| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Kavita |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 07:49:52
I have been dedicating a lot of time to uncovering my anger over the past couple of days, and could really use some member support, because this is hard. I feel so guilty writing all this - on a public forum, but I think it is necessary for me to heal. Thanks in advance for reading it.
My father made me feel so small, sort of like he completely controlled me. He often dictated what I did, and I tried so hard to please him. My memories are from later, but the first example is when I was in middle school. I wanted to sing, he wanted me to play an instrument. So I played the clarinet - for 8 years. I didn't like it at first, but in high school and college I loved the comraderie I had as a band member, and now I am proud to say I have that skill. Despite everything having worked out in the end, it was a taste of what was to come.
In high school, my father wanted me to join the debate team. I HATED IT. It made me so nervous. I am an attorney, and to this day, I swear I will never speak in a courtroom. Oral argument in law school was terrifying to me.
It was discovered early that I had a knack for writing, but my father wanted to push me in the direction of science and math, as English just wanted a serious enough subject, meaning you couldn't base a stable career on it. So I majored in genetics and did quite well, went on to an Ivy League law school and now an intellectual property attorney making more money than I dreamed. Of course, my father made me feel like an idiot because it took me four years to get my degree which he thought I should have been able to do in three.
Again, things all worked out, and my father likes to take a lot of credit for pushing me. I am grateful for the life he has given me, but god he's been a jerk sometimes. He always made me feel, and still makes me feel, like I am never good enough. Up until the point where I got a job, he loved to talk about how the area is swimming with attorneys, and even when I got a job, he loved to talk about how unstable to market was. Would he have experienced pleasure if I lost my job? Would it have been a good laugh for him?
The most traumatic part of growing up was grades. It you didn't bring home A's you weren't good enough. I would stress myself to the point of illness when big tests came. One time I even communicated my feelings, about how sometimes I felt like jumping out of a window when I couldn't get the top marks. He was like, "So what?" He told me that I was dumb a lot, too, and that my brother was smart. Though people around me think I am smart, I certainly don't feel smart. I feel pretty slow a lot of the time.
He also used to hit my mom when I was younger. There was one big showdown when I threatened to call someone if he didn't stop. He'd had her head in between his knees - all this because she didn't want to wax the car. He said, "Oh yeah, who are you going to call?" My brother was young at the time, only 5 I think, and I was trying to keep my father from killing my mother (I really was afraid of what he might do), and my brother from seeing it all. I was 11 at the time.
I also have memories from when I was younger, around three, where she would be crying, and I think it was because he hit her. When my brother and I were older, and he realized he couldn't get away with it, he stopped. But I spent a lot of my childhood afraid of leaving my mother alone.
My god this is really hard.
The one thing I know I am not over is the constant teasing about my weight. He was so mean. I was 11, and I wasn't fat. But as a result of his teasing, I was told I was fat and ugly, which meant I was fat and ugly, so heck, I might as well eat, right? To this day I can't eat food without fear. I used to sneak food because I was afraid he would see me. And I developed a bingeing problem by the time I was 11. I could eat a whole bag of cookies. And boy, was he ticked off when he found out they were gone.
I exercise religiously, about an hour every day, sometimes 2 with the occassional day off, eat lots of fruit and vegetables, and treat myself to low fat ice cream for dessert. I am rather regimented, but I am healthy. In some ways I still feel like a prisoner, but I am pleased that I am in good shape and that my cholesterol is ultra low (118). But I still live in fear of being fat and ugly, and there are many foods I just don't let myself eat.
But the abuse doesn't stop. I hosted a party a little while back, and when guests offered to help bring food, I accepted. I am young working attorney with long hours sometimes, and also have a home to take care of, so I was grateful for the help. At the party, when my Uncle asked him, "Why don't you get some food?" my father replied, "Did she make any of it?" My Uncle, bless his heart, replied, "Yes! She did a lot!" Earlier in the gathering my father had made some snide comment about how the party should be outside, and asking why we weren't having it out there - as if to say that the inside of my house wasn't good enough and I was a bad hostess for not letting my guests outside, and for making my guests bring their own food.
I was raised not to talk back, so it's no wonder I internalized all my feelings. To this day I still have enormous inadequacies, and I am so surprised and flattered why someone tells me I am pretty or that I am smart. I received some excellent evaluations at work, saying that I am hard working, intelligent young woman, and I almost couldn't believe it because the people who I work with are all so smart themselves. I feel so lucky to have my life, and almost an imposter in world because a lot of people think highly of me. Why on earth can't I just enjoy it, why must I have this pain?
I am thinking about joining a support group so I can get over obsessing over what I eat, if I should eat, if I deserve to eat. Can you believe that? I am wondering if I deserve to nourish myself! And I thought I was a well-adjusted human being!
I welcome all your comments and suggestions. |
| 19 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 09:36:39
"Why are our parents so good at pushing our buttons?--Because they installed them!" |
| mala |
Posted - 02/07/2005 : 02:23:11
Kavita,
Hi, yes I'm Indian too and boy are Indian parents something or what.
They are so good at emotional blackmail and you know they have so many issues of their own. Listen I'm in australia at the moment and have got limited access to the net but I'll post more when I'm home. In the meantime you take good care of yourself .
Good Luck & Good Health
Mala |
| Hilary |
Posted - 02/06/2005 : 13:36:27
The problem is, of course, that even cutting a parent of your life doesn't end the pain because by that point you've so internalized their voice that the parent is in you. It's not Kavita's father who "causes" her pain, it's the messages he gave her over the years that love is completely conditional. I know this pattern all too well - I had it myself. You see the light in your parents eyes only when you "succeed" at something they consider important.
Success and laurels do not equal happiness. I think Sarno himself points out that the degree of a person's success can be extremely misleading to an outsider. The world assumes that success brings internal happiness - that a successful person must be happy. In truth, the pursuit of success can result from feelings of intense insecurity, fear and low self-esteem. All the academic and music and professional prizes in the world cannot equal the feeling of contentment with oneself purely for being oneself.
I agree with Baseball, Kavita: get mad, get enraged, feel the crap your dad put you through, and get better.
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| Baseball65 |
Posted - 02/05/2005 : 09:09:21
Wow...and I was feeling sorry for myself that I DIDn't have a Father!
That was a powerful story..that was very brave of you to post that.I assume you are a TMSer? This sort of candidness and digging is a vital part of your recovery.It is important to dig this stuff up and to allow yourself to feel all the rage,anger and frustration.
I had a veeeeery different experience growing up...nothing was expected of me...and that's what I became..nothing.
I came down with TMS none the less.The vital part of the healing process is to assign the correct feeling to the experience....TMS is a reservoir of unfelt and misdirected feelings.
If someone had done to me what was done to you,I'd be really ,really angry...the fact that it sounds like he is STILL being a jerk would make me even angrier...probably enough to cut that person out of my life.As somebodies Father,I have changed the way I talk and parent my own children.....reading stories like these you begin to realize that spirit is way more important than substance.
You sound like a very successful and Laureled person,and yet you seem so very hurt.
I imagine your Father thought he was doing the right things when he was raising you...and look! You're an attorney...you play an instrument,you have a home...you're everything he wanted you to be...and he'll never see or enjoy it,because he sounds like he is never satisfied.
In the meantime,you do not need his approval to recover.You are no longer his minion.Get mad...get better.
My hat is certainly off to you for your courage.
peace
Baseball65 |
| Logan |
Posted - 02/05/2005 : 08:47:59
Kavita,
I just wanted to say that I wish you well on your journey to connect more deeply with the feeling that you talked about in your post. Reading it, I felt like you touched on some of the same emotions I went through for my healing. My dad wasn't abusive, my stepdad I mean - as my "real" father is sort of a mystery to me - but fathers have such a strong impact on their daughter's self-esteem that "mere" disapproval, rarely praising often berating, can be poisonous to a growing girl.
Feeling these feelings, remembering their roots, it doesn't mean your dad is a monster, or that you can't love him or see him. But it sounds like you do need to feel what you felt when he refused to acknowledge your childhood feelings, to feel what you continue to feel when he dishonors you in your own home. To feel like you have the right to be you. I just wanted to let you know that you will be in my thoughts and wish you luck in finding a good therapist who can help you get to the you inside the person you became in order to please him. Don't give up the search. She's in there and I bet she's amazing. |
| Kavita |
Posted - 02/04/2005 : 09:16:45
Mala,
Yes, I am Indian. Ironic, because the first time I saw your name, I wondered if you are as well.
I think my cultural background has affected the way I've been dealing with these, the foremost of which is a fear to talk about it because that would be betraying your family. As the saying goes, don't air your dirty laundry in public!
Nice to meet you, Mala, formally, that is! |
| mala |
Posted - 02/03/2005 : 22:00:33
Kavita,
Are you Indian by any chance?
mala
Good Luck & Good Health
Mala |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 02/03/2005 : 17:07:46
Kavita,
I agree with the majority of responses that you have suffered severe abuse and that you are doing exactly the right thing in telling your story. You must talk about it over and over again and with a therapist and/or group setting. You must stop defending your father and try to connect with the pain, hurt and anger that is inside of you that is still there and unexpressed. I can tell you that I cried when I read your story. Good luck in your recovery work. |
| n/a |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 14:40:01
Kavita - sending you hugs from across the Atlantic. Good luck with your doctor's appointment tomorrow. Let us know how it goes. |
| Kavita |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 13:47:25
Again, tremendous thanks for your feedback. To answer some of your questions, I located some resources and have a phone number for therapy. I am seeing a TMS doctor tomorrow, so she should be able to suggest some further resources.
Tunza - I LOVE exercise. It gets out all my stress, makes me feel empowered, and puts me in a good mind set. (Plus, my reward for working out is dessert!)
You all have been absolutely wonderful, what you said really resonates within me. I think I am finally on track to healing. This exercise has made me realize that the physical pain seems like only an inconvenience compared to the energy required to dig through the emotional pain. |
| Tunza |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 13:20:20
quote:
I exercise religiously, about an hour every day, sometimes 2 with the occassional day off, eat lots of fruit and vegetables, and treat myself to low fat ice cream for dessert. I am rather regimented, but I am healthy. In some ways I still feel like a prisoner, but I am pleased that I am in good shape and that my cholesterol is ultra low (118). But I still live in fear of being fat and ugly, and there are many foods I just don't let myself eat.
Although exercise and limiting junk food are good habits to have the fear that is driving you to approach them this way is not. I had anoxeria when I was 17 and this turned into binge eating for a year or so. What changed my relationship to food a lot was doing an Outward Bound course (28 day hiking, kayaking, rock-climbing, sailing etc course). I had to learn to use food for fuel to have the energy to do these activities and I had to share it with other people. Food had become such a source of shame for me even though I never got really overweight. I still have "issues" with food but not to that extreme.
Do you enjoy the exercise? I like walking my dog in some of the local bush tracks. It is so peaceful and such a great way to recharge my batteries. Sometimes I do some of my best psychological thinking on these walks and it feels so much easier to access my internal dialogue and see what's going on emotionally for me in this setting.
Sometimes I see people walking these same tracks with headphones on and I wish they would take them off and listen to the sounds of the bush - the native birds and the wind in the trees. I think some of these people are afraid to take the headphones off because they're afraid of being alone with their thoughts.
Sorry Kavita, I veered way off the topic! Anyway, I do think the eating/exercise fear does indicate how much your father's critical way of raising you (even if he thought he did it for your own good) has affected you and you don't have to feel guilty for feeling angry at him.
Kat |
| Laura |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 12:38:08
Kavita,
You asked for help and I'm sorry if the responses you're getting seem harsh. You say your dad is not a "monster." I think if you were to take a poll and ask people, they would definitely use the word "monster" to describe someone who beats his own wife. Your father physically abused your mother and verbally abused and manipulated you. You grew up in a home that sounds anything but loving and nurturing, and now as an adult you are suffering the consequences.
Take Michelle's advice and listen carefully to what she's telling you. Find a really good therapist, perhaps a Sarno oriented therapist, and talk to them about this. We are not trained therapists only sympathetic listeners who feel your pain. If you continue to make excuses for your father, it's not going to help you or him.
I hope you get some help and resolution to this problem. Good luck, Kavita.
Laura
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| Michele |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 11:43:27
I just returned from my first visit with a therapist who is familiar with Sarno, and is going to help me identify my emotional tension.
You described EXACTLY what we just talked about. We talked about my past sexual abuse, my controlling dad, my angry husband. She said that because of the childhood sexual abuse, the way I handle things as an adult are affected. Then I told her about my husband and describing how he gets angry about some things I do and say. I then went on to tell her that despite that, it's not that bad, we have a great time together.
She stopped me and said, do you know what you just did? I honestly didn't know.
I JUSTIFIED THE ABUSE.
"It's not that bad."
I was sexually abused - BUT I WASN'T RAPED so it wasn't that bad.
My husband may yell at me and diminish my feelings - BUT HE'S NOT BEATING ME, so it's not that bad.
My Dad was a mean son-of-a-bitch, BUT HE PROVIDED FOR MY NEEDS, so it wasn't that bad.
She said it is one of the techniques I use to get away from what I'm feeling. My assignment this week is to notice what I do to avoid being in the moment and feeling the emotion.
Your Dad treated you like crap, and you defend him. Same thing? Justifying the abuse. Apparently you (and I) use food to avoid the feeling. Or exercise, or doing the laundry, or anything else that can be used to get away from the moment.
Make sense? It certainly did for me! |
| Hilary |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 11:00:35
Kavita,
Your dad did a major number on you. No question.
What's interesting is that you jump quickly to his defense when another member of the group (Michele) points this out.
That's entirely normal. That's what kids of all ages do. You have to keep working away at this. It has taken me years of therapy to get to a place where I can really feel anger at my parents. To begin with, I did absolutely everything I could to protect them. My brother and I may both be anxious as hell and incredibly depressed, but that's just us, right? Nothing to do with our parents, not at all - after all they never hit us, always did what they thought was right and always provided for us.
There are many forms of abuse. Emotional abuse can be very serious. Parents can place demands on their children which become utterly unbearable. It sounds as if that's what's happened to you.
I went through a lot of the kind of stuff you're talking about, too. Eventually I realized that my parents had always done what was best for THEM, not for me. That was pretty devastating. It reversed everything I'd thought about my childhood. But suddenly I wasn't depressed any more, and I started to separate a little bit from my parents.
My opinion is that you don't have to DO anything right now. You just have to keep chipping away at these feelings, despite the guilt and all those voices telling you that you're a wretched, ungrateful daughter for delving into this stuff. Your dad ****ed up, and you have the right to get angry about that. Doesn't mean that you're going to stay angry, or that you won't move past this, but take one step at a time, at your own pace.
I wonder if the current issues around food come from the guilt you're feeling about delving into your past. are you in therapy? |
| Albert |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 09:56:34
It's true that people aren't perfect, but that doesn't mean that "he" isn't wrong when he does things such as put your mother's head inbetween his legs because she won't wax the car, or when he constantly belittles you.
I wonder if you need to be so apologetic for him. The fact of the matter is that when things didn't go "HIS WAY" he hit your mother, and feels it is okay to belittle you. Like did he really have to worry about whether or not you made the food at the party you talked about?
Perhaps either verbally or by letter you should tell him that you don't find his behavior towards you acceptable, and if he isn't man enough to accept what you have to say, distance yourself from him. I don't care who a person is. They have know right to mistreat you. |
| Kavita |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 09:35:41
Wow, your support means everything to me. But please, my father is not a monster. He rarely physically disciplined us, only when it was warranted, and rarely raised a hand to my mother. He was raised with a very nasty father, and despite that, showed much love towards me and my brother. What I've written are particular incidents over the years, and desipite some critical errors, he has been a great father. We are only human after all. The truth is he would give his life for mine in a second. But I agree with your assessment that I ought to put some distance between us until I sort out more of feelings, and can safely assert myself where he is concerned.
I feel immense guilt about writing these things on a public forum, and about someone who gave me life and love (despite the snide comments). That is one emotion that we TMSers all have in abundance. Any advice for dealing with that?
Thank you so much for your support, and for the book recommendations. |
| Laura |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 09:19:06
Kavita,
I read your post with such empathy. There are some people who clearly were not intended to be parents and yet they are. Your father (and mine) were two of those people. When you grow up with belitting comments, they become engrained into you and as an adult we still hold onto those beliefs. I am sure you are an intelligent, bright, and beautiful young woman and the more you distance yourself from your father the better off you'll be. My parents live in Michigan (I'm in California) and I see them for a few weeks once a year. It is torture to spend any length of time with them. My dad doesn't make the belitting comments he did when I was younger (you're a dummy, you're useless, you're clumsy, etc., etc.) but he and my mother do other things and push my buttons. Therefore, I try and limit my time with them and, fortunately, they are so wrapped up now with my nephew (he's a college football player and is their pride and joy - everything they wished my brother and I could have been) that they really don't have time for me anyway. In fact, they are retired and you'd think they had all the time in the world but half the time when I call and have something really important to talk to them about, they're telling me they're "busy" or they're going somewhere and can't talk. Maybe it's devine intervention or something, who knows.
Anyway, my point is that you do not deserve to be treated this way by your dysfunctional, bastard of a father and my advice is to just not have time to be with him and to distance yourself as much as you can. Have you ever read the book "Toxic Parents"? It describes abusive parents such as you and I and a lot of others have and gives some very good advice. I once sent it to my parents and I highlighted all the areas that pertained to them (which were many). I said "Read about yourselves in the pages of this book."
I wish you luck and I definitely feel for you. It is definitely not easy, but like Michelle said, hopefully you have a good therapist you can talk to and she can help you sort out your feelings through therapy, which may involve hitting some pillows and venting your anger at you father. Keep us posted on your progress.
Laura
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| Fox |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 08:54:47
Kavita - I don't understand what's wrong with your exercising an hour or two a day and being careful to eat in a healthy manner. That's what the health professionals recommend anyway. It's been in the newspapers a lot lately. I do the same and it has kept me healthy, happy, and more attractive than I would be if I did not maintain these "positive addictions" (as Dr. William Glasser would say). Are you severely underweight or so obessesed with these thoughts that it interferes with your daily functioning? If not, then there is not any problem with your actions. Instead, you are to be commended for your discipline....As for your feeling that you don't deserve to eat, well, that is a different matter and, as you already know, that persistent thought must have entrenched itself in your brain due to your father's frequent criticisms of you and perfectionistic demands of you. |
| Michele |
Posted - 02/02/2005 : 08:28:24
(((Kavita))) I'm sending hugs your way! You could use some!
Sorry, but it sounds like your Dad is quite the monster. Apparently he lives close to you? Have you ever tried distancing yourself from him? Don't call him, don't see him, don't plan time with him? Is your mom alive? If he asks what's your problem (instead of what's wrong), can you work up the courage to say, "I need time away from you Dad, because you are not good for my mental health." Or something to that effect. Do you have a therapist/counselor that you're working with? I've been in a group, and also reading about co-dependency. Much to my surprise, it is not only about alcohol and drug abuse. I am a classic co-dependent, i.e. most of what I do is to please others and keep the peace. I allow others to run my life.
One of the books I'm reading now is by Pia Mellody, "Facing Codependence". I see myself in alot of it, and you may as well. It is hard to stand up for yourself when you've basically had the boot on your head all your life pushing you down.
You need to start affirming yourself, internally and externally, and start the process of eliminating the negative things your Dad so generously supplied to you. You are not any of those things, and you know it. Right??
Joining a support group sounds like an excellent idea!
P.S. Perhaps your cholesterol is too low? I was recently told mine was too low (131). If you do a google search, there's some interesting reading on the subject.
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