| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| cnotes11 |
Posted - 01/08/2012 : 02:47:14
I read Dr. Sarno's books about 6 months ago. I liked alot of the ideas and came to the conclusion TMS was likely the cause of my back pain. My one problem was that the way to "cure" tms seemed vague. There didnt seem any conclusive way to get from A to B. I posted on the forum and read what others had to say. But in the end just felt buried by the information.
So 6 months later, I am doing alittle better, I've found a meditation technique that seems to be helping (if anyone is interested I can give the info). But I am still looking for other ways to help myself.
I was thinking that it might be beneficial to me and others if people could respond to this post by listing and concisely describing the single most effective way they've dealt with TMS...?
Just to note -- The knowledge is enough approach, clearly isnt working for me, I've made a TMS list, tried affirmations and also discussed things with a therapist.
Thanks in advance for your responses
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| 14 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| eric watson |
Posted - 10/06/2012 : 15:47:39
have you gotten better from this post cnotes11/in your post did you get the meaning of the id-ego and superego-you know the symptoms jump around and you have to approach them the same way-now your stomachs hurting-have you been to the doc to see if its something like the flu-there r tms equilavants but you still have to rule out bacteria-i say you know because you have studied so much -did you finish the 33 day program and how did the precense portal work out -let me know,thanks |
| cnotes11 |
Posted - 01/12/2012 : 22:41:06
Thanks everyone for responding. I have something new to try and different perspectives are always good.
As I mentioned in my earlier post, I did find one thing that has helped me so far. I'm not finished with it yet, but already can see that its helped and any positive progress for me seems miraculous.
Here is the link to the website -- http://thepresenceportal.com/ --there is a book and a variety of videos. I hope that others will be able to benefit as I have, living with TMS type symptoms can be horrible and I don't wish it on anyone.
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| balto |
Posted - 01/11/2012 : 08:51:14
I think there are lots different "methods" to cure our tms/anxiety illness. Several I can think of are:
- Meditation.
- Yoga.
- Sarno said: recognize that you problem is mental, not physical usually is enough.
- therapy.
- desensitize, exposure, keep doing the thing we affraid to do...
- pray,
- acceptance.
.....
Whatever method you can think of, they were all designed to help you to forget your problems. They all tell us: don't think about it, don't give it any value, accept it, not fear it.
If you can clear you mind of thoughts about your pain, your symptoms, they will leave on their own.
If your focus is not on yourself anymore, the pain will vanished.
And remember, whatever method you use, it will take time.
For me, I took the leap of faith and just refused to fear my symptoms any more. The symptoms left me within 3,4 weeks.
I think Sarno and many other authors are being nice in their writing. They mostly said tms/anxiety usually happened to goodist, perfectionist,... I think they should have add "selfish, self-center" to the list. If we can quit thinking about ourself and live totally for others then we will never have any of those mental diseases anymore.
Martin Luther King, mother Terresa, Joan of Arc, Gandhi, ... I don't think none of them have tms.
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| PhilMid |
Posted - 01/10/2012 : 14:19:16
quote:
Originally posted by cnotes11
I don't quite follow, is this the same as what Viking777 posted http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Structured_Educational_Program ?
Yes it is the same programme. It increased my knowledge and complements Dr Sarno’s book. This offers an approach that appears to be bit vague or lacking in his book especially for those of us who are not so lucky to just read and be pain free.
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| maccafan |
Posted - 01/10/2012 : 09:23:22
Hi cnotes11,
Most of my last post to this thread was directed at skizzik. Sorry, I know I didn't make that very clear. skizzik came down pretty hard on me and I feel frustrated by that because I was trying to help not sound arrogant. I hope my post did help him to understand what I meant.
Good luck to you. Your answers are in Dr. Sarno's books. I kept reading them and thinking about it all until it worked. |
| cnotes11 |
Posted - 01/10/2012 : 04:03:38
@philmid - hadn't when I posted last but since then I watched it -- I think the video is pretty clear and does a good job describing the potential connection between our subconscious and mind body symptoms. It was exactly what I was looking for...a reductive statement.
This of course begs the question what to do? In your last post you you stated.
"I can recommend the Structured Education Programme (SEP) as it is part of a package that is helping me become more aware. The link was one that the SEP suggests you listen to."
I don't quite follow, is this the same as what Viking777 posted http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Structured_Educational_Program ? If so I am already planning to check it out once I finish the current meditation program I am doing.
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| PhilMid |
Posted - 01/10/2012 : 02:13:11
quote:
Originally posted by cnotes11
I'd still like to hear peoples opinion (if they have them) of conscious vs subconscious emotions? Perhaps someone can refresh me... is TMS thought to be due to conscious emotional/mental factors or subconscious?
My experience at this point is leading me to believe whatever it is thats causing my problem is well beyond my consciousness...and correct me if I'm wrong but I don't recall alot of clarity on this issue in the book?
Unconscious mind. Have you looked at the video link that I mentioned as it explains this in detail from an expert? It gave me an insight into why subconscious internal conflict results in pain or TMS. |
| cnotes11 |
Posted - 01/09/2012 : 22:08:16
Thank you both for the responses @philmid - I appreciate your bullet pointing out what you've been doing and knowing someone else feels as I do.
@maccafan - I didn't mean to suggest that because your answer was short it was "easy" or not enough or something. I appreciated the effort.
Maybe the reality is that there isn't a concise answer. As simple as "having faith" "learning" "letting go of the fear" sound, the consensus I seem to be getting is that this is a long process that varies greatly for everyone and not everyone becomes pain free but many are empowered or able to maintain themselves or at the very least have new perspectives to work with.
I have only been approaching my problem from a TMS perspective for about 6 months, and I do feel better now than when I started, perhaps I haven't given it enough time and I need to be more patient. I just find myself constantly thinking what else I can do or how can I maximize the gains I've made so far?
I'd still like to hear peoples opinion (if they have them) of conscious vs subconscious emotions? Perhaps someone can refresh me... is TMS thought to be due to conscious emotional/mental factors or subconscious?
My experience at this point is leading me to believe whatever it is thats causing my problem is well beyond my consciousness...and correct me if I'm wrong but I don't recall alot of clarity on this issue in the book?
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| maccafan |
Posted - 01/09/2012 : 11:33:58
What I was trying to do in replying to cnotes11 post was to keep my reply short and to the point. He had commented that he felt buried in information from earlier replies to a post he had made and he asked for concise and a single most effective way that someone dealt with their TMS. So that's what I tried to do.
A bit longer way to reply to his post would be to say that I had been hurting so badly for so long and the doctors had not helped me only scared me so I decided to educate myself on back pain as much as I could. I made it to book store and bought 5 books on back pain. One happened to be a small paperback book with a weird title, "Healing Back Pain, the Mind-Body Connection". It was small so I decided to check it out first. I scanned the first chapter and then read "Letters from Patients" in the back of the book. The letters described everything that I'd been going through. Even the crack sound that I heard when I bent over when the pain really started severly. I thought good grief, let me start from the first of this book because the light bulb in my head was already going off.
I wasn't "cured" magically and instantly. But I felt a bit empowered and stood up and tried to walk like I use to and it was better. It took about 3 weeks for the acute pain to let up. And yes, I did repeat things to myself like, "You're secrets out, you don't have any more clout" to my unconcious mind. Then I came up with some of my own things to say to my brain and some aren't repeatable here.
A better way to say what helped me from A to B is not saying that I just "believed" that TMS is real, etc. but that I "learned" that it is real. By reading and learning about the diagnosis I understood the logic of it.
And no, I didn't skip over the "psycho parts" and no, I never felt the abnormality was "no big deal". You misunderstood what I was trying to say in a short reply. I liked reading the psycho parts the best especially the Appendix: Academic Issues located at the end of The Mindbody Prescription. It was interesting to read about Freud for example and what he thought about psychogenic physical symptoms. Dr. Sarno has a lot of respect for Freud but disagrees with him on some points as far as the TMS model is concerned. I have read all of Dr. Sarno's books repeatedly and they are worn and my yellow marker has left it's mark!
From what I've learned about TMS and has worked for me is that you don't have to change your personality to get relief from the pain. The books explain that we can't really change our personality, just maybe modify it some. I didn't change the patterns of my life, I don't have any one to talk to about deep experiences at this time (just superficial stuff), and my day to day stresses are basically the same. My physical outlet is sitting at my easel and painting which I love to do. I think what really stirred up my back pain and its equivalents and symptom imperatives is that as I've become very introspective as I've grown older. And this has been quite scarey to my unconscious mind with all its repressed emotions.
Skeptical people who have accompanied a spouse or friend who wanted to go to a Dr. Sarno lecture have been "cured" or able to stop their pain just by listening to the lecture. I don't consider myself cured but able to maintain being able to stop a painful symptom or symptoms because of what I have "learned" about the cause of it. I have suffered with many equivalents and have taken a long time to realize that they too were TMS. I've worked hard at this since 2002. And I have spent time on this board to keep learning about this condition and maybe help someone else with what I've been through by sharing. I hope this longer post helps someone else. |
| PhilMid |
Posted - 01/09/2012 : 08:57:06
quote:
Originally posted by cnotes11
As for the other responses I can only say I envy the ability to get over it as easily as it sounds you have and am sincerely happy for you.
I not only sympathise with you about the recovery but I am experiencing the same problem. Progress is slow but it is progress and I am grateful for that. My experience suggests it is definitely unconscious and it is not always what has happened but what may happen. See
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldyI7mJG2EA&feature=player_embedded as Dr Schubiner explains where the emotions are held. I can recommend the Structured Education Programme (SEP) as it is part of a package that is helping me become more aware. The link was one that the SEP suggests you listen to.
I still get painful episodes but it is no longer stopping me doing anything that I want. These are working for me:
- The obvious one - reading “Healing Back Pain”
- Deliberately challenging myself by doing physical activities that I did not think possible. I found these are possible.
- Being more active throughout the day. Restarting things that I have not done for awhile.
- Reading and posting on this forum.
- Practicing Yoga and stretching into positions that should be a problem. They are not.
- Journalling is a useful outlet. It certainly helps me identify behavioural patterns and thoughts. Correcting it is another matter though.
If conditioning has proved to be the cause of the problem, then conditioning is also a way out. Hence why I am challenging my existing beliefs.
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| cnotes11 |
Posted - 01/09/2012 : 08:01:44
@Viking777 thank you very much for the link -- I browsed through the educational program a bit and it looks quite good. Will look into further.
As for the other responses I can only say I envy the ability to get over it as easily as it sounds you have and am sincerely happy for you. I can see the value in "letting go" "not overthinking" "keeping it simple" "trusting yourself" but at the end of the day those things are easy in theory hard in practice.
@skizzik I have given a great deal of thought to what causes the pain, but unfortunately I can see no logic to it. The pain seems to be irreverent of day to day conditions. Yes I have people to talk to but just about everything that can be said has over the course of 7 years. I have some physical outlets, but the pain tends to reduce any enjoyment I get from these activities although I do them anyway.
I'm curious to hear peoples opinion of conscious vs subconscious emotions? Perhaps someone can refresh me... is TMS thought to be due to conscious emotional/mental factors or subconscious? My experience at this point is leading me to believe whatever it is thats causing my problem is well beyond my consciousness.
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| skizzik |
Posted - 01/08/2012 : 23:20:34
Getting caught up in the so called "knowledge" of tms can be quite a trap. If Sarno made a mistake it was to not spend enough time explaining that one should'nt make getting out of TMS a ritual.
His treatment of repeating sayings to yourself as a psychological programming session can backfire in my opinion.
Most who got better read the book, probably skimmed over the phycho parts, and just felt great as the poster above stated that the abnormality was no big deal.
The catch then is were you able to figure out what day to day stresses were the cause of your physical pains? Think about them, and put them into perspective? Do you have friends and family members that you trust, and can talk to them and share experiences? Do you have physical outlets where you can exercise and get the endorphins going to the brain on a regular basis?
Patterns in your life will have to be different then they were when the pain came on. What patterns are causing your pain? Can you alter the patterns?
Constantly beating yourself with "the knowledge" over and over is futile without a daily pattern change. Wether that pattern is a constant thought, or an action you keep repeating is what you need to figure out. |
| maccafan |
Posted - 01/08/2012 : 11:40:24
The single most concise way to describe how I have dealt with TMS is to believe that TMS is real and that the information given by Dr. Sarno is true. I didn't care who the information came from because what I read made sense to me. Also I got angry for having been duped for so long and used that anger to deal with my unconcious brain.
That's how I got from A to B. It may seem vague because it is so simple. It doesn't have to be very technical and involved.
I was tried of hurting with back pain, I trusted myself, the TMS info and I let the knowledge sink in. I didn't fight with doubts, I just kept it simple.
I have a badly degenerated disc between L4 and L5. The disc can't really be seen on xray. But when I read the TMS info including the part that said spine changes like this is like getting grey hair I just exhaled and relaxed. I let the fear go and the knowledge in.
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| Vikings777 |
Posted - 01/08/2012 : 09:31:47
This 33 day program has helped me alot so far, still in pain but seems to have helped
http://tmswiki.org/ppd/Structured_Educational_Program
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