| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Hilary |
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 06:48:01
Kasja mentioned this in another thread, and I got thinking about the role work plays in TMS. I wondered what experiences others with TMS have had with work - how you chose your field, whether you like it, why you like (dislike?) it, and so on - and how your work has played into your TMS.
One thing you said, Kasja, that really interested me, was that doing something you feel at a deep level lacks value can create a lot of anger. This was helpful to read, because I've had a real struggle finding something that "fits" me, and I believe I have a great deal of rage about that. I think I'm getting there, but it's been a real challenge!
I left school with a degree in English and found an editorial job in book publishing which I though would fit me to a tee. Guess what - it didn't. I loved the people and became Ms. Confidante to everyone in the office, but was less than enthralled with the business of books. Loved people, not so keen on numbers and figures. I stuck that job for about a year longer than I should have, and was finally forced to bail because my TMS symptoms were so bad I had to be treated for depression.
After that I left the UK and moved to the States, where I wound up in New York City. That was about ten years ago. I absolutely LOVED the city and felt absolutely at home there almost immediately, but still couldn't find a job I really liked. I kept thinking I should be a writer, but that was based on nothing. I totally lacked confidence and didn't know how the hell I'd go about it.
Eventually, I fell into recruitment. What a double-edged sword! On the one hand, I did really well, my boss loved me and I made some serious money - more than I'd ever imagined I could make - so I could live a nice NYC lifestyle - decent (though small, of course!) apartment, gym membership, could do cultural stuff around the city and go abroad occasionally, go out to dinner, see a therpist, etc. Nothing lavish, but I was able to live in an incredible city without being in a constant financial panic. It was quite intoxicating for a while! On the other hand, I felt frustrated every single day because on a deep level, as Kasja says, I didn't see how what I did was valuable. I was helping people and companies make more and more money, but I didn't really feel good about that. There were also personality issues at work which required me to swallow my anger and frustration on a daily basis and just get on with things. This paid off financially, but it didn't pay of emotionally or mentally or physically - not at all.
Who knows what makes us value what we do? I'd always, always had a strong sense that I needed to help people and make the world a better place. Naive, I guess, but it's something I can't get away from. If that means making less money, then so be it. I don't think I can be happy if I'm not doing something I deem worthwhile.
So I gave it all up, and left my job. I also left New York, and moved back to the UK 5 months ago. (Cue new TMS symptoms, and my introduction to sarno and TMS theory).
Over the years I'd becoming more and more interested in how people make decisions around careers. I think, because I'd had such a struggle figuring it out for myself, and probably because I was angry that I'd been given f-all help along the way, I really wanted to help provide others with tools to make effective caerer decisions. So I'm now doing a one-year postgrad in Careers Guidance and education. This will equip me to see clients one-on-one, and teach careers education. I think it's an extremely important field which, if done right, can give young people tools that will guide them throughout life. (It's rarely done right, unfortunately, but I aim to change that!) I really like the idea of faciliating groups and teaching, as well.
The other thing about moving into this field is that I can start getting some counselling experience. Down the road, i could see another career change that would enable me to become a therapist. I feel that I've got substantial work to do on myself before that, however.
So, I am both pleased and anxious about this transition. My back pain started the month I moved back to the UK: I was happy to be here, but it's only recently that I've been forced to think about what's going on at a deeper level. Career guidance is typically not a well-paid field, so I'm going to have to be creative about how I make money - I am single, and I can't deny that making money matters. I think there's a possibility, in this business, of setting up a private practice.
There are days when I think about the lifestyle and $$ I left behind, and I think I must be insane. On bad days, I worry that I've made a big mistake, and I get angry when I think about how difficult it's been for me to find a career path. But then I think about the fact that I'm being equipped to work in a field which IS going to make a difference to people, and I like that. I just hope I can make a go of things financially!
I think the money thing gets to me more than I'd realized, actually. I need to do some more thinking about this!
One more thing: I am still bugged by the thought that I should do some writing, and I think I need to move on this. I'm not sure what I'd do, or how, but it's recently occured to me that the only way to put this ghost to rest is to let it out of its cage. (I think I mixed a few metaphors there!) Does anyone else have experience of pursuing something they've always been, well, haunted by?
Look forward to hearing others' experiences...
Hilary
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| 7 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Hilary |
Posted - 01/27/2005 : 05:43:45
DUH! -- I forgot about my original post and just got around to reading responses here.
Thanks for your really interesting input, everyone. I can really relate to what pretty much everyone has said here. For me it has been a constant quest to find something I can do which challenges me and makes me feel as if I'm contributing to a better world. I've spent so much time feeing discontent in work and angry that I'm not doing something more personally fulfilling. Yet the idea of throwing myself in over my head is absolutely terrifying!
I'm really glad I left the high-paying headhunting job though. That was a weird combination of stressful and boring... not good for TMS.
Interesting, Baseball and tennis tom, that you both describe CA as a "TMS cauldron". I sort of feel the same way about New York. I absolutely love that city and in so many ways it totally shaped me, but I don't think my time there particularly contributed to feeling better. It is the most competitive place in the world! (possibly with the exception of LA!) |
| Kajsa |
Posted - 01/23/2005 : 07:39:13
Actually I can relate to all of the posts.
The dependency as well - to choose a job that is "safe" but not challenging.
I grew up with a brother, only one year older than me.
I had much better grades in shool.
He is now president of a huge multinational company. He works all over the world.
Why did our lifes become so different?
He is a boy I am a girl?
I was my parents thearpist (kind of), spending a lot of time at home "helpng them" and he was out with his friends all the time.
I do not blame him and I do not envy his job.That is not at all wat I dream of (to have a business career).
But I think he is quite content and actually LIKE his job.
THAT I envy.
But I think itīs important to not become a martyr (like our friend TMS PAIN "bless his soul").
And not get stuck in the phrases like "I could have been president with my grades BUT..."
I can not blame my uppbringing for ever.
I have to actually change my life.
I did write a book (for children) some years ago.
And I got it published ! It got great reviews and it came out in a second.
edition after a while.
So, my dream came true....
But then I didnīt write a second one. Why?
Because I didnīt allow myself to succeed?
Yes, something like that. I blame the lack of time, lack of money, lack
of "the right room to sit in" etc.
But I think that I am afraid to fail.
I think this is "the bottom of my TMS".
And i have to deal with it (I am on my way...).
Not only talk about it, read about it, write about in (on the board) etc
NO, acutally DEAL with it.
Itī a bit like going to the gym even if you have "the pain".
Kajsa |
| Kajsa |
Posted - 01/23/2005 : 07:08:43
Yes, work IS an important factor in TMS.
Hilary - I can really relate to a lot of the things you write about.
The AMBIVALENCE the most.
To do the job very good and to everybodys satisfaction.
But not your own satisfaction! (as if that didnī count...)
To stay to long on a job that really doesnī fit you -because
the working time is good, the money is good, or whatever. But on
a deeper level feel that you are doing something that "isnīt you".
Yet, you do it good "because you are a TMS.person".
As I wrote - I became "the librarian of the year". I was in quite a lot of magazins telling people about how I work and so on.
I was invited to conferences etc.
Of course I think that libraries are very good - and librarians do a lot of important work ! No question about that.
I have been working a lot with teaching how to seek and value information and how to read and write.
But I have always hated the more administrative part of the job -organize books and papers etc. It is a big part of being a librarian.
And I have never felt at home with my collegues. I do not dislike them
at all - it is not that - but I have never really felt "at home" with them.
Most of them are very interested in organizing and rules and so on (and that is a good thing when you work in a library). But I feel totally dead inside after a day in front of my computer or when I handle papers and stuff. I love the contact with the visitors and pupils -but my contact is really never on a deeper level.
This creates anger ! And sometimes I have done the most childish things
like "putting the books in disorder etc"
That is not a very productive or mature way o deal with the problems!
Itī pure agression.
Kajsa
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| Bazz |
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 12:51:23
Great topic. Work was basically the problem why I'v got TMS.
Just two months after I started a new job in a large insurance company I got RSI-complaints in my hands and neck. My contract expired after one year and was not prolounged because of the RSI, so I lost that job and needed to stay home for about a year.
After reading dr. Sarno's books I finally found answers why I got this RSI-complaints to this job.
I did a job in finance, but actually it was too boring to me. The people were boring, the departement was boring and the work was not really valuable. When I started this job I had the high expections that this company worked highly professional, (which was not true) it would be dynamic and a step forward in my carreer. (which was not true) So it was quite a disappointment for me.
When I look back at my youth and years at college, It doesn't look like I have made a very logical choise to go studying finance. I was a quite active person, liked speaking abroad languages, liked subjects as marketing and trade. However the choise of my finance study was about rational reasons, like fear for presentations, my suffering from severy acne (also TMS!), a friend who did the same study, my personallity etc.
One important thing that dr. Sarno writes in the Mindbody Prescription is about unconscious dependency. Although I have done a high education and developped myself very good, I have chosen a job and a direction that was quite safe but not really challenging.
I am actually still thinking about new careerchoises, but actually it is not that easy. I do still cope with the RSI, which is going better but far from 100%. Also I ussually get doubts if my (some kind of introvert) personality suits to the jobs that I really prefer. To me it's a complex process in which I am still looking for the best solution.
Barry |
| Baseball65 |
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 11:07:11
Hi Tom.
Well,The Car was a 1960 Hillman Minx convertible.I got it from a Roll Royce mechanic who was one of my "clients".I believe Rolls Royce took over Hillmans Factories at some point.
My life has been a series of extremes,though while going through it,it all seemed perfectly normal...and hell! It isn't even over yet.
As far as work goes....drumroll...I almost posted about this....I'm working for the SAME IDIOT!!!
I read the Louise Hay Book and the part on employment and anger etc.
She says you can not move forward in life and career until you have "made peace" with your past anger.....though not necessarily by going back to the same job.
I wrote extensively on my anger with him,my life,etc. and came to the conclusion I have always come to: I am Once again working for someone I am far better than.No more discussion.I am morally and professionally superior to him.period.
However,my side of the street was not totally clean.Although I worked hard and did the anal retentive perfect work that I pride myself on,he (vacant)had been fair with me in regards to money,looseness of schedule(like doing the music thing next week) and a lot of other things. After meditating on it,I looked at all the loneliness and illness in his life...his wife virtually ignores him,he has no children or other family OR friends...he exists to work.
The more I thought about what a sorry son of a bitc# he was,the more I felt guilty for "ditching" him. I called to just check on him,like a friend....I do ultimately TRY to live up to the morals taught by Christ...that's how my life turned around...and how I got TMS.
I was NOT trying to get my job back.He answered the phone and was ecstatic that I had called,telling me about all the big contracts he had just gotten from Apple computers to do their new facility here,and how he needed me back.
I told him I though we were through,and he said "Why"....I recapped our last discussion and he said,"You just have to understand that I just want things done my way"...OK...I was reminded of Ty Cobb in Ken Burns "Baseball"..."I just HAVE to be first"....just minus all the talent and Balls.
So..with the intent of :
A: Leaving the moment I get any other job offered
B: pursuing with vigor all my leads into writing
C: viewing it as working for him..NOT professional painting
and..of course...
day 2 back at work. He left me alone in a home with an insurmountable amount of work before me.I just "do my thing"
He comes in the next morning and begins to rip my work to shreds.
Punch line: As he is doing so,the client walks in and says:
"My God,we've had dozens of painters,and I've never seen anyone do as much work in a day,as neat and perfect as Marc did it"
Of course my Boss retaliated by instructing me in every single thing I did wrong the remainder of the day....and...his HIP began to "kill" him.
I came home and wrote in depth last night....and I finally realized WHY I have ALWAYS had problems with guys like him.No matter how apparent their shortcomings,no matter how wrong any other Male I work for is,I desperately need MALE approval.....probably goes back to my father Dying when I was 5.The client was female...no matter how much she praised my work,I was needing male approval.It's like a wolf pack mentality....must be approved by alpha wolf.
He of course left without approving of me,lost in his own wretched world of anger and hopelessness.I now view my job with him as a sort of "school"...where else could I so often and so intensely be confronted with the very foundations of my being.
....of course,like any other school,I expect to graduate...or this might be all deep philosophical BS and I might 'drop out'....only time will tell.I do know that I have forever struggled against every institution,religion,Idea and person that has ever held sway over my person....something is there....what will I find??
My best and most enlightened friend has worked for the same IDIOT for a year and a half..he just laughs at him and finds his pedagoguery amusing.....why can't I laugh it off???
deeper and deeper ever we dive....the only thing that matters is continually raising awareness...the actions will take care of themselves. .........
I have sometimes listened to my own stories and had I not been there,would imagine myself a liar on the scale of Marco Polo (or Marcos Milliones...implying the millions of lies he told)
I think if I actually told my story,it would be not unlike Forrest Gump.....that movie reminds me of me.The only difference is,it's like a photographic negative.....I fought and kicked and pissed and scraped every inch,and still was spun through the randomness of the aether like a gossamer.
Maybe that is what I need to do...where would I start???
I know how to write a hell of a good song,but they are only 3-4 minutes long....Ideas???
Fire away!!
Marc
peace
piece
Baseball65 |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 09:46:14
Baseball65,
That is an absolutely amazing biography. It would make a great European style humanistic movie. I think you should write a script. We watched "Napoleon Dynamite" last night. A charming movie made on a pittance of a budget. You certainly have much more material to work with. That was also the tightest post you have written here. It could also be a good plug for The Good Doctor. Maybe he could play a role similar to Vanessa? Redgrave as the head psych doctor in "Girl Interrupted".
There was a great scene in that flick about "ambivalence" - no doubt a TMS emotional equivalent. When you get the Oscar for screenwriting, maybe you can give me a little mention.
What was the vintage convertible you had? I'm a convertible guy too. I'm 'gonna get the new stretched Jeep Unlimited Rubicon in red.
I feel the same as you do about CA. A TMS cauldron. You made a good move for your family to get out. Too many bad influence on the kids. You lose control of them and 49th worst education system. It used to be #1 when I grew up here.
It sounds like you're working again. It didn't take you long. On one of Schechter's tapes, he mentions Deepak Chopra saying illness is Western culture's way of meditating - maybe unemployment too? Glad you got some money coming back in, super sleuth, it didn't take you long. Hope you got a better boss this time.
Great post Baseball65 - very POWERFUL!
Best Wishes,
tt |
| Baseball65 |
Posted - 01/22/2005 : 08:59:29
Hi Hilary.
This is a HUGE and important topic,especially taking TMS into consideration.
I had a very different path to where I am,and yet relate to many of the ideas you have set forth,particularly,leaving a high paying job to go live somewhere else.I've just done exactly that.
I was always ranked super-high academically,but due to a disturbed childhood,was in jail by the time I was 18,in spite of straight-A,gifted type of school career.I was always ranked at the top of every class,yet barely finished High school.I come from a Harvard/Stanford sweater-over-the shoulders type of Family.....I am tattooed with long hair...you get the picture.
I spent most of my mid 20's UN-doing what I had done the first 20 or so years of my life....I was fundamentally a career criminal.I dealt drugs,organized burglaries,robbed people and ran an ongoing cigarette fencing deal,that went on for years.When I was 20(1985) I was making 1000-1500 dollars a week and I had no JOB!!!! I went to the beach,played guitar all day,and toodled around in a vintage convertible. I thought I was sooo clever and that everybody who worked a day job was just stupid.I related a lot to the Character Ray Liotta played in "goodfella's"
I never just Stopped...I had many mini-epiphanies along the way....and by the time I was about 24 had hit rock bottom.Now the fun began.
I tried to go "straight" and it isn't easy.Lugging cinder blocks up a hill,drywalling and sanding,having missed college I was now working as a "minion" of people who I was far more intelligent than....this was my First TMS taste...my shoulder started to kill me.I went for Therapy often with no resolution.
Than I met HER..the most Beautifulest sweetest girl in the world.....and had to go even straighter.She was a miss goody-two-shoes Midwestern girl,with a southern Baptist upbringing....I'm a jaded Los Angeles ex-F-up...Great combo!!!
So,we get married and oooops...now I'm someone's Father.I start working harder through the few options I have and now I am making decent money,as I land a job in the Film and TV industry.Now I SURELY have arrived.Within 5 years,I am actually an upstart BOSS on small movies ,sometimes actually running paint departments,hiring and firing people.I have to politic and bribe,push and shove in a very Machiavellian manner....I'm there.."sucked in" as they call it...an "untouchable"...no one can figure out how I weaseled my way to places that have taken others YEARS to get to.There is constant pressure to land a job on the next show.
OH yeah.....I am also a COMPLETE CRIPPLE..The once buff-tough bugsy in training is now a glamourized manual laborer,limping around his Un-chosen life,not seeing the extremely hard U-turn he has tried to make .TMS had made me an invalid,I walk with a cane,have surgery,go to chronic pain centers and eventually find Sarno...and of course a cure.
At some point along the way,My Brother who is very much like you (Degree in English,Career jumper,single,big $$$$$$,Lives in NYC,ultra-hipster...is a professional event planner,MTV,VH-1,The superbowl,etc...)
calls me on the phone drunk one night...he ends up crying and says
"I wish I was more like you...you always did whatever you wanted....you never listened to Mom....I did everything right,and I HATE my life!"""
....if he only knew...
...so,after years of getting more and more disillusioned working in the entertainment industry(which I am fundamentally and spiritually at odds with)..I move to Nashville,TN. to live a slower,more NORMAL life...leaving the 'glamour' job I had to make less money,and live simpler.A lot of it had to do with my kids,but even still I think LA has gone to Hell,and no job is worth living in the constant congestion and confusion of Babylon.
Just as you are Haunted by the idea you should be writing,I have(somewhere in that OTHER life) gotten very close to be signed as a songwriter...I actually signed a development deal with a grammy winning producer the last year I was in LA,and have played with some of the biggest names in the industry....to go and PAINT the next day...talk about a TMS rage maker...I'm in the studio recording with Tom Petty's band one day,and pushing a sander the next.
So...I still pursue the writing thing...in spite of my age and the odds and everything else...to the dereliction of a lot of my "other" responsibilies (I'm ditching work next week to maybe get a sniff of writing for a new female artist)...
TMS=suppresed rage=talents not matching challenges
If I didn't still try to suceed,I would probably have some sort of horrible condition....thank GOD I found Sarno...
this is definitely the second or third consideration in any TMSers make-up .....Family is still #1
peace,love and woodstock
Baseball65 |
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