| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| avik |
Posted - 04/12/2012 : 11:31:25
I dont experience any during the day...only when im in bed...which in turn gives me insomnia.
Im thinking maybe something CBT based?
Any/all recommendations are appreciated. |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Scottydog |
Posted - 04/28/2012 : 14:44:45
In truth people are so wrapped up in themselves that unless you sit yawning or with half-shut eyes or drool or something no one will know or even suspect that you hardly slept the previous night. So 'I definitely fear that people will not like me (as much) or respect me (as much) as when I am "on my game" and well rested.' is a false belief because they won't even notice!
I have insomnia and wake with the anxious feeling and knot in stomach but think it is due to repressed anger or hurt and I am trying to reduce that by dealing with anything which I am repressing(usually unknowingly at the time). My husband and I had a heart to heart this a.m. so that I could explain some of his (imo) irritating habits which I repress my feelings about. (turns out he is unaware of how grumpy he sounds and what I took as criticism in his voice was more tiredness due to his job). Anyway, that was just meant as an example of what can wind me up.
I am also NOT taking on any more of my family members' problems which they assume I will help them to sort out. Another example.
Anyway, things could be quite different for you but this is how I am tackling the problem. |
| avik |
Posted - 04/28/2012 : 09:27:11
quote:
Originally posted by Bugbear
"I'm terrified of not being 'my best' the following day...not being able to work as hard, socialize or do the things I only do when I am well rested"
Avik, this is a great, big clue. It is this fear of not being your best, not being 'perfect' that is driving your insomnia. I could have written that sentence about myself but substituting 'migraine free' for 'well rested'. I never linked this fear with perfectionism before now. It is as clear as a bell.
I personally don't think 'fighting' any symptoms does any good because we are just maintaining our focus on the physical problem.
Agreed. However, what I meant by "fighting" was just focusing on ways to understand and combat the issue (ie, go the gym when you are in pain or, deliberately eat what you want when having IBS, etc). Thumbing my nose at TMS as always worked best for me, because it weakens it...and this takes some energy and focus to do. If you try to do this same thing with insomnia, I find it gets WORSE.
It actually became more clear to me as I wrote it, although I think I knew/have known this to be the problem for a while now.
Ever since I started with this on and off insomnia/sleep-issues, I noticed that I "didnt like who I was" or, "wasnt happy with my personality " (amongst other things" when I was exhausted during the day. I am not sure anyone really is, but I was and still AM NOT OK with not being "my best". I definitely fear that people will not like me (as much) or respect me (as much) as when I am "on my game" and well rested.
As a result, I fear not being able to sleep, which in turn means not being my best, the following day. For me (the typical perfectionist and one who is 100% happy and content with who he is), this is DEVASTATING. I know that sounds dramatic, but its just the way it is in my head.
I wonder if my sub-conscious escaltes this for me before sleep, so that I can have insomnia and then this indirectly forces me to "stay-in" the following day (not work as hard, not have as many meetings, not go out at night and be with friends or go on dates, etc)-so that I dont have to face any of my regular fears or insecurities. Its kind of a brilliant form of TMS and obviously for me, quite effective at diverting my attention.
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| Bugbear |
Posted - 04/28/2012 : 01:48:21
"I'm terrified of not being 'my best' the following day...not being able to work as hard, socialize or do the things I only do when I am well rested"
Avik, this is a great, big clue. It is this fear of not being your best, not being 'perfect' that is driving your insomnia. I could have written that sentence about myself but substituting 'migraine free' for 'well rested'. I never linked this fear with perfectionism before now. It is as clear as a bell.
I personally don't think 'fighting' any symptoms does any good because we are just maintaining our focus on the physical problem.
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| avik |
Posted - 04/27/2012 : 22:35:11
quote:
Originally posted by susan828
avik, I am wondering if you are aware of any thoughts that are going through your head when you experience the night anxiety? Are you experiencing any physical symptoms like shaking? Are you thinking about a problem, something going on in your life? Maybe you can describe exactly what you are experiencing. I have so many books and find a really helpful one or just give some advice but if you can describe it as best as you can, it would help.
Susan-
I am actually just scared. Scared of what, I have no idea (although I have quite a few stresses in my life right now). The feeling is of an adrenaline rush right when I am about to fall asleep and for the first time ever, it has gotten physically worse over the past couple of days. More specifically, I get these terrible pins and needles in my legs (which I had before when I was fighting parasthesia from TMS). Also, I actually got nauseous the other night; it was the first time I had a "full-body-experience" from anxiety and it was not fun. I think I came close to a full blown panic attack, although I cant be sure because I have never actually had one.
Im terrified of not being "my best" the following day...not being able to work as hard, socialize or do the things I only do when i am well rested.
Its weird...I am building this whole thing up in my head part of me feels like I should keep talking about it to try and identify the culprit, while the other side thinks that the more I talk about it the worse it gets.
I know its going to step just as quickly as it came but until then, I am suffering.
I wonder if this is the last hiding place for my TMS? I have beaten virtually every other ailment that I used to have (and I have had them all, over a 15 yr period of time). Whats interesting though is that those ailments I could "fight". Insomnia on the other hand cannot be fought...you have to NOT fight it to get it to abate. I think... |
| susan828 |
Posted - 04/27/2012 : 21:14:59
avik, I am wondering if you are aware of any thoughts that are going through your head when you experience the night anxiety? Are you experiencing any physical symptoms like shaking? Are you thinking about a problem, something going on in your life? Maybe you can describe exactly what you are experiencing. I have so many books and find a really helpful one or just give some advice but if you can describe it as best as you can, it would help. |
| avik |
Posted - 04/27/2012 : 19:12:12
SteveO and Susan
I picked up Bourne's book today and it is MASSIVE!
I have no problem doing the work but I am concerned about two things:
1) Considering that I only have anxiety at night, do I need to read this entire book
2) and related to the above...I am worried that delving this deeply into something that I dont experience during the day will make me focus on it too much?
Interested in hearing your thoughts on how I should approach this book and if there are certain areas that maybe I should focus on. |
| balto |
Posted - 04/26/2012 : 07:29:47
Reading alone is not going to cure anything, no matter how good the book is. You need to also apply what you're learned from the book too. |
| avik |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 19:44:04
quote:
Originally posted by susan828
Avik, I feel that Bourne's book would help you even at night. I have woken up with tremendous anxiety too. They key to getting over this is when you no longer see anxiety as the bogey man. When you see it as just adrenaline and nothing more, you no longer fear it. You can say "oh there you are, pesky thing" and when you no longer fear this "terrible thing", it just goes away. You get to the point where it doesn't have power over you anymore. When you stop seeing "it" as "it", but just a darn chemical reaction that means nothing. I have ben through a 4 month anxiety program and it all came down to this. I have read every book ever written and Bourne's really gets it right. I still get the night thing every now and then but it's indicative of what's going on in my life. I also hate myself at times because this is not how I wanted to turn out. It is really hard struggling with this day after day.
Susan-that makes a lot of sense but unfortunately for me, common sense GOES OUT THE WINDOW when its late at night and I am trying to sleep. Its like I am a different person when I am laying in bed...
That said, I just ordered the book.
Recent read Claire Weekes's book and it didnt do much for me. Hopefully this one will clarify things for me.
Thanks! |
| susan828 |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 19:01:20
Avik, I feel that Bourne's book would help you even at night. I have woken up with tremendous anxiety too. They key to getting over this is when you no longer see anxiety as the bogey man. When you see it as just adrenaline and nothing more, you no longer fear it. You can say "oh there you are, pesky thing" and when you no longer fear this "terrible thing", it just goes away. You get to the point where it doesn't have power over you anymore. When you stop seeing "it" as "it", but just a darn chemical reaction that means nothing. I have ben through a 4 month anxiety program and it all came down to this. I have read every book ever written and Bourne's really gets it right. I still get the night thing every now and then but it's indicative of what's going on in my life. I also hate myself at times because this is not how I wanted to turn out. It is really hard struggling with this day after day. |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 16:20:43
"AT LAST A LIFE: Anxiety and Panic Free" By Paul David
http://www.anxietynomore.co.uk/at_last_a_life.html?hop=ryzen24
and this site is good:
http://www.anxietycentre.com/ |
| avik |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 12:26:45
Guys-
I had one of the worst sleep related night of my life last nt and shockingly, after reading through this thread and listening to Claire Weekes.
What happened was that I had a very important meeting today; a once in a lifetime opportunity to sit down and chat with a very well known investor. I inadvertently said to myself already a week ago that I will "probably have problems sleeping the night before this meeting". This was the death blow. Even though I slept beautifully for the preceding 6 days (to last night), last night I merely thought about having a sleeping problem and I literally got about 45 minutes of sleep.
I tried everything...writing in a journal, reading, listening to audio-tapes and I even took some meds to calm me down. NOTHING worked. I just laid there and did nothing and did not "try" to sleep. Still though, sleep never came. Its like being in a nightmare. "It" (my sub-conscious, my TMS, my FEAR) was SO powerful as to not let me sleep.
My thing is FEAR. Its Baseless FEAR, but FEAR nonetheless.
How do I stop my annoying brain from "teasing" me that I am not going to be able to sleep??? Why is it sabotaging me?
This is one of the most frustrating things I have ever dealt with because I feel like I have "beaten" this insomnia thing before and I am doing it to myself. It makes me hate myself for doing it...
SteveO and Susan :
Happy to read this book by Bourne but I find that most of these books (including Weekes) refer to people with daytime panic and anxiety, neither of which I have. I have never had a panic or anxiety attack in my life. My issue seems to fear...only at night. It doesnt even make sense to me but I guess I agree with Weekes now that she says "once you develop a sensitization to something (in my case, falling asleep) your body gives you adrenaline/fear response and then you FEAR THAT FEAR. This becomes a viscous cycle and its the second, self-reproduced fear keeps me up.
Do you two think this book would be beneficial to me if I am just having anxiety at night? |
| Dr. Zafirides |
Posted - 04/20/2012 : 23:21:07
quote:
Originally posted by avik
I dont experience any during the day...only when im in bed...which in turn gives me insomnia.
Im thinking maybe something CBT based?
Any/all recommendations are appreciated.
Avik,
I discussed tips for a better night's sleep on my 12/6/11 podcast. You can listen to it here:
http://www.thehealthymind.com/2011/12/06/the-healthy-mind-dec-6-2011/
I covered the information on sleep in the first 10 minutes of the program, so you don't have to listen to the entire show if you didn't want to. :) :)
Just FYI.
Kindly,
Peter Zafirides, MD
http://www.thehealthymind.com |
| susan828 |
Posted - 04/20/2012 : 20:22:18
I have had anxiety since childhood and have over 60 books, some for the layman and some clinical. I have to agree with Steve....out of all of them, the one that finally did the trick is the one by Bourne. Skip the others...he just hits it right on the nose. |
| SteveO |
Posted - 04/19/2012 : 22:56:13
Avik, have you read The Anxiety and Phobia Workbook by Bourne? Release of anxiety is a personal journey, but I've never found anything as powerful as Bourne's. I've read all the books I've seen discussed here and Weeke's is very good too. But no matter how much you read, it all depends on when you decide to give it up. To let it go. The good authors can explain things but you're the one holding it, and only you can free yourself. It takes great courage but you can let go. |
| happystar |
Posted - 04/16/2012 : 18:35:57
Avik,
Have you tried doing a bit of restorative yoga before sleeping? I would recommend it. Then you can finish it off with meditation.
Hope this helps.
|
| balto |
Posted - 04/15/2012 : 20:41:43
Don't forget the book: How to Stop Worrying and Start Living. By Dale Carnegie. Read the review at Amazon.
Most of our anxiety started when we don't know how to handle many of life's challenges and difficulty. This book help tremendously. Dr Sarno and Dr Claire Weekes taught us how to treat ourself of tms/anxiety. Dale Carnegie taught how to prevent it from happening.
The audio version is very relaxing to listen to while driving. |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 04/13/2012 : 19:14:39
Avik,
I hear you, and believe me... "not caring" is on my current work-load assignment and by no means mastered. Definitely a work in progress.
For meditation, I think Jon Kabbot Zin is a great starting place. I've been studying it for a couple of years, but really not practicing like I should. His book "Full Catastrophe Living" is in audio format on Youtube right now. (Just do a search for that title.) It's an amazing book, and to me... has TMS principles running through much of it.
Again, I'm more of a resource than a living example at this stage, but I've researched a lot and I do believe mindfulness will eventually help me, and hopefully you too.
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| avik |
Posted - 04/13/2012 : 13:16:47
Guys-
Thank you so much for your responses!
Shari and Wavy Soul is it worth BOTH reading her book and listening to her audio/panic book or can I just do the latter? To clarify...I dont have any panic or anxiety during the day.
Bryan I hear you on the "not caring" that has worked for me so many times in the past. For some reaosn though, I cannot get my brain to NOT say to me "you are going to have a problem sleeping tonight", right before I go to bed. Also, I think my anxiety now is more related to personal things that are going on in my life and not with my usual "fear of not being able to sleep".
Also, I really have start implementing mindfulness techniques/meditation into my daily schedule. It seems to be the underlying foundation for most of these modalities.
Is there a good book for an intro to meditation?
Stryder-thank you.
Wavy Soul-great post.
Yes, I have crushed! all the other symptoms over the past two years and am left with intermittent bouts of insomnia.
Im going to look into your recs; great idea having the ipod by the bed loaded with all that good audio-info.
FYI-new age music makes want to punch the wall
Fadoozle-good advice...I need to keep doing that.
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| Genshin |
Posted - 04/13/2012 : 11:57:51
quote:
Originally posted by avik
I dont experience any during the day...only when im in bed...which in turn gives me insomnia.
Im thinking maybe something CBT based?
Any/all recommendations are appreciated.
You could listen to Eckhart Tolle's audiobook The Power Of Now. It helped me get rid of my anxiety. |
| Sarnotic-nerve |
Posted - 04/12/2012 : 19:47:35
I used to have some horrible anxiety-based sleep problems?
It went away naturally when I got married-strange!
Now, I play a golf course in my mind when I can't sleep on occasion. I never make it past the 2nd hole.
______________
The pain is real! The cause...well, that's complicated. ;) |
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