| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 18:05:16
Hello - I am 22 years old and have been diagnosed with the following ailments over the past 4 years:
Herniated Disc
Bulging Disc
Torn Disc
Spinal Osteoarthritis
Transitional vertebrae
Spinal stenosis
Degenerative disc disease
Uneven legs, right leg is a little shorter than the left
Probably missing something here...
Anyways, I have undergone the following courses of treatment over the years:
Ambulatory traction
Back decompression traction
Chiropractor
Massages
Ultrasound
4 x physical therapy
in soles
heel lifts, shoe lifts
acupuncture
steroid injections
anesthetic injections
laser spine discectomy
Anyways, none of these treatments have caused any relief in pain. I typically have pain pretty much all day long in various degrees, the easiest thing to do to ease the pain is laying down. Some treatments have resulted in a brief reduction in pain but only for a week or so at most. I recently came across Dr. Sarnos work and have been considering this as a possibility. I read the first book Healing back pain and saw myself on most of the pages.
I used to smoke marijuana every once in awhile and I would always take a percocet or two to ease the increase in pain. I recently stopped taking percocet a few months ago and have tried smoking twice since then. My back pain increases to almost an unbearable level, I am wondering if anyone else with TMS has experience this? Do you think smoking would maybe increase activity in the subconscious and create more pain? Maybe something to do with blood flow and oxidation? Let me know what you think please.
|
| 17 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Dave |
Posted - 05/05/2009 : 11:21:22
quote:
Originally posted by Matt2364
Thanks Dave, that makes a lot of sense. I am just not sure how to "feel" these feelings.
Yep, that's a tough one. We've been conditioned our entire lives to hide from our emotions for various reasons.
There's really nothing we can do to "force" ourselves to feel. Psychotherapy may be helpful. Short of that we can just do the work that Dr. Sarno suggests, such as journaling.
It may be useful to try to feel angry when you are in private. Punch a pillow, scream at the top of your lungs, really try to get the conscious anger out. In my experience, conscious anger is often a smokescreen for deeper emotions that we are pushing down such as extreme sadness, hopelesness, etc. One time I was successful using this approach, I started out expressing anger towards my father that he was putting pressure on me to help him with a household project, when it was a beautiful day outside and I wanted to spend it with my friends. As I got the anger out, it transformed into an overwhelming feeling of sadness about how my father ignores me, does not give me credit for the accomplishments in my life, sees my anxiety as a weakness rather than trying to understand why I feel the way I do, etc. The anger turned to tears and I cried profusely for a few minutes. Afterwards I felt a genuine release from some physical TMS symptoms I had been experiencing at the time.
I was never quite able to replicate that catharsis, but it did help me learn a bit more about myself and uncover some hidden feelings that I was not facing up to. |
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 05/01/2009 : 17:34:03
Thanks Dave, that makes a lot of sense. I am just not sure how to "feel" these feelings. I have always perceived everything rationally from both parties perspective and I nearly always understand and accept the other persons reasoning. After all of this time, it is hard to think of anything any other way.
I will admit that I have never cried or really felt any sympathy at the death of a relative or friend. I am assuming this is because I experienced my fathers death at such a young age. I am sure my unconscious is working over time during these periods to keep everything repressed, but I really do not feel anything towards these deaths. It is honestly embarrassing to even mention this as these are people that I miss and really enjoyed. It is weird to not feel anything...at funerals I usually have to pretend that I am sad so people do not think that I do not care. It is obviously not that I do not care it is just that I don't really feel the emotions for some reason.
What would you recommend, any frame of mind or exercises that would help me "feel" these emotions? |
| Dave |
Posted - 04/30/2009 : 14:53:33
quote:
Originally posted by Matt2364
I know exactly what you are saying, but for some reason I do not feel mad at my father.
That is precisely my point. TMS is about the emotions you do not feel. Deep inside, on an unconscious level, there may be a child who is in a blind rage at your father for killing your dog!
quote:
I have always been a very understanding person and seem to accept anyone's reasoning if I could see it as rational.
This is more evidence of a goodist TMS-prone personality. Again, TMS is not about what you think on a conscious level. It's about deeper emotions that you are pushing down because they are too ugly to face.
quote:
I guess I try to justify everyone's reasoning so that I do not feel conscious anger towards them...this makes a lot of sense.
You're on the right track. Intelligence and rational thought can be our enemy. It provides an escape valve -- an excuse -- to not feel certain emotions.
You don't want to be consciously angry at your father, and rationally you may accept that he did what he thought was right. But this rational thought does not change the fact that on an unconscious level you may feel differently.
Even if the deeper emotions are irrational, inappropriate, or just plain wrong, we cannot run from them. We have to accept that they are there and try to feel them, or at least allow ourselves to feel something. It is a reconditioning process that hopefully, over time, will provide relief from the symptoms.
|
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 04/28/2009 : 20:20:18
I know exactly what you are saying, but for some reason I do not feel mad at my father. I know that my Dad loved Nash (dog) as much as I did and once I spoke to him about it, I understood where he was coming from at least. I have always been a very understanding person and seem to accept anyone's reasoning if I could see it as rational. Basically, my dad was worried that he would snap and bite one of the small children that are always at my house. Nash also bit my Mom a few weeks prior and she had to get a Tetanus shot.
I just realized that I am trying to justify his action, although it is the total opposite of what I would have done. I guess this is something that I need to look into. I would never of had Nash killed unless he was in miserable pain and I felt as if I was doing him a favor. I guess I try to justify everyone's reasoning so that I do not feel conscious anger towards them...this makes a lot of sense. I basically just had a break through, thanks for pointing that out. I always look at everything from both peoples perspective and always seem to find some rational for the any action that the other person took. I always looked at this as an intelligent and useful exercise to understand where other people are coming from. I guess I just need to get angry and try to let it out...
Thanks a lot of everyone's help and opinions, more on this later. |
| Dave |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 11:16:33
quote:
Originally posted by Matt2364
I have had some new developments with TMS and I am wonding what everyone thinks. I got a call two days ago from my dad who said that he put one of our dogs down...
You seem to be treating this 'death' as any other, and attributing your pain to being unable to relate to the death of your dog.
Nowhere in your message do you express any anger towards your father for killing your dog. Have you explored this angle?
Personally I find it apalling that anyone would consider murder a satisfactory solution to a behavior problem that ultimately is the owner's fault and not the dog's. But I do not want to start a big debate here.
I am merely suggesting that you might be totally missing the main reason the child inside you is in a rage over this. This is not like the natural death of a relative. This is your father taking it upon himself to end your dog's life without even consulting you about it. If that doesn't make you angry, then I think you need to ask why... |
| bestcaddy |
Posted - 03/28/2009 : 13:21:15
Running Saved me, although I have had other similar issues. I saw a TMS bay area doctor who when asked if running could worsen my back pain told me yes...if I got ran over by a car while doing so. Mind over matter. I have been having aweful TMJ symptoms, but I think I am breaking through it, sleeplessness is my only issue. I think the key to getting over TMS is to do the one thing someone with that condition is commonly perceived shouldnt do. The mind over matter, you need to physically convince yourself the symptoms are bullcrap.
Ethan |
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 03/28/2009 : 10:18:28
I have had some new developments with TMS and I am wonding what everyone thinks. I got a call two days ago from my dad who said that he put one of our dogs down, Nash is a big golden retriever who is 6. The reasoning was that over the last 2 years he had bitten our other dog charlie twice and big my mom a few weeks ago. He never even called to say there were thinking about doing this, just called and said that it was done. I did not see any increase in pain that day, but halfway through the next day my back started to hurt quite a bit. I ended up throwing up 8x's that night and have not really been able to fall asleep because I am always too cold or too hot. Is throwing up something that can be caused by TMS or was this something totally unrelated. I cannot think of anything that I would have eaten that could have done this to me.
Also, I have always been very bad at expressing any emotions towards the death of anyone. When my dad I told me I basically just said it was fine and not a big deal. Over the past 10 years or so whenever a grandparent or aunt or uncle has died I have never cried or really shown any emotion whatsoever. I am assuming this is all attributed to the loss of my father when I was 7. My subconscious probably thinks that every death will be as painful as the death of my father and tries its hardest to repress all emotions. I was watching a movie last night with a dog in it that saved his owners life and I started crying a few times during the movie. I think this has to be my subconscious releasing pent up emotions in the disguise of the emotional movie scene.
Let me know what you think.
Carbar - Thanks for the encouragement. I ended up going for a little run yesterday hoping that it would help and it turned out being a very bad idea. After the run my back has been killing me all day and night, and it was only like a 1/2 mile run. |
| carbar |
Posted - 03/26/2009 : 20:05:05
Hi Matt,
I was 17 when I first started having TMS pain in my arms (RSI). All though college I tried treating this pain in all the conventional ways you mentioned, though no surgeries. I graduated, got a job in my field, hated it, and quit after a year. I took a job working for practically no money at a bookstore and stumbled across Dr. Sarno's Mind Body Perscription while helping a customer.
It definitely saved my life. I personally find that book to be the most accessible of Sarno's work, especially in how to approach caring for yourself.
It sounds like you are on the right track with journalling and running.
As someone who's graduated recently from college can tell you, grades matter a lot less than actually having the degree. It isn't required to put your GPA on a resume, so don't fret too much about missed classes. Anyway, you've got a new strategy now. And go ahead and get mad at those TMS pains for making you miss what you like to do... :)
|
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 17:56:15
Yeah, it seems that I need to find that line...I really cannot think of anyone that I would want to yell at, I have really seen the point in yelling. It seems much easier to communicate something at a normal volume. Anyways, I have not tried exploring this in a safe environment. Next time I am in my car or something I will give it a try, I am sure I will get a few awkward looks, haha.
Yeah, I am sure there are a lot of built up emotions surrounding the death of my father I just have to figure out how to access them. Whenever I think about I never think that it was a big deal or get emotional. I would definitely like him to still be around and have a few fond memories that I hold on to. This part may take a little bit of work, I am sure whatever is bothering me there has been repressed for at least 14 years.
During my previous exam the main stressors in my life were exams. I have always been a straight A student and since quitting taking percocet I have started to go to class less and less. I usually would be awake and ready to go and then decide I would be much better off just laying in bed and watching TV so my back did not hurt sitting in class. Anyways, I missed 2-3 pop quizzes in 3 of my 4 classes. I ended up having to drop one and ended up with a A, B+, and B this quarter. I had to get close to a 100% on all of my exams to get an A so that would be a cause of stress and anxiety, especially since I did not studying till the morning of the exam.
I can definitely related to what Dr. Sarno has said about doctors turning everyone into virtual cripples. Upon reading that in one of the books I began to evaluate all of the times that the pain is worse and it seems to be when I am doing everything the doctors said not to do or what they think would cause pain.
Thanks for the help and suggestions everyone I really appreciate it. |
| positivevibes |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 02:13:16
Hey Matt, I think you're on to something! :-)
There's a fine line between being in control in (for example) a social situation, and letting yourself lose control and feel your emotions when you're alone. The trick is to be able to do both. To feel your feelings. To admit them to yourself.
You've never lost control and yelled at anyone? Wow. So hyopthetically, if you allowed yourself to lose control, who would you yell at, and what would you say to them, and why? Have you ever explored that in a safe environment while you were alone?
Your father dying when you were so young...that scenario is probably loaded with emotion. You're just protecting yourself. When you're ready, you may want to explore it and feel it. If it's too scary to explore on your own, get a therapist or trusted friend to help you.
When your back hurt during your previous exam, what was going on in your life? What was going through your mind, through your emotions?
Typing 6 pages about how your roomates annoy you...that's a great start! See, there's more inside you than you realize.
The exercise (running, swimming) is terrific. I have continued to go to the gym and exercise for several months. I realized that the exercise didn't make my pain worse, and it helped my mood and my feelings about myself. Keep exercising and tell yourself that you're healthy. Remember what Dr. Sarno says about doctors sometimes turning us into virtual cripples with their "don't do this, don't do that" jargon. Listen to your body. It doesn't hurt to run? Great, so run!
Keep writing. Keep exploring your emotions. Concentrate on what's going on inside your mind. |
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 00:43:12
The most traumatic thing that I have probably experienced was the death of my father when I was 7. This is something that I rarely talk about, I recently tried to tell my girlfriend about something related to my father and I almost cried on 2 occasions. I recognize that this is probably a source of TMS, I definitely have repressed these emotions. At this time I did not notice any increase in pain or anything like that. As I continue to think about it, I found it very difficult to link increases in pain to emotional factors. The only time I can think of is during Exams at school and before I give speeches, two tasks that probably cause anxiety.
I am sure there are a lot of repressed emotions in my subconscious, I have always been proud of the fact that I have never lost controlled and yelled at anyone. I was proud of the ability I had to repress and take control of my emotions. This is something that I am not realizing is the source of most of my problems.
I will definitely start to keep track of emotional triggers and see if I can identify anymore. I had an exam last week and my back killed during the whole thing and for the remainder of the day. Knowing that this event had caused increased pain I thought about it during my next exam and experience no increase in pain beyond my normal levels and kept that constant throughout the day. This was a very encouraging sign for me.
Today, I went on a one mile run. I had virtually no pain during the run and no increase in pain today after the run. Running has always been something that has scared me and I always assumed that this would cause great pain since all of my doctors always said running was really hard on the spine and to avoid it all costs. Even though I had never experienced any pain during running it always scared me. I decided to go running or swimming every day in attempt to break that fear and hopefully this will help me accept the TMS diagnosis and relieve my pain symptoms for good.
I also did about an hour of journalism today about everything my roommates do that annoy me, it ended up being six typed pages before I decided I needed to stop and move on to another topic. |
| positivevibes |
Posted - 03/23/2009 : 22:31:40
quote:
Originally posted by Matt2364
I honestly have a very good life and cannot think of anything that could be causing this, with the exception of my back of course.
That's because TMS is distracting you to the point where you are only focusing on your back pain.
Are you sure you haven't suffered some traumas in your past? They don't have to be serious traumas like abuse -- a trauma is anything that has hurt you and caused you emotional pain.
I'm sure that you do have a very good life, but how do you feel about yourself and the way you operate in the world?
What are your triggers (what seems to make your TMS worse)? I'm not talking so much about physical triggers (like "it hurts to sit") but emotional triggers. You have to identify these and start paying attention to them.
The more you understand yourself, the less power TMS will have over you. |
| Matt2364 |
Posted - 03/23/2009 : 15:52:27
Thank you everyone for the response. I have only smoked twice in the last 4-5 months because of the increase in pain, the benefits and enjoyment of smoking are outweighed by the pain. No, I have not been smoking to repress any emotions. I have always just enjoyed smoking and most of my friends always so smoke. This has been helpful knowing that other people see an increase in pain levels, just another convincing fact to add to my repertoire. I have read Healing back pain, and just started reading the divided mind by Dr. Sarno. Can anyone suggest some good activities to get to the root of these repressed emotions? I honestly have a very good life and cannot think of anything that could be causing this, with the exception of my back of course. |
| pandamonium |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 16:45:24
I suppose it depends on WHY you are smoking it? i.e. Are you using it as a means to sedate your emotions?
Once you have found out about TMS, then you must realise that you need to get in touch with your repressed emotions to try and recover.
If you conciously know all of that but are still trying to sedate things then I'd see the increase in pain as some kind of subconcious turmoil.
In other words you need to feel it to heal it (Michael Brown, The Presence Process) |
| scottjmurray |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 05:18:05
Eh, I hate pot personally. It seems to amp my mind up in the most annoying way. Minutes will go by before I'll even catch myself in some bizarre, self-destructive thought pattern. My memory and my awareness get all fuzzy. I don't know what is up with that substance, why I get so uncomfortable on it and it seems to put others at ease. Oh well.
quote:
engaging in other kinds of escapist activities allows you to "stuff" and repress emotions that you don't want to look at or feel, THAT'S why it hurts like hell when you get high smoking pot, you're ACTIVELY repressing whatever it is that's causing problems
I'm inclined to disagree. Other chemicals (opiates for example) aid in repression by numbing you up pretty damn good. Marijuana on the other hand seems to have the opposite effect. If it really did aid in repression you would have less TMS pain instead of more.
I guess people all react differently to it. What a weird drug.
~*~
author of tms-recovery . com |
| ukeboy |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 02:18:59
I'm noticed the same too.. pain does increase with marijuana at times.. sometimes it doesn't.. really weird.. not sure if I have an explanation |
| scd1833 |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 19:37:36
the good news is that you're a "textbook" TMS case. keep reading, half an hour every day for at least a month or til your symptoms resolve.
you're still thinking physically though, you need to think about the emotions that are deeply repressed that are causing the symptoms.
smoking weed, drinking booze, engaging in other kinds of escapist activities allows you to "stuff" and repress emotions that you don't want to look at or feel, THAT'S why it hurts like hell when you get high smoking pot, you're ACTIVELY repressing whatever it is that's causing problems.
i smoke weed a lot, and tend to have mild neck, and/or upper back pain at times when i do it. but I have an awareness of TMS so I can deal with in my mind and usually resolve the symptoms
forget about all the physical diagnoses, and all the "science" and medical treatments that you've heard from MD's for the past 4 years, and focus on the emotional sphere from now on. good luck |
|
|
