| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| balaenoptera |
Posted - 02/27/2012 : 10:58:47
Hi there
This is the story of my pain.
I have had a four-year history of depression before my pain symptoms started about ten months ago. Off course my depression has also become worse since. My pain syndrome is located in the muscles around the hip, in the buttocks and slightly above in the lower back, and in the lateral and frontal upper thighs. My symptoms not only consist of pain, rather a combination of pain and unpleasant sensations: muscle pain, muscle tension and prickling sensations. It is hard for me to stand on my feet because there is such an unpleasant tension and later pain in this area. When I rest afterwards, my buttocks and upper thighs start prickling. Although the affected area stays the same, the intensity and quality of symptoms has often changed during the last months. For example: the prickling sensations in my upper frontal thighs had almost disappeared, meanwhile they emerged in my buttocks and recently came back to the thighs. I also had pain in the right knee which disappeared after a month. And I had unpleasant tension in the muscles around L5 and the sacrum which also disappeared, came back, and now seems to get better again. But overall there is no real improvement.
Once this all started I was physically totally in shape, I exercised five times a week for at least one hour. I did yoga, bike tours, running, moderate strength training and jujutsu (a martial art).
From my sports I was used to have some pain from time to time, even for some months in a particular muscle. But usually I gave not much attention to it and eventually the problem resolved. When my symptoms occurred ten months ago, they were rather mild and again I gave not much attention to them and didn’t consult a physician. But within six weeks they became more severe and started to have a strong impact on my movements and such on my daily living.
I visited several physicians, orthopedists, neurologists and internists. I also had physiotherapy and consulted a chiropractor. No one could really find a reason for my pain. On x-ray one orthopedists diagnosed a slight dysplasia in both hip-joints, while the physiotherapists say they can’t see any problem there. The MRI showed a slipped disc between L5-S1 and then this was made the cause, although my symptoms don’t fit to a slipped disc (at this vertebral level). Actually this seems to be the remnant of the slipped disc I had 12 years ago (between L5-S1) from which I totally recovered (after some time I even was in better shape than before, mainly because of practicing yoga). Lately another MRI was done from the muscles of the pelvis with normal results.
This is not the first time I heard of psychosomatics. Even some of the physicians mentioned that. But they couldn’t give me an explanation and offered no help. They just mentioned it because they had no clue what is going on. I myself also didn’t reject a psychosomatic origin but I could not fully accept it because 1. the symptoms were so severe 2. I rather believed there must be an organic reason in conjunction with mental issues, and both have to be treated and therefore diagnosed. 3. I had to exclude all possible organic reasons and this took several months of visiting all the doctors, getting MRIs et cetera.
But now I am 90% convinced that my pain really is in my head. I hope I can stick to it and don’t get any doubts again. I now have started the educational program from the TMS wiki. But my problem is also that the pain has worsened my depression and I have developed fear and anxiety. Psychotherapy has stabilized me a little but not to the extent that I’m always able to handle the pain. There are always days when the pain overwhelmes me and consequently my anxiety grows and my confidence that this will have an end goes to zero.
Sorry for the long story, hope you have any suggestions, comments and so on. Does this sound like TMS to you?
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| 18 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| balto |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 17:31:33
quote:
Originally posted by balaenoptera
@balto
I have developed anxiety because of the pain. Before that I wasn't anxious. Do you think in my case Claire Weekes books are also useful?
I did have pain before anxiety too. They all have the same cause, our mind. Dr Claire Weekes did not mention anything about muscular or nerve pain, it is not her expertise, but if you really really apply what she taught, all your tms/anxiety symptoms will disappear. If you talk about mindbody illness and you don't talk about Claire Weekes, you're missing half the story.
Here is what wiki have about her: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claire_Weekes
and here is her website:
http://www.claireweekes.com.au/
Very impressive lady. She had cured countless people from anxiety and panic. She is the first female DSc graduate from University of Sydney. She was from Australia so not too many in the US know of her. I wonder Darko heard of her?
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| balaenoptera |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 16:44:51
@balto
I have developed anxiety because of the pain. Before that I wasn't anxious. Do you think in my case Claire Weekes books are also useful?
@brian3000
Did you mean Darko? Because there is no user Dark.
Best |
| MainEventMike |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 15:39:36
quote:
Originally posted by bryan3000
Aussie, he's spammed every thread about his book nonstop. He's not a physician and has no medical training. He apparently owns a record label and majored in business. (Clearly) His posts look like thinly veiled sales pitches to me, which is fine if they could be kept to one thread. Why can't we have a "Buy My Stuff" thread and those who want to follow him can simply post there, leaving the forum an open, free discussion among people wihout agendas?
Seems simple and fair. Just my opinion, but it's cheapening the forum.
What's so bad with an ask-Steve thread? He makes money, the threads are kept clean. Everyone wins.
_____________________________
-1/2010 - Developed chronic sinus problems. ENTs/Docs can't find anything
-5/29/2010 - Doc gives cocktail of allergy meds which induces first ever panic attack/anxiety.
-7/16/2010 - Anxiety stays/worsens - put on Xanax
2/1/2011 - Began Xanax taper - Withdrawal starts - full body chaos
-6/11/2011 - Last dose of Xanax. Physical/emotional chaos continues for several months.
-Now: Taking it day by day, looking for real answers and ways to heal myself without medical poison.
If SteveO wants to promote his book, so what? He provides great advice and isn't that what we're all looking for here? I need good information and SteveO makes some great posts and he explains it really well. I haven't read his book but, I will because I get so much from what he says. If he wants to reference his book in every post, I say let him. I for one need the direction that he gives. |
| balto |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 14:29:14
Hi balaenoptera. Since you also have anxiety, I suggest you should also read books by doctor Claire Weekes. I have tms/anxiety for decades. Books by Dr Sarno helped tremendously but I could never be able to completely cure myself until I found Claire Weekes' books. She saved my life. You can search on Amazon for her books. Goodluck. |
| Marlawantstohike |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 13:15:17
About Steve, we have a choice whether to read his book or not and I would hate to see him not feel comfortable to respond to posts. He did spend ten years writing his book to help people like us, I sincerely doubt it's the kid of book that will make him rich.
If it bothers you, don't read his posts.
I think he offers a lot of good info and whether he mentions his book to help or make money only he knows that. |
| lynnl |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 11:26:09
quote:
Originally posted by bryan3000
Again, seems like it would be a great idea to have a separate forum for salespeople and doctors to pedal their wares here. A separate forum would serve the purpose of allowing people to access adverts if they choose, and keeping the forum free from relentless sales pitches.
Mods, any thoughts?
Bryan, I can, to some degree, see where you're coming from.
But, while I'm not sure I've read ALL of SteveO's postings, from what I have read they have not struck me as blatent advertising or commercialization, veiled or otherwise.
In my opinion, and apparently of others as well, he has a good grasp of the whole TMS process. He undertook the task of writing and publishing a book which (I assume, not having read it ...yet) is a thorough accounting of the TMS battle as he experienced it. He believes he has meaningful contributions to offer others in their battle. I know that feeling; I feel the same way, but have not been as industrious as Steve in writing my own experiences in lengthy, consolidated form.
It's unreasonable to expect him to regurgitate all of his thoughts and suggestions and advice repeatedly in response to questions and postings by others on this bulletin board. Why not permit him to simply point others to his book to read his messages in their entirety?
Judging by the sparsity of traffic on this forum, and by the enormous reluctance of the at large population to accept and embrace the TMS concept, I doubt that financial gain is foremost in his motives.
Now I realize that your suggestion was more along the lines of restricting his mentioning the book to one place, rather than randomly interspersed through other people's postings. It seems to me that would be a bit cumbersome. Either the reference would soon be lost entirely, or we'd be left with references to references
I don't own this board and have no say in the matter; and I don't mean to be taking sides here, but that's just how I see it. Nevertheless I certainly do respect your opinion, Bryan. It does contain a valid element of concern.
Lynn |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 09:38:50
Balenoptera,
Do a user search for Dark and search hi recent posts. He had an excellent post regarding depression and pain very recently. Very inspiring.
Wish you the very best and I know you'll gain control over this. It can take time for most of us. |
| balaenoptera |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 08:58:33
Hi
I’m almost done with Mindbody Prescription and I’m trying to put all the information together that I got from the book and all the online resources. I have to sort out what works for me.
I might have confused some of you about the herniated disc. I also don’t think that the herniated disc in my MRI is the cause. In my case this is even more obvious, 1. because my pain symptoms (regions) do not fit to the L5-S1 level 2. because what showed up in the new MRI is the herniated disc from 12 years ago (at this time diagnosed via CT scan) from which I totally recovered 11 years ago. Regardless if the disc was the culprit in the past or not, I think not, could have been the trigger, whatever.
From the experience of my recovery 12 years ago I have actually learnt NOT to give too much attention to body sensations such as pain or stiffness. Whenever I pushed it too hard during exercise I gave not much attention to any resulting muscle aches and the problem resolved. I even practised yoga relaxation techniques and awareness meditation. The latter is called the vipassana technique where you are trained to scan your body, but retain total equanimity. This has worked for me until my current pain emerged. After some weeks of ignoring the pain it became more severe and had such an impact on my movements that I couldn’t bear it any longer. I got a severe depression and my pain got even worse. So NOW I’m totally focused on the pain.
But having now ruled out any serious cause for the pain, and accepting that it’s indeed TMS, I’m trying to get my focus away from the pain and to get in touch with my underlying emotions. I hope I will succeed.
Best |
| Ophelia |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 03:37:15
SO HELPFUL; Steve thank you so much for renenforcing the disc and other things you mentioned in your last concise post, you make so much sense to me, as a sciatica sufferer for 2 years constant pins and needles down left leg foot and right foot, I really hang onto your every word....please keep them coming! Many thanks Opheliaquote:
Originally posted by SteveO
Hi balaenoptera, hang in there buddy, you will be ok. You are stuck in that ouroborus cycle we all get caught in. Everyone I worked with felt they were the exception, and they worried they would not heal. But they did heal. You've obviously been doing some soul searching and realize you have TMS for private and personal reasons. But you also need to know that it's not just "simple knowledge" that heals you. Just knowing about TMS doesn't heal us. It is not a passive modality like a drug, or therapy, or surgery that can be "given out." It must be accepted, deeply integrated, eventually altering your physiology. This can take time, and the faster you want to heal the slower you may heal. So you realize that you have TMS, and you ask what to do now? Of course I'm biased and would recommend my book because it explains all of this in great detail as to "what to do now?" But RBart is right, you can buy Healing Back Pain too, it's a simpler easier to read book than mine. Mine is like a handbook to always go back to.
Dr. Sarno wrote in HBP, that healing rests on 2 pillars, first is the acquisition into the nature of the disorder, and second is to act on that information. So you need to go read all about TMS from this site or books, etc. This will begin your healing by gathering knowledge. Then you must act on the new knowledge. That means, you get to work and start trying to figure out what you are not expressing to someone, why you respond like you do, avoiding paying attention to your symptoms, becoming more aggressive physically, soothing your autonomic nervous system, etc. And several other things, this entire time never thinking there is something wrong with your body. You have to think purely emotional. We have discovered how powerful talking to someone is in healing, and also in journaling. When you are in severe pain you have something to express that you can't with your mouth, and so your body is expressing what you cannot or will not. I explain this id-superego shadow conflict in my book. When you were younger you must have never learned how to express your true feelings because of parental upbringing or trauma. As an adult you then don't know how and you hold your expressions in your body in the form of symptoms. Your doctor was a good doctor when he said you started out with a mild injury and your mind latched onto it and magnified it, very good insight. So you must break the stranglehold that you brain has on your symptoms. It's not easy but it works. You can begin with behavioral changes but as Dr. Sarno has shown they are "singularly ineffective." You must also link the pain to your emotions are healing rarely takes place. So you MUST link the pain to your emotions at the deepest level of unconsciossness through the conscious brain. This happens through repetition. You have to keep reading, keep talking about your life, keep believing that your pain is not from a physical problem. But you have to do a balancing act, and not obsess on all these things, do them with little energy and carefree. The more fun you can make it the faster it happens. If you're in pain you're depressed, and if you're depressed there's a reason, find it! But don't obsess or you end up in psychoarcheology.
I'll give you a hint, TMS almost always comes from a relationship separation problem, mom or dad, or spouse, or children. Also finances.
1)Forget about your pain being physical in nature
2)Try to narrow down the field of what triggerd your pain (you also know that when you picked up the weights that it only triggered your pain).
3)Keep soothing the rages of fire within you, unlock your sympathetic nervous system and engage your parasympathetic system.
Good luck, what we mean by "disc slipping" is the insane notion that a back disc can slide in and out of place, this is impossible. Also Dr. Sarno states that disc rupture is more commonly called a herniation, which is just the bulging part of the disc. If a nerve was being you would be paralyzed quickly so discs rarely can pinch a nerve, although my leg was paralyzed it was not from a disc but from reduction in bloodlow. The stronger your unc. rage the more pain needed to keep it in-check (from coming out). So the angrier you are the more pain you must experience. Anger is simply the social reaction to overcoming fear. We get angry when we have to stifle fear.
I hope you understood some of that, I didn't realize English was your second language.
Check this out:
The Great Pain Deception
PainDeception.com
Good luck
SteveO
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| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 00:06:39
Oh, and if Sarno were here... no, I don't expect he'd be pedaling his books, despite the fact that he's actually qualified to do so. |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/29/2012 : 00:01:16
Aussie, he's spammed every thread about his book nonstop. He's not a physician and has no medical training. He apparently owns a record label and majored in business. (Clearly) His posts look like thinly veiled sales pitches to me, which is fine if they could be kept to one thread. Why can't we have a "Buy My Stuff" thread and those who want to follow him can simply post there, leaving the forum an open, free discussion among people wihout agendas?
Seems simple and fair. Just my opinion, but it's cheapening the forum.
What's so bad with an ask-Steve thread? He makes money, the threads are kept clean. Everyone wins.
_____________________________
-1/2010 - Developed chronic sinus problems. ENTs/Docs can't find anything
-5/29/2010 - Doc gives cocktail of allergy meds which induces first ever panic attack/anxiety.
-7/16/2010 - Anxiety stays/worsens - put on Xanax
2/1/2011 - Began Xanax taper - Withdrawal starts - full body chaos
-6/11/2011 - Last dose of Xanax. Physical/emotional chaos continues for several months.
-Now: Taking it day by day, looking for real answers and ways to heal myself without medical poison. |
| Aussie |
Posted - 02/28/2012 : 23:51:41
[quote]Originally posted by bryan3000
Again, seems like it would be a great idea to have a separate forum for salespeople and doctors to pedal their wares here. A separate forum would serve the purpose of allowing people to access adverts if they choose, and keeping the forum free from relentless sales pitches.
Mods, any thoughts?
_____________________________
Brian3000,
We are lucky to have people who are masters in understanding TMS visit the forum. Whether or not they mention a book they have written is fine by me. If Sarno was posting on this site would we ask him to not mention his books?? The mentioning of the book was one small sentence, The other 50 or so were absolute gold! |
| Aussie |
Posted - 02/28/2012 : 23:37:13
Wow SteveO, Incredibly insightful stuff! It's great to have someone like you posting here and i for one am lapping up your posts! I have just ordered your book and looking forward to reading it. I much like balaenoptera have been diagnosed with a l5/s1 problem although my MRI only showed a minor disc bulge.. I had a major pain episode at age 18 while bending over to pick up shoes and this took around 6 months to get back to about 95% better. Fear remained long after most of the pain had gone, Mostly from the doom and gloom stories that my GP and physio gave me about back problems. Around 12 years passed with the odd acute flare up that would always pass after a couple weeks. Then out of nowhere when i was very physically fit and doing heavy weight training and playing high level sport mild chronic back pain started..It has been over 2 years that this pain has been with me now and it seems to get worse after every flare up i have now. Im new to TMS, I fit the profile to a T. Iv'e tried journalling..Nothing at all comes up. At the time of my major pain episode my family was having financial troubles and i was having problems with my girlfriend that were emotionally upsetting and taking up most of my thoughts during the day. I was just an 18 year old kid (32 now) and certainly dont have any hang ups anymore about these issues. For me it's really difficult to know where to go now. I don't feel like i have buried emotions from what seem like insignificant events now.. For me the fear i have about my pain is the worst. I try to think emotionally but get stuck, Then if i have a twinge or pain increase my mind goes straightback to thinking about a physical problem..Very frustrating! Iv'e read all of Sarno and will try your book now. I have been checked by a back specialist in Australia who ruled out anything serious and still cant beat this. Deep down i know TMS is causing this pain but i cant seem to let go. I always thought i was a strong person mentally but this pain is really wearing me out. Thanks for listening i needed to vent! |
| bryan3000 |
Posted - 02/28/2012 : 23:34:39
Again, seems like it would be a great idea to have a separate forum for salespeople and doctors to pedal their wares here. A separate forum would serve the purpose of allowing people to access adverts if they choose, and keeping the forum free from relentless sales pitches.
Mods, any thoughts?
_____________________________
-1/2010 - Developed chronic sinus problems. ENTs/Docs can't find anything
-5/29/2010 - Doc gives cocktail of allergy meds which induces first ever panic attack/anxiety.
-7/16/2010 - Anxiety stays/worsens - put on Xanax
2/1/2011 - Began Xanax taper - Withdrawal starts - full body chaos
-6/11/2011 - Last dose of Xanax. Physical/emotional chaos continues for several months.
-Now: Taking it day by day, looking for real answers and ways to heal myself without medical poison. |
| rbart4506 |
Posted - 02/28/2012 : 18:36:39
If you have not read Dr. Sarno's 'Healing Back Pain', do so...
You will see that the majority of people out there have degenerated/herniate S1/L5 disks, me included :)
The disk is not the cause of your pains...
You must work on the mental/emotional stuff...I need to heed my own advice :)
Being an athlete, I understand your comments about being in tune with your body and focused on pains and such. It is a difficult to change that way of thinking, but it can be done...
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| balaenoptera |
Posted - 02/28/2012 : 14:58:45
Hi
Thanks for your response.
I know that you can get TMS even if you are in good shape. Actually I wanted to emphasize that I was used to have some aches from pushing it too hard from time to time. Meaning that I was not a person who gave too much attention to muscle pain or other aches. This was what some physicians suggested to me when they had no clue what’s going on. They argued that I might have focused too much on any minor initial pain and such worsened it. Right now this is one of my big problems, that I cannot get my focus away from the pain, but initially it was not.
About the slipped disk: I am not a native English speaker, I live in Germany, so I am not familiar with all the medical expressions. Slipped disk is what the dictionary gives me for my diagnosis at L5-S1, other terms are herniated disk or prolaps. Anyway, I had this diagnosed 12 years ago. I was not aware of TMS then, but I got over it rather quickly through exercise, mainly I think because of yoga. Some years later, still not knowing about TMS but having acquired some basics in psychology, I was looking from a different angle on my herniated disk. Even though the onset of pain was right after lifting too much weight, I realized that I was in constant inner tension at this time. I had pretty nasty things to digest prior to the onset of pain. I came to the conclusion that it must have had something to do with my mind.
But now it is different, I have many areas of pain and I don’t have progress. Even though I now know that it doesn’t have to do anything with my spine (or my old prolaps), with my hip-joints or any other structural cause. I might have even identified the underlying emotions (or the reasons for them) that could have produced such an inner tension ten months ago when the pain started. But what can I do now with this knowledge?
Best wishes
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| lynnl |
Posted - 02/28/2012 : 09:13:02
quote:
Originally posted by SteveO
Also, it is a physical impossiblity to slip a disc so that never happened to you.
SteveO
PainDeception.com
I'm glad to see someone else echo that opinion of a "slipped disc"!
Anyone who's ever butchered an animal, or even done much cutting on a large piece of bone-in meat should, with a little thought, recognize how rediculous that idea is. 
Barring some catastrophic trauma, such as a car crash, there's no way structural/skeletal features can slip or move around relative to surrounding tissue structures. ...certainly not the normal day to day activities of life.
Lynn |
| tmsjptc |
Posted - 02/27/2012 : 12:23:41
Not much time to answer because I'm at work, but yes, it definitely sounds like TMS to me. |
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