| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| susan828 |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 12:59:07
I have read all of Sarnos' books. He says not to think about what's bothering you now because it's the old subconscious stuff that's causing us to create pain. So what am I supposed to think about when the pain starts? Just saying "this is psychological" is not helping me. Reassuring myself that there is nothing structurally wrong isn't helping because I know that already. I am feeling very skeptical now because I just don't understand this. I am intelligent, I am trying but I don't know what to say to myself to stop the pain.
I also have done the Schubiner workbook. He tells you to write down what is bothering you now, which seems to contradict Sarno. I am so confused now. Is there a book that explains this better...what I am supposed to do, say to myself? I find Sarnos's writings too abstract. I would like something that explains this better. I really want to stop hurting and would appreciate some advice. |
| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| lynnl |
Posted - 04/22/2012 : 11:07:28
In reading all the many comments written here by others who have had success with their Sarno/TMS recovery, the one thing that stands out to me is the wide variations in perceptions. Now much of that I'm sure is simply owing to differences in the way we express ourselves. But I think it's more the result of actual differences in our experiences. Certainly I see similarities with my own experiences, but I see as many, if not more, differences. Probably the one contributor whose comments most closely mirror my own thoughts is Darko.
My point is, this seems to be uniquely different for everyone. Of course that's not surprising, since we all are in fact uniquely different.
After I started having success, which came very quickly for me, the one main overall impression I got was, this is the "Ultimate Paradox."
It all seemed totally counterintuitive. The way to stop the pain was to NOT TRY to stop the pain. But rather concentrate my effort on dealing with my emotional household. The pain termination was the by-product, not the main goal.
I can fully understand your confusion Susan, over just what it is you're supposed to think about. I felt the same. Just what does he mean by "think psychological?" I started out by trying to recall my early childhood. Did my parents beat me? Abuse me? Nope! Eventually I did start focusing on an early incident when I was just starting school, when an older boy started picking on me. I had not recalled that incident for probably 50 years. It led to other early memories. I really got totally involved and consumed by those thoughts. At some point in that "thought session" I felt the pain totally extinguish.
Now as to the 100% confidence and certainty of the TMS theory validity: reading Healing Back Pain and seeing how it fit my situation perfectly made me PRETTY DARN CERTAIN that this was it. But it was only after I felt that pain extinguish that I was truly 100% certain. So I take issue with the notion that you have to be absolutely, 100% certain before it will work for you. I submit that NO ONE is ever 100% certain until AFTER they experience it working for them. So don't worry that there's some tiny residual bit of doubt in your mind.
Likewise, on the matter of what (or perhaps when) emotional issues are relevant: as I said, I started searching for long-buried traumatic events or experiences. But I quickly discovered that it didn't matter one iota whether I focused on long forgotten, or current issues. The only important thing was that my thoughts and focus was on emotional things or issues. In my case I found tender, poignant, loving thoughts to be most effective. I specifically avoided anger and negative emotions. Though in retrospect I think those might work well for some other people.
I kinda view this as the mental equivalent to learning to ride a bicycle. It helps to get pointers, but ultimately one has to get on, fall a few times, keep trying, until finally you develop the feel for what works and keeps you balanced and upright.
Lynn |
| susan828 |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 18:42:24
It's funny that you mention Steve's book because I ordered it before I even saw your post. It sounds like something that may resonate more easily with me than Sarno, we'll see. I have seen the stress scale. I have a good score on that. Nothing has changed much. I've just had an anxiety filled life, since childhood...fearful, health anxiety, regular anxiety, fibromyalgia. When the fibro stopped the day I broke up with someone who was giving me stress, truly stopped after 2 years of agony, I knew something gives here, along the lines of TMS.
I can't afford therapy. The practitioners in my area who are listed don't take insurance. I have called all of them. I did Schubiner's workbook and CD but never finished it. Time to go back. It has not one bad review on Amazon, not even 1 star taken away from maximum allowed. I am looking forward to Steve's book though. Thanks so much for your replies. I will not give up trying. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 18:22:59
Susan, another suggestion, purchase SteveO's new TMS book,"THE GREAT PAIN DECEPTION". His TMS saga has been a long one and may give you encouragement. I'm currently reading page 8 for the fourth time and plan on reading that page at least ten times.
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| Sarnotic-nerve |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 18:21:31
Susan, it definitely takes time for many people.
And as tennistom mentioned, maybe seeing a TMS specialist would help. In terms of strategies, there are billions of people In this world suffering from TMS, so there's no 3 step miracle process for everyone. But there are tactics..many of them you already know about.
You did the Schubiner workbook. Have you tried his program?
______________
The pain is real! The cause...well, that's complicated. ;) |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 17:06:18
Susan, have you looked at the Rahe/Holmes list?
HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
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| tennis tom |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 17:01:08
quote:
Originally posted by susan828
I have read all of Sarnos' books. He says not to think about what's bothering you now because it's the old subconscious stuff that's causing us to create pain. So what am I supposed to think about when the pain starts?
Susan, I was replying to the above, either my understanding of the Good Doctor is at fault or your's is. If reading the books is no longer helping it may be time to see a TMS professional. There's just so much help you can get from a message board from people who don't have first hand knowledge of your life's issues.
Good Luck
==================================================
DR. SARNO'S 12 DAILY REMINDERS:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0dKBFwGR0g
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
"Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint." Mark Twain and Balto
======================================================
TMS PRACTITIONERS:
John Sarno, MD
400 E 34th St, New York, NY 10016
(212) 263-6035
Here's the TMS practitioners list from the TMS Help Forum:
http://www.tmshelp.com/links.htm
Here's a list of TMS practitioners from the TMS Wiki:
http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Find_a_TMS_Doctor_or_Therapist
Here's a map of TMS practitioners from the old Tarpit Yoga site, (click on the map by state for listings).:
http://www.tarpityoga.com/2007_08_01_archive.html |
| susan828 |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 16:30:43
Tom, the 12 principles in the video are in the book. I have read them. I want to know what to say to myself, what to do. I know what happened to me during my life that has caused me to be an emotional wreck. I am in so much pain in my jaw, my head, and saying "it's psychological" and "there's nothing wrong structurally" doesn't help. Some of you have been here for a long time and I am hoping for some concrete strategies, what to actually say to myself, what to do, that will work. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 16:09:28
Yeah, when the TMS pain hits, you're supposed to shift your thoughts to the psychological/emotional, exploring what is bothering you in the back-ground. The TMS reservoir was constructed and began filling long ago forming the TMS personality. It's the stuff going on now that's filling it to overflowing necessitating the symptom to prevent the village downstream from being flooded. For examples of current emotional stresors see the Rahe/Holmes list in my sig below, there's your science.
==================================================
DR. SARNO'S 12 DAILY REMINDERS:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0dKBFwGR0g
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
"Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint." Mark Twain and Balto
======================================================
TMS PRACTITIONERS:
John Sarno, MD
400 E 34th St, New York, NY 10016
(212) 263-6035
Here's the TMS practitioners list from the TMS Help Forum:
http://www.tmshelp.com/links.htm
Here's a list of TMS practitioners from the TMS Wiki:
http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Find_a_TMS_Doctor_or_Therapist
Here's a map of TMS practitioners from the old Tarpit Yoga site, (click on the map by state for listings).:
http://www.tarpityoga.com/2007_08_01_archive.html |
| Sarnotic-nerve |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 14:43:17
I don't recall read Dr. Sarno recommending "not to think about what is bothering you." There is no duality! The mind and body are one...he says it a million times.
It's very tough to access and interpret your subconscious, especially in relation to TMS. In fact that's why Dr. Sarno works so closely with his patients and their psychotherapists (psychotherapists he recommends, who work with TMS)
But it's quite easy to look at your life and circumstances to figure out what might be causing tension, stress, anxienty, panic, etc... This is always helpful to a person's well being- IMO. "Feel your feelings!"
So just saying, "this is psychological" isn't going to help eradicate your pain. You have to know 100% that it's psychological.
Self awareness is the key to TMS recovery
______________
The pain is real! The cause...well, that's complicated. ;) |
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