| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Neo Veloci |
Posted - 03/15/2012 : 09:58:33
Hi there,
This is my first post on this forum, so please be nice!
I've suffered from rsi for over 10 years. After trying almost every kind of 'doctor' and 'therapy' in the first two years, I accepted my pain (mostly in the wrists, but also hands, back, neck and shoulders) and learned to live with it.
Acupuncture seemed to work the best. I've never been painfree, but after a session, it would drop to about 30-50%, which would last for weeks, sometimes even months, but the pain always returned. (Which makes sense if I have TMS.)
In the last month it returned with a vengeance. Starting a new job probably had something to do with it. Frequent computer time as well.
Frustrated by attacks with excruciating pain once again, I wondered if rsi knowledge had advanced in the last decade and started to look for answers on the internet.
I'm Dutch, so it took a while, but after a few days I found Dr. Sarno's theory and although I was sceptical that the mind could cause my pain, I certainly believed it could worsen it. So I bought 'Healing Back Pain: The Mind-Body Connection' and found myself described on almost every page, which convinced me that I have TMS.
I finished the book three days ago and started working on my unconscious rage.
Although I now fully believe my pain is mentally caused and therefor pretty much harmless, I'm not yet able to control it when it's flaring up (when typing behind a computer).
Which brings me to my question. I know I'm impatient and should give it more time (hey, I'm a perfectionist!) but I would like to know if it's safe to fight the pain. Won't the fact that my brain is depriving my wrists of (enough) oxygen, cause more waste to build up in my muscles and therefor increase my symptoms and longevity of them?
I would really appreciate your help. |
| 14 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Neo Veloci |
Posted - 03/21/2012 : 05:48:39
quote:
Originally posted by Trueq
hi,
i have been trying to beat rsi in my hands by trying to use them normally but the pain in them is unbearable now as i cant hold or touch anything its gets worse and worse. I cant journel as i cannot hold a pen in any hand and my symptoms dont move so i am asking anyone out there if they have been in a similar situation?
thanks for any replies?
craig
Maybe this advice can help you:
http://www.tmswiki.org/ppd/How_to_ignore_crippling_pain |
| Trueq |
Posted - 03/20/2012 : 07:00:16
hi,
i have been trying to beat rsi in my hands by trying to use them normally but the pain in them is unbearable now as i cant hold or touch anything its gets worse and worse. I cant journel as i cannot hold a pen in any hand and my symptoms dont move so i am asking anyone out there if they have been in a similar situation?
thanks for any replies?
craig |
| Neo Veloci |
Posted - 03/19/2012 : 03:19:57
Thanks Tennis Tom for your explanation.
@Shawnsmith:
About five years ago I was training for a 10 mile running contest, but a week before, I developed an injury in my knee, which didn't recover in time. In the years after that, when I'd run for even 2 minutes, the pain in my knee would return very sharply and for fear of it getting worse, I'd stop. I never ran again.
I suspect it was (and still is) TMS.
This last week, I did a lot of journalling and my rsi sympoms have already calmed down a little, so yesterday I thought let's try running for a little bit... After two minutes the pain was there. But this time I ignored it and it went away! Although after another minute it came back twice as painful, which almost made me doubt if it was TMS, but I ignored it again and it went away again. I kept running for another minute and stopped at a moment where there was no pain.
I suspect it's a 'Pavlov thing'. Journalling is great and will solve the cause of the problem(s). But after that, at least for me, I have to ignore the pain so I can reprogram my body to stop responding to old triggers... |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 03/18/2012 : 16:14:48
quote:
Originally posted by Neo Veloci
Which brings me to my question. I know I'm impatient and should give it more time (hey, I'm a perfectionist!) but I would like to know if it's safe to fight the pain. Won't the fact that my brain is depriving my wrists of (enough) oxygen, cause more waste to build up in my muscles and therefor increase my symptoms and longevity of them?
Yes, it's safe to fight the pain, that is the TMS protocol, since the pain is real but benign. You must recondition the body to return to normal functioning. By waste products, I believe you are thinking of the lactic acid build up due to exercise. TMS pain discourages muscle use, so the opposite, atrophy due to non-use would be more the issue. From my understanding of reading Sarno and the physiology of TMS, the pain is localized to a very few nerve cells. I would compare it to when you get a pin prick, it's a tiny area buy if it hits a nerve ending your body will definitely let you know. TMS is the subconscious creating benign pain as a psychosomatic defense mechanism to distract the conscious mind from emotional pain the subconscious decides would be even more painful to face. By thinking TMS psychologically, you short-circuit the TMS gremlin, face the emotional issues head-on and there is no longer the need for the physical pain distraction.
==================================================
DR. SARNO'S 12 DAILY REMINDERS:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0dKBFwGR0g
TAKE THE HOLMES-RAHE STRESS TEST
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale
Some of my favorite excerpts from _THE DIVIDED MIND_ :
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
==================================================
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." Jiddu Krishnamurti
"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional." Author Unknown
"Happy People Are Happy Putters." Frank Nobilo, Golf Analyst
"Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint." Mark Twain and Balto
======================================================
TMS PRACTITIONERS:
John Sarno, MD
400 E 34th St, New York, NY 10016
(212) 263-6035
Here's the TMS practitioners list from the TMS Help Forum:
http://www.tmshelp.com/links.htm
Here's a list of TMS practitioners from the TMS Wiki:
http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Find_a_TMS_Doctor_or_Therapist
Here's a map of TMS practitioners from the old Tarpit Yoga site, (click on the map by state for listings).:
http://www.tarpityoga.com/2007_08_01_archive.html |
| shawnsmith |
Posted - 03/17/2012 : 06:53:22
I think that ignoring your pain may not be the right way to phrase the issue for the simple reason is the pain is your body's way of telling you something. Your body is speaking to you and the voice it uses is pain. So ignoring it may not be wise advise, rather listen to what your body has to say. The body, via the pain, is informing you that you are under stress, worried or experiencing some other kind of inward or outward pressure which you may or may not be consciosuly aware of. Having said that, if you have TMS, it is also wise to resume all normnal physical activity and try to banish the thought that the pain is due to any structural problem. If you do anything to ignore the pain then you are telling your brain that you believe that the source of your pain is totally physical as a result of some structural problem. Yes, it hurts like hell -- I know -- but resuming activity is a must. |
| Neo Veloci |
Posted - 03/17/2012 : 03:49:32
Thanks guys. Your point is clear.
The fact that waste products don't seem to be an issue on this forum gives me the confidence to not be scared of it anymore. |
| andy64tms |
Posted - 03/16/2012 : 16:39:03
Hi Neo Veloci,
We are all friends and nice here, I ‘m a new comer myself. I also have pondered many statements from Healing Back Pain; I think this is natural and healthy. For some of the more obscure arguments, I have made up reasoning to suit.
For example: Your build up of waste in the muscles question, could be explained like this:
You have a stomach ache (waste) causing pain and discomfort. Pretty soon your body takes care of it. It may do this at a leisurely slow pace, not as fast as you would like. It is similar with Dr. Sarno’s “mild oxygen deprivation” theory. Your body will take care of it.
More importantly the reason for pain is to distract you from your bad emotions etc. The way it does this is unimportant. It is very hard to grasp this fact as we all want to know the "Whys and Hows", you are not alone.
Welcome to the forum
Andy
Past TMS Experience in 2000, with success.
Now on Day 6 Wiki Edu.
Charlie horse on neck for 20 years. (to be evicted soon.) |
| Stryder |
Posted - 03/16/2012 : 15:46:05
I think it's because it [waste product] is irrelevant.
I agree with Lynn, it doesn't matter what/if any clean up is done automatically by your body as a result of mild oxygen deprivation. You take care of doing the TMS work and your body will take care of the rest.
Take care, -Stryder |
| lynnl |
Posted - 03/16/2012 : 10:54:31
quote:
Originally posted by Neo Veloci
Dr. Sarno doesn't mention waste products in his book. Is that because it's BS or because it's not an issue with TMS?
I think it's because it is irrelevant.
I just took Sarno's comments at face value and accepted that a localized oxygen deficiency will cause pain, and let it go at that. It worked for me.
It sounds logical that reduced blood flow would reduce the rate at which cellular waste products would be flushed away. But that's all just a mental game anyway. Whatever the mechanism(s), Sarno's concept works.
I think getting too obsessive about the actual details can serve to undermine your acceptance and confidence that this will work for you.
Lynn |
| Neo Veloci |
Posted - 03/16/2012 : 03:43:32
Thank you for your replies!
I'm definitely on my way to get to the roots of my issues. Have tackled a couple already and I can sense the improvement already. Pain is less severe and the flaring up takes longer.
Just to be clear, with controlling the pain, I was referring to Dr. Sarno's tip of talking to your brain and sending more oxygen to the deprived areas. That hasn't been working just yet.
So you all agree that the oxygen deprivation isn't causing waste to build up in the muscles? (I don't know how to say it differently in English..) If so, physical therapists and acupuncturists must be wrong and all they're doing is bring more blood/oxygen to the areas, instead of trying to dispose of waste products, which they say they're doing...
I know I'm still focussing on the physical here, but since the mind initiates real physical symptoms, it interests me what exactly happens and Dr. Sarno doesn't mention waste products in his book. Is that because it's BS or because it's not an issue with TMS? |
| lynnl |
Posted - 03/15/2012 : 13:43:46
quote:
Originally posted by DaveYou will never be able to "control" it. The pain is brought on by an unconscious process. You can only [i]accept it and train yourself to react differently to it.
I'll have to disagree with that. From my experience it can be controlled, and even eliminated altogether. I certainly did.
Granted, some other sympton will more than likely try to replace the original one. But that can be controlled in the same way.
Lynn |
| PhilMid |
Posted - 03/15/2012 : 11:43:40
Hi Neo,
Like you, I have doubting thoughts and found that they have the same purpose as pain – an emotional distraction to keep the pain cycle going. I know why the pain is there but by ignoring it, it is losing its hold. On those odd occasions when the pain cannot be ignored then I will journal. Be sensible about using the computer but don’t believe that it is excessive use that is the cause of the pain. There are so many success stories on the Internet, see http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Repetitive_Strain_Injuries_-_RSI showing how people with severe RSI have returned to computing.
As Stryder says “it takes a while for all this to sink into your unconscious, so keep at it daily". You will overcome this with vigilance and self belief.
Phil
|
| Dave |
Posted - 03/15/2012 : 11:39:38
quote:
Originally posted by Neo Veloci
Although I now fully believe my pain is mentally caused and therefor pretty much harmless, I'm not yet able to control it when it's flaring up (when typing behind a computer).
You will never be able to "control" it. The pain is brought on by an unconscious process. You can only accept it and train yourself to react differently to it.
quote:
Won't the fact that my brain is depriving my wrists of (enough) oxygen, cause more waste to build up in my muscles and therefor increase my symptoms and longevity of them?
This is thinking physical, not psychological. The pain is benign.
|
| Stryder |
Posted - 03/15/2012 : 10:50:06
Hi Neo,
Provided your doctor has ruled out serious disease, you can proceed to treat as TMS. The answer to your questions is, yes. As Dr, Sarno says in Healing Back Pain, the pain is real, the pain is severe, but it is harmless and does not cause permenant damage. Read the "treatment" chapter every day. In there there are listed the "Daily Reminders", and in there it says that the pain cannot harm your body since it is due to mild oxygen deprevation.
So you ask how can this be true, that the pain is harmless? This is confirmed by the fact that thousands of people with TMS have no pain now, and their body was not damaged by the pain.
As stated in HBP, find 30 minutes of quiet time daily, read the "treatment" chapter every day, journal, and you are on your way.
And yes, it takes a while for all this to sink into your unconcious, so keep at it daily.
Take care, -Stryder |
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