| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| lobstershack |
Posted - 02/05/2005 : 10:32:54
I just wanted to take the time to extend a sincere Thank You for all the help and support you have provided me over the past few months; it really has been invaluable to me. 
Now I present to you my latest snafu--part of a seemingly endless litany of obsessions:  what lead me to TMS in the first place was a meeting with Dr.P (she's a doctor of metaphysics, I believe the acronym is Md.d, but I could be wrong). She works closely with my therapist--who is wonderful by the way, if anyone is in the Fort Lee, NJ /NYC area and needs his info please email me--and I see her approximately once a year.
It's hard to describe what she actually does; I'm not even quite sure. My therapist refers to her as "gifted" and I believe on her card it says supra intuitive. What ever the case may be, she's really quite incredible, not at all some flaky "psychic." So when I saw her mid-October and asked her toward the end of our session about my headaches she told me the cause was purely emotional.
When I called her a few weeks later in distress about my pain, she reassured me that the cause was emotional. That is when I heard Howard Stern mentioned Sarno and I put the two together and got MBP. What's wonderful about my therapist is that he believes fully in the mindbody connection; and although he's somewhat familiar with Sarnoian theory, I'm educating him.
I was wondering how many on this board actually saw a TMS doctor? I for sure know that there is nothing to rule out since I have had multiple CT scans, blood tests, neurological evaluations, the whole bit, over the past 5 1/2 years. But as I mentioned in another thread, I don't have the money for a TMS doctor. So what I was thinking of doing was calling Dr. Sarno next week and seeing if there is anything we can work out. I went to the websites of Dr. Gwozdz and Dr. Angelov, and their fees are $500 and $800 respectively--way too much if you ask me, but admittedly cheaper than getting stuck in the web of allopathy.
This all started a few days ago when I took a slight dip in my progress--which is to be expected, I know--and I believe it might just be my unconscious playing it's usual Seth-you-can't-get-better-until-you-do-this game. And then I read this today on Dr. Gwozdz's site:
"On TMShelp.com, I have seen people with TMS get very frustrated because they tried to cure themselves by just reading a book when a little redirection from a TMS doctor would probably have made a big difference. I know that it sounds like I am trying to sell my services, but I am sincere in my comment."
As you can imagine this got me even more worried.
I would like to know your feelings on the matter.
Also, I was reflecting on an outburst with my father a few days ago, and finally realized fully that I have a tremendous amount of anger inside, something I had only really believed on the infamous intellectual level. So, I just checked out Facing the Fire from my library and have commenced reading. It looks like it is going to be very helpful and while I am a bit scared to confront and experience these emotions; I know it is something that must be done. As time goes on I am beginning to understand more and more how TMS recovery is a "process." That even the seemingly simple things such as realizing one has a tremendous amount of anger deep down inside can take months.
Anyway, time to go to the gym and run--as I have been for the past couple of months!--and then to Borders to do homework. I'm trying to limit my time on this site to max twice a day, lest I begin to go slightly bonkers.
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| 12 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Kristin |
Posted - 02/12/2005 : 16:26:52
Seth,
Thank you for the welcome a week or so back. I appreciate your acknowledgment.
I don't expect to ever visit a TMS doctor but will continue to visit this website and read the recommended books. I am currently finding myself drawn to meditation and buddhist philosophy. Doing yoga initiated this exploration. Some kind of psychotherapy could be in my future.
There must be something in the theory that if we have our experience validated by an expert the self-curing can more easily continue. It can be reassuring and maybe just the boost needed. I hope you work out a way to do what you feel you need to.
I am also coming to terms with anger in myself. Perhaps more specifically anger at myself for letting pain ruin parts of my life. Loving kindness toward myself and forgiveness is current the matter to work with. The hope is that forgiveness toward my own feelings can help open the way and clear a path. I'm not sure where the path will lead yet.
It sounds like your committment is solid. Just remember to be easy on yourself but tough on the pain. |
| Dave |
Posted - 02/12/2005 : 10:46:00
quote:
Originally posted by Seth
Hi everyone,
I'm still thinking strong a la TMS; I keep telling myself "there is no turning back this time!" Whereas in the past I was just wading in water up to my waist, I think I finally took the dive. Wish me luck!
Seth
Great attitude.
However, luck is not part of the equation. Follow the process diligently and you will get relief. |
| lobstershack |
Posted - 02/11/2005 : 16:29:26
Hi everyone,
I'm still thinking strong a la TMS; I keep telling myself "there is no turning back this time!" Whereas in the past I was just wading in water up to my waist, I think I finally took the dive. Wish me luck!
Seth |
| lobstershack |
Posted - 02/10/2005 : 11:00:41
Hi everyone,
I've been "under the radar" so to speak for the past couple of days. I'd like to share what's been going on: Dr. Sopher emailed me back--twice--and gave me some great inspirational advice, which basically agrees with everything I have been told on this board, i.e., a visit to a TMS doc is not required--although he is in the process of relocating and not seeing patients for the next month or two as a result--and that being on antidepressants is not a problem at all and will not impede in the TMS healing process. So that made me feel really good, to hear this from a TMS doctor himself.
Also, I my morale has been up and I'm feeling better. Basically--and I know this may be hard to understand--I realized that I have to begin viewing the TMS protocol as I did any of the other modalities, albeit all of them physical, that I have tried implementing. Let me explain: In the past when I was presented with a new avenue (dietary changes, supplement protocols, etc.) that I thought might help my condition I really submerged myself in it one-hundred percent. And of course there was no real fear attached because if I were to get better it was not I that was doing the work, rather the physical modality I was implementing. I have learned that I have to view TMS work in the same light. That is, treating it as I would have treated any other method in the past, except that this time around there is the addition of fear, stemming in part from taking full responsibility for your own healing. I know this may sound oh so simplistic, but up until now, I was not giving it my all, not surrendering, to introduce a metaphor used once on this board: I was at the edge of the cliff ready to step onto the bridge, but continued to remain on solid ground. So suffice it to say, I know I am on the right path because I believe there should be a certain sense of fear, of discomfort when taking that initial "plunge," because up until that point, if one is not experiencing those feelings they are remaining--at least I believe--in their "comfort zone."
Yesterday I tried for the first time screaming in my car a la Facing the Fire, and I must admit, it felt a bit strange, especially when I attempted to bring verbiage into the mix, but I am going to keep at Lee's suggested techniques. I am also trying to limit myself to visiting the board only once--sometimes twice  --a day, just in attempts to keep my mind focused on other things.
I hope everyone is doing and feeling well. Regarding yesterday, Happy New Year to all those who were celebrating--I for one was not, but I'm sure many (?) on this board were.
Bye!
Seth |
| lobstershack |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 21:18:01
I cannot express how much all of your kind words mean to me. But, with it being late, and with TMS still to be done I will respond in greater length tomorrow. Hope everyone sleeps tight!
Seth |
| Louise |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 13:17:49
Seth -
I live in Los Angeles, and saw Dr. Schechter 3 times in late 2003. Fortunately for me, my Blue Cross insurance covered it, with just a $25 co-payment for me. I took the step of going to see a TMS doctor, because I had received a diagnosis of herniated discs in my back. I had also previously had back surgery, which at the time, I totally believed would relieve my pain. I had a mental image of the MRI film showing a pinched nerve, and it was very hard for me to put aside the idea that my "pinched nerve" was causing my pain.
I've sort-of got the same problem with my remaining TMS spot - my left knee. I've previuosly had arthroscopic surgery on the same knee and the doctor removed a lot of cartilige. I've seen x-rays of both of my knees, and the left one pretty much looks like bone-on-bone. I think that having seen that picture contributes to the difficulty that I have in believing that my knee pain is totally non-physical. I've been doing some renewed work on TMS, but if I can't do it on my own, I won't hesitate to call Dr. Schechter again.
Good luck. TRY not to stress too much over set-backs. Remember that they're a part of life - all parts of life, including TMS. The obsession itself is a manifestation of TMS. Try to step back a bit from all of this & observe. Try not to react, just observe. It might help.  |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 13:04:54
quote:
Originally posted by Albert
Think of it this way when it comes to a $500.00 fee. TMS doctors make a big sacrifice when it comes to money. Before I heard of TMS I saw a back doctor who does 3-4 surgeries a week. He's probably become rich. But a TMS doctor doesn't have the opportunity to make that kind of money. And it costs a lot of money to have a medical practice. Malpractice insurance is very, very expensive. Plus the overhead of having an office etc.
Plus, most doctors might not charge you $500.00 for the first consultation, but they see you only for about 15 minutes or so. Plus there seems to be some follow up by TMS doctors.
I believe that there are a lot of surgeons who would never get into a TMS practice, because they just wouldn't be willing to give up the surgery gravy train. Hurrah to those doctors who do. They might not make as much money as a surgeon, but at least ways they can feel good about themselves when they go to sleep at night.
P.S. What would happen if a back surgeon got TMS, and wasn't willing to admit to himself that what he is doing is wrong? Pain, pain, pain....
Very good points Albert. I agree with you whole-heartedly. I don't begrudge TMS doctors their fees. Compared to most other doctors, when it comes to "curing" chronic pain, they earn their money. I believe most of it is covered by insurance, if one has it. The insurance companies would be well advised to go the TMS route since it will save them millions in the long run over surgery, and PT.
Compared to what most of us spend on alternative therapies, from A to Z, and the waste of time they are, TMS doctors are a bargain. They also probably sacrifice personally being ostracized by their peers for having the courage to take the path less traveled. |
| n/a |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 12:02:32
You wont go bonkers, Seth. We are not used to healing ourselves - we get ill - see someone, a doctor or whatever - they give us advice and/or medication or refer us to someone else. That's what we are used to from childhood. And, to be fair, for many conditions, that works.
For many of us when we first begin to treat our own pain, by way of reading, journalling, discussing and thinking the feeling that we need the support of a professional is absolutely normal. I still believe that if I had had access to a TMS doctor I would have recovered more quickly than I did. For a while i was absolutely obsessed with TMS - I knew that I'd found what I had been looking for and was all over the place emotionally - sometimes elated because I could do things that I thought I'd never do again, sometimes down in the depths because the back pain had returned, but I calmed right down again, gradually.
But the important thing is that I did recover.
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| Albert |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 09:47:57
Think of it this way when it comes to a $500.00 fee. TMS doctors make a big sacrifice when it comes to money. Before I heard of TMS I saw a back doctor who does 3-4 surgeries a week. He's probably become rich. But a TMS doctor doesn't have the opportunity to make that kind of money. And it costs a lot of money to have a medical practice. Malpractice insurance is very, very expensive. Plus the overhead of having an office etc.
Plus, most doctors might not charge you $500.00 for the first consultation, but they see you only for about 15 minutes or so. Plus there seems to be some follow up by TMS doctors.
I believe that there are a lot of surgeons who would never get into a TMS practice, because they just wouldn't be willing to give up the surgery gravy train. Hurrah to those doctors who do. They might not make as much money as a surgeon, but at least ways they can feel good about themselves when they go to sleep at night.
P.S. What would happen if a back surgeon got TMS, and wasn't willing to admit to himself that what he is doing is wrong? Pain, pain, pain....
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| Logan |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 09:29:33
Seth,
I did get better without seeing a TMS doctor but like you, I was afraid for awhile that I couldn't do it on my own. I too felt like my pain was "different" than most of the people's on this board because they had low back pain and I had shoulder/neck pain. As it turns out, those fears turned out to be just that, and I was able to work through them and get better.
I think you will find the Lee book to be tremendously helpful, once you get beyond feeling like a dork for doing the exercises. I admit, it took me a couple of weeks to get over feeling ridiculous and to really get into doing them but I'm glad I did because they were a key part of my learning to FEEL anger in a kinesthetic way and to release it.
I believe you mentioned crying in a previous post of yours and I believe sorrow and anger are two sides of the same coin. Alot of times, I'll do my "anger release" exercise - I prefer beating my couch with a mini baseball bat - and then a few days later, I'll feel the need to cry, to throw myself on my bed and sob actually, like I did as a child, without having a specific or "real" reason to do so. Since I've let myself do that, about two years now, I've been able to get beyond those doubts and fears and to feel normal, pain free, good.
As far as you seeing a TMS doc, since you live in Jersey, I'd say go for it, the cost/benefit ratio is absolutely in your favor. The biggest reason I didn't see Sarno in person was geography/economics - I live in Phoenix so the airfare, hotel, consultation fees etc. would have quickly added up to $2,000+. Even so, I serioulsy considered charging it on a credit card.
First I thought, I would try the VHS tapes which were a comparative bargain at a mere $99. I played them constantly for a couple of weeks. As I was doing stuff around the house or homework or whatever, Sarno's voice seeped into my subconscious. I believe they helped but it still took some months after that - and the Lee excersises - for everything to sort of click together for me.
Whatever you do Seth, be patient with yourself and don't give up! We're rooting for you. |
| lobstershack |
Posted - 02/06/2005 : 12:20:47
Hilary,
Thanks for the input; yesterday I emailed Dr. Sopher asking him if he can help me out monetarily and if he in fact sees out of state patients. Also, I'm planning on calling Sarno tomorrow. But I was wondering if anyone else has any thoughts concerning my initial post, as they would be greatly appreciated. Sorry if I seem a bit "clingy", but ever since I took a dive in my progress I've been a bit obsessive and all over the map. I'm trying to bring myself back down.
Seth |
| Hilary |
Posted - 02/05/2005 : 11:01:39
Seth, I don't think that Dr Gworzdz is saying anything to be alarmed about. Also, I think this stuff is all very personal, and knowing how many people here have actually seen a TMS doctor won't really help YOU to make a decision about whether or not that's the right approach for you.
If you want to see a TMS doctor, why don't you call Sarno and Gwozdz, and see if anyone can do a deal for you, or payment over time, or something. If that's what it takes for you to feel completely reassured, go for it.
I agree that $500 isn't exactly peanuts - it kind of makes me cringe when doctors charge that kind of money but I'm in the UK now so it's a whole different ballgame - but then again, $500 isn't a whole helluva lot for real peace of mind.
I guess the only question is, WILL that buy you peace of mind? If you think it will, then do it. |
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