| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| DiskPain |
Posted - 12/20/2004 : 07:07:43
Anyone ever get pain on rainy days. I thought it was just a coincidence, but even when TMS training is going well, if there is a lot of humidity or rain, I get a lot of pain around my TMS area. I wake up feeling different than other days even before I realize it is raining. Most people feel that humidity and rain can irritate an injured area. Why is that? |
| 5 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Tunza |
Posted - 12/20/2004 : 13:19:13
Re how strong and unconscious conditioning can be:
I've pasted below from an article called Psychoneuroimmunology: Bi-directional Interactions Between the Brain and the Nervous System
This is a biology student's summary of what she had learnt about conditioning. You can put keywords "experiment conditioned stimulus immune saccharin" into your web browser's search engine and you will pull up scientific journal articles about these experiments but I liked this summary because it uses less scientific jargon:
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"Psychoneuroimmunology", is defined by Ronald Glaser, one of the premier researchers in the field, as a "field that studies the interactions between the central nervous system, the endocrine system and the immune system; the impact of behavior/stress on these interactions; and the implications for health of these interactions" (1). The term was first used in 1974 by Robert Ader who was the first person to perform experiments that demonstrated that the brain could influence the immune system (2).. In his classical conditioning experiment, Ader paired a conditioned stimulus (saccharin solution) with an unconditioned stimulus, a drug called Cytotaxan, which is known to decrease the number of T-lymphocytes in rats. When the immune system is compromised by a decline in the T-lymphocyte count, it is referred to as immunosuppression; therefore, Cytotaxan can be classified as an unconditioned stimulus for immunosuppression. After several pairings, the rats were presented with the saccharin solution (CS) in the ABSCENCE [my emphasis] of Cytotaxan (US), and a blood sample was taken so the ratsŐ T-lymphocytes could be counted. The result was a DECLINE in the T-lymphocyte count, indicating that conditioned immunosuppression had occurred(3). Further research revealed that even just the perception of a stressor was enough to cause changes in the immune system.
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The other thing I thought about when you said "I wake up feeling different than other days even before I realize it is raining" was that I can often tell myself to wake up in the morning at a certain time and I will. Even if that time is not the time I usually wake up (so that rules out that I am just waking up at the time my body gets used to waking up). Some of my friends have told me they can do this too.
Our unconscious minds are so much more intelligent than we give them credit for. A classic example is when we break a bone our body sends in the correct kinds of cells for repairing the damage. Different chemicals and cells are put into action at different stages of the repair. Imagine if we had to sit there and conciously instruct the body to do this. The human race would have been extinct long ago without this unconscious intelligence. It isn't such a stretch of the imagination for me to think that someone's unconscious mind will know it's raining or humid before the conscious mind wakes up. Sarno says in Healing Back Pain that the conscious mind is just the tip of the iceberg. So much is going on underneath without us realising and that stuff underneath has a huge effect on our conscious behaviour.
Kat |
| Dave |
Posted - 12/20/2004 : 10:59:29
quote:
Originally posted by DiskPain
How is it conditioning if the pain comes before you are aware that it is raining? I know exactly what conditioning is. There is also no way to uncondition yourself. It just comes when it wants.
Our brains are extremely complex machines. You may not be consciously aware that it is raining. But our brain can sense changes in barometric pressure.
As for your statement: "there is no way to uncondition yourself" that is plain wrong. It can be done but it takes time. If this is your attitude then you do not fully accept the TMS theory.
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| DiskPain |
Posted - 12/20/2004 : 10:34:01
How is it conditioning if the pain comes before you are aware that it is raining? I know exactly what conditioning is. There is also no way to uncondition yourself. It just comes when it wants. |
| Dave |
Posted - 12/20/2004 : 10:06:50
quote:
Originally posted by DiskPain
Anyone ever get pain on rainy days. I thought it was just a coincidence, but even when TMS training is going well, if there is a lot of humidity or rain, I get a lot of pain around my TMS area. I wake up feeling different than other days even before I realize it is raining. Most people feel that humidity and rain can irritate an injured area. Why is that?
C O N D I T I O N I N G.
It is one of the most important concepts about TMS. Dr. Sarno wishes that he highlighted it more in his book. |
| Wilf |
Posted - 12/20/2004 : 09:13:16
My dear late mother used to say that she could tell when the weather was about to change because "her leg would act up". She had had numerous operations on vericose veins and had scars on her leg. I have scars all over my body, but the only ones that "act up" are the tiny ones from my vasectomy. This happens when a low pressure system arrives, i.e., rain. I do not experience real pain, just an awareness that the scars are there.
It is probably the change in pressure that has an effect on your pain. |
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