| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| glen_ap |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 07:34:27
I have been reading around a bit here and I have picked up on to a trend that I think may negatively affect a persons ability to overcome TMS.
There has been a lot of discussion regarding dealing with your anger and emotions as they come up and not repressing them. This is a good practice in general, however Dr. Sarno specifically states that the rage in our unconscious is not and almost never will be conscious. That means cannot feel those emotions in our unconscious. There are times when that rage can surface, but those are few and far between.
The unconscious is very adept at repressing rage, but the brain is afraid that it may surface and that is why it causes pain. I think it is very important to understand this fully or we may never overcome TMS.
So we are to be aware of the fact that our mind is repressing emotions in our unconscious and list out the possible causes, such as personality traits, life stresses, good and bad experiences. Remember, the child in us (id) hates any form of responsibility. In our conscious we may be happy about a job change, but our unconscious gets angry about it. I am very happy that I am a father, but I am sure that my unconscious is enraged that I have another responsibility in my life.
Best of luck in getting rid of all your pain.
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| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Dave |
Posted - 09/24/2004 : 09:20:36
quote:
Originally posted by MidwestJim
Given this, do you feel that depression can truly be a TMS equivalent?
Yes, and it's a very strong TMS manifestation.
To quote fictional Dr. Melfi from The Sopranos (who surely was quoting some other psychologist):
Depression is rage turned inward.
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| glen_ap |
Posted - 09/24/2004 : 07:05:08
quote:
Originally posted by menvert
I have been really trying to understand how journaling fits into that concept, because as far as I can see journaling seems to only address conscious issues. Or am I actually journaling to try and find what sort of things, set me off and therefore there must be unconscious feelings related?
Since I have only started the process of overcoming TMS I do not know for sure but I will offer my opinion. Firstly, I have not found anything in any of Sarno's works that mention journaling, but please correct me if I am wrong. He did mention making a list of things that could cause anger in your unconscious such as (Spouse, Children, Job, Parents, House/Mortgage, childhood issues, being a perfectionist, etc). He says to review that list every day and when you are aware of pain.
I do believe however, that if enough conscious emotion is not dealt with that it will add to the unconscious repressed rage. So dealing with your emotions in a healthy manner (Journaling and paying attention to conscious emotions and not putting them off till later) could possibly help with TMS.
On a side note, here is something else I do that is helping me overcome the fear associated with certain "triggers". I tell myself that the trigger does not cause pain, TMS does. For example, sitting is one of my triggers. So I tell myself when I am sitting that it does not cause pain, only the TMS does. It seems to be helping. At the same time, I also review my list of stresses that I mentioned above.
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Glen |
| menvert |
Posted - 09/24/2004 : 06:43:01
As glen stated unconscious rage is the major source of TMS... so I have been really trying to understand how journaling fits into that concept, because as far as I can see journaling seems to only address conscious issues. Or am I actually journaling to try and find what sort of things, set me off and therefore there must be unconscious feelings related? I am quite confused as how to implement journaling.
I am mainly just working to change my thought patterns so when I feel pain . I think, what event happened and what feelings were involved, specifically avoiding thinking that some physical activity caused it.
I think depression definitely is a TMS equivalent and it has become very much in vogue lately so therefore is a readily chosen target for the brain :)
Depression for me can be both a cause and a symptom of pain/TMS, Though after accepting TMS my depression has DRASTICALLY reduced. My depression increased a lot recently but it is now more or less gone after finding this forum :) but I am still wondering whether my apathy and lack of motivation is a symptom hehe. |
| MidwestJim |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 14:02:09
quote:
Treating TMS is not about fixing the source of the problem. The source is unconscious; we can't access it. The most important aspect of treatment is to understand the TMS process, accept the cause and purpose of the pain, and thwart that purpose by reconditioning ourselves to think differently about the pain.
Given this, do you feel that depression can truly be a TMS equivalent? For me, chronic depression is my number one problem (headaches and backpain are numbers two and three). When feeling depressed, which is the majority of the time for me, I feel a sense of hopelessness and unworthtiness, intense fear of failure, and general apathy. As weird as it sounds, I can "feel" these sensations throughout my body.
If depression is really a TMS equivalent, then it is the ultimate one. It literally makes it extremely difficult to recondition oneself to think differently about it, as it's worst effect is to cause one to think differently in the first place. |
| Dave |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 13:24:15
quote:
How can we ever beat TMS if we can't attribute it to daily stresses?
As Glen said very well, it is important to understand the difference between the unconscious rage that is the direct cause of TMS pain, and the conscious emotions that we may be repressing. The latter is certainly a major ingredient to the former, but it is not the source of TMS.
It is not necessary (nor possible) to stop repression. Nor is it possible (or necessary) to change our personalities. We can definitely make improvements in the way we handle stress, and learn to recognize aspects of our personality that lead to repression. We can learn to express our emotions. We can learn to "relax." But none of this in and of itself is necessary for treating TMS.
Treating TMS is not about fixing the source of the problem. The source is unconscious; we can't access it. The most important aspect of treatment is to understand the TMS process, accept the cause and purpose of the pain, and thwart that purpose by reconditioning ourselves to think differently about the pain. |
| MRosenthal |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 11:46:28
I disagree. I believe that he states that the pressures we put on ourselves to be a perfectionist and a good person can contribute to TMS. I feel the anger when I try to be a good person and don't really want to. I have agreed to do many things for my wife that I may not agree with, but I feel that I must in order to be a good husband. I get angry about that and repress the anger to keep calm. How can we ever beat TMS if we can't attribute it to daily stresses? |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 11:13:25
Glen, that sounds reasonable from a psychological expalantion of TMS. I feel we would all be better off expressing our true feelings to each other. It seems though, that our culture increasingly dictates that we must hide our emotions and true thoughts behind a veneer of phoniness. I think this greatly contributes to our culture of TMS along with the increase in psychgenic symptoms especially in the workplace. Now that the workplace is freely giving out monetary rewards for being in pain, there will be no end to it, until the house of cards collapses and the last person putting in an honest days work says "Screw this I'm out of here and I'm not turning off the lights."
I fear for our society that we are becoming "good Germans"-just following orders. Not expressing our emotions, opinions and true feelings is turning us into a society of lemmings. I think this behavior is part of the "cool" culture. It is un-cool to display passion or individuality. In reality, it seems that those who do break-out of our culture's repressive roles, become the most successful. They are the ones who are not afraid to think out of the box, are creative and original thinkers. To give a really bad example, Martha Stewart. Her stock has doubled recently. It was announced on the business news, this morning, that a reality TV producer is coming on board. Martha is making lemonade out of lemons-well I said this was a really bad example. Martha is not shamed and going into hiding-just jail. I doubt if she gets debilitating TMS pain-go Martha!
I have mentioned in recent posts that I talk to myself in my car. I am doing this increasingly and more voiciferously. My TMS is getting better! I don't just talk, I also swear quite alot and increasingly. One of the great things to come out of cell phone technology is that when people see us talking to oureselves now, they assume we are on the cell phone hands-free. If you use an earpiece it's even more convincing.
I think doing this is good practice for expressing our hostilites, lowering our TMS stress build-up and keeping our sanity in an increasingly insane world. After my commute, I get out of the car, feeling relaxed-it's a form of emotional exercise for me.
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| Texasrunner |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 09:53:02
Good assessment of the general principles of TMS. And you are quite correct in your understanding of unconscious vs.conscious emotions. |
| johnfindlay |
Posted - 09/23/2004 : 09:47:50
Nice one - thats me..and I agree accessing all the sub-concious rage would be a full-time job and then some!
JF |
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