US) another 3 million people die, million more missing, million more died at sea trying to escape, millions are disable due to war wounds...
Torture, hunger, forced labor, restricted freedom, re-education camps, prisons... was the norm for the first 10 years under communist rule. People died, family being broken up...
And yet the rate of mindbody illness in Vietname is much much lower than it is in the west. Why?
Physically vietnamese are much smaller, less healthy compare to people in the west. They are subjected to hard physical labor much more than people in the west but yet their backs rarely hurt. They were tortured mentally everyday with all that happened to them and around them and yet they rarely have MB symptoms. Why?
I'm not exactly sure why but this is what I suspected that help protected them from "contracting" mindbody illnesses:
Most of them lived in close living space and share the space with lots of people. Their days are filled with activity and non stop conversation with other, there are rarely any moment of "aloneness", they don't have a chance to dwell on their own problem or their horrible past. They always have to focus on making a living, focus on survival, focus on being alive, they don't have time to feel sorry for themself. To increase their chance to be alive and survive, they have to work together. They have to learn to help and share with each other. And by that, them problems seem smaller, seem easier to handle. Traumas and lost are easier to accept...
I also suspect their religion is helping too. Buddhism is the dominant religion in Vietnam, people believe what happened to them in this life is the result of how they live their last life. Bad things happened because they did something bad in their last life, and good things happened as reward for something they did good in their last life. So they are more "acceptance" of what happened. And that keep their fear and their anger low.
I observed the same thing in India, Thailand, cambodia, Malaysia, Phillipine... I really believe in the comforting power of healthy relationship. And I believe the past can only hurt you if you keep dwelling on it, keep re-living it. I believed that if we can be acceptance of what happened to us then move on, we can minimize the bad effect of negative emotions that we had on our health. Don't be a victim, believe in yourself. Other, millions of others can do it so can we.
Get rid of all fear thoughts, believe in yourself, believe that you are healthy, then you will.
------------------------
No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
| All1Spirit |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 09:12:48
Hey Balto
My wife and several other friends have no problem going with the flow or just being. When my wife had surgery she was more concerned about getting good food – not the competence of the doctors or the outcome.
What differentiates them from me is their “innocence.” They have few if any major traumas in their lives...I once asked my wife if she had any painful memories in her childhood, yes she said, one time a girl made fun of her new dress. Other than that she remembers all the great times with her cousins, sisters, aunts and uncles and especially her grand parents.
My childhood is slanted towards pain and the book of insults would run into the hundreds of pages. She has a positive outlook and a very high stress tolerance....so yes she has internalized a belief that everything is good and will turn out right – we were given different colored glasses in our youth!
The more times you incur and insult or hurt the more raw the nervous system is and the easier it is to pull the trigger of over response.
"Around and Around the Circle We Go....
The Answer Sits In The Middle and Knows..." |
| balto |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 09:04:33
quote:
Originally posted by RageSootheRatio
On Balto's mention of "desire" ... I have also thought that having DESIRE is actually one of the greatest GIFTS in life, but I suppose it is true it is a double-edged sword. But to go through life with extremely little desire can also make life very bleak, in my experience.
RSR
You are very right, without "desire" life for us human would be so boring. But we don't have to elliminate desire from our life, we just have to be more acceptance to what happen to our lives. Sh.. happened, we just have to move on with life. Failure will happened, Thomas Edition failed thousand of his experiments before he succeeded in making the light bulb. We can just accept failure a few hundred times and life will be much more pleasant. Accept our fears then let go of them, everything will just be a lesson, a memory.
Easier said than done but with practice, with a set mind, it can be done.
------------------------
No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
| RageSootheRatio |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 08:44:12
This is a very interesting discussion. Thanks for starting it, All1Spirit (and for the record, I have appreciated ALL your posts, whether they be questions, more of your own story, thoughts, etc. I think it makes the board more lively, which is great.)
It is interesting about this idea, going "below" the anger or shame or grief and arriving at a core emotion of hurt. One thing I have found helpful in "processing" my feelings is going through /expressing the whole "flow" of them (I feel angry that... , I feel sad that, I feel afraid that ... I regret that ...) AND THEN to write a "response letter" back ... Part of this is from the journalling tools of Emotional Brain Training, which I believe was "borrowed" (with acknowledgement in some places) to John Gray (he calls them "love letters" I believe.)
On Balto's mention of "desire" ... I have also thought that having DESIRE is actually one of the greatest GIFTS in life, but I suppose it is true it is a double-edged sword. But to go through life with extremely little desire can also make life very bleak, in my experience.
RSR |
| balto |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 08:27:11
quote:
Originally posted by All1Spirit
I don’t want to challenge Dr. Sarno’s ground breaking work but consider this. It is well accepted in psychology that behind the emotions of: frustration – shame – grief – anger and rage is the core emotion of Hurt.
When I came home at age 8 and found my father was packing to leave the family I was not initially angry, I was hurt, then sad then angry. When I found my former wife having an affair I was at first hurt then angry.
Hurt precedes these other emotions and anger can be a smoke screen to deny hurt. In fact in psychology when we teach assertiveness skills you don’t report the anger you report the hurt.
So when your friend stands you up, you can go to anger and risk a confrontation or you can report the core emotions: “ I am really hurt you forgot our date.”
So as I begin this work and look at all the disappointments I feel the need to go deeper than anger and rage and see the source of hurt and feel how it hurt!
I also suspect that since it is our inner child that is a prime emotional part, that mine is really pissed that I have allowed all this unfelt emotional energy to be heaped on him and he is not having any more of it.
"Around and Around the Circle We Go....
The Answer Sits In The Middle and Knows..."
some of the Eastern philosophy I've read would believe that "desire" and "fear" would come before hurt and other negative emotions. Without desires we would have fear and other emotions. You desired a stable family, a loving parents. You fear your father's leaving will take away all that and that fear produce all other negative feeling: hurt, angry, shame... The stronger the desire, the stronger your fear will be and it will hurt more.
Same thing happened when you found out about the ex's affair.
But if that ex were someone you no longer care for, no longer love, and you just could stand living with her anymore, her affair wouldn't hurt much or at all. Without a desire to continue your relationship with her, fear and hurt wouldn't happen inside you.
Many philosophers taught us how to minimize our mental pains with their timeless teachings:
Life is impermanent. (Buddha)
Life move on, it doesn't wait for us. Nothing last forever, even our pains. Live in the present, don't let our mind fall behind in the past or way ahead into the future. Our happiness is right here now with us.
You can conquer almost any fear if you will only make up your mind to do so. For remember, fear doesn't exist anywhere except in the mind. (Dale Carnegie)
Power of choices. We choose what go in and out of our mind. With practices, with meditation, with mindpower... we can take back control of our mind, or thinking. (use Ace1's method)
Why are ye fearful, O ye of little faith? (Jesus)
Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for you are with me; your rod and your staff, they comfort me. (bible)
Have faith in yourself, have hope, a man without hope and faith is almost like a dead man. We have to get rid of our fear. It is one of the most destructive emotion known to men. Make up your mind, live without fear and life will be wonderful again. Put your faith in a higher power.
Just a thought.
------------------------
No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
| Sylvia |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 08:25:08
quote:
Originally posted by All1Spirit
I don’t want to challenge Dr. Sarno’s ground breaking work but consider this. It is well accepted in psychology that behind the emotions of: frustration – shame – grief – anger and rage is the core emotion of Hurt.
When I came home at age 8 and found my father was packing to leave the family I was not initially angry, I was hurt, then sad then angry. When I found my former wife having an affair I was at first hurt then angry.
Hurt precedes these other emotions and anger can be a smoke screen to deny hurt. In fact in psychology when we teach assertiveness skills you don’t report the anger you report the hurt.
So when your friend stands you up, you can go to anger and risk a confrontation or you can report the core emotions: “ I am really hurt you forgot our date.”
So as I begin this work and look at all the disappointments I feel the need to go deeper than anger and rage and see the source of hurt and feel how it hurt!
I also suspect that since it is our inner child that is a prime emotional part, that mine is really pissed that I have allowed all this unfelt emotional energy to be heaped on him and he is not having any more of it.
"Around and Around the Circle We Go....
The Answer Sits In The Middle and Knows..."
You have also posted this exact thing word for word in Dr. Schubiners forum. I wrote a response to you in Dr. Schubiners forum that since you have arrived here at TMSHelp on Feb 2 you have made 89 posts and counting with an average of 5 posts a day. And that I hope you don't plan to try and hold court on Dr. Schubiners forum. There is around 5 posts a day from the entire forum.
Of course you will do whatever you want. |
| All1Spirit |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 06:37:54
Shawn
I suspect that like I , there was no one to help you process the grief of losing your father. Missing an abusive parent is pretty common. My father was a cheater but not abusive, but my mother then married a succession of alcoholics and one was abusive. I ran away at age 16. Lots of drama and negative stuff for many years.
Still it was not until I was about 25 that I had any thought that my family life was difficult and much later before I saw it as abuse.
When I was 8 and you were 14 the reasoning part of the brain is still developing so the emotional part takes a big hit. I don’t think you ever get over it and for you it was time when having a father is so critical. Boys need a man to leave the security of the mother and learn independence and power in the world.
"Around and Around the Circle We Go....
The Answer Sits In The Middle and Knows..." |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 06:12:02
With my own particular biography, my father left my mother when I was only 14. Dad was a both a cheater and an abuser. As an adult looking back I can see mom and dad's divorce as being a good thing overall. But I was the baby of the family and I did not understand all these things at the time. I remember feeling really hurt by dad leaving as well as lonely. To this day I feel mom and dad's divorce affected me negatively more than anything else. That was 34 years ago. I am the only one of my siblings who still keeps in regular contact with dad. To this day, dad does not see he did anything wrong even though he caused a lot of people to suffer. He blames people for living in the past, of being childish and not being forgiving. |
| plum |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 03:28:14
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OOKQ3RBDKy4
Is it an horrific dream
Am I sinking fast
Could a person be so mean
As to laugh and laugh
On my own
Could you ease my load
Could you see my Pain
Could you please explain
The Hurting
Could you understand a child
When he cries in Pain
Could you give him all he needs
Or do you feel the same
All along
You've been told you're wrong
When you felt it right
And you're left to fight
The Hurting
Get in line with the things you know
Feel the Pain
Feel the sorrow
Touch the hurt and don't let go
Get in line with the things you know
Learn to cry Like a baby
Then the hurting won't come back
***
The Hurting is one of the most underrated albums from the 80's.
I saw them live. Awesome. |
| chickenbone |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 17:30:41
Yes, All1Spirit, "hurt" is a big part of it also. It goes along with anger. I felt terribly hurt when I was physically abused by a babysitter and my parents would not believe me. I think there is a big dose of hurt if we were victims of childhood abuse or just had parents that were unavailable to tend to our emotional needs. |
|
|
