| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| roxygirl577 |
Posted - 12/15/2008 : 13:54:22
I'm about 2 1/2 months in with Dr Sarno's treatment and everyday has been a roller coaster for me. Some days I feel horrible, others, not so bad, but the pain is always there...neck/upper back.
I'm here in desperation, because I want to believe it's tms, but I'm still getting doubts because of my condition. I've done a lot of reading and searches, and I kow Sarno says that tmj is tms, and s many people here have gotten over it. But I feel like mine is so different because it's not from grinding my teeth or a bad bite. My jaw is literally out of place and is stuck there (my mouth can't open more than 10mm) ...I'm not worried because of my jaw, I'm worried because of my neck/shoulder pain. I want to beleive it's tms, but if my jaw is dislocated (not treatable) then wouldn't that always cause my muscles to be tight and affect my neck. I'm so worried that I;m going to feel liek this forever. And I can't get past the structural because I can't find anyone who has had this problem, here on the board or in Sarno's book.s If I just knew one person who had what I have and has gotten better I could feel so much relief and go on with my treatment. I feel so lost. |
| 11 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| tcherie |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 13:46:53
I also agree that everything is not TMS, and that this forum is to discuss varying viewpoints on the theory. But I did feel overwhelmingly that this forum is for people who believe in the validity to a large degree and have determined for themselves or with a doctor's help that their pain could be emotionally derived (TMS).
I do think richedie's statements may be a little too much on the negative side, which would make a reader question why he would even entertain a forum like this. I do not think anyone is being that trivial to say that a broken arm/leg is tms, but I do feel like you can make yourself more susceptible to certain viruses and illnesses by how you carry your stress.
For example, I work with my cousin who is two years younger than me at the same stressful job. We have been there the same amount of time. We do the same duties. We also live together. The only difference was I was more conscious of what I ate (not perfect, but more conscious than she was), I exercised more (not perfect, but while I did some she did none), and I regularly visited the doctor. Can you guess who started having health issues (sudden allergies, mild depression, upper back and neck pain)? ME. Her personality is carefree, she doesn't let anyone or anything bother her. On the otherhand, I am highly sensitive to people and a perfectionist at my job.
So I do think that stress (whether you are conscious of it or not) and repressed feelings does manifest itself in physical symptoms. When you can manage your stress you can start some physical healing. For some it can be simply mentally recognizing that their pain is emotionally based (therefore ending the cycle of holding on to the pain), for others it may take actually making changes in their life to get out of or deal with a stressful situation and then the healing can begin.
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| mizlorinj |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 11:05:53
I have to agree with SCD as I have seen (in myself and family) that so many conditions are of mind/body origin, or at least exacerbated by an emotional condition. No, of course a broken arm is not TMS--though surely your emotional condition affects healing time! Dr. Sarno's treatment and explanation is a different way of thinking than traditional docs. Years of our conditioned thinking won't be undone overnight. And there is plenty of mind/body research, actual "physical" conditions healed with emotional work, available if you look. Fascinating stuff.
Roxy, please do what you need to do. Not sure finding someone on this Board who has what you have is your answer. People have been diagnosed with TMS on this board and still come back unsure it is a correct diagnosis. Yes, this is a very different way of thinking. But once you accept it and "do the work", healing takes place. 2 years ago I was bedridden with TMS pain. I feel like I was given another life.
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| LuvtoSew |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 05:57:59
roxygirl557
I'm so glad you found that info concerning the mri as I really hate to see you go thru surgery as I've read so many conflicting stories on tmj surgery. One oral sx. I saw said he use to do surgery on tmj, but quit several years ago as the outcome was so unpredicable. The tmj space is so tiny an area.
Actually I like to read conflicting opinions, if we all thought the same, well what would be the reason to be here.
Now if you watch the real life Mystery ER's on the health channel, you'll find there are many rare conditions that are very hard to diagnose, that many people people get written off for as being a hypochrondriac.
So in my opinion it is always good to get medically checked out before assuming something is TMS.
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| alexis |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 05:44:15
quote:
Originally posted by johnaccardi
richefaggot,
Can you do me a favor...shutup.
Love the ignorant bigot telling someone to shut up for expressing his opinion.
richedie, Just because some people here are a little fanatical doesn't mean there's nothing to the theory. It's like vitamins...sure some people become vitamin extremists with rows of pill bottles thinking the right combination will bring ideal life and health. But that fanaticism doesn't mean vitamins are unimportant...just that some people don't know where to draw the line. And some are just in the process of looking for that line. Even the medical industry doesn't know where that line is...although they generally have a more educated guess than the layman.
TMS theory is not perfect and certainly doesn't apply to everything -- or even most things. I too stand aghast when people think things like warts are TMS. Even those arguing the immune system affect as TMS (distraction) rather than a simple (and medically well understood) stress effect surprises me.
But if you experience directly the distraction elements of TMS you would likely find it more convincing -- at least in a limited context. This does not, however, mean that any condition YOU have is TMS. You may not have TMS (what I call distraction syndrome) at all...but that doesn't mean that others don't. And sure, some people go overboard and carry the theory too far. But that is the normal human instinct to simplify. It's really no more an error to say "everything is TMS" than to say "nothing is TMS". The world is a lot more complex -- but we as humans would prefer not to believe that.
Be warned, though, that people's drive for simplicity causes them to feel threatened when their theories are challenged. This goes for those who want to believe everything is physical as much as those who want to believe everything is psychological. Having beliefs challenged makes people nasty. Online they rant and insult...in the real world they blow people up.
But accepting these failures and weaknesses of humanity is a big part of recovering from TMS. If, in fact, it's a condition you ever have had. |
| johnaccardi |
Posted - 01/04/2009 : 22:07:06
richefaggot,
Can you do me a favor...shutup. |
| stanfr |
Posted - 12/30/2008 : 06:30:32
richedie, if you feel that way you're probbaly in the wrong forum!
Im just recovering from a massive head cold which i would bet my last dime is Mind-Body (hit me on CHristmas, no coincidence). I can't generalize to everyone but for me personally, almost every non-traumatic health issue has been heavily mind-influenced. You've got tons of bacteria and viruses in your system, as skizzik points out it's when youre natural defenses are compromised (think, stress) that you end up with problems!
I think there's a better explanation of the process than what Sarno has described, he's overzelous in his theory, but he is way ahead of 99% of the medical and scientific community, so credit is due! |
| scd1833 |
Posted - 12/29/2008 : 18:30:10
I think ALMOST everything is TMS. only because I have experience with so many things disappearing with the proper thought process. a broken arm isn't tms but most unexplained maladies that conventional and alternative medicine have trouble treating, ( and there are many) can be attributed to a mind-body process(TMS equivalent) Sarno is not a crackpot in any way!! He is a very astute Physician. Roxygirl, it's obvious to me that your fear and anxiety over the extreme TMJ symptoms is just making it worse! it's TMS!!!! ACCEPT IT!!!!
the people that are TMS "crazy" are actually the ones that understand TMS on a deeper level than the "newbies" JMHO |
| skizzik |
Posted - 12/29/2008 : 17:16:36
quote:
Originally posted by richedie
Not everything is TMS. In fact, most on this forum are TMS Crazy, thinking everything is TMS.
I admit, I feel that way until proven otherwise.quote:
Originally posted by richedie
Some on here act as if infections do not exist, viruses are bogus
hmmmm....low immunity due to stress in many cases?quote:
Originally posted by richedie
and injuries are TMS, LOL. Crazy.
yeah, guilty here too, but it's weird when you go from none to a dozen in a short amount of time. quote:
Originally posted by richedie
I am starting to think very, very little is TMS.
I still writhe in pain still beleiving in tms, and yet my belief of all of it being created in my mind seems to keep getting stronger because when I do let go and think medical, the symptoms get worse if thats even possible. Every time I think medical I'm now conditioned to think "then why does the symptom do this?" "Why does it do that?" Then my thoughts go to tms. A very fustrating place to be.
quote:
Originally posted by richedie
Dr. Sarno is a bit of a crackpot in my opinion.
Yikes. I'd probably think the same thing if reading HBP in 04 had'nt took away my original low back pain just reading it over and over. If only it were that easy now
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| richedie |
Posted - 12/28/2008 : 23:42:02
Roxy, did you ever get the necessary help? Not everything is TMS. In fact, most on this forum are TMS Crazy, thinking everything is TMS.
Some on here act as if infections do not exist, viruses are bogus and injuries are TMS, LOL. Crazy.
I am starting to think very, very little is TMS. Dr. Sarno is a bit of a crackpot in my opinion. I hope you get well! |
| njoy |
Posted - 12/15/2008 : 14:57:12
Hi, I had tmj for months, once. It started when a chiropractor adjusted my neck. The pain was "fleeting" which means I was in horrible pain for exactly 45 seconds every few minutes. The intervals between attacks varied from an hour or two to several minutes. While I was awake, 20 minutes was about average. The only thing I could do was run (literally) around the house counterclockwise (clockwise made it worse -- don't you dare laugh!! - it wasn't funny at the time). Otherwise, I would be screaming in agony.
Anyway, this went on for months. I was seriously contemplating suicide. Not that I could think but I was just going to jump off a bridge. There was no hope. LIfe was the over.
Then, one day, I was crying in pain and my husband said a prayer and said, "Be still" so I did and he reached up and pushed on my neck. The pain stopped. I got better and better from then on until finally the pain vanished completely. It still threatens to come back if I sleep on that side.
Was this tmj really tms. I believe it was. I think that the pain had served its purpose and I wanted it gone but didn't know how to stop it. My husband's action gave my brain the excuse it needed.
Later, my husband had a similar experience. He hated his job and one day he pulled as muscle in his leg. The pain was excruciating. This went on for five years. He couldn't work at anything. Then one day, he said, "I want to go to an acupuncturist". He had NEVER been willing to do this, before. One treatment and the pain began to diminish every day until it was gone. It has never come back.
Again, tms. The initial pulled muscle was real but he hung onto and amplified the pain to get out of his horrible job. With two kids to feed, he couldn't even think about quitting with his conscious mind. So his subconscious took over.
In the old days, ladies who were sick of responsibility (and sex) would get dreadful migraines and lie around in the dark sucking down opium. Of course, consciously, they hated the pain.
I have fixed just about everything that ails me since first reading Sarno in 1992 but occasionally something new pops up or old symptoms return. Still, I know its tms unless there is darn fine reason to think otherwise.
I hope this helps, roxy.
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| roxygirl577 |
Posted - 12/15/2008 : 14:32:48
So I may have answered my own question...I never look up neck pain or tmj on google anymore because it's drives me even more crazy and makes me think physcial...but in this case, I felt like I needed to and I'm glad I did for once. As I said before my disc is entirely dislocated and is not treatable. They call it disc displacement without reduction. When i looked up about it, I found this...
"The use of MRI and the arthroscope has been shown in research to not only reveal displaced discs in symptomatic patients, but also in asymptomatic volunteers. So in other words, many people without TMJ problems have displaced discs. Research has also shown that repositioning splints and disc repositioning surgeries in many cases actually caused the disc to further be displaced, even in patients who had been considered cured. The accumulated scientific evidence in the 1990's appears to be showing that the disc, by itself, is not the sole culprit in TMJ and facial related pain, even when it is positioned off the condyle. In fact, quite the opposite appears to be true, that is, the further anteriorly displaced the disc is, the better the patient feels. There are many opinions regarding the clinical significance of displaced discs and, not surprisingly, treatments vary among practitioners. Although some claim they are able to capture a disc, or to replace the failed tissue, others question whether it can be done. On the other hand, there is good data that the physical displacement as such is not the cause of pain, and that any restriction in range of motion will improve with time. There is also evidence that articular tissue will undergo fibrotic changes, leading to the formation of a pseudo-disc."
...That goes to prove that it definitely is tms...That's why some people don't even know they have dislocated discs because they may not have tms...I feel a lot better, I'm done worrying. |
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