| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| bethany |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 10:23:45
Hi all! I am new to the forums, but familiar with how the knowledge of TMS can heal pain. About one year ago, I discovered Sarno and other books on TMS. After reading and believing, I rid myself of chronic back/butt and other various pains. I am a runner and these ailments had plagued me and my running had suffered for a few years. After becoming pain free, I was a joyful runner again and really ramped up my mileage. I ran mostly pain free until last October when I began to suffer from on and off heel pain. Now, that heel pain is with me always and has once again affected my running.
I pray that it is TMS for that would allow me to run without fear of further damaging my foot. I am a stay at home mom with one 5 year old daughter and a marathon coach for Team in Training (fundraising group for the Leukemia and Lymphoma Society). While I do not feel I am under a lot of stress right now, I am a perfectionist and am easily irritated by certain types of people. I tend to hold my feelings (any kind) inside and I can often feel the anger bubbling. I have been journaling in hopes that this will help. So far, no relief. I am in the stage of obsessing over the pain, too. Not helping, I know, but can't figure out how to stop. I am also a Christian and a firm believer in the power of the Lord, so praying often!
Anyone have any thoughts or similar experience with heel pain being TMS? Advice is truly welcome!! |
| 13 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 03/03/2007 : 17:10:37
Bethany, I think that's a good decision, good luck! |
| bethany |
Posted - 03/03/2007 : 14:51:36
Thanks once again, tennis tom, for your input.
I am well aware that it takes longer than 3 days for an injury to heal. Taking more than one day off in a row is a pretty big step for me and is actually more of an experiment. I want to see if taking more time off from running relieves any of the amount of pain at all. So far, it seems to have lessened some, but I still get bouts of the shooting, throbbing pain at moments that don't make sense (like at the eye doctor the other night).
I appreciate your viewpoints on my coaching. I never think about feeling competitive with my team members, but I do know I will get jealous of the fact that they get to train hard and run the race while I stand on the sidelines, run with them for short bits, and cheer. However, right now, I am not coaching at all, so don't think this would be contributing to my current level of pain.
I think it may be time for me to take a break from the forums along with some more time off running. I am going to try to put my focus somewhere else because this obsession with my pain is not creating a healthy mindset for me. I do plan to contact Monte and set up a phone consultation with him ASAP. I think talking to someone, rather than typing (however helpful this has been-thanks!), will help answer more of my questions.
So, I am going to sign off for now. Plan to be back to the forums in awhile, so check on me later!! blessings and peace-bethany  |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 03/02/2007 : 20:05:55
Hi Bethany,
IF it's a legitimate injury--not TMS--three days is not enough rest time to allow it to heal. My legitimate running and tennis injuries took between two weeks of totally resting the injured part followed by light testing at week 3 and back to normal use by week 4.
I understand your obsession/addiction to running. I've been there. I have my old running calendars with my mileage for years not missing a day rain, shine or near pneumonia.
I hear your aversion to the pool. Today I did a pool run and in the pool the heel doesn't contact the bottom. I was on my toes and ball of the foot.
You mentioned that you are a coach for Team in Training. Is this adding to your pressure? Do you feel you need to compete with your team members? If so, this could be adding a lot of pressure, especially if you're injured. In my opinion, the best coaches are the ones who teach rather than demonstrate or compete with their students.
Being a player coach seldom works. If this is an issue, you can be a good coach by doing more chalk-talks, perhaps observing your students from the back of the pack and giving them consultations about what you are observing from that vantage point. Or you can even ride along-side them on a bicycle and coach from there. The best coaches teach more and demonstrate less. |
| bethany |
Posted - 03/02/2007 : 15:58:01
I hear you, tennis tom. I never thought about the pain possibly being a combo of TMS and real injury. I know I am definately doing some compensating on my running form when I do run with the heel pain because other aches flare up, but those always subside after my run is over.
The doctor I visit does treat runners and other athletes quite frequently. In fact, his office and staff assists with local running races. With my past "back" problems, I was only advised to cut back on my mileage, but never to completely quit running. This case may be different. And when I had an MRI done on my back, my pain got significantly worse. The fear came into play. So, I am afraid to get an MRI done this time due to the return of that same fear induced pain.
I have taken off the last 3 days from running. I know that may not sound like much, but for me, 3 days in a row is a big deal. While my heel does still hurt, it seems to be slightly less in severity of pain. So, the plan is to take a bit more time off (maybe another week), and see what happens. I fear (once again, addiction to running coming into play here) taking too much time off for I will lose my fitness base. I am absolutely horrible at doing anything other than actual ground running. The pool thing holds no appeal to me even if it would help keep up my endurance. My mind would suffer from lack of desire.
Having also done some searching on this forum for other info on heel pain, I have discovered it is a highly questionable topic. Some people seem convinced it is TMS, others believe it to be injury. Not a lot of help there!
By the way, last night I had an eye doctor appointment which led me to TMS thinking. As I was sitting in the waiting room, my heel had this sudden shooting pain that kept up until I was in the exam room. Now, I was sitting, so no pressure was on my heel. I began trying to figure out why this sudden shooting pain. Well, I do not like waiting for things (lack of patience) and my eye doctor, who is a male, honestly makes me feel a bit uncomfortable. Due to his gender and the fact that he is a "close" talker and must be "close" to me when doing the exam, this was causing some anxiety which may have been what triggered the pain in my heel. Thoughts?
I am seriously considering a phone consultation with Monte Hueftle to see where that gets me. At this point, it is the next best thing I have to actually making an in-office visit with an out of state TMS doctor, which would be a trifle expensive!
Thanks again for your input. Greatly appreciated. peace-bethany  |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 03/02/2007 : 11:28:11
Hi Bethany,
Thanks for your reply. I think your case points out why TMS doctors post here on occasion, especially when they are relatively new to it and then disappear. It is frustrating and near impossble to dx TMS over the internet.
A good TMS doctor will do a phyical exam to rule out a "real" injury and also to a lenghty "social" interviw perhaps as long as an hour to get background into the patient's emotional issues.
So we are all amateurs speculating here in dribs and drabs. So I'll speculate since you asked for opinions. According to the books TMS can be the cause of about 80% of what ails people sitting in the doc's waiting room. That leaves 20% that is legitimate, real structural causes. What if your injury is in the real catagory. From past "injuries" you have acquired an awareness of TMS thinking. You go out and do your run and the pain does NOT subside after a few miles. TMS pain usually subsides with use.
My injuries always healed after two weeks of following conventional doctor's advice with-in two weeks to a month. This was prior to finding TMS. This was the conventional RICE treatment, basicly giving the body time to heal itself. The most a doc has ever done for one of my injuries was to put a Koban bandage on it and give be a pair of crutches for a gastrox tear of the calf.
With my back/hip injury I didn't follow what always worked and ran, hiked and played through it. And I regret that and wonder what would have happened if I'd done what always worked before? One thing would be that I would NOT have discovered TMS Theory becusese there would be no need to because perhaps my injury would NOT have morphed into chronic pain. I theorize by "playing through" my injury I MAY have created a "compensatory gait disorder" resulting in "real" traumatic osteoarthritis to my hip joint.
At the time I was going through a very emotionaly trumatic relationship break-up with my ex (she had gone "astronaut" on me and I was using sports to literaly running away from the pressures she was hitting me with. ( I learned my lesson. Now I keep my bags packed and the fastest most capable vehicle my Jeep, wheels pointed forward, for a quick launch and escape into the wilderness).
Your pain is trying to tell you something either physical, emotional or a combination of both. Is it worth it to NOT stop and figure it out? You've cut back but not stopped running. Perhaps this may result in a "compensatory gait disorder" because you are changing your running technique not to impact your heel. Running is pretty basic technique wise, one foot in front of the other, repeat for 26.2 or 100 miles until finnish. Your lower body will tell you if you are doing something wrong.
You are like any good athlete addicted to the activity. To stop doing it causes a big excess of pent-up unreleased energy. When I stopped in frustrtion ALL physical activity for six months, I wound up in a "significant depression" needing therapy and scarey bad side-
trip with doctor prescribed Lexapro.
You have cut back your running significantly--that hasn't helped (and perhaps you are starting to change your gait to compensate--that's probably not good eithter, IMHO. Is there a running foot doctor in St. Louis who treats elite runners and is a runner himself? That kind of doc could give you better conventional allopathic medical adive mainly becaues he sees so much of it and has from experience learned what works and what doesn't. This is the kind of running doc who runs Machu Pichu, Death Valley or the Sahara on his vacation.
So we're all shooting in the dark here throwing out random ideas. The solution rests in your mind, your body and your heel. When all is said and done YOU will need to do what will stop the pain, through thinking, doing or not doing. The MRI may relieve your miind if nothing substantive shows up--but also open up another can of worms between your doctor, the radiologist commenting on your foot (who maybe reviewing your film in India, because it's cheaper there) and your TMS educated mind.
In conclusion I would reccommend a conservtive approach until the DX gets sorted out. Like I said before, continue your running in the pool, doing deep water running with a floatation belt or one of those inexpensive pool noodles. You are still running but giving your body a chance to recover from years of hard work and finding an alternative activity to your running addiction. To use a tennis analogy, YOU want to be playing the ball, not having the BALL play you. Who's in control here your Nike's or your MIND?
Good Luck! Hope that helps some,
tt
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| bethany |
Posted - 03/01/2007 : 15:37:37
Thanks again for your response, tennis tom. (and I will look into the trash can/baseball bat combo, stryder!)
My heel pain is NOT keeping me from running, however, I have reduced my mileage significantly, much to my dismay. This is due to the fact that I am trying to manage the pain. The potential for an over-use injury is possible, I suppose. But, since it started in October and hasn't let up since, I am led to believe it is TMS. If it was an injury, I would assume it would've healed already. Now, I haven't taken a lot of time off from running, but have decreased my mileage over the last month and it has only gotten worse. Seems backwards to me.
you said: "As some TMS sufferer's listen too carefully to every tick and twinge of their body and live in fear of movement perhaps there's another side of the TMS coin that causes some to NOT listen to their body's messages and override the message to stop." THIS IS SO ME! Does this indicate TMS or an injury that I refuse to accept? I am a very regimented person with my running and rather hard on myself with my performance (me vs. me).
The doctor does not seem to have a definate diagnosis. He uses words like "tension," "inflammation" (of which Dr. Sarno talks about), and "tightness." He recommends stretching, which does not seem to help for very long. He does not believe it is a stress fracture, but has suggested an MRI for my own peace of mind. Do you advise? Having received care from the same doctor for "back problems" that turned out to be TMS, I hesitate to go with what he suggests. And having once before suffered from various TMS ailments which I recovered from with reading and knowledge on the subject, I want to believe the heel pain is TMS as well. It is just not going away as easily.
I am familiar with Monte Hueftle. His website introduced me to TMS and his book was the first I read on the subject. I know he does phone consultations, so I may consider this option. I live in St. Louis, Missouri and do not know of any TMS doctors in this area.
I am taking a few days off running right now just to see what happens. Running is kind of an addiction for me, so not sure what affect it will have on my brain as I tend to be more crabby and sensitive when I haven't run!!
thanks! peace! |
| Stryder |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 23:06:11
bethany said: "I have also considered buying a punching bag for letting off steam."
A steel trash can, a baseball bat and safety goggles may also meet your needs -or- just have yourself a good cry.
Take care, -Stryder |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 21:09:25
Hi Bethany,
I was just throwing the pool work out there as an alternative to having to stop running. It isn't clear to me if you are unable to run and if your medical dx's have ruled out a real injury. It is impossible to dx anything as intricate and complex as TMS from a few paragraphs.
What do you think is going on with your heel?--TMS, an over-use injury or a combination of both? I have been a marathon runner and I wouldn't characterize it as "normal activity". Running 26.2 miles is way beyond what your average person does. Don't get me wrong, I think it's great but it demands a lot of the body and the mind.
I've had a lot of running injuries and they usually healed within two to three weeks. Although I don't recall ever having a heel.
If it's soley TMS psychogenic, caused by an autonomic reduction of blood flow to the heel, I think it would go away after a mile or two into a run. If the pain persists for miles then perhaps it is an overuse injury and resting it would be in order.
I feel there can be another side to the TMS coin that can push us to run through real pain. As some TMS sufferer's listen too carefully to every tick and twinge of their body and live in fear of movement perhaps there's another side of the TMS coin that causes some to NOT listen to their body's messages and override the message to stop.
I am just throwing out some random thoughts on TMS and running. I have no way of knowing what is going on in your case. A good TMS doctor would do a phyical exam and a lenghty social history to help evaluate a patient.
You are correct that not running would be contrary to TMS theory--if it is TMS. From my quick reading of your situation it was not clear to me if you knew whether your symptom was TMS, legitimate structural injury, or both. I was offering the pool running as a way to keep active. It would be very difficult for someone at your level psychologicaly to quit exercising without substituting another outlet to release all that energy. Running in the pool is still running. If the heel pain is excrusciating and does not lessen or stop after a few miles into a run, I would not reccommend continuing. If it's TMS that won't let go then stop and walk or sit and ask yourself what is going on emotionaly that is doing this to me. If it's legit then R.I.C.E. it. I am just conjecturing here. Your conscious and unconscious will have to tell and direct you as to how to proceed.
Are you familiar with Monte Hueftle, an occasional contributor to this site? He has a self-published book about running and TMS and has a website of his own. I'm fairly far removed from running these days, he may have some ideas more relevant to the needs of runners. You can find his contact info on the HOME PAGE at the "TMS Related Boooks and Other Resources" button.
Good Luck
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| bethany |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 19:22:15
tennis tom-
I appreciate your comment. But, isn't it contradictory to TMS to "give in to the pain?" I think by doing something other than actual running, I would be doing exactly that, even if it's running in the pool (which I have heard is a good way to keep up your run conditioning-however, would prefer to stick to outside!). I believe that by taking away the actual impact from running on sidewalks and streets, this would also be giving in. I hear so much about how the surface you run on can affect "injuries" and can really take its toll on your joints. I have come to believe otherwise through what I have read and learned about TMS.
I also know that I am not a big pool person, therefore, since my mind would not be into the pool running, this would in turn, not help in healing. Thanks again, though! peace |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 16:01:52
To help maintain conditioning and facilitate returning to "normal activity" run in the pool or if that hurts your heel also, do deep water running with an AquaJogger Belt.
Good Luck |
| bethany |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 15:47:00
Thanks chloe and sonora sky for your input. I may just try some vigorous jumping up and down. I have also considered buying a punching bag for letting off steam.
To follow up on what I have done for my heel pain to get my mind wrapped around the TMS diagnosis...I have been to the doctor three times who has done some A.R.T. (active release treatment) and ultrasound. He told me the area has some tension (duh) and inflammation and suggested an MRI just to rule out a stress fracture (my peace of mind)--which he does not believe is a common thing in that area of the foot. I have not received a definitive answer on the cause of the pain, therefore, refuse to give in to the MRI. I also have not gotten much relief from the treatment. The reason I have continued to go to the doctor is to rule out any serious injury despite the fact that deep down, I feel it is TMS.
More advice/sharing from anyone? |
| sonora sky |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 12:27:22
Yes, this has been one of my various TMS ailments. It lasted for a period of about three months, until I learned about TMS. During the time I had heel pain, I saw a podiatrist who diagnosed plantar fasciitis. I got custom orthodics, but nothing seemed to help. Now I know that (the diagnosis of PF) was a big joke.
Here's the background to my mysterious pain: it developed in april of 2006, when I was desperately trying to find appropriate (i.e. comfortable but cute--I'm not a sporty girl) hiking shoes for my honeymoon trip to the Canadian Rockies. Whenever I tried on a pair of hiking shoes, I experienced heel pain in my right foot. When I wore any of my other shoes, sandals, flip-flops, etc., I experienced little or no pain. Now here's the clincher: within a 1-yr period, I had finished my graduate school coursework, gotten engaged, moved from the midwest to TX (that's certain to give anyone TMS  ), gotten married, and was preparing to take my qualifying exams. The exams were scheduled for the first week of may; a few days later we were to leave on our honeymoon trip.
Correct diagnosis? You guessed it.
This whole story is so funny to me now, because it's obvious that there was a LOT going on in my life...and a year later, I'm still adjusting. The heel pain went away shortly after our trip, during which I was also plagued with excruciating neck pain/stiffness, which I'm still experiencing, on and off.
I found this pain to be particularly unusual simply because I'm not an athlete, and because I had been particularly sedentary (studying 8-12 hrs a day) during the months leading up to the pain. In this case, the TMS gremilin really had a sense of humor...
I know heel pain has been discussed on this form. You may want to do a search for "heel pain," "plantar fasciitis," "bursitis," etc.
best,
ss |
| chloe |
Posted - 02/28/2007 : 10:30:54
Hi,
I have had lots of foot pain which has mainly gone - only comes back when I am stressed - like now about my throat pain. I could hardly walk but gradually built up what I could do each day. Setting goals was the thing that helped me the most and then having reward (Fred Amir style) Be comforted by the fact that you have got over other pains. I also found jumping up and down, quite vigorously, when i was worryng about the pain helped.
Good luck. |
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