| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| hambone |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 07:32:26
After reading all the Schubiner course student emails for three months I am struck by two themes: first, these people are all really bright; and second, it is a continuing tragedy of epic proportion that the conventional medical establishment rejects the mind/body solution to pain syndromes. Millions of people are in serious, horrible, life-altering, misery, meanwhile the medical establishment acts like flat earth fundamentalists at an evolution convention. Ever since I learned the truth about these pain syndromes in 1983 I have been furious at the monstrous coverup of incompetence and malpractice..
My question: what is being done to get the TMS/MBS curriculum into medical schools? Is there any organized effort to do so or is it just Dr. Sarno or Dr. Schubiner acting solo? Do we need to organize and get serious?
I suspect Drs. Sarno, Schubiner et al find it difficult to call fellow physicians what they are- incompetent. Orthopedists, etc. have been allowed to get away with incompetence. We've been too damn polite. Maybe the march to competence needs to be lead by a non-physician who does not hesitate to call a spade a spade. The mild-mannered approach has not worked, period. And millions remain in agony, or hooked on painkillers, or commit suicide as a result.
Now-fifty years after Dr. Sarno's groundbreaking work began- we need a new strategy: organized, relentless and fierce, if necessary.
Your ideas, please.
Steve
STEVEN T HAMBLIN |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Peg |
Posted - 06/23/2009 : 11:54:27
I can't take credit for that great quote.
Allan (forum member) shared that with me and after the quote, he wrote; Dr. Sarno's time has come!
Peg
In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual. Galileo Galilei |
| Capn Spanky |
Posted - 06/23/2009 : 11:11:14
I definitely am interested, Hillary. I'll be contacting you. Thanks! |
| HilaryN |
Posted - 06/22/2009 : 15:56:21
Ah! I wondered where you'd got to, Capn Spanky - we missed you at the last online meetup, too, in May.
We're doing another online meetup and wiki tour on Sunday:
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5755
If you're interested let me know, and if the time doesn't suit we'll be doing another one soon.
Hilary N |
| Capn Spanky |
Posted - 06/22/2009 : 13:16:27
Dog-gone-it! I lost track of this and forgot. I hope you have something similar again soon. Is there an MP3 of the teleconference for those of who would like to hear it? |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/22/2009 : 12:50:50
Peg shared a wonderful quote on the wiki's mailing list that I thought was worth passing on:
quote:
All the forces in the world are not so powerful as an idea whose time has come.
--Victor Hugo
Forest
tmswiki.org |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/21/2009 : 13:47:18
quote:
Originally posted by forestfortrees
If you are interested in TMS activism projects like the ones described above, you may also want to attend the wiki's second wiki/activism teleconference on June 20.
The teleconference went off very successfully yesterday. HilaryN, Pandamonium, Peg, MathewNJ, Webdan65, Barbara Kline, LCSW-C, Lisa Morphopoulos, and I all attended. Dr. Stracks, who wrote the text in the Dr. Stracks on explaining TMS to friends/family thread even dropped by to talk about setting up a TMS clinic in Chicago. He will be starting up a program very similar to Dr. Schubiner's, but will probably customize it as he goes along.
Peg and I talked about the work that we are doing and have done on the "Q&A with an Expert" project (recently revived by Peg, who is probably ready for more questions. Post new questions at the bottom of this page). Hilary talked about the Meetup and Wiki Tour events that she has been organizing for the public (the next one is next Sunday. Please join us to show your support!). HilaryN also talked about updating the Specific Symptom & Diagnoses project, which we could use all of your help with, especially if you have a TMS symptom that some people may not know much about. Matthew and Peg talked about their TMS Success Stories - Live panel project, in which they will be putting on free internet teleconferences patterned off of Dr. Sarno's alumni panels. Webdan65 talked about his plans for the Success Story Videos on YouTube project that he discussed above. Finally, I talked about some ideas for the future, as well as how we can communicate and keep organized to maximize our effectiveness.
Whenever you get a bunch of TMSers together on a teleconference, a wonderful dialogue always seems to spontaneously arise. Therefore, while we had an agenda, we also just tried to let the conversation naturally flow.
It seems like we are beginning to see the birth of a well organized and highly movement of TMS activism. It calls to mind the famous quote by Margaret Mead, "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed, citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."
I think that coordinating and organizing our efforts (and forming a supportive community so that we have fun along the way) will be crucial to our success, so what we did during the conference was very exciting to me.
If people are interested in guided tours of the wiki, both HilaryN and I would be happy to give them. Just drop us a line.
Forest
tmswiki.org |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/14/2009 : 21:22:01
Thanks Peg!
I think that when our lives are transformed by a diagnosis of TMS, we get a burst of energy and want to share what we've learned with the world. We don't want them to suffer needlessly the way that we have. Working alone to bring about change can be lonely and frustrating, though, and we can rapidly burn out. Plus, when we work alone, it is very hard to get things done. When we cooperate, however, we are far more effective.
As any activist knows, the solution is to get organized.
A core part of setting up the TMS Wiki has been building a community of devoted TMS activists--like the people who will be attending the TMS Wiki's second wiki/activism conference (HilaryN, Pandamonium, Peg, MathewNJ, Webdan, ForestForTrees, Georgie Oldfield, Barbara Kline, LCSW-C, Lisa Morphopoulos, and Flutterby).
Anyone who wants to help with TMS activism can count on our support. It's a lot more fun to "save the world" when other people are involved! Therefore, if you are interested in helping to spread the word about TMS, I encourage you to join us.
I think that the wiki is a very natural thing to organize around because, like Wikipedia, it is protected by a copyleft rather than a copyright. This means that the content can be freely copied by anyone as long as they aren't making any money, provide appropriate attribution, and "share alike." (Legal info and more details here.) Thus, the wiki really is "owned by all TMSers."
Another reason to work with us is that we are very well connected with the community of TMS professionals and can help coordinate projects with the leadership of that group (Schubiner, Schechter, Clarke, Selfridge, etc.). Peg, Barbara, Georgie and I went to the TMS conference in Ann Arbor and made some terrific contacts there. I also had a chance to present the wiki to the entire conference, and it was incredibly warmly received (partially because of the Copyleft I mentioned above). Looking at our member list, no less than 26 TMS professionals have joined the wiki. Six of them contribute their time to answer questions, for free, at our Q&A section. In fact, when Dr. Schubiner first suggested that we make that section (it was his idea), he said that he was volunteering his time because he wanted to help draw attention to the wiki.
I'm not saying that change will come rapidly. On the contrary, I think that it will take a lot of hard work and patience. But I do think that it will come much more quickly if we work together.
For example, I used to run the Q&A With An Expert section of the wiki all by myself. I'm incredibly busy, and I fell behind with updating the questions. However, since I am working with Peg, I was able to ask for her help, and now she is working on the section almost every day! All of a sudden, thanks to her help, this wonderful program is back up and running again (and now we need more questions again! To post yours, click here). In fact, when I was training her, when we came upon a question about Fibromyalgia. Because we knew that Nancy Selfridge is a big supporter of the wiki, we just sent her an email, and she answered the question herself! (Dr. Selfridge had TMS for years that was diagnosed as Fibromyalgia, and wrote a book about TMS and Fibromyalgia. Dr. Sarno wrote in the forward of her book that, "This is a very important book.") It was very exciting. 
Forest
tmswiki.org |
| Peg |
Posted - 06/14/2009 : 11:54:03
Great job Forest.
Thanks for all of your efforts.
Peg
In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual. Galileo Galilei |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/13/2009 : 19:57:41
People who are interested in both this thread and TMS activism in general may wish to join the wiki's mailing list. Peg will, most likely, discuss her video success story project there, and several other "TMS Activism" projects are also frequently discussed. If you want to participate in and know what is going on with TMS activism, it is a good list to be part of.
If you are interested in TMS activism projects like the ones described above, you may also want to attend the wiki's second wiki/activism teleconference on June 20. Peg will be there and Webdan has said that he will try to make it, so there will probably be some discussion of the project. Alltogether, the following people are scheduled to attend: (some of them aren't sure that they can make it) - HilaryN (frequent TMSHelp poster and wiki contributor)
- Pandamonium (frequent TMSHelp poster and wiki contributor)
- Peg (frequent TMSHelp poster and wiki contributor)
- MathewNJ (organizing the free online patient panels described in my previous post)
- Webdan (needs no introduction!)
- ForestForTrees (me! I founded the TMS wiki and do a lot of TMS activism)
- Georgie Oldfield (UK TMS physiotherapist, author of tmsrecovery .com)
- Barbara Kline, LCSW-C (therapist from MD who is very passionate about TMS)
- Lisa Morphopoulos (therapist from NYC, also very passionate about TMS)
- Flutterby (new member on the TMSHelp forum)
The next teleconference will be about TMS activism instead of general discussion and support. The wiki is currently hosting two series of teleconferences. Many of you may already be familiar with the first series. It mixes a tour of the wiki with an international meetup. Click on this thread and this wiki page for details. Eventually it will turn into an international Skype teleconference based TMS support group with patient panels like Dr. Sarno holds. We refer to it as an international meetup/tour of the wiki and it will be announced separately, most likely by HilaryN.
The wiki/activism teleconference I'm describing here is to discuss the wiki, its projects, and general TMS activism. We usually joke around a bunch and have a good time, but the emphasis is not on supporting each other in dealing with TMS (though since we all have it that comes up) and is instead on the state of TMS activism and on how we can get things done.
Forest
tmswiki.org |
| PRCalDude |
Posted - 06/11/2009 : 14:29:00
quote:
Originally posted by Webdan65
Making TMS mainstream really does require a paradigm shift in the entire medical BUSINESS.
And I put the word business in caps for a reason.
If TMS and the MindBody approach became commonplace, doctors and pain clinics around the country would have no purpose. Unless of course they began teaching and treating TMS. But consider the back surgeon. The resistance to TMS comes because it is a threat to everything they have been taught to believe. It is a threat to their very financial future.
Chiropractors: I have never been a big fan of chiropractic care based on my own personal experience. I have also heard some horrific things about how chiropractors are taught to market their services. Through fear. Scare the patient into believing a regular and ongoing series of "treatments" are necessary or prepare for the worst.
Physical therapists are no better: I went to one last year with barely any pain, but muscle imbalances that had pulled my spine crooked. After 6 weeks of "treatment" which consisted of a stock set of photocopied stretches and a bunch of elbows in my back to "loosen the bound muscle fibers" I developed chronic pain. All day - every day pain that too many of us here are too familiar with. They programmed my mind to believe I was broken. And despite knowing about TMS, I took the bait - hook, line and sinker. Talk about focusing on the body.
When I spoke to the Physical therapists about Sarno and the Mindbody approach - I got vague interest at best. Perhaps they were just being polite by nodding their heads with modest agreement. I even copied my CD's of Healing Back Pain and gave it to one of the main physical therapists to listen to. Two weeks later - he still didn't listen claiming - he "didn't have time". What could be more important??? That's when I announced I wouldn't be back. LOL
I (once again) agree with you completely, Dan. I saw a physical therapist who released me from treatment quickly, but he didn't tell me he thought I had a mind-body issue going on, so I left believing I was too damaged to get better. Only later, when I talked to a friend of mine who worked for the guy, did I find out that a quick release from therapy means that one probably has a mental pain process going on - but the patient is never told.
Chiropractors are shysters all. |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/11/2009 : 13:10:00
It seems like there is potential for cooperation between multiple projects here. Hilary and I are trying to start up a monthly wiki tour/meetup, which we hope will eventually morph into a full scale online teleconference based international support group for TMSers. The last one that we held was very successful (you can read about it in this wiki page or in this TMSHelp forum post. We had seven participants from three continents and I think everyone had a great time.
Afterward, one of the participants suggested that we set up regular free patient panels like Dr. Sarno's. I asked him if he would like to spearhead it, and he said that he would be willing to do so. His doesn't participate much in this forum, but is active on the tms_support Yahoo Group and the wiki (his wiki username/profile is MatthewNJ). You can read more about the patient panels here.
Anyway, it occurs to me that we could record the success stories from the patient panel/success stories teleconference (ideally with video) and that anyone who wants to do a video testimonial may possibly also be interested in giving their success story in the patient panel/success story teleconference.
Forest
tmswiki.org |
| Peg |
Posted - 06/11/2009 : 05:22:49
Sounds good Forest, we'll talk.
Steve--I don't think the fact that you have had other episodes of symptoms detracts from your success. I have as well, but I have never been as bad as when I didn't know the REAL cause of my pain. The most important and liberating thing, after accepting the tms theory, is that if we develop some annoying or downright painful symptom (imperative), it doesn't persist once we figure out that it's just tms again.
The alternative would be that we would go down the physical/structural path, visit MD's (no offense docs), have tests, receive bogus diagnoses, have unnecessary, expensive and possibly harmful treatments.
Webdan--I have webcam and skype as well.
Marsha--Hi--hope you're doing okay.
Peg
In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual. Galileo Galilei |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 22:58:45
Peg, I just want to emphasize I am serious about helping record video success stories. If you can line up people to record, I could help with the technical side. It wouldn't be fancy, but it could probably get the trick done. I'm perfectly happy to lend you my camera for as long as it takes.
Since travel can be expensive, my bet is that you will probably want to stick with local people unless you happen to be traveling anyway. My bet is that the way to find them would be through local TMS doctors who you already have good relationships with. My bet is that if you contacted such a doctor they would be happy to mention your name to some of their successful patients. Not only would helping you be a good deed, but for doctors who are authors, it could increase their international profile to have a compelling success story by someone whose life they have really changed. Hence, if they think about it, they have many reasons to help you.
For both Peg and Dan, it seems like it could be helpful to record two video segments: one that is a longer, more in-depth success story (I personally like more in-depth stories) and a second that is more specifically a thank-you for Dr. Sarno.
Steven, I think that mentioning recurrences is fine. Sometimes when people read about the instant and complete cures, they think that it will always be that easy and begin to doubt the diagnosis or blame themselves if it doesn't happen that way for them. Seeing that other people have had to struggle with it but have still profited enormously could be very helpful.
Nightwing, the TMS wiki is hosting an international meetup via a teleconference at the end of the month. We would love to have you join. Details can be found here:
http: //tmswiki.wetpaint.com/page/The+TMS+Wiki%27s+tour+and+meetup
(remove the space when you paste the address into your browser.)
I'm very optimistic that as more and more people start getting comfortable with high quality video-cameras built in to their cell phones that posting TMS success stories on YouTube and other video sharing sites will become more and more common. For example, if seeing a bunch of YouTube TMS success stories was a big part in accepting the TMS diagnosis for someone, then it would seem very natural for them to take half an hour to make their own success story with their own cell-phone camera once they had healed. I think that it is up to us, though, to start that trend, by putting the first videos up. (By the way, if anyone wants to email me a cell-phone video of a TMS success story, I'd be happy to post it on YouTube and other sites. My email address is "ForestFor Trees@ ymail.com" (remove the spaces).) |
| Nightwing |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 20:51:36
First let me say I am so glad I found this site and Dr Sarnos's books. I am a typical story right from many pages of his books. I have improved beyond imagination, but have a ways to go yet. I only read his book, Divided Mine about 10 days ago and it was the first one I read.
Webdan65, I will give thought to letting you use my story. I only say thought, because I am a very sceptical person, past job of 20 years made me that way. Although I have improved greatly, I still have a few doughts. Dr. Sarno, says the other treatments, ie: Chiropractors, surgery, ect are placebo effects. My question is, what makes this not just another placebo? I am hopping with all my might that it is not. I have a lot of deprogramming to do. One being the concept of not going to a chiropractor. Chiropractors have saved me and members of my family numerouse times, from needless surgery. One example, the orthopedic Dr's wanted to break my sons legs, rotate them and put them back, because he was very pigioned toed. 2 months with a Chiroprator, my some was walking straight as an arrow.
I have been in different levels of pain, from annoying to severe for over 6 years now and I am almost pain free from low back pain in only 10 days. I have also only had 2 nights that I have not had to get up in the middle of the night to drink a cup of antacids, because of heartburn. I beleive it was the knowledge from the book and this was unexpected.
I really think the biggest obstical will be stuborn people like me. I was told 2 years ago, that this myght be phycosematic (spelling?) I can't remember the Dr, whi told me this, because I thought he was a quack. I knew how and when I hurt my back, it was not in my head. It took me to be in such pain and tired of being in pain, to open my eyes. I think this is what is going to have to happen to people, before they understand. Another book / video will help those of us who have made the leap, re-affirm the belief, but others will not bother with it. They will just look at it as another person just trying to make money with a scam.
I am so thrilled so far, that I too want to tell everyone in the world and can't understand why the healthcare system has not embrased it, unless it would cost them money some how. I have told a couple peole I work with, who know me and how I have dealt with this pain and they look at me like I am nuts, when I tell them how I became as pain free as I am now. I have only told two people right now and only because these people have family members dealing with cronic pain.
I am going to try and search for a TMS meetup group somewhere in my area, if they don't have one I might try and start one. If I continue to get better and stay better, I would deffinatley let you use my story.
Again glad I found this group and hope to make a lot of new friend here. |
| hambone |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 17:18:48
I'm willing to be interviewed on audio or video. I have a webcam on my laptop but have never used it or skype. I love the youtube idea and I love showing Dr Sarno how he's helped end our bouts of suffering.
My TMS history involves victory over two episodes of metatarsal foot pain that put me in a wheelchair; seven years of lower back pain and three episodes of hamstring pain.
I suppose someone watching me on Youtube might ask why do I keep having pain recurrences if I have this syndrome all figured out and therefore wonder if I have anything of value to impart. I guess we need to admit that the syndrome can pester a person forever and you need to defeat it over and over, not a pleasant prospect.
STEVEN T HAMBLIN |
| sarita |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 04:29:29
youtube can have a huge impact. youtube is the way to go. |
| pandamonium |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 02:45:37
I have skype and a webcam, so Webdan if you want to run some kind of mock up with me I'd be happy to oblige, just email me.
I love the idea of a thank you to Dr Sarno, to whom we owe a huge debt of gratitude.
Panda
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
A beginner's guide to psychology: If it's not your mum's fault.... it's your dad's... |
| forestfortrees |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 00:30:32
quote:
Originally posted by Peg
Also, I think it would be great to make it for Dr. Sarno. Most of us feel that we owe him a debt of gratitude. Wouldn't it be wonderful for him to be able to watch the stories of those he has helped. The medical community may not acknowledge him, but I see no reason why we can't.
Can you imagine how happy that would make him? Another idea would be to embed the collection of video success stories in a wiki page as an internet "thank-you card" for everything that he has done for us.
quote:
Originally posted by Peg
I would be interested in partnering with someone who has knowledge of how to make a decent quality video. I would be willing to find stories, make contacts and travel to record if necessary.
I could also provide some technical support. Skype will only provide video if the interviewee has a webcam, but I have a camera that can record video that I'd be happy to lend to Peg. She lives near me, so I could show her how to use it and should be able to show her how to upload the videos onto YouTube (I haven't yet uploaded a video from this camera, but uploading videos to YouTube and other video sharing sites is pretty simple, so it shouldn't be a problem.) I don't have a tripod yet, but I'd be happy to purchase one (tripods are important for video).
Peg, I think that the first step would be setting up some appointments to video people who are either close by or don't have webcams. Once you do that, we can talk about getting the camera to you.
Another option is that even if we only have audio, it shouldn't be hard to put just the audio up on YouTube and other video sharing sites (optionally along with a photo of the speaker). It wouldn't be nearly as powerful as video, but it would still be really good.
Forest |
| Webdan65 |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 20:07:23
Hey Gang:
Wow, I'm thrilled at the groups willingness to get involved.
I love the video idea too. I can either help you get your own video up on YouTube, or we could conduct a video interview on Skype and record it. Skype is free and if you have a webcam - we could do it that way.
If the video is too much - we can stick with the audio. I already have the tools to record a phone call. I want to play around with recording the skype video before setting something up.
As for traveling and doing in person interviews my business won't allow me all that much time to travel. With todays technology, I think we can still get a lot done remotely.
I'll be in touch with you all within a week to start scheduling calls or video Skype sessions to record. The great news is that beyond the WIKI and YouTube.com I have software that will allow us to post these success stories on dozens of video sharing sites for the maximum distribution.
Talk soon...
Dan |
| Peg |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 15:21:43
I would be happy to share my story either by audio or video.
I think either would be great. I do agree that video can be more powerful. I really like watching the few video success stories that are on the wiki.
I would like to create a whole DVD with numerous success stories. I think it would be a great way to get the message out. Perhaps the tms doctors would want to show it to their patients who are struggling.
Also, I think it would be great to make it for Dr. Sarno. Most of us feel that we owe him a debt of gratitude. Wouldn't it be wonderful for him to be able to watch the stories of those he has helped. The medical community may not acknowledge him, but I see no reason why we can't.
I would be interested in partnering with someone who has knowledge of how to make a decent quality video. I would be willing to find stories, make contacts and travel to record if necessary.
Peg
In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual. Galileo Galilei |
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